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Dr. Lunchables posted:I’m still laughing that a goon named Comstar is upset over the Clan Invasion. World class stuff. I bought the rule book that had rules for the Clans ('92 I guess I think it was the Compendium) , played IS Mech's and then lost every single game vs Clan Mech's my friend used. The irony is not lost.
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Jul 22, 2022 14:32
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Early on we did the 2/3rds rule for Clans vs IS since all we really had to go by was tonnage until BV started showing up. It was better, usually.
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Jul 22, 2022 14:35
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Want to say that one of the line devs around 2010 or so pretty much outright said that heavy lasers were pretty much a case of "if we redid the clan invasion we'd use these"
Der Waffle Mous fucked around with this message at 19:49 on Jul 22, 2022 |
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Jul 22, 2022 16:41
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Yeah, Randall Bills has often remarked that he feels the older devs got the idea behind the Clans wrong, from a strictly at the table perspective. Imagine a Clan force built around groups of three, or a weapons with the same big damage but extremely limited range: those were the sort of things he wished were adopted, rather than "our guns do more damage and have greater range and our pilots are better and we operate in base groups of five to top it all off".
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Jul 22, 2022 16:59
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Clans: "We use four-pointed stars as our universal symbol!" Also the Clans: "Except in our military formations."
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Jul 22, 2022 17:07
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Where's my Inner Sphere advanced armor that specifically nerfs Clan weapon damage and range increments
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Jul 22, 2022 19:02
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Double down on the daggerstar importance. There's 8 Points on this bad boy!  In seriousness though, kind of fun to see that maybe some of the ideas of alternate Clan military structure was seen with the Society's military forces, with the base 3 and all
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Jul 22, 2022 19:05
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Xotl posted:Yeah, Randall Bills has often remarked that he feels the older devs got the idea behind the Clans wrong, from a strictly at the table perspective. Imagine a Clan force built around groups of three, or a weapons with the same big damage but extremely limited range: those were the sort of things he wished were adopted, rather than "our guns do more damage and have greater range and our pilots are better and we operate in base groups of five to top it all off". At least they didn't go directly with historical Mongol tactics as an inspiration: "we infinitely kite you until you get so frustrated you throw" e: wait a minute, maybe they did
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Jul 22, 2022 19:27
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Comstar posted:Has the game changed in any way to actually make any point to bringing a light fast mech or a mech that's not at the old optimal weight of 5 tons below the next weight class? If you're balancing with BV some of the absolute best mechs in the game are fast light mechs and mechs at weird tonnage breaks. Off the top of my head, the Gunsmith and Locust IIC are outright two of the best mechs in the game, and the gamut of other "this is the best X class mech" congregate at 35, 55, 75, and 85 tons but have entries all over. Specifically, the Hammerhead is 45 tons, Carrion Crow is 40, Black Lanner is 55, Vulture Mk III and Mk IV are 60, War Crow is 70, Zeus is 80 (yes, I'm serious, there is a Zeus variant that is one of the best mechs ever printed), Jade Phoenix is 85, all off the top of my head. Strobe fucked around with this message at 19:36 on Jul 22, 2022 |
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Jul 22, 2022 19:33
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I posted my first painted mechs a little while ago and I want to buckle down and get some more done. Do people usually recommend keeping a unified look/scheme, or kind of go with whatever would look cool on each mech? I'm not planning on doing a specific house/clan, if fluff is ever needed I plan on just going with a merc company.
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Jul 23, 2022 06:16
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So I traveled the long way to Milsims and got Battletech: A Game of Armored Combat, the Technical Readout: Succession Wars, and Battletech: Campaign Operations book.I am still waiting for Battletech Beginners Box to arrive from Amazon. Is there any online tools that might..automate some of the stuff in the Campaign Operations? Also, what books do you need to actually play it? it talks about the Advanced Rules for Tactical Operations on page 1 like it's missing a page 0 where it actually should be mentioning Battletech: A Game of Armored Combat at some level. Does it go from Alpha Strike to B:AGOAC to Tactical Operations or is another level in there somewhere? What level do people play at conventions? Finally, has anyone in the history of the world actually done a campaign using the Campaign Operations rules? The detail and 1000 and 1 things to keep track of remind of RoleMaster. It seems more like a dream to read about than actually play, though the idea itself of it ever happening is a nice one.
