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CuddleCryptid posted:It's going to be something to see what happens in all the legacy law states. Michigan, my state, is one of them, so we now have made abortion illegal. But the Gov, state DA, and the county DAs of most counties with major cities in them have all gone on record saying that no one will actually be persecuted for it. That said, AFAIK Planned Parenthood's plan is still to basically shut down and not being persecuted is not the same as not spending time in pretrial jail. I'm almost certain the that law has been suspended by a judge in MI, but the GOP in the state is writing up a new law. Looks like Whitmer and a left leaning state supreme court is standing the way.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:41
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I;m having a really hard time looking my daughter in the eye right now. She's only 11, but how can I explain to her that her body isn't truely her own, that people consider her a vessel?
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Jun 24, 2022 15:41
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Accubitus posted:Is anyone aware of any charities that I can donate to that *directly* impact women's ability to get an abortion? I'm thinking like organizations that provide transportation, that kind of thing. Reproductive Equity now, especially in states that made these awful laws.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:41
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TyrantWD posted:People will easily accept it all. The truth is they "care", but not that much. It is lot like how a lot of people would answer yes if you ask them should we save the polar bears. All of it falls under the category of "sure, if someone else can take care of that issue, I guess that would be swell, but it doesn't bother me enough to make me do anything about it". The thing is, almost no one who answers that question has ever encountered a polar bear personally. Lots of people will encounter drug stores that don't stock condoms. Lots of people will encounter doctors who end their birth control prescription. Lots of people will encounter friends who had their lives destroyed by a forcibly dissolved marriage or an unwanted pregnancy. You can't put these things out of your mind as easily. I'm not saying anything will definitely happen, just that we're heading for a period of social chaos we can't even imagine
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Jun 24, 2022 15:41
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Accubitus posted:Is anyone aware of any charities that I can donate to that *directly* impact women's ability to get an abortion? I'm thinking like organizations that provide transportation, that kind of thing. Women On Web is the one that my family donates to, they're an international organization that ships pills all over and they are headquartered in Canada at the moment I believe. They're pretty legit, their sister org Women on Waves straight up sails boats around to repressive nations and sets up abortion providers just outside their national waters and helps people get service under international law instead of local ones.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:41
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Mooseontheloose posted:I mean if we are going to this level of rhetoric any leftist that didn't vote for Hillary Clinton as a means to stick it the Democratic Party is culpable. No, you're not allowed to make that argument in D&D, only the one you're arguing against. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jun 24, 2022 15:43
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I think it's a sign of a healthy country that the unelected unrecallable judiciary that gave itself the power to review laws decided to release a decision so far in the minority and hated by everyone on a Friday so they could then leave the city and retreat to their (now fortified with federal money) homes in the burbs. It's great that this can happen, and I'm glad that the liberal majority will allow this to happen in the name of decorum rather than, say, ignoring Marbury, immediately appointing 100 new judges, and overturning all of these decisions (which they have the power to do).
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Jun 24, 2022 15:45
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Cimber posted:I hope all the ladies who protest voted for Jill Stein are happy. Maybe Hillary should have tried harder.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:46
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nine-gear crow posted:No, you're not allowed to make that argument in D&D, only the one you're arguing against. Ok fine. There was a political reality at the time that Obama had very little to no power to solve. The Democrats were in the minority in the Senate and a recess appointment would still lead us here.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:46
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Accubitus posted:Is anyone aware of any charities that I can donate to that *directly* impact women's ability to get an abortion? I'm thinking like organizations that provide transportation, that kind of thing. http://www.havencoalition.org/ is one, there might be others for other regions.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:46
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Ubersandwich posted:I'm almost certain the that law has been suspended by a judge in MI, but the GOP in the state is writing up a new law. Looks like Whitmer and a left leaning state supreme court is standing the way. It's cute how it goes to the people and their representatives when there are several states where the GOP lost the vote yet retains control of state governments. And these gerrymanders are not justiciable.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:47
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haveblue posted:The thing is, almost no one who answers that question has ever encountered a polar bear personally. Lots of people will encounter drug stores that don't stock condoms. Lots of people will encounter doctors who end their birth control prescription. Lots of people will encounter friends who had their lives destroyed by a forcibly dissolved marriage or an unwanted pregnancy. You can't put these things out of your mind as easily. There won't be any social chaos. They could overturn gay-marriage and interracial marriage tomorrow, and the anger and motivation to do anything would have dissipated by the end of August. Everyone would just shrug and say it sucks, but I guess you could move to a blue state where it is legal. To be fair, there is very little that can be done, other than move to a blue state, or turn your purple state into a blue state so you don't have to move.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:48
