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MotU posted:I reported every gif posted as a tweet I've been on these boards for (takes an embarrassingly long time doing the mental math, finger counting was involved) 14 years without a posting enemy. Stop the timer.
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Jun 21, 2022 00:18
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Gumball Gumption posted:Fooch is the only dude who has a legitimate beef and a lot of that is old resentment towards a crew who are primarily gone and I think if he posted more people would be more welcoming. Though we got to stop razzing him about Mox. If Foochs announced they were leaving the AEW threads forever instead of yea ok a few months ago I would've bought the cameos for Foochs too. Foochs being accused of being a TNA fan was genuinely baffling too! In the end there are probably 3 types of posters. People who just want to talk about wrestling, they don't want to take it too seriously and they mostly want to goof around. People who want to discuss wrestling more seriously, analyze things and maybe care a little more about what the wrestlers themselves think. And then there are people like Eat My Fuc who I can't put into a box. There are probably people from category 1 who think they belong in 2, vice versa, people from 1 who think and post that people from 2 are annoying and people from 2 who think people in 1 should go to Barstool. But for the most part, there's lots of posting and for the amount of posting people get along pretty well. There are definitely some cases where people might be made fun of for no reason for jumping in and asking questions because they are new, but that's a double edged sword because threads are a long form conversation and when you jump into a conversation halfway it can be tough to do it seamlessly when you are genuinely confused. For me when the conversation goes in ways I don't really find interesting I just ignore the thread for a few days. Other people just want to post and that's fine.
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Jun 21, 2022 00:27
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I want to preface this by saying that I'm not trying to discount anyone's negative experience - with that being said I've been posting in this subforum for more years than I'd like to even admit to myself and I'd have to say that just in my experience this is the least cliquey this subforum has ever been there were times where actual 'crews' were a thing and if you weren't in the group of cool posters that hang out after school you'd get poo poo on constantly and your posts and opinions wouldn't matter - we've come a long way from that and though it's not perfect it's far better than it used to be as far as this brigading and cliques thing goes again, I'm not trying to lessen the point of anyone affected by some nonsense but it's more friendly and welcoming around here than in the past in quite a few ways
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Jun 21, 2022 00:29
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Lid posted:This might not be directed at me but thank you for saying this because you've hit the nail - this is a chance to assess the cultural enforcement, including me. I have been called out for being a dick to MJeff and MJeff is loving right, I was out of line dunking on him not letting something go. In that I was part of the problem and directly contributed to a good poster stopping by using the very behaviours I'm now railing against. If you wanna make it up to me, take a step back, do what you're asking everybody else to do and really try to look at what the people that disagree with you are saying and try to read what they're saying as things being said by people with feelings. Not a clubhouse, not overly defensive fans, people with feelings of their own, just like the people you're trying to argue for.
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Jun 21, 2022 00:32
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Gumball Gumption posted:Fooch is the only dude who has a legitimate beef and a lot of that is old resentment towards a crew who are primarily gone and I think if he posted more people would be more welcoming. Though we got to stop razzing him about Mox. I think this is absolutely part of the problem. I don’t think there’s some “cabal” or conspiracy the way people ar couching it. I think theres an atmosphere. Atmospheres of permissively are created by what is allowed and accepted and normal. If it’s normal for people to just mock everyone and insult them then you don’t even notice if it’s happening in this thread. No one cares because it’s normal. And then because no one is saying anything when someone does the reaction is “I don’t see it”. But like it easier to believe a bunch of different posters all have the same experience because they made it up in their own heads than that the group is just desensitized to its habits? It’s the entire reason I spoke up. Because this shouldn’t be about Lid. It should be about the pattern of people echoing the basic points.
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Jun 21, 2022 00:41
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Lid posted:I want the culture to change. I want people to feel their niche interest with a bunch if weirdo niche people can be discussed and not be exclusionary. I don't want any of you banned and not an enemies list, I want there to be mutual respect between people and that it not feel like punching down. Sadly due to your isanely stupid posts today directed at people who contribute way more to this form than you, I can't see myself respecting you any time soon. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jun 21, 2022 00:42
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I’m just glad that despite this forum’s faults, this is still the most sane place to discuss wrestling on the internet that I’ve ever found and I’m happy to have it
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Jun 21, 2022 00:45
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I don't think I'm going to get any answers to my very straightforward questions, so I'm just going to ask that to whoever wants go to on a culture war, present or future, please leave me the gently caress out of it next time.
