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Doctor Spaceman posted:Time to just give up on Control Shaman and put it alongside Shadow Priest as a deck I just cannot get to work. 
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Jul 20, 2022 20:05
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Tin Tim posted:There was a brief window in wild where ctrl shaman was real with hagatha and nzoth and shudder as another nzoth instead of a misery machine. It will never come back hagatha shudderwock control shaman in standard was the dumbest fun i've had in this game 
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Jul 20, 2022 20:41
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There's an event on in Arena where every so often in the draft, you get a special pick from a limited number of special noncollectable cards. One of these cards is a 1 mana 2/2 Murloc that shuffles a copy of itself with +1/+1 into your deck. This card is mediocre going on terrible because shuffling a 1 mana 3/3 that in turn would shuffle another 1 mana 4/4 into your deck is straight up making your deck worse. Despite this, you see this card all the time and it's so revealing about the amount of players using draft aids because the special cards aren't visible on HSReplay stats, so people don't know how to rate them on their own.
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Jul 20, 2022 20:50
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Finally, a counter to Bad Luck Albatross.
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Jul 20, 2022 21:14
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BIG HEADLINE posted:Oh, poo poo. Now this is a card: And just like that, they fixed Duels (unless this doesn't work on Mycelium, since it's worded 'shuffle this card into your deck').
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Jul 20, 2022 21:25
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Jeza posted:There's an event on in Arena where every so often in the draft, you get a special pick from a limited number of special noncollectable cards. One of these cards is a 1 mana 2/2 Murloc that shuffles a copy of itself with +1/+1 into your deck. yeah I mean as always with Arena it depends what the card is up against in the selection, and obviously that's a card that scales if you can somehow guarantee that you can get like 4 copies of it in your starting deck because all the copies and the subsequent copies they generate benefit from each +1/+1 but that's a huge edge scenario..
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Jul 20, 2022 21:43
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Prime Gaming dropped a new reward, a free random legendary. It should be available until August 19th, so if you're not desperate for a different standard legendary you're missing right now, you should claim it after the new expansion is released.
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Jul 20, 2022 21:54
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it feels like the majority of legendaries from the next set are p bad though, too much setup for too little reward
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Jul 20, 2022 22:33
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Cry Havoc posted:it feels like the majority of legendaries from the next set are p bad though, too much setup for too little reward you say this but i'm crafting a golden remornia day one
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Jul 20, 2022 22:37
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Packs, packs, packs. Watching the theorycraft streams (starting tomorrow, July 21st) will give up to 2 packs on Twitch (redeem the first to start the timer on the second), while the live reenactment of "Tale of murder most foul" on friday the 22nd (10 am pt) will give additional pack drops as well (also surprise bundle drops, if you're lucky).
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Jul 20, 2022 22:58
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Jeza posted:There's an event on in Arena where every so often in the draft, you get a special pick from a limited number of special noncollectable cards. One of these cards is a 1 mana 2/2 Murloc that shuffles a copy of itself with +1/+1 into your deck. Agree that the battlecry generally does more harm than good, but I think you're overestimating its effect. Infinite murloc is a little worse than Blazing Battlemage, which is a fine arena card.
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Jul 20, 2022 23:06
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The 4 mana mage minion that conc's when you cast a secret is gonna be insane. Really do feel that wild secret mage could come back with some of these. Might even be renethal-capable given it has such insane draw.
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Jul 21, 2022 09:15
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Now that the whole expansion has been revealed what are peoples thoughts? I'm not super excited by any of the 'sets' of cards they're adding (Skeletons, Relics, Totems I guess, Rogue's new secrets) but a bunch of the individual cards seem like they could be interesting and pretty strong. The new Druid Mire Keeper is going to be in every single Druid deck for the next two years so... hooray.
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Jul 21, 2022 14:09
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 I was a bit surprised to see a card with the old Pure Paladin clause after they revealed the Elitist Snob, but I liked that old archetype even if I think at its best it was like T2? I'm looking forward to it again, and I'm going to predict that next year's core rotation will include some of the original Pure cards.
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Jul 21, 2022 14:33
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Yeah Pure Paladin might be viable just because of that legendary, it's so busted. Definitely looking forward to the highlights of getting Matron from it(Mage legendary dragon) and killing the opponent with Maki rolls.
