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Yeah I think "canonically" (for what little that matters) Ironbreakers don't use greatweapons, but they should.
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Jun 24, 2022 21:41
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Nah in the lore and army books there's ironbreakers with great weapons just like there's shielded blorcs. Hammers are technically more offensive oriented the ironbreakers would still have higher MD than MA. Hammers should be a small 12-14 unit and be basically mini heroes that are amazing for clearing out chaff while providing guardian. Their role is bodyguard so they should be a unit purely designed to support single units. They still might add joseph bugman in zhufbar so hopefully we'll get some dawi ranger lords and more hybrid lords but most importantly we should be getting rangers with powder and some melee focused ones with precursor weapons. The HE's are the faction to emulate so every faction should have a huge lord/hero choice to choose from. I'd love to see miner heroes that were really good support heroes as well as more thane variants to choose from.
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Jun 24, 2022 21:57
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I thought HE just had Princes, Princesses, and Archmages. tbf Archmages can be of each lore but they're all the same outside of your flavor of spells
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Jun 24, 2022 22:10
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oh there is that White Lion dude. uhh Alastair?
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Jun 24, 2022 22:11
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I really want to see the Stunties get some kind of mechanic for, idk, Grombrindal or Thorgrim or something related to reuniting the Karaz Ankor. Not necessarily conquering all of it outright, rather making sure that Dawi hold all the holds. Kraka Drak up in Norsca all the way to Karak Zorn in the Southlands. Think of the major holds providing some kind of buff or something, to reflect the dwarves accomplishing what they literally never loving shut up about. Along the lines of the Wood Elves healing their trees. Something that's flavorful and gives you an incentive to give a poo poo about holding territory beyond just painting the map. Also: Rune golems, just because I think they're a cool idea. Also also: Thunderbarges because that mod was dope as hell.
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Jun 24, 2022 22:18
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Dawi mainly just need a unit or two that can do well specifically in the Skaven matchup where they get out-gunned completely, Skaven's DLC units give them so much variety and almost all of them are good at murdering large amounts of slow infantry and shorter ranged units and low damage high armor heroes and infantry. A better airforce would help, if gyrocopter gunners had an increased amount of units per group or they had the modded thunderbarge officially added that would probably do it.
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Jun 24, 2022 22:51
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I R SMART LIKE ROCK posted:I thought HE just had Princes, Princesses, and Archmages. tbf Archmages can be of each lore but they're all the same outside of your flavor of spells They have nobles that have like 4 mount options that allow them to counter a ton of threats, lore masters which are basically combat casters, and i think a white lion hero but i honestly don't remember if that was vanilla or modded haha. The lords have melee lords, ranged hybrid lords, and archmages but every one of them has great flexible mount options that can make them play very differently. They also have that sister of avalorn hero and i think 1 more hybrid hero too. The key is you wanna have a ton of options so late game when you're just pumping out armies to slowly grind down the map you can make unique armies instead of pumping out the same loving army 15 times. Late game dawi is literally the same 11 units in every loving army. Runelord, runesmith, thane, engineer, cannon, organ gun, 2 bugmans, etc.
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Jun 24, 2022 23:01
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my secret hope is that they'll introduce legendary heroes for every faction, give all those artists something to do.
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Jun 24, 2022 23:16
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Warriors of Chaos being a hybrid settled/horde faction like Vampirates and Ogres (kind of) would make a lot of sense to me. It'd be fun if their was a system sort of like the Daemons faction where you could get favor with certain gods to unlock units and if your generals could ascend to become demons when you hit max level or something.Gonkish posted:I really want to see the Stunties get some kind of mechanic for, idk, Grombrindal or Thorgrim or something related to reuniting the Karaz Ankor. Not necessarily conquering all of it outright, rather making sure that Dawi hold all the holds. Kraka Drak up in Norsca all the way to Karak Zorn in the Southlands. I'd like to see these factions fleshed out a little more. Especially the norse dwarves since it's right in the middle of all the action on the RoC campaign.