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Jun 21, 2022 00:46
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Dacap posted:I’m just glad that despite this forum’s faults, this is still the most sane place to discuss wrestling on the internet that I’ve ever found and I’m happy to have it
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Jun 21, 2022 00:46
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Fsmhunk posted:Sadly due to your isanely stupid posts today directed at people who contribute way more to this form than you, I can't see myself respecting you any time soon. You have been the worst poster in this thread by a mile, specifying this thread the feedback thread. Clicking "show fsmhunk's posts" are you being a total rude dick, antagonistic, and just straight up an rear end in a top hat to everyone in view. You are not part of the problem of culture by the by, you are just an unadulterated prick who unlike the others I think should be booted from here.
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Jun 21, 2022 00:50
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Lid posted:You have been the worst poster in this thread by a mile, specifying this thread the feedback thread. Clicking "show fsmhunk's posts" are you being a total rude dick, antagonistic, and just straight up an rear end in a top hat to everyone in view. You are not part of the problem of culture by the by, you are just an unadulterated prick who unlike the others I think should be booted from here. I'll try that Fsmhunk posted:I admit a couple of weeks ago I got riled and said something really mean to EMF because of a light hearted joke post they made. It was totally on me and nothing they said deserved that level of personal insult and I was rightly probed for it. Sometimes it's nice to realize just because someone made you mad it doesn't make them a toxic poster, sometimes you can be angry and also totally in the wrong like I was. I am on the spectrum and obviously sometimes read way to much into things, but sometimes you just gotta take a breath, take the L and realize you were acting like a dope and just move on. For your own benefit, if nothing else. Fsmhunk posted:Thank you EMF. Huh
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Jun 21, 2022 00:54
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I'm being way more polite than you deserve shithead. The fact you singled out a bunch of posters who didn't do poo poo to you and tried to paint them as toxic problem posters precludes you trying to claim the moral high ground in this thread. Including saying people were 'afraid' of one of the nicer posters here. You're completely pathetic.
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Jun 21, 2022 00:55
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Gumball Gumption posted:I'll try that Fsmhunk posted:Frankly most of the people talking about getting ganged up on get most upset about is times they're objectively wrong about something and they got mad someone pointed it out. The fact Lid poo poo on MRT in particular is very telling, since I've been posting here he's been the best fact checker there is on this board. Either way all of the people here now posting about the fourm being toxic all post way more agressive than the people they singled out to poo poo on. Sorry that peope don't like you because you're a mean, angry person who's exhausting to be around. Fsmhunk posted:If there are peopl legit afraid of yea ok they should probably get off the computer before a particularly spooky animated Google logo gives them a fatal heart attack. Fsmhunk posted:No, when you don't enjoy something you make novel length posts about it over the course of multiple years. Don't try to paint it as you above it all and everyone else is petty when in reality you're one of the biggest whiners around. Fsmhunk posted:If someone says something very stupid and funny people will make fun of them for it. If this upsets people so greatly they might try acting in a less abnormal fashion. Fsmhunk posted:You said if you see a post in the AEW thread you don't like you just ignore it. The lie detector determined that was a lie. Fsmhunk posted:Hey Elephant Ambush, your post was easily ten times more hostile and mean than what NienNunb posted lol. Stop pretending to actually care about being nice to each other or the quality of discussion, you just get outraged that most people don't take you seriously and give your lovely posts the exact response they deserve. Frankly, in response to all these threats of people refusing to post here because they're so afraid, I say if this is the caliber of poster we can expect to lose, I certainly won't be losing much sleep over it. Fsmhunk posted:If they're afraid of yea ok they simply should not be watching AEW. Sinister figures like The House of Black and Darby (skeleton) are far too scary for them to view. But sure they're all above board.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:00
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NienNunb fucked around with this message at 01:31 on Jun 21, 2022 |
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Jun 21, 2022 01:01
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STAC Goat posted:I think this is absolutely part of the problem. I don’t think there’s some “cabal” or conspiracy the way people ar couching it. I think theres an atmosphere. Atmospheres of permissively are created by what is allowed and accepted and normal. If it’s normal for people to just mock everyone and insult them then you don’t even notice if it’s happening in this thread. No one cares because it’s normal. And then because no one is saying anything when someone does the reaction is “I don’t see it”. But like it easier to believe a bunch of different posters all have the same experience because they made it up in their own heads than that the group is just desensitized to its habits? It’s the entire reason I spoke up. Because this shouldn’t be about Lid. It should be about the pattern of people echoing the basic points. Agreed on it being an atmosphere thing and the desire to reflect and change. Unfortunately, the defensiveness and wagon circling at this point probably indicates how low the desire to do that is. Probably why flagging for closer moderation is a good idea.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:01