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Center-right democrat shitlibs do not and never have cared about abortion rights or gay rights or (especially) trans rights. They will happily let the backslide continue as long as they get to keep making their money.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:48
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Ubersandwich posted:I'm almost certain the that law has been suspended by a judge in MI, but the GOP in the state is writing up a new law. Looks like Whitmer and a left leaning state supreme court is standing the way. It's accurate that a judge blocked the law but those rulings have a tendency to get ignored. Hopefully with the upper levels all pushing the same direction it still works out. All I know is that the midterm elections in Michigan (and states like it) are going to be loving *wild*. We are almost guaranteed to have abortion rights on the ballot this year with how hard the proposal has been pushed in popularion centers. I'm running the polls again this year and hoping that my fairly liberal district doesn't get attacked.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:48
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Cimber posted:I hope all the ladies who protest voted for Jill Stein are happy. yeah man it's not that the US is a backwards shithole nation ran by insane theocratic white supremacists, it's the voters that broke everything you want to know why leftists think 'libs' are bad? This is why. You have no concept of material conditions and systemic issues. History doesn't exist. Everything is in the moment. Voters voted bad, made US bad, very sad 
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Jun 24, 2022 15:48
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DrThief posted:Been reading this thread for the last few days and as a European I find it completely bewildering how the USA, the oldest democracy in the world, allows 9 unelected officials to dictate social, fiscal and other serious policy without any checks from the other branches of the government. The constitution was essentially a beta version after the buggy initial release kept crashing, and even then the supreme court didn't initially have this power, it was an exploit that Marbury noticed and nobody ever really fixed, they just did some patches to get around it sometimes like using an amendment to overturn the Dred Scott decision
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Jun 24, 2022 15:49
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VitalSigns posted:It makes a lot more sense when you realize that "oldest democracy" means that it hasn't been updated much in 250 years. An 18th Century Conception of rights trying to operate in the 21st Century, with 19th Century gatekeepers.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:50
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Regarde Aduck posted:yeah man it's not that the US is a backwards shithole nation ran by insane theocratic white supremacists, it's the voters that broke everything There are plenty of theocratic white supremacists among the voters as well.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:50
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Cimber posted:I hope all the ladies who protest voted for Jill Stein are happy. Yeah! If we got democrats in charge of the WH and both chambers of Congress we could finally enact real change! Wait (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jun 24, 2022 15:50
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Skyl3lazer posted:gave itself the power to review laws Still amazingly wrong no matter how many times it's repeated. The concept of judicial review is older than the United States.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:52
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smoobles posted:Yeah! If we got democrats in charge of the WH and both chambers of Congress we could finally enact real change! They might lose a chamber at midterm elections, but that’s still two years to pass a single bill. How could they possibly fail?
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Jun 24, 2022 15:53
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Main Paineframe posted:There are plenty of theocratic white supremacists among the voters as well. Okay, what does people voting for Jill Stein instead of Abulea have to do with that?
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Jun 24, 2022 15:53
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Skyl3lazer posted:
From the outside it already is. In many ways the US political system has become the thing to point to as a cautionary tale.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:53
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TyrantWD posted:There won't be any social chaos. They could overturn gay-marriage and interracial marriage tomorrow, and the anger and motivation to do anything would have dissipated by the end of August. Everyone would just shrug and say it sucks, but I guess you could move to a blue state where it is legal. If you're convinced nothing will be done and there's nothing that can be done, then why post? Is your goal to convince people to not try?
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Jun 24, 2022 15:53
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Regarde Aduck posted:yeah man it's not that the US is a backwards shithole nation ran by insane theocratic white supremacists, it's the voters that broke everything The voters put those insane theocratic white supremacists in power. I don't know why there is such resistance to accepting the fact that the voters are the problem. There is no 3rd party coming in and forcing things upon the public that we didn't choose. It is about time people wise up to the fact that the public sucks. We, as a collective, chose this outcome.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:54
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Mooseontheloose posted:Ok fine. There was a political reality at the time that Obama had very little to no power to solve. The Democrats were in the minority in the Senate and a recess appointment would still lead us here. We don’t know because they didn’t try! They didn’t try because norms and stability are more important to them than fundamental rights. 
