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Should I step down as head of twitter This poll is closed. |
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| Yes |
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420 | 4.43% |
| No |
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69 | 0.73% |
| Goku |
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9001 | 94.85% |
| Total: | 9490 votes | ||
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Sophy Wackles posted:Did he waive due diligence though? Sounded like twitter was refusing to provide any of the internal user data until after he agreed to the deal and started making threats. I would guess twitter has been lying for years about bot and shill type accounts. He waived every right to due diligence and process, waived the ability to look at their books and finances, and basically agreed point blank to a contract they wrote that was incredibly one sided that he obviously didn't read because he was high as balls on uppers and no one even his lawyers can get him to sit and listen to exactly how loving bad it was to not do any basic research and look at their books. Him telling Twitter they would get bought at 54 dollars a share with no due diligence and agree to every term basically was an instant sell to the board and he hosed himself.
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Jul 13, 2022 03:07
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waiving diligence doesn't necessarily mean twitter can't be held accountable if twitter's public statements to investors have been lies, which i'm sure is the only approach elon's legal team can take. i think it's going to come down to a judge who knows nothing about the internet or bots or statistics or even basic math trying to decide if twitter's public metrics about monetizable users and bots amount to a lie or not.
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Jul 13, 2022 03:12
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UCS Hellmaker posted:He waived every right to due diligence and process, waived the ability to look at their books and finances, and basically agreed point blank to a contract they wrote that was incredibly one sided that he obviously didn't read because he was high as balls on uppers and no one even his lawyers can get him to sit and listen to exactly how loving bad it was to not do any basic research and look at their books. 54.20  a share
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Jul 13, 2022 03:14
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Barudak posted:I wish Trump had just stuck to savaging people on twitter instead if imploding america. https://twitter.com/rawbub/status/1546992672597938181?s=21&t=UsDU2RbH0yN-5uymn4YC4Q
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Jul 13, 2022 03:17
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Sophy Wackles posted:Did he waive due diligence though? Sounded like twitter was refusing to provide any of the internal user data until after he agreed to the deal and started making threats. No, he didn't start yelling about twitter's data and bot accounts until after he signed the merger deal. At which point the due diligence thing was already over. Then 3 things happened: 1. Telsa stock took a big dump. 2. Twitter stock didn't go up. 3. The stock market overall was going down. #3 means he way overpayed. He bought at the peak of the market, and agreed to too high of a price because twitter was playing hard to get. He got double-dared into spending $44 billion. #2 means that investors aren't confident he can actually pull it off. And #1 means that people aren't fully jokerfied into the Cult of Musk. They see him putting up a buttload of Tesla stock as collateral and thing "wow maybe this insanely overvalued stock won't go up forever". Telsa's stock runs on Elon hype, right now Elon looks like an idiot who stuck his dick in a beehive because somebody said he couldn't impregnate a bee. Plus it's made the deal more expensive for him and his bankers. Sophy Wackles posted:I would guess twitter has been lying for years about bot and shill type accounts. Here's the thing: anywhere they report on this, they talk MDAU: monetizable daily active users. So the twitter bots that spam every Musk-related tweet with "Elon Musk will double your bitcoin, send money here"? Those aren't MDAUs. They're bots running scripts that don't see ads, or twitter doesn't charge for the ads they load. So twitter is saying less than 5% of the users that they charge advertisers for are bots. Or in other words, "less than 5% of our non-bot users are bots". And that's what Elon will have to prove: that twitter is lying about a thing carefully chosen to be true but meaningless. Klyith fucked around with this message at 03:21 on Jul 13, 2022 |
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Jul 13, 2022 03:17
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Bad Purchase posted:waiving diligence doesn't necessarily mean twitter can't be held accountable if twitter's public statements to investors have been lies, which i'm sure is the only approach elon's legal team can take. he has to be able to prove it, though he has to prove not just that the bot numbers are wrong, but also that Twitter knew they were wrong and deliberately lied about them it doesn't seem like he has any real evidence yet, and it's unlikely that the judge will let him go on a fishing expedition
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Jul 13, 2022 03:18
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Thanks for the clarification everyone. It’s going to be interesting to follow in court and watch Elon and twitter hopefully both go up in flames.
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Jul 13, 2022 03:21
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Bad Purchase posted:i think it's going to come down to a judge who knows nothing about the internet or bots or statistics or even basic math trying to decide if twitter's public metrics about monetizable users and bots amount to a lie or not. Oh it's almost a guarantee that they'll try to find a judge who doesn't even know what a bot is or could be in the context of Twitter. Twitter will show a picture of the maid from The Jetsons using a computer that says "THIS IS WHAT MUSK ACTUALLY BELIEVES"
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Jul 13, 2022 03:21
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Main Paineframe posted:he has to be able to prove it, though a trial like this isn't really about proof, it's about swaying a judge. proof is one way to do that, but probably one of the less effective ways out there.