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I think I have the right to get defensive about what was said.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:06
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"Wagon circling" is also a needlessly antagonistic term to use.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:08
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There are also a few people who’ve posted in this thread who haven’t been as antagonistic as Lid. It’s hard to address them when you’re pissed off at someone being hyperbolic. Likewise, when one person is a solid rear end in the AEW thread, it’s hard to distinguish between the mildly snarky people and the real rear end in a top hat. Alas, in the absence of actual moderation it’s unlikely to get sorted out.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:12
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Quantum of Phallus posted:Or posting a gif as a tweet You rule
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Jun 21, 2022 01:12
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It's going to be literally impossible for this conversation to progress at all if every response that isn't complete agreement and acquiescing is characterized as hostile and defensive and thus automatically not worth acknowledging. Which is basically the whole issue. Again, the constantly framing of Well Meaning Good Faith Critique vs. Psychotic Overly Defensive AEW Fan.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:15
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Pylons posted:"Wagon circling" is also a needlessly antagonistic term to use. It is but its because this is headed in a direction of "everyone's got it out of their systems let's just go back and have some laughs again" like it's a thing to blow over and we're all friends and this was just a moment. But it's not, this has been going for months upon months and "the way things are" is the problem so if we just go back it might as well have been this conversation never happened at all. There needs to be some meaningful change. Hell currently the AEW thread is outstanding at this moment as people are talking to each other and it feels great. Could be my imagination but it could also be people are stopping to think "is what I'm about to write helpful, funny, encouraging or something that isn't mean?" and its incredible. If the thread now is how it always is and will stay then job done  .
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Jun 21, 2022 01:17
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I'm genuinely confused. Like, if I disagree with someone am I not supposed to say anything just in case I share a similar viewpoint to someone else also disagreeing, because that can be misconstrued as bullying? That sounds like the opposite of a conversation about wrestling than one that has shorter statements and jokes thrown in.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:17
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Big Coffin Hunter posted:I'm genuinely confused. Like, if I disagree with someone am I not supposed to say anything just in case I share a similar viewpoint to someone else also disagreeing, because that can be misconstrued as bullying? That sounds like the opposite of a conversation about wrestling than one that has shorter statements and jokes thrown in. its bullying if you disagree with me (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jun 21, 2022 01:19
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Really makes me feel good about the dialogue that got opened up and the discussion that was had, where everything I brought up was soundly ignored by the guy who said it all in the first place. Really awesome non-toxic open environment. Comfy as gently caress.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:21
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MotU posted:I reported every gif posted as a tweet aw come on partner 
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Jun 21, 2022 01:21
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We should just reverse the experiment. We had the Enclosed Pool Thread, now we can have a thread for whatever you want to describe this earnest posting style. Serious posting? Give someone like Lid or whoever thinks they have a good read on the style people want here IK for it and let the posting appear or not.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:22
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yea ok posted:Really makes me feel good about the dialogue that got opened up and the discussion that was had, where everything I brought up was soundly ignored by the guy who said it all in the first place. Really awesome non-toxic open environment. Comfy as gently caress. Alaois posted:its bullying if you disagree with me
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Jun 21, 2022 01:23
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Lid posted:It is but its because this is headed in a direction of "everyone's got it out of their systems let's just go back and have some laughs again" like it's a thing to blow over and we're all friends and this was just a moment. But it's not, this has been going for months upon months and "the way things are" is the problem so if we just go back it might as well have been this conversation never happened at all. There needs to be some meaningful change. It's galling to me that you're trying to take credit for improving the subforum while just completely loving ignoring a bunch of people's distaste for this situation and how they were treated in it, particularly yea ok, in this very thread, right now.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:23