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Jun 24, 2022 15:55
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TyrantWD posted:turn your purple state into a blue state so you don't have to move. I'm not sure why you included this in your list of flippant dismissals because if it happened enough times it would actually solve the problem
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Jun 24, 2022 15:55
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Main Paineframe posted:There are plenty of theocratic white supremacists among the voters as well. Yes but the logical conclusion from that is democracy is when theocratic white supremacists vote in enough numbers to unperson you and it's legal and cool.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:56
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Mooseontheloose posted:Ok fine. There was a political reality at the time that Obama had very little to no power to solve. The Democrats were in the minority in the Senate and a recess appointment would still lead us here. He could have done more than just surrender immediately.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:56
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smoobles posted:Yeah! If we got democrats in charge of the WH and both chambers of Congress we could finally enact real change! I mean, as it relates specifically to appointees to the supreme court this is what happened
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Jun 24, 2022 15:56
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TyrantWD posted:The voters put those insane theocratic white supremacists in power. I don't know why there is such resistance to accepting the fact that the voters are the problem. There is no 3rd party coming in and forcing things upon the public that we didn't choose. It is about time people wise up to the fact that the public sucks. We, as a collective, chose this outcome. This is the sad truth. So much of the voting public cares about one thing and one thing alone: taxes. They’d sell out their same-sex marriage if it meant the person they were voting for would get them a tax break. Add on all the dumbass single issue voters and you have a conservative majority for eternity.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:57
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TyrantWD posted:The voters put those insane theocratic white supremacists in power. I don't know why there is such resistance to accepting the fact that the voters are the problem. There is no 3rd party coming in and forcing things upon the public that we didn't choose. It is about time people wise up to the fact that the public sucks. We, as a collective, chose this outcome. Except we didn't. The Republicans have won 1 election by the popular vote since 1988. But they have put in 6 of the supreme court justices currently sitting. The fact is that our system of government is broken.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:57
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Nucleic Acids posted:Okay, what does people voting for Jill Stein instead of Abulea have to do with that? Well, I mean they voted for someone who had no shot at winning and Clinton wouldn't of appointed judge beers? So, there is one big difference there.
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Jun 24, 2022 15:58
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Blue Footed Booby posted:If you're convinced nothing will be done and there's nothing that can be done, then why post? Is your goal to convince people to not try? I don't need to convince anyone not to try, they already spent decades not trying, and now it is too late. I was just pointing out that the general public would easily swallow the loss of gay marriage and interracial marriage, as easily as they accepted the loss of women's rights. Wiping any of these rights will not cause an ounce of social chaos. Maybe you get a march in a few big cities, but even those are dying out. The last March for Our Lives in DC, that happened after Uvalde, was so tiny you could mistake it for a Proud Boy gathering. People don't fundamentally care about these issues at a level where they are willing to do something about it. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jun 24, 2022 15:59
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Gumball Gumption posted:Yes but the logical conclusion from that is democracy is when theocratic white supremacists vote in enough numbers to unperson you and it's legal and cool. Well, you could have nine unelected justices who can use their undemocratic powers to unilaterally overturn the will of the majority. That worked pretty well for getting all sorts of important protections put in over the objections of the theocratic white supremacists, at least from the 1950s up until a few years ago.
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Jun 24, 2022 16:00
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Here are the States with trigger laws, yes? So abortion is now illegal in these states? Arkansas, Idaho, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, Missouri, North Dakota, Oklahoma, South Dakota, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, Wyoming
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Jun 24, 2022 16:00
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Crows Turn Off posted:Here are the States with trigger laws, yes? So abortion is now illegal in these states? https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/24/states-set-to-ban-abortion-after-supreme-court-overturns-roe-v-wade.html
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Jun 24, 2022 16:01
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Mooseontheloose posted:Well, I mean they voted for someone who had no shot at winning and Clinton wouldn't of appointed judge beers? So, there is one big difference there. Sounds like Hillary should have run a better campaign then so she could have earned their votes.
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Jun 24, 2022 16:01
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TyrantWD posted:I don't need to convince anyone not to try, they already spent decades not trying, and now it is too late. I was just pointing out that the general public would easily swallow the loss of gay marriage and interracial marriage, as easily as they accepted the loss of women's rights. Wiping any of these rights will not cause an ounce of social chaos. Then why loving post about it?? If you genuinely believe what you're posting then the only thing more useless than trying to stand against the tide is posting about it being useless to try.
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Jun 24, 2022 16:03
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CuddleCryptid posted:
I feel you. I've lived here for 10 years after living in Washington State most of my life. I'm still getting used to it. Things will be interesting because it feels like abortion is going to be in play every election for the foreseeable future, we're at a point where whoever is in power will decide for the time being.
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Jun 24, 2022 16:03
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