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The order swapped because of Covid but they filmed multiverse like a month after wandavision wrapped. Which is why the only reference from Strange’s previous adventures is an off hand mention of Spider-Man. Wanda’s surrender of the hex was forced by a government agency, a super villain’s taunts, and her husband. The praise people gave her afterwards seems facile (Doctor Strange clearly want something from her, so he doesn’t get mad about Westview!) People tried to paper over deep psychological holes with “you apologized and now you’re good.”
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Jun 23, 2022 21:21
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| # ? May 26, 2024 00:41 |
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After three episodes of Ms. Marvel, I'm honestly shocked at how much I'm enjoying the show. The pacing seems much tighter than most of the other Marvel shows, the characters are relatable and it has a ton of heart. The only real gripe I have with it so far, albeit a fairly small one, is how much certain points in the story rely on Damage Control being inept, but it all works. A month ago, I wasn't even totally sure I'd actually watch it. I hope word of mouth gives it a lift on the viewership. I also fully understand that there are still three more episodes to totally change my opinion on the series as a whole.
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Jun 23, 2022 21:21
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Codependent Poster posted:Yeah when she and Kamala are talking in the mosque about how they have to sit in the back. That's basically the same scene. Her character just goes 0 to 60 quickly. It's all understandable but its lazy writing to lean on understandability. They could have easily thrown in a line about her pushing back on Kamala and Bruno's love of superheroes earlier to set it up. This is admittedly nitpicky. It's the only problem with the show and it's a minor one
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Jun 23, 2022 21:22
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Goons, take the "Stop saying it's a plot hole for a character to not act rationally in the moment" challenge.
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Jun 23, 2022 21:29
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live with fruit posted:That's basically the same scene. Her character just goes 0 to 60 quickly. It's all understandable but its lazy writing to lean on understandability. They could have easily thrown in a line about her pushing back on Kamala and Bruno's love of superheroes earlier to set it up. Didn't they? I thought she was open with her disdain with the whole "Night Light" viral video as soon as that plot started.
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Jun 23, 2022 21:30
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live with fruit posted:That's basically the same scene. Her character just goes 0 to 60 quickly. It's all understandable but its lazy writing to lean on understandability. They could have easily thrown in a line about her pushing back on Kamala and Bruno's love of superheroes earlier to set it up. Nakia's a 0 to 60 kind of person. Nakia doesn't dislike superheroes. She's angry that this superhero got her mosque invaded by disrespectful government assholes.
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Jun 23, 2022 21:31
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chitoryu12 posted:Goons, take the "Stop saying it's a plot hole for a character to not act rationally in the moment" challenge. Is it that time of the week again for another of your "goons, am I rite?" posts? Time flies
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Jun 23, 2022 21:33
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kazil posted:Is it that time of the week again for another of your "goons, am I rite?" posts? Time flies When y'all stop being loving weirdos about normal things I'll stop saying something.
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Jun 23, 2022 21:43
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Arist posted:Yeah, basically. I'm not sure I buy that she undoes the spell if Vision wasn't aware of it. The fact of the matter is that she no longer had a choice on if it was coming down, just how. Wanda chooses the most noble option by bringing it down peacefully by her own free will, because she's a good person... but she's also a desperate person who's just had three more fresh traumas added to an already staggering pile of them, and the last we see her, she's reading an evil book that eats souls. So I don't like where she ended up in MoM (I'm a comics reader and I don't think any character has been hit with the WOMEN RIGHT, SO GODDAMN CRAZY, CAN'T TRUST 'EM WITH ANY POWER stick harder or more often than Wanda, so I was really hoping she'd avoid that particular noxious fate in the MCU)... but I understand it.
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Jun 23, 2022 21:44
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XboxPants posted:I have a notoriously bad memory and WandaVision was a while ago, but where are you getting that she didn't feel very bad about it? From what I remembered, she voluntarily ended the enchantment on the town, even knowing it would erase her magically created children, who she arguably cared about more than anyone else at the time. one review I read of MoM said that the ideal viewer for that film is someone who's read a plot synopsis of WandaVision but didn't actually watch the show, and I have to agree given how fundamentally incoherent Wanda's character arc between the two is. even to the extent that "the Darkhold did it" explains undoing much of her arc from WV, it's still not coherent or consistent, since she becomes murderously obsessed with bringing her sons back yet no longer seems to care at all about resurrecting Vision or Pietro
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Jun 23, 2022 21:55
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CapnAndy posted:She might anyway, because Vision and the kids were limited to existing in a small New Jersey town, and also because the whole thing had clearly spun out of her control and she couldn't keep it going any more; the townspeople were frequently breaking out of their "roles", the government was intruding and had proven they weren't going to stop doing so, at least one magic user had already infiltrated with a goal of hijacking the Hex, Vision was in active revolt, and she was out of decades to switch genre to in order to reset everything. I've never thought of this before and it's now my favorite interpretation. She HAD to stop, because she didn't have anymore sitcom eras to make parodies of.