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Jul 21, 2022 14:42
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The Countess seems like she'll be quite strong against slower decks but in a faster game I'm not sure you'll ever play a 7-mana do-nothing 7/7
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Jul 21, 2022 14:51
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predicted launch tier list so I can mock myself later: S Tier Aggro DH Wig/Bless Priest A Tier Ramp Druid Wildseed Hunter Pure Paladin B Tier Imp Warlock Evolve Shaman Miracle Rogue F tier Skelly Mage Enrage Warrior
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Jul 21, 2022 15:14
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I figure implock will be strong. Plenty of power spikes and reload. On the other hand, maybe it will be a bit too reliant on getting the location. Private Eye throws my initial impression of Gravedigger out the window. Don't need the payoff card to be crazy tempo like Stunner when the secrets are Patches. The secrets seem to be better tempo than usual too. Halkias seems like garbage, though. I was excited for the miracle rogue cards, but that was if I could draw my deck. Will be trying some Kael'thas + Maly stuff for the off chance it works. Playing totems seems really boring. Almost all in on drawing one legendary. Evolve is probably ok. Janky shadow/copy priest decks look fun. Can't be bothered to form an opinion on the rest.
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Jul 21, 2022 15:56
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The DH relic package looks interesting but I'm wary of it if near minion less Quest Hunter is still a thing. It's very dependent on having enemy minions to kill.
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Jul 21, 2022 17:59
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I am working on a new Kingsbane deck and I am not 100% happy with it so here it is please give me feedback and suggestions: ### KB # Class: Rogue # Format: Wild # # 2x (0) Preparation # 2x (1) Buccaneer # 2x (1) Deadly Poison # 2x (1) Gone Fishin' # 1x (1) Kingsbane # 1x (1) Paralytic Poison # 1x (1) Patches the Pirate # 2x (1) Prize Plunderer # 2x (1) Secret Passage # 2x (2) Blade Flurry # 1x (2) Cavern Shinyfinder # 2x (2) Eviscerate # 2x (2) Nitroboost Poison # 1x (2) Silverleaf Poison # 2x (2) Swindle # 1x (3) Raiding Party # 2x (4) Tinker's Sharpsword Oil # 2x (5) Cutting Class # AAEBAYO6AgaRvALl0QK77wLVjAOp6wOs6wMMiAeoCK8QqssD99QD590D890DgeQDkp8E958Et7ME/dMEAA== # # To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone
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Jul 21, 2022 19:15
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Kingsbane/Miracle why not? ### KB2.0 # Class: Rogue # Format: Wild # # 2x (0) Preparation # 2x (1) Buccaneer # 2x (1) Deadly Poison # 1x (1) Doomerang # 2x (1) Gone Fishin' # 1x (1) Kingsbane # 1x (1) Paralytic Poison # 1x (1) Patches the Pirate # 2x (1) Prize Plunderer # 2x (1) Secret Passage # 1x (2) Blade Flurry # 1x (2) Cavern Shinyfinder # 2x (2) Eviscerate # 1x (2) Nitroboost Poison # 1x (2) Silverleaf Poison # 1x (2) Swindle # 1x (3) Edwin VanCleef # 1x (3) Raiding Party # 1x (4) Edwin, Defias Kingpin # 2x (4) Tinker's Sharpsword Oil # 2x (5) Cutting Class # AAEBAYO6AgyyAqgIkbwCsc4C5dECu+8C1YwD590DgeQDqesDrOsD7YAECYgHrxCqywP31APz3QOSnwT3nwS3swT90wQA # # To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone
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Jul 21, 2022 19:50
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Current Silver Hand for anyone interested: ### 2nd Place # Class: Paladin # Format: Wild # # 2x (1) Lost in the Jungle # 2x (1) Oh My Yogg! # 2x (1) Righteous Cause # 2x (2) Air Raid # 2x (2) Far Watch Post # 2x (2) Hand of A'dal # 1x (2) Nat Pagle # 2x (2) Pursuit of Justice # 2x (2) Rebuke # 2x (3) Carnival Barker # 2x (3) Day at the Faire # 1x (3) Divine Favor # 2x (3) Muster for Battle # 2x (4) Balloon Merchant # 2x (4) Lightfused Stegodon # 1x (5) Lothraxion the Redeemed # 1x (5) Quartermaster # AAEBAeq3BASnBfsI7A+H3gMN7Q+4xwLZxwKd7AKMrQOWtgPKwQOC3gOD3gOE3gOi3gP36AO9uAUA # # To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone
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Jul 21, 2022 21:20