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Big Coffin Hunter posted:I'm genuinely confused. Like, if I disagree with someone am I not supposed to say anything just in case I share a similar viewpoint to someone else also disagreeing, because that can be misconstrued as bullying? That sounds like the opposite of a conversation about wrestling than one that has shorter statements and jokes thrown in. Nah. I think it’s the difference between “I disagree, my opinion is X” and “you’re an idiot for thinking that, so I’m gonna make fun of you.” I also personally figure that if two people have already expressed my particular point of disagreement that I don’t need to chime in, but that’s me.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:24
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Big Coffin Hunter posted:I'm genuinely confused. Like, if I disagree with someone am I not supposed to say anything just in case I share a similar viewpoint to someone else also disagreeing, because that can be misconstrued as bullying? That sounds like the opposite of a conversation about wrestling than one that has shorter statements and jokes thrown in. It feels like to some people when they post something that they get a lot of pushback that acts like they're stupid or crazy for the take. That the threads are overwhelmingly pro-AEW and will shut down even mild criticism. I suppose whether or not this is true is the point of the debate.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:25
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Gumball Gumption posted:We should just reverse the experiment. We had the Enclosed Pool Thread, now we can have a thread for whatever you want to describe this earnest posting style. Serious posting? Give someone like Lid or whoever thinks they have a good read on the style people want here IK for it and let the posting appear or not. I did, it died I should have supported it more but I hate writinghttps://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3991416 Also the MMA threads are consistently very good to excellent fez_machine fucked around with this message at 01:29 on Jun 21, 2022 |
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Jun 21, 2022 01:26
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jackofarcades posted:It feels like to some people when they post something that they get a lot of pushback that acts like they're stupid or crazy for the take. That the threads are overwhelmingly pro-AEW and will shut down even mild criticism. Is it really shutting down if I just don't agree with them on that particular criticism?
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Jun 21, 2022 01:27
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fez_machine posted:I did, it died Why couldn’t that survive?
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Jun 21, 2022 01:28
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Big Coffin Hunter posted:Is it really shutting down if I just don't agree with them on that particular criticism? It depends on how you respond and how reasonable the criticism is, surely?
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Jun 21, 2022 01:30
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yea ok posted:Really makes me feel good about the dialogue that got opened up and the discussion that was had, where everything I brought up was soundly ignored by the guy who said it all in the first place. Really awesome non-toxic open environment. Comfy as gently caress. Dude I said it in the PM and you quoted - this is not about me and you and trying to frame this as me and you is not a thing. I will leave your name out of it in the future, but you were just a name among many names, because in those threads people kept posting eggshells and "we all know who we're talking about". I didn't know you of them would be so personally slammed by thus, and I regret it.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:32
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it's a running joke among posters here that tony khan is incapable of booking more than one women's match per show, i don't think anyone is particularly sensitive to aew receiving criticism. if your criticism is something that most people don't see as an issue then yeah i can see you getting somewhat outsized pushback but i don't know how you avoid that
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Jun 21, 2022 01:32
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Ivypls posted:it's a running joke among posters here that tony khan is incapable of booking more than one women's match per show, i don't think anyone is particularly sensitive to aew receiving criticism. if your criticism is something that most people don't see as an issue then yeah i can see you getting somewhat outsized pushback but i don't know how you avoid that Yeah like, if you think Dynamite should "breathe more" or that there should be more talking I'm going to push back on that because that isn't what I want.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:33
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jackofarcades posted:It depends on how you respond and how reasonable the criticism is, surely? I'm not sure, because with some of the names mentioned, it seems like just disagreeing even when being a positive dude gets you marked as a bully so the argument here feels disingenuous to begin with.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:33
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Pylons posted:Yeah like, if you think Dynamite should "breathe more" or that there should be more talking I'm going to push back on that because that isn't what I want. And of someone brings up the writers conversation again they deserve anything shutting that down.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:35
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ya can't straight up call someone out by name and then say this isn't about you and me
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Jun 21, 2022 01:35
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