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Jun 23, 2022 21:59
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Arist posted:I'm not going to give her points for eventually reluctantly doing the right thing after consciously enslaving a town for multiple weeks. I liked the way WandaVision ended (except that Monica line), but come on. MoM actually reckons with what she did and what that suggests about her character. It's extremely hard for me to ignore the Monica line, because it's pretty much the only moral judgement on Wanda's behaviour that we get. The townsfolk are all angry and sulky, Monica tells her "they'll never know what you sacrificed" and it feels like we're meant to see the townsfolk as these ignorant losers who can't understand why Wanda was so justified in mind controlling and torturing them for so long. What she did was unforgivable, but that's fine because she's super special and important.
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Jun 23, 2022 22:02
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The most common complaint I saw about Wandvision was that they thought that what Wanda did was evil and she wasn't punished. The most common complaint about MoM was that they 'wasted' the potential of Wanda by how making her face consequences for her actions. Idk how anyone can reconcile these two groups of people (and a lot of them are probably the same people!) to please everyone
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Jun 23, 2022 22:18
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Firebert posted:The most common complaint I saw about Wandvision was that they thought that what Wanda did was evil and she wasn't punished.
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Jun 23, 2022 22:24
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Firebert posted:The most common complaint I saw about Wandvision was that they thought that what Wanda did was evil and she wasn't punished. Because the show seems to say that what she did wasnt all that bad/she had her reasons. Which makes it even more of a whiplash when she goes full evil. Magic terminator mum was awesome though, and these things have never really had coherent character development. So I can't be too dissapointed.
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Jun 23, 2022 22:30
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CapnAndy posted:As kinda one of those people, I would guess that what they wanted was for Good Guy Wanda to recognize she committed crimes and atone, and what they got was Villain Wanda doing way worse crimes that put her drat close to the unforgivable line, if not over it. Wanda in the MCU is a tragic character. Her family was destroyed by war, her powers came as a direct result of torture, her twin brother and her were recruited/brainwashed into fighting for the wrong side, her brother dies, she tries to break right and struggles, she falls in love during a time of conflict, her lover dies multiple times, and that all leads directly into Wandavision. Aye, grief can turn people into real monsters. Grief often turns into more grief and can hurt innocent bystanders. Grief in someone with superpowers who doesn't understand their own powers even more so. And then she DOES go too far and is brought to account and dies trying to undo a small amount of the damage she's done. I'm not expecting Wanda to be gone forever (especially now with the multiverse), but even if she is dead-dead, then it's a good, tragic arc. She's a tragic character. I get the people who were weirded out at the ending of Wandavision, but what was she gonna do, go to super-jail? MoM is a direct result of Wandavision and I don't really see any gaps in the arc that bother me, frankly.
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Jun 23, 2022 22:36
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As for MoM, I’m on Wanda’s side up until the point she decides she ‘needs’ to magically eat a teenage girl. Honestly, Wanda went full Dr. Doom and I like it. As for Ms. Marvel it occurs to me that Kamram was far too quick to say “we need to get everyone out of here because my family will kill them all”. That means he’s seen them commit massacres, before.
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Jun 23, 2022 22:38
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Strom Cuzewon posted:Magic terminator mum was awesome though, and these things have never really had coherent character development. So I can't be too dissapointed. Besides Wanda, who's this true of?
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Jun 23, 2022 22:38
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real villain of MoM was Dr. Strange for his excessive use of force against Pizza Poppa
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Jun 23, 2022 22:44
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live with fruit posted:Besides Wanda, who's this true of? Tony Stark's character is all over the place
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Jun 23, 2022 22:45
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CapnAndy posted:As kinda one of those people, I would guess that what they wanted was for Good Guy Wanda to recognize she committed crimes and atone, and what they got was Villain Wanda doing way worse crimes that put her drat close to the unforgivable line, if not over it. I feel like they didn't really do a good job of explaining the Darkhold to audiences, because Good Guy Wanda was never going to happen after how Wandavision ended. I felt like what we got was pretty true to a character who has quite often slipped into villainy in the comics, especially given how powerful her MCU iteration had become.
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Jun 23, 2022 23:10
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kazil posted:MoM: no Jimmy Woo, 3/10 The guy who also plays Jim from The Office? He was in MoM for sure
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Jun 23, 2022 23:33
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live with fruit posted:Besides Wanda, who's this true of? Tony swings around constantly about his relationship to his suits. Clint + natasha was heavily hinted at being romantic before they pulled his family out of nowhere. There's whatever the gently caress was Hulks deal in Infinity War and then Endgame. Norton-Banner is nothing like Avengers Banner. Thor in his first movie is far more serious than when Waititi got to him. Drax goes from vengeful widower who is very literal, to an utter buffoon (which is fine, cos he's really fun at that).
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Jun 23, 2022 23:36
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StrugglingHoneybun posted:The guy who also plays Jim from The Office? 
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Jun 23, 2022 23:43
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I like the Ms. Marvel title card and how many pictures are in it and how they're different every episode
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Jun 24, 2022 00:35
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One big small thing to me was the crowd chanting "Allahu akbar" at the end of the wedding. When's the last time that phrase was spoken on American/Western television by someone other than a loving terrorist?