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Desert Bus posted:Current Silver Hand for anyone interested: this is the one I’ve been trying to make work Quest Paladin Class: Paladin Format: Wild 1x (1) Avenge 2x (1) Blessed Goods 2x (1) Blessing of Wisdom 2x (1) Crystology 2x (1) Desperate Measures 2x (1) First Day of School 1x (1) Galloping Savior 1x (1) Holy Maki Roll 1x (1) Judgment of Justice 2x (1) Knight of Anointment 2x (1) Lost in the Jungle 2x (1) Oh My Yogg! 2x (1) Peasant 1x (1) Reckoning 1x (1) Repentance 1x (1) Righteous Cause 1x (1) Rise to the Occasion 1x (1) Sphere of Sapience 2x (1) Tour Guide 2x (2) Equality 2x (2) Garrison Commander 2x (3) Day at the Faire 1x (3) Prince Renathal 2x (4) Dun Baldar Bridge 2x (4) Lightfused Stegodon AAEBAYsWCugBjK0Dj84DyesD2+4DtPYD0PcDyKAE0L0El+8ED90K1RO4xwLZxwLZ/gL5kwObzQOezQOD3gOi3gPM6wP09gOV+QPunwTnuAQA or perhaps keeping it to 30 cards and maxing out at day at the faire / muster for battle, think that would be slightly more consistent in being able to play the quest reward on turn 5
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Jul 22, 2022 01:43
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Starsfan posted:let me know how it goes! I think Cheesemonger is a cool card.. the spells it generates can get in the way of your barbaric sorceress plays though, and if they ever get shuffled into your deck Finley style it will tank your Balinda / Deepwater Evokers Yeah, I immediately realized that would be an issue. I'll give it another go today and see if my record improves (went 2-3 before going back to variations of burgle reno/thal/SI:7 rogue). Cheesemonger is a goddamn tragedy. It's not at all poorly statted, the ability is random enough to not be reliable, but it's trash because it doesn't have initiative of any kind and doesn't combo with anything else in a broken way. I miss being able to sneak a package of weird stuff into an otherwise straight-to-legend deck and barely notice the difference.
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Jul 22, 2022 04:05
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Nathria looks like a big ol' mess. More hand manipulation, more secrets, and another (very welcome) slower keyword (like Corrupt, Dredge..) that will be overshadowed by the power level of everything else in the set. Also an old school Shaman unsupported theme pivot! With that said, here's an unsolicited list of the dumb poo poo I'm looking forward to: Skydiving Instructor is back, but BIGGER. I don't know if there are enough viable "big stats, bad battlecry" cards to build a package around this in standard, but I plan to find out.  Day 1 craft. Toss it in every deck. Chaos Reigns.  Obnoxious, but slots right into a Burgle deck and adds some flavor to a possibly viable Secret Mage archetype.  Deathrattle Demon Hunter is the only DH deck I've enjoyed at all (RIP Illidari Studies), so I'll give this a whirl. NOTE: DH was a mistake and should be deleted regardless. HONORABLE MENTION:  Bad card, big nostalgia: It's 2019. "Pandemic" is still just a movie, and you're hoping this Faceless Lackey does/does not poop out a Doomsayer.
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Jul 22, 2022 05:28
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Excelzior posted:predicted launch tier list so I can mock myself later: Way too conservative. This is a post-1st nerf tier list. On launch tier S will be everything that can exploit new Kaelthas, and any aggro fast enough to compete with that.
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Jul 22, 2022 15:33
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AnacondaHL posted:Way too conservative. This is a post-1st nerf tier list. Not seeing enough minion generation in the new set to make the card work reliably? So going back to mechs maybe. I hope I get the legendary! Also I assume that Muck Plumber supersedes Kaelthas? Or does it happen before Kaelthas takes effect?
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Jul 22, 2022 15:51
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I’m excited for this new expansion, lots of fun cards to play around with!
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Jul 22, 2022 16:09
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As with Voyage to Sunken City, I'm mostly pleased with the direction this set is taking and love the theme. I'm nervous about Kael'thas but at least it's minion-based instead of spell-based and requires a mix of cheap and expensive minions in deck (or reliable generation of one or both) to function properly. Most of my frustrations with the current Standard meta are based on UiS cards, particularly the quests and quest assist cards.
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Jul 22, 2022 16:17
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I dont believe in nu kaelthas old kaelthas was dominant because you could run a bunch of spells that drew you more cards to keep the chain going Minions on the other hand almost exclusively give you card draw in the form of Deathrattles or End of Turn effects. How are you going to chain it? and if not, what minion is so dominant that it would be worth the deckbuilding of including garbage like Tinyfin just to cheat him out a turn or two earlier?