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Jun 24, 2022 23:18
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Arghy posted:They have nobles that have like 4 mount options that allow them to counter a ton of threats, lore masters which are basically combat casters, and i think a white lion hero but i honestly don't remember if that was vanilla or modded haha. The lords have melee lords, ranged hybrid lords, and archmages but every one of them has great flexible mount options that can make them play very differently. They also have that sister of avalorn hero and i think 1 more hybrid hero too. oh if we're also talking heroes then yeah there is no white lion hero. it's Noble, Mage, Loremaster and Handmaiden. I find Nobles to be campaign map heroes going around performing actions. so honestly I never really noticed their mount options. to be honest late game armies do always tend to look the same because you take the tier 4/5 options, for elves it's Dragon of some flavor, Sisters of Avalorn, Phoenix Guard. I'll sometimes have a Prince / Princess with reduced LSG upkeep that's a cheap spot filler army for defending the home territory it is funny the king Dawi stan is jealous of High Elves. they would be delighted to know this
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Jun 24, 2022 23:39
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Norsca has the problem that they are not dwarves or empire and people only know how to play as such. You let the enemy into your territory, let them take frozen hell holes they can't defend, then run over them and sack them for cash. You need at most one frozen hell hole city built up. The rest of your land is ablative armor.
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Jun 24, 2022 23:41
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Third World Reagan posted:Norsca has the problem that they are not dwarves or empire and people only know how to play as such. yeah norsca territory also has the benefit of having lots of natural choke points and funnels so you can get the drop on them. plus every knows the true capitol of Norsca is Couronne
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Jun 24, 2022 23:50
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Too bad Norscans don't know what a wall is.
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Jun 25, 2022 00:01
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when I think of fantasy hell viking raiders, I think of a bunch of scraggly dudes hiding out in the forest while Frenchmen poke around their poo poo longhouses and grumble about the cold
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Jun 25, 2022 00:33
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Kaiju Cage Match posted:Too bad Norscans don't know what a wall is. it's one o them things with fur and tusks, right?
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Jun 25, 2022 01:00
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People always complain about siege battles and the norscans don't even get to build walls and people still complain!
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Jun 25, 2022 01:02
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Jamwad Hilder posted:Warriors of Chaos being a hybrid settled/horde faction like Vampirates and Ogres (kind of) would make a lot of sense to me. It'd be fun if their was a system sort of like the Daemons faction where you could get favor with certain gods to unlock units and if your generals could ascend to become demons when you hit max level or something. In fiction most Warriors of Chaos groups are just huge roving armies travelling the Chaos wastes fighting each other for their gods' favor, until one becomes strong enough and attracts enough followers to go down south. So yeah, a hybrid settled/horde faction fits them to a T. Definitely would be fitting to fight and curry differen chaos god favors, up to and including daemon prince status.
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Jun 25, 2022 01:53
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DaysBefore posted:Dwarves seem pretty hard to rework probably better to just remove them entirely tbh agreed
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Jun 25, 2022 01:58
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Third World Reagan posted:People always complain FTFY
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Jun 25, 2022 02:07
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I R SMART LIKE ROCK posted:oh if we're also talking heroes then yeah there is no white lion hero. it's Noble, Mage, Loremaster and Handmaiden. I find Nobles to be campaign map heroes going around performing actions. so honestly I never really noticed their mount options. Nobles are going to be loving amazing in armies with the chariot and mass reworks. They are also already extremely good anti-large on foot, given the amount of large threats added, I think they'll be putting in work in IE.
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Jun 25, 2022 02:21
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Any good info from the Reddit Q&A session CA was running today?
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Jun 25, 2022 02:28
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I really hate the new sieges lol. What if sieges but they take even longer and are weird to manage.