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Jun 24, 2022 04:00
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live with fruit posted:That's basically the same scene. Her character just goes 0 to 60 quickly. It's all understandable but its lazy writing to lean on understandability. They could have easily thrown in a line about her pushing back on Kamala and Bruno's love of superheroes earlier to set it up. Also her complaining about the mosque in the ablution room
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Jun 24, 2022 04:40
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live with fruit posted:That's basically the same scene. Her character just goes 0 to 60 quickly. It's all understandable but its lazy writing to lean on understandability. They could have easily thrown in a line about her pushing back on Kamala and Bruno's love of superheroes earlier to set it up. No offense, but this seems like reaching for something to complain about. It's not like she was some established beloved character who suddenly does an about face because the plot needed them to. She decides to run for the board in, what, episode 2? And even then they devote a whole several scenes and multiple motivations to the subplot.
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Jun 24, 2022 05:18
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It wasn't clear to me how angry she actually was. It felt more like a "what the hell is going on?" reaction. She obviously didn't have time to figure out how she actually felt about it, and for some reason they didn't have time to talk about it. It felt like a setup for Kamala to doubt herself for a while, but for her friend to actually be fine with it the next time they talk after Bruno explained everything.
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Jun 24, 2022 05:34
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mutata posted:No offense, but this seems like reaching for something to complain about. It's not like she was some established beloved character who suddenly does an about face because the plot needed them to. She decides to run for the board in, what, episode 2? And even then they devote a whole several scenes and multiple motivations to the subplot. I felt that Nakia's anti-Night Light stance came out of no where and that it's only really there to add unnecessary stress on Kamala. Even Mad Men took shortcuts. It happens.
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Jun 24, 2022 06:05
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live with fruit posted:I felt that Nakia's anti-Night Light stance came out of no where and that it's only really there to add unnecessary stress on Kamala. Even Mad Men took shortcuts. It happens. Nakia is a nascent JJJ. Let her blossom it something truly charmingly obnoxious.
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Jun 24, 2022 06:10
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Marsupial Ape posted:Nakia is a nascent JJJ. Let her blossom it something truly charmingly obnoxious. That too. She saved that dumb kid's life.
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Jun 24, 2022 06:28
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Everyone posted:One big small thing to me was the crowd chanting "Allahu akbar" at the end of the wedding. When's the last time that phrase was spoken on American/Western television by someone other than a loving terrorist? Imagine, how this show would have played out if that rear end in a top hat conservative whose name I forgot was still in charge.
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Jun 24, 2022 06:37
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Muslim surveillance is a unifying principle of both political parties. If that wasn’t true they probably would’ve closed Guantánamo Bay in the past 20 years
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Jun 24, 2022 08:29
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It's kinda funny that chuds are dismissing Ms. Marvel as woke as in a tonne of ways it's a very conservative show about sincere religious belief, respecting your parents, close family ties, and the importance of tradition.
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Jun 24, 2022 09:52
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Necrothatcher posted:It's kinda funny that chuds are dismissing Ms. Marvel as woke as in a tonne of ways it's a very conservative show about sincere religious belief, respecting your parents, close family ties, and the importance of tradition. This is future the liberals want. Young ladies dressing moderately! Having fun without alcohol! Calling your grandmother on the reg! We have to keep these clown world morals away from our precious white chiodren!
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Jun 24, 2022 10:25
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Necrothatcher posted:It's kinda funny that chuds are dismissing Ms. Marvel as woke as in a tonne of ways it's a very conservative show about sincere religious belief, respecting your parents, close family ties, and the importance of tradition. Funny how Muslims used to be an extremely reliable Republican voting bloc right up until 9/11. I wonder what happened. Nakia feels pretty believable to me, as someone who's politically liberal but grew up in an extremely conservative religion and culture and isn't [yet] willing to break with that religion and culture. Yes she goes zero to sixty a lot, but that feels accurate to me, if her experiences are like mine were she's perpetually boiling inside as she struggles with contradictory beliefs and values and it never takes much for that to lash out.
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Jun 24, 2022 12:30
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Necrothatcher posted:It's kinda funny that chuds are dismissing Ms. Marvel as woke as in a tonne of ways it's a very conservative show about sincere religious belief, respecting your parents, close family ties, and the importance of tradition. From the perspective of a foreigner, one of the universal tropes of american TV families that I recognize is that parents are strict but loving, they are usually very religious and go to church each sunday. Kamala's family is essentially no different other than minor issues of culture.
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Jun 24, 2022 12:30
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Necrothatcher posted:It's kinda funny that chuds are dismissing Ms. Marvel as woke as in a tonne of ways it's a very conservative show about sincere religious belief, respecting your parents, close family ties, and the importance of tradition. No no no we didn't say we want right conservatism we said we want white conservatism
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Jun 24, 2022 15:00
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Arist posted:Is it actually explicitly a Circle K Well, strange things are afoot there 404notfound posted:In that scene where Najma was looking at Kamran's phone, was it an iPhone? If so, that was an early tell that Kamran wasn't actually bad The apple phone thing has been known forever. Dr Evil's getting a Dell
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Jun 24, 2022 17:30
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