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Jul 23, 2022 06:54
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MekHQ is a campaign tracker tool that might be what you're looking for. The Beginner Box is the most basic BattleTech rules, the actual rules included are sometimes also called "Quick Strike". It's "BattleTech Lite" in every meaningful sense of the phrase. The Game of Armored Combat is the full BattleTech rules for playing with basic 'Mech, sometimes called "Introductory" because it's the least complicated presentation of the full rules and it sticks very firmly to 3025 tech. After that is the core rulebooks. The "core" (I use that word loosely, you'll see why in a bit) rulebooks for BattleTech are these: Total Warfare ("The Rules", the main book) TechManual (How to build basic stuff. "Basic" is putting in a lot of work here) Tactical Operations (Recently split into two books, one book full of optional scenario-level rules, and one book full of How to build not-so-basic stuff. If you find an older copy that's all of that in one book, most of that is still fine and will work) Strategic Operations (Pretty sure this also split recently, but it was more of a reshuffling split and not "now it's two books" split. The most recent printing is advanced aerospace stuff like warships) Campaign Operations (Running campaigns, with multiple levels of granularity for how to actually do that) Interstellar Operations (Recently split into two books, one book full of all the random one-off equipment and weird poo poo from any given era, and one that's all BattleForce and higher level games than just 'Mech vs 'Mech) Alternately, the BattleMech Manual is your one-stop-shop for playing all 'Mechs, all the time. If you don't really care about using tanks or infantry or fighters, this works by itself. It contains the 'Mech sections from Total Warfare, a good chunk of but not all the 'Mech equipment from Tactical Operations, and some of the Tactical Operations optional rules are scatter throughout for flavor. Alpha Strike is an entirely separate game, in somewhat the same sense as Apocalypse is to 40K. It's faster, less detailed (YMMV on whether that's good; I like it), uses the same miniatures but is a wholly separate game to play. Alpha Strike and Total Warfare (I'm going to refer to "standard" BattleTech as Total Warfare basically at all times to avoid confusion as much as possible) are both played extensively at conventions in the CGL demo team area. The exact rules in use vary based on the particular event or game; if you're looking for "tournament BattleTech", as much as such a thing exists, you're looking for Total Warfare or the BattleMech Manual (personally I prefer the latter because it's just laid out so much better it's not even funny).
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Jul 23, 2022 07:39
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Is the Technical Readout: 3039 the one I need for the Unseen 2nd ed mechs? I got the Succession Wars book but it pointedly does not have many of them. I also note I don't seem to be able to actually BUY it anywhere. Is it out of print and PDF only?
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Jul 23, 2022 15:18
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Comstar posted:Is the Technical Readout: 3039 the one I need for the Unseen 2nd ed mechs? I got the Succession Wars book but it pointedly does not have many of them. TRO 3039 has been out for a good long while so it is harder to get in print. Succession Wars has several of them, but you've noticed it doesn't have all of them. Many of the others are in TRO Clan Invasion. Succession Wars came out right in the middle of/immediately after the Harmony Gold suit against PGI that Catalyst was a named party in, and it's pretty easy to speculate that the ones where there was even a chance at an unfavorable ruling had to wait their turn just in case.
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Jul 23, 2022 16:44
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Xotl posted:The run of books from about 2010 to 2018 were produced in very low quantities as CGL was suffering from difficulties following the 2010 financial shenanigans that happened at the company, combined with a general low interest in BT. The boom produced by the kickstarter can't be overstated: that you're seeing non-TRO, non-rulebook volumes (like Tukayyid, IlClan) being reprinted is something that hasn't occurred in decades. So if you want late Jihad and early 3150 stuff, you're going to be in for a hard time. This makes a lot of sense. It makes sense that during the nineties boom bolstered by Mechwarrior and Mechwarrior 2 made for a boom cycle that ended in the early 2000s and was only recently revived by neat miniatures funded by KS. That certainly mirrors my own contact with the franchise over the last 30 years. I hope thye do see fit to reprint some of the other releases from the last two decades.