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Jun 25, 2022 02:34
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Crazy Joe Wilson posted:Any good info from the Reddit Q&A session CA was running today? I'm pretty sure the post today was just to collect questions for a future blog post, probably in a couple weeks (they've already committed to talking about starting positions for this next one).
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Jun 25, 2022 02:50
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DaysBefore posted:Dwarves seem pretty hard to rework probably better to just remove them entirely tbh Spotted the elf.
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Jun 25, 2022 03:01
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orangelex44 posted:They have the hunting thing too. The hunting thing is a pain in the rear end because it doesn't give you a real heads up on where the hell the monster is gonna be if you don't know. Having to raid a spot in North America when all your guys are out in Russia is rough. It'd be better if you could trigger multiple hunts at once so you weren't just biding time waiting for the travel.
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Jun 25, 2022 08:45
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In singleplayer the lore of Yang seems to be hands-down better than Yin. Am I missing something big for either? Yin has the cool missile reflect spell but while its neat and useful against the AI, isn't a huge gamechanger unlike the cheap, spammable breath spell and the slow-moving huge wall of fire. Any other Yin spells I should really re-evaluate? (Getting easy access to a whopping map-wide -40% fire resist, even for one army only, is nice too).
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Jun 25, 2022 17:37
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Ravenfood posted:In singleplayer the lore of Yang seems to be hands-down better than Yin. Am I missing something big for either? Yin has the cool missile reflect spell but while its neat and useful against the AI, isn't a huge gamechanger unlike the cheap, spammable breath spell and the slow-moving huge wall of fire. Any other Yin spells I should really re-evaluate? Doesn't Yin have the summon?
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Jun 25, 2022 18:06
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orangelex44 posted:Doesn't Yin have the summon? It does, yeah. I'd forgotten about that, tbh, but they are nice. Cast time is a little long though, but still.
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Jun 25, 2022 18:18
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Ravenfood posted:It does, yeah. I'd forgotten about that, tbh, but they are nice. Cast time is a little long though, but still. Yeah. It's been a while since I played (waiting on IE like the majority), but I rather liked Yin for having workable damage spells plus the spear summon. IIRC Yang was more damage, but lacked that emergency utility. I don't think I ever really used either of their buff spells.
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Jun 25, 2022 19:10
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So with regards to the map and Ind/Khuresh being so prominent on it, my total shot in the dark is that there's only two more race DLCs coming: Chaos Dwarves and "Dogs of War". DoW are in quotes because my dream is that they add 1-3 units from every remaining faction people could hope for - I'm talking Araby, Nippon, Amazons, Ind, and Khuresh along with Tilea and Estalia - along with a mechanic where certain NPC nations get limited rosters that pull from this pool to give local flavor (and allow for alliance recruitment!). You can work in Albion (Norsca) and Hobgoblin Khanate (Greenskins) with this mechanic, and maybe even Nagash (although he's probably a DLC of his own some day). They might not get any LLs in the traditional sense, but only mercenary leaders that act as hordes. I say this because WH2 taught us that stuff won't be added unless if fits on both the combined map and original game map... and that for the most part, while provinces within a map's boundaries could be tweaked quite a bit those boundaries themselves were mostly fixed. Yes, ME shifted east but those lands were always there from the start - they were just locked out from play. It seems drastically unlikely that the Realm map is set up to expand to the south or east enough in this way to allow for the Tilea, Estalia, Ind, or Khuresh... which means that they're all off the table to be added in the traditional fashion. However, outside of the Chaos Dwarves, there just aren't very many candidate races for a full DLC - you've got maybe Nagash if you think he deserves a whole roster, but after that you're all the way down to Hobgoblin Khanate-levels of unlikeliness for potential candidates. While DoW isn't an eighth edition tabletop army (it's been more than twenty years for them), and thus isn't guaranteed to show up, they're decently popular and did have a published army in older editions similar to Kislev or the Vampire Coast. It's not inconceivable that they never show up, but it seems a safe bet that they'll be involved one way or another before CA is finished. That means we're left with three mutually exclusive requirements: 1) whoever gets added needs to fit on the Realm map; 2) Ind and Khuresh are on the IE map and it would be terrible PR to leave them empty or as placeholders forever; and 3) DoW had an army book while implies they're on the to-add list. It sure seems a hell of a lot easier to design just a couple units for Ind/Khuresh than an entire roster/half-roster with LLs, and similarly it seems easier to try and re-use hordes than to expand the Realm map by another 20% or more. Plus, even if this hypothetical DLC didn't have a full slot of LLs (or any, for that matter) I don't think people would complain very much if it was adding some representation to all their favorite minor factions.