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Jul 13, 2022 03:26
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Bad Purchase posted:a trial like this isn't really about proof, it's about swaying a judge. proof is one way to do that, but probably one of the less effective ways out there. the specifics matter a fair bit because the courts are wise to people pulling bullshit to try to worm out of a deal they've changed their mind on if he had reason to think that the bot numbers were fake before he signed the deal to buy the company, then he shouldn't have signed that deal his justification for backing out is that he thought the numbers were true at the time, but now he reasonably believes that they're false. so he has to convince a judge that he had good reason to change his mind on that, and that it wasn't just a bullshit pretext to back out
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Jul 13, 2022 03:36
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Bad Purchase posted:waiving diligence doesn't necessarily mean twitter can't be held accountable if twitter's public statements to investors have been lies, which i'm sure is the only approach elon's legal team can take. It's not even that, because the actual number of bots on twitter is a fundamentally unknowable number; everyone involved is just choosing the methodology they like best to make their best guess, and the methodology Twitter uses to determine how many bots are on its network was formally codified as part of the deal and stipulated to ahead of time by both parties; if Elon had problems with it, he probably shouldn't have waived due diligence before signing. He has zero ground to stand on. From a legal standpoint, the question comes down to: 1) Did Twitter, using their own internal practices, knowingly, fraudulently misrepresent the number of bots on their network to Elon and their shareholders by a materially significant amount? If they did, they would be hosed, but if you pay attention, Elon's lawyers, as opposed to Elon, are very careful not to accuse Twitter of malicious fraud because they have absolutely nothing to back it up. Instead, they are accusing Twitter of refusing to turn over the sensitive internal numbers they would need to do their own tests, which sounds like a reasonable complaint, except that A) they already waived due diligence so even if they do their own tests, it doesn't actually matter and B) part of the agreement is that Twitter is not required to hand over any sensitive internal information that they feel could damage their value as a company if disclosed, which is a clause Elon probably should have thought harder about before agreeing to. 2) if Twitter didn't knowingly lie, were they at least negligent in measuring the number of bots on their network? The problem for Musk is that a company is generally considered to not be legally negligent as long as they adhere to both the law and standard industry practices, even if those practices turn out to be functionally inadequate (*Cough2008bankingIndustryCough*); and Twitter is, more or less by definition, the industry standard for the industry that they're in. Who is Elon going to claim is using a better system at measuring bots on their network than Twitter: Gab? Parler? Whatever the gently caress Trump is doing?
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Jul 13, 2022 03:43
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all the things you are saying rely on a rational judge that understands the case and has no ulterior motive meanwhile at the rittenhouse trial the judge believed (or pretended to) pinch to zoom was hocus pocus in order to contest photo evidence
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Jul 13, 2022 04:09
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Sophy Wackles posted:Thanks for the clarification everyone. It’s going to be interesting to follow in court and watch Elon and twitter hopefully both go up in flames. inshallah
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Jul 13, 2022 04:15
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Bad Purchase posted:all the things you are saying rely on a rational judge that understands the case and has no ulterior motive this has nothing to do with technology or bots tho it's just "did musk believe twitter's numbers when he signed the deal" and "why does he not believe the numbers now" remember, this is contract law, something that (unlike criminal law) is taken very seriously by the judicial system. there's no loving around when dealing with billionaires' promises to each other
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Jul 13, 2022 04:38
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The number of bots and the volume of bot tweets are two wildly different things. Humans can't post as quickly or as often as a bot can, 24/7/365, nor can they scrape the data to tweet for maximum impact as efficiently. I wouldn't be surprised if the number of active, posting bots at any one time is significantly lower than the number of humans. They're just much more voluminous and (marginally) more annoying. A bot that doesn't tweet or rarely tweets, like in those million followers packages you can buy to puff up your clout, is a different story. It can be harder to tell if it's a bot as long as the program that spawns it is halfway decent at spoofing its IP.