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Jul 23, 2022 19:17
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Picked a mech from a random lootbox I had because I didn't want to pick paint to the legendary model I had, and didn't want to touch the Shilone(?) just yet. Turns out I had a Battle Cobra.  Was aiming for more of an emerald color, but the paint dried out darker than I'd expected, compared to what I had on my palette. Added some New Gold for the cockpit and fake cobra eyes. The overall jade colour felt a little boring, so I gave it a bunch of red accents on the front and back. Followed it up with a brown wash on the bottom half of both legs, let it dry a little, than wiped away with Q-tip dipped in water. Reaper washes definitely make me think I need to thin them out to make them runnier. As it stands, they seem too eager to cling to any surface I put it on. Then I did some very minimal dry brushing as babbies first attempt, I added a little too much white to the green I was using but I think I did it sparingly enough that it turned out well, especially the upper torso and back.
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Jul 23, 2022 22:00
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lol I like the scheme. I'd be heated if one of my units got blasted by that thing 
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Jul 23, 2022 22:22
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That;s kind of what I like about ilClan Era, is that everyone uses every kind of tech. You have IS factions who have the knowhow to just build clan-specced equipment and included it as standard equipment on some of their designs, and Clans who adopt IS tech to help with logistics, plus Clan Sea Fox who sells a bit of everything to everyone.
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Jul 23, 2022 22:57
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I don’t think I’ve ever seen a Battle Cobra before; those eyes are hilarious
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Jul 23, 2022 23:26
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Endman posted:I don’t think I’ve ever seen a Battle Cobra before; those eyes are hilarious You have no idea how disappointed I was when I looked it up, knowing nothing about it, and wondering if I'd ever run one in a lance and was just so... so sad afterwards.
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Jul 23, 2022 23:33
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Jobbo_Fett posted:You have no idea how disappointed I was when I looked it up, knowing nothing about it, and wondering if I'd ever run one in a lance and was just so... so sad afterwards. Why? It's a solid 6/9 40 ton Zombie with near maxed armor and paired Clan Large Pulse Lasers for scout murdering and small pulse lasers for chewing up infantry. They outgun most anything that can outrun them and outrun most anything they can't outgun Pretty solid for 1,487 BV and they're hilariously cheap for a Clan 'Mech.
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Jul 24, 2022 00:03
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Battle Cobras are fantastic if your approach to BattleTech isn't "how deadly can I make a single unit and drat the cost".
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Jul 24, 2022 00:12
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Double posting because there is genuinely very few things more satisfying at a meta level than showing up to a game against someone who only plays Inner Sphere with a list that's all Clan, and you outnumber them. You can practically hear the gears turning. 
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Jul 24, 2022 00:14
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PoptartsNinja posted:Why? Because my brain only operates on how many guns they bring or how cool they look and I don't find they do either well 
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Jul 24, 2022 00:18
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Call me crazy, but I think that it would have been possible to balance the clans in a way that made combat asymmetric and still have them sport a number of their insane weapons that have few downsides. Make 'em brute force only. Clans get their ER lasers and PPCs, their half-tonnage LRM and SRM launchers, and their Ultra autocannons. But that's it. No LBX. No streaks. No electronic gear (mmmaybe just ECM and active probe, but no Artemis or targeting computers). No heat-creating plasma weapons or pulse lasers. Make the asymmetry about one side having extremely hard hitting weapons that just have really good base stats, and the other side has weapons that are strictly worse with regards to range, damage and tonnage, but make up for it with electronic warfare, utility weapons, and dual-purpose weapons like the lb10-x that can both hole punch and exploit crits.
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Jul 24, 2022 02:51
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That's kind of cool but would also make Clan even more insufferable to play both as and against. "One side gets the minmax, the other side gets all the fucky control/disruption equipment" means that no matter who's winning the other side is going to feel really frustrated. Either you're getting steamrolled by godmechs with Star Trek phasers, or you're lashing out impotently at a foe who refuses to stand up and fight while slathering you in rules-heavy bullshit. I guess this is kind of what happened during the actual Clan invasion in universe.
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Jul 24, 2022 04:39
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Go full lore accurate. Choose a tonnage/BV and the clan forces have to stay at or below while the IS forces can bring whatever the hell they want. Also trolling with honor duels.
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Jul 24, 2022 04:44
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I think it's a better version of asymmetry than we got, which is basically the SNK final boss philosophy. One character is just better, and you can try to grind them down with multiple characters, but every button they have is really good.
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Jul 24, 2022 04:47
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Yeah, you're probably right. Rushdown/aggro vs control/disruption is a pretty hallowed game design archetype, maybe they coulda pulled it off in a fun way.
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Jul 24, 2022 13:37
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Any word on the Hammerhead reprints?