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Jul 22, 2022 16:29
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like I know brann+kelthuzad is enticing but if you're getting there you've already won the game 95% of the time
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Jul 22, 2022 16:32
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New Kael'thas (at least in Standard) seems like its only real application is combining Brann with stuff that's normally too expensive to Brann; your Mordresh/Jace/Denathrius/Kel'thuzad type thing. And honestly, that seems like overkill unless a big armor gain deck becomes popular. (Besides, if that was something decks really wanted to do, I think we would be seeing them do it with Mailbox Dancer.) There aren't many minions that add or refresh full mana, and you're going to run into board space issues if you try to build a big miracle turn with a bunch of cheap garbage. Maybe I'm missing something super-obvious, but I think new Kael'thas is going to be a dud. I'm looking forward to giving Relic DH a try.
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Jul 22, 2022 16:49
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Tier 1 is Token Danny Druid and all of the aggro decks that kill it
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Jul 22, 2022 16:54
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Firebert posted:Tier 1 is Token Danny Druid and all of the aggro decks that kill it I'd have to see how that druid deck plays against decks that are serious enough to play Mutanus before saying it's that busted, but I'm still shocked at how good the core token druid build seems to be.
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Jul 22, 2022 17:00
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Right, so the idea behind Kaelthas 2.0 is that you should already have enough gas to power your hand, so Kael's role switches to creating an unstoppable boardstate, or performing an OTK to just win. Examples: Kaelthas has the chance to singlehandidly bring back a Charge Warrior deck, as there is great synergy with To the Front, and you can put minions into the deck that are more flexible. Kaelthas might also elevate various Deathrattle Rogue packages into being busted, giving alternative play should you miss the early Smokescreen highroll. Druid is the easy example, in both ramp and Celestial forms. Kaelthas + Brann + X is so ubiquitous that I am assuming it will be in all the above and in Mage and in more. Anyone playing a control hoser deck would be using X as Mutanus for example. And Shaman already has the Pirhanna stuff, opening options for more fair but flexible use, not to mention some totem scam potential with 0- and 1-mana totems. Hunter has a shot at incorporating this into the Wildseed or Beast package, making their highrolls a bit more unfair. All of the above and more would have to flop to make Kaelthas have no impact, and I'm calling that plausible but not probable.
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Jul 22, 2022 17:02
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idk why tinyfin keeps coming up. Like it's funny but you can play a 1 cost and it's still really good. Cheating 10 mana is strong at any point of the game, not just turn 6, but it is especially unfair on turn 6.
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Jul 22, 2022 17:10
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No Wave posted:idk why tinyfin keeps coming up. Like it's funny but you can play a 1 cost and it's still really good. Cheating 10 mana is strong at any point of the game, not just turn 6, but it is especially unfair on turn 6. Because it's just shorthand for "cheap minions are usually significantly worse in the late game than cheap spells", and figuring out the exact balance of big payoffs to one drops/one drop producers to make Kael'thas work as mana cheating is going to take more refinement than people usually give it credit for. Laughing at Murloc Tinyfin is just easier than explaining that yes, Mistress of Mixtures is never going to be a card you regret running, but it's going to be a really weak draw after turn four and School Teacher probably won't be reliable enough to be your sole source of one-drops and etcetera.
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Jul 22, 2022 17:30
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Yeah I mean in the olden days a combo that was built around having 3 specific legendary minions in your hand (Kael'thas + Brann + X battlecry legendary) would be considered impracticable in a meta that has trended faster and faster, but I guess nowadays with tradeable and dredge and the abundance of cheap card draw it is possible.. The problem with the spell Kael'thas was that there was poo poo like lightning bloom or conjure mana biscuit as well as the spells that drew more cards that enabled massive combo turns, or in the case of lightning boom specifically cheating that poo poo out in the really early game. I don't see that being the case for the minion Kael'thas.
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Jul 22, 2022 18:16
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I think the Kael’Thas + Brann + Mordresh/Kelthuzad/whatever combo isn’t going to be as ubiquitous as people think. The fact that both pieces of the combo legendary means you need a lot of draw to consistently hit them both, and even more if the battlecry is also a legendary minion. Owl Warlock had a similar 2 legendary card combo and they usually made it through the top 20ish cards of their deck before pulling it off. I think there will definitely be decks that use it as a big finisher but I don’t think it’ll be the week 1 nerf that some people are worried about
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Jul 22, 2022 20:24
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Haha, Remornia+Reflecto+Charge is a three card OTK in wild.
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Jul 22, 2022 20:28
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