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Jun 26, 2022 02:58
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Swap one of the npc Cathay factions with Khuresh invaders and put an Ind faction where the lizardmen are.
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Jun 26, 2022 04:01
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Kislev's hybrid units are cool, but I'm a bit stumped as to what to do when they're up against similar units. Any tips on how to do Kislev vs Kislev fights? And Kislev vs Tzeentch? And I guess the reverse once I get around to playing a Tzeentch campaign? I ended up autoresolving Tzeentch's survival battle. I'm pretty far into my Kislev campaign, about to get my third soul, but still haven't had a chance to touch a large part of the roster, most of my armies being ones that I confederated. Katarina should favor Ice Guard, both due to the upkeep reduction she give them and their magic weapons being useful against the foes she'll face in the Chaos Realm. As I approach the endgame, should I shuffle out some of the armored Kossars to secondary armies, and which units and their associated redline skills should I purchase in their stead? Bear cavalry or bear artillery and sleds? I don't have a feel for which of their spells are best yet. Dr Christmas fucked around with this message at 04:24 on Jun 26, 2022 |
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Jun 26, 2022 04:06
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I’m not really a fan of Little Grom since it’s only one unit. Generally Ice Guard + Tzar Shields + Bear Cav is good enough for everything. You can add Streltsi and Sleds for flavor, sleds are still good if you want more AI power or just want to bait the AI with them since they’re bad at dealing with skirmishes units.
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Jun 26, 2022 04:41
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Heavy war sleds all the way with some bear cav, get a healing priest and just roll everyone together in a big murder ball while your ice guard make a firing line. Tzcheench gets absolutely murdered in melee and doesn't really have charge defense so run them down with mobility. Kislev is mostly about their mobility and bear cav + bear lord + bear hero will murder everything short of greater demons. The hawks of misha doesn't deal FF damage so cast that right as you charge into a blob then retreat as it goes off.
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Jun 26, 2022 04:48
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Against tzeentch, send everyone into melee Against kislev, send everyone into melee and hope you got better cav or chariots
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Jun 26, 2022 04:52
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Clearly they're saving Ind and Kuresh for game 4 
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Jun 26, 2022 04:58
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The trailer for the fourth game will be a lot of gruff Sigmaresque talk about the dangers of chaos punctuated by glimpses of demons and Inception horns. Then in the end there'll be a line like 'And we shall fight to the last, in His name' or something and the title will fade up: "Total War: Warhammer 4...0,000" along with a vague release date and the hashtag #4theEmperor
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Jun 26, 2022 08:22
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why is everyone clamoring for more human expys? it just means yet another 20+ settlement ordertide faction gets added aren't there any non-aligned races to be added? why not make more flavors of dwards and elfs
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Jun 26, 2022 12:25
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Dr Christmas posted:Kislev's hybrid units are cool, but I'm a bit stumped as to what to do when they're up against similar units. Any tips on how to do Kislev vs Kislev fights? And Kislev vs Tzeentch? And I guess the reverse once I get around to playing a Tzeentch campaign? I ended up autoresolving Tzeentch's survival battle. Other armies are going to be more varied. Kossars remain useful throughout the game but become more and more relegated to being archers as time goes on. I had more success transitioning my melee units from armored kossars to tzar guard, who are very, very durable. Other excellent units to use are both varieties of sled: light ones are cheaper, faster, and recruit in one turn and are the cornerstone of my quickly recruited defensive armies. Heavy ones take longer to get and