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Jul 13, 2022 04:55
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Bad Purchase posted:waiving diligence doesn't necessarily mean twitter can't be held accountable if twitter's public statements to investors have been lies, which i'm sure is the only approach elon's legal team can take. the difference between an actual user and a bot/curl/wget script is virtually nil without things like captchas* *and captchas can, funnily enough, be solved by the same Google suite of tools. Have Google captcha read the words . send recording to Google translation service. get exact text back into previously mentioned Google captcha
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Jul 13, 2022 04:59
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Bad Purchase posted:waiving diligence doesn't necessarily mean twitter can't be held accountable if twitter's public statements to investors have been lies, which i'm sure is the only approach elon's legal team can take. So what you're saying is it's a coin flip.
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Jul 13, 2022 08:09
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EVIL Gibson posted:edit: yah Elon should be fined for pulling out if he was shown any sensitive information which, from his responses, were quite sensitive. i dunno do we really want elon to form a connection between pulling out and bad things happening?
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Jul 13, 2022 08:27
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Robo Reagan posted:i dunno do we really want elon to form a connection between pulling out and bad things happening? "Can't bust?" - The Musk
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Jul 13, 2022 08:31
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https://twitter.com/mannyfidel/status/1546992447770824705?s=20&t=BvX2USSk3NBNts8DcrZp9A
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Jul 13, 2022 08:46
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Robo Reagan posted:i dunno do we really want elon to form a connection between pulling out and bad things happening? a lot of single mothers and very hateful kids he left behind , I sure hope it sticks
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Jul 13, 2022 08:46
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Today Donald Trump truly became President, god bless
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Jul 13, 2022 08:58
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steinrokkan posted:Today Donald Trump truly became President, god bless It's probably the most cogent, accurate and hilarious slam I've ever seen him land.
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Jul 13, 2022 09:23
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Robo Reagan posted:https://twitter.com/mannyfidel/status/1546992447770824705?s=20&t=BvX2USSk3NBNts8DcrZp9A dang
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Jul 13, 2022 09:46
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Donald Trump so presidential he's still assassinating people while out of office
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Jul 13, 2022 09:55
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is that what we’re calling two sad gross old dudes slapfighting now
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Jul 13, 2022 16:49
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sugar free jazz posted:is that what we’re calling two sad gross old dudes slapfighting now sad gross old dudes slapfighting is literally the only thing that matters or has any capacity to affect anything in America, you will speak of their dementia gibbering with respect
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Jul 13, 2022 16:59
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Robo Reagan posted:https://twitter.com/mannyfidel/status/1546992447770824705?s=20&t=BvX2USSk3NBNts8DcrZp9A I wonder if musk will allow trump back on Twitter after this
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Jul 13, 2022 18:46
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Robo Reagan posted:https://twitter.com/mannyfidel/status/1546992447770824705?s=20&t=BvX2USSk3NBNts8DcrZp9A trump can tell elon is just another don jr and is treating him accordingly
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Jul 13, 2022 18:50
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twitter promised they’d let trump tweet again when he wins in 2024 if he helps them humiliate musk
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Jul 13, 2022 18:52
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Once in a while Trump really makes me chuckle in a good way. He is 100% correct too.
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Jul 13, 2022 18:57
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Heartbreaking: The Worst Person You Know Just Made A Great Point
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Jul 13, 2022 20:37
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Tarkus posted:Once in a while Trump really makes me chuckle in a good way. He is 100% correct too. yup
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Jul 13, 2022 21:03
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Strange Poon posted:trump can tell elon is just another don jr and is treating him accordingly Haha goddamn.
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Jul 13, 2022 21:10
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You guys realize that's not the actual fatass posting that, right? I've unfortunately seen many examples of his twitter posts over the years, he isn't anywhere near that coherent.
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Jul 13, 2022 21:56
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Much like Trump made us all look at George W in a different way, Musk and Desantis have me rooting for Trump to continue bodying them.
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Jul 13, 2022 21:59
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Gologle posted:You guys realize that's not the actual fatass posting that, right? I've unfortunately seen many examples of his twitter posts over the years, he isn't anywhere near that coherent. He is shockingly coherent with insults though. Man doesn't miss
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Jul 13, 2022 22:07
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Gologle posted:You guys realize that's not the actual fatass posting that, right? I've unfortunately seen many examples of his twitter posts over the years, he isn't anywhere near that coherent. I'm actually fairly certain it is. it's got the rambling cadence down, plus would Trump really let anyone truth for him?
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Jul 13, 2022 22:08
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Joe public still thinks of Elon as a Tony Stark genius figure, and the world is about to find out just how dumb he really is.
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Jul 14, 2022 10:31
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Gologle posted:You guys realize that's not the actual fatass posting that, right? I've unfortunately seen many examples of his twitter posts over the years, he isn't anywhere near that coherent. Genuinely, I am unsure. Being a catty bitch is one of the few things about him that seems out with his handler's control.
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