can't kite quite as well (more on that in a second) but are much better in melee. Bear riders are excellent melee bruiser monstrous cavalry. In general my melee line relies on having a lot of priests in every army. I think having one of each works well. Streltsi are very useful if you can keep them firing, which usually means putting them behind the priests and giving them a firing angle, and in non-katarin armies I do think a mix of ice guard, streltsi, and kossars is probably the most cost-effective ranged composition. Use tzar guard if you need more infantry, but I usually dont need many of them, if any. If you can afford more ice guard, go for it, they are strict upgrades to kossars. Like with my Katarin army, I like having a little grom and think they smash large infantry blobs very, very well. Non-Katarin or Boris armies (who should just play to their gimmick) use a decent amount of combined arms. Generally I use 6 sleds in 3 groups to skirmish, usually pulling back toward my lines but ideally, two groups pull to the sides while one pulls straight back. Timed right this means a 3rd of the army enters my ranged units' firing line after having been shot up by my sleds, and get wiped out, because an entire army firing on 1/3rd of an army doesnt go so well for that 3rd. Then the sleds go back up to assist the other two sled groups and repeat. You mentioned spells: I work hard to have an Ice Witch with Ice and a Tempest Frost Maiden in every army. I think both lores have standout spells that justify their inclusion. The Ice lore has it's slow: that thing is absurd. It will keep several units effectively locked down from moving. It stacks with the slow from the tempest lore effect and the slow from frostbite effects. You can just make 3-5 units stop moving for huge amounts of time. It's crazy. And, it can help your slower war sleds avoid fast anti-large cavalry and let them shoot them up happily. Frost blades is a great buff to let your hybrid units punch above their weight in melee. The rest aren't standout spells but those two are just great. Tempest also has great buffs: a range buff that also slowly enemies through its lore effect? Great. The charge one is less useful only because I tend not to use the really high-charge units it would most benefit (gryphon legion) but it still has a niche. The bombardment is very nice. Hawks of Miska is low-key very useful: some damage but without any friendly fire in a decently large AoE with a morale debuff can help you break enemies early, and Blizzard is the superior huge nuke spell if you can ball up your enemies. Against AI, late game Kislev is all about breaking up your enemies' advance with skirmishers and defeating them piecemeal using a ton of slow effects so they arrive one at a time to your relatively fragile melee line, and then using buffs (priest AoE, Frost Blades) and charges from either sleds or bear cavalry to quickly kill them, then repeat as the next unit arrives. Against Kislev, figure out which way you are stronger and do that. I tend to outrange them because I rely on kossars early, so use magic and ranged to beat them in a shooting duel (and the AI doesnt focus fire as well). Against Tzeentch it depends: if you can get your sleds and bears to the side and advance simultaneously you can sometimes get the whole army to use its "skirmish" retreat step into itself and blob up for some nukes and slows while you either charge your hybrid troops in or just get them within firing range and eliminate them that way. Here is where the Ice defensive dome actually works well: send a few units ahead to bait fire, throw down the defensive spell to absorb as much as you can, and then while the AI is wasting shots into few units with a hugely boosted ward save, you move up your other ranged units and shoot the poo poo out of them.
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Jun 26, 2022 13:09
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99pct of germs posted:why is everyone clamoring for more human expys? it just means yet another 20+ settlement ordertide faction gets added After Chorfs are added they really have sort of exhausted almost everything from the lore except a few factions they'd need to build almost from scratch like Halflings, Hobgoblins, Amazons, Fimir (who already got in as part of Norsca), Ind, Nippon, Araby, Kuresh etc. And except for Halflings, Hobgoblins and Fimir they're all almost exclusively human. Zore fucked around with this message at 13:31 on Jun 26, 2022 |
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Jun 26, 2022 13:29
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