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Jul 24, 2022 15:20
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What's the site that allows you to build a lance to a BV(?) point value? Is there a standard point value used for tournaments or a random match up? The numbers I've seen vary by 100-200% but I figure there has to be SOME standard "Bring 4 standard Mech's" that people play. What was the standard lance in 3025 - 1 light, 1 medium, 2 heavies and one of them having LRM's?
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Jul 24, 2022 15:46
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Comstar posted:What's the site that allows you to build a lance to a BV(?) point value? You mean this? http://masterunitlist.info/Force/TWBuild
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Jul 24, 2022 16:11
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PoptartsNinja posted:Any word on the Hammerhead reprints? They're trying to make good with anybody who had a defective print right now, that might push the next batch back. Comstar posted:Is there a standard point value used for tournaments or a random match up? 4000 is pretty common in 3025 but you need to go to at least 6k once you start using the full spread of equipment. Maybe even 8, unit costs start stacking up fast. quote:What was the standard lance in 3025 - 1 light, 1 medium, 2 heavies and one of them having LRM's? One light, two mediums, and if you're good you get a heavy instead of another light. If that last mech is driven by someone important, it might be an assault instead. There are probably more Locusts in existence in 3025 than all assault mechs in the Inner Sphere combined. Defiance Industries fucked around with this message at 18:12 on Jul 24, 2022 |
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Jul 24, 2022 17:14
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Comstar posted:What's the site that allows you to build a lance to a BV(?) point value? There isn't a universal standard. There was, however, an actual fairly prominent (as far as these things go) tournament at the Atlantic City Open that used a BV limit of I think 6500. Our local group uses 6000, with no consideration for era because BV does a pretty good job of letting different eras' units fight on even terms.
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Jul 24, 2022 19:39
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Hey BattleTech thread! I used to play GW games as a kid and briefly again in my late teens but then other stuff happened. It’s been, what, at least 12 years since I’ve touched a mini? My cousin who I used to play with is pretty much the same and he bought some Dark Eldar to paint for fun the other day. That ended up in me being sucked into a horrible YouTube vortex of miniature content and got me thinking painting something and playing a miniature war game again might be decent fun. I have no interest in jumping into any GW poo poo again with their prices and godawful practices, so I started eyeing BattleTech after seeing some of the boxes at a game store a week or so back. I really like the idea of just getting a couple of mechs, painting them and being able to play a game with them right away. I’d like to get the Beginner Box but that seems to be severely out of print. Am I understanding correctly that it’s being rereleased this fall? I was thinking I could get that and some paints, see if I can still handle a brush, and if it’s fun, I can buy the A Game of Armored Combat box and perhaps even more mechs somewhere down the line if I really dig it. Also, I’m a bit confused about the multitude of different mechs and rule books out there. If I end up getting the AGoAC box and then buy a box of mechs that I like the looks of, where will I get the rules for those specific mechs? Do I need the Manual? Or just look them up online? Or if I buy a box of Clan mechs, do I have to have the Clan Invasion book to play with them? I’m aware that you need Total Warfare to play with anything else than mechs and also that I could play pretty much any object as anything but I do like the idea of having the actual models I want to play with. a cyborg mug fucked around with this message at 19:42 on Jul 24, 2022 |
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Jul 24, 2022 19:39
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Early copies of the new printing of the Beginners Box should make an appearance at GenCon, with the full run expected this fall, yes. Specific rules for specific 'Mechs are primarily based on their record sheet, which can come from any one of a dozen places but there are a lot of them (for basically anything in plastic) on the BattleTech site's download section, and you can get basically everything else from fan-made design programs like Solaris Skunk Werks or MegaMek/MegaMekLab. The books will have the rules for what stuff is on the record sheet and how to play. You don't need the Clan Invasion box to play Clan 'Mechs, but it will do the trick. If you're planning to get them anyway, Total Warfare is the book with The Rules in it, if you're planning to play with 'Mechs only then the BattleMech Manual will do basically everything you need. The Clan Invasion book also comes with rules for how to use the Elementals in the box if you have any desire to use those and not get Total Warfare for some reason.
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Jul 24, 2022 20:36
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Battletech in general does not have any requirement for models to be specific to what you're fielding. For one there are a lot more official designs (especially vehicles) than official miniatures are and in general the only real rule is each unit must be represented differently on the board and have a means of determining facing. If you're going straight up scale terrain it's better to have the correct models or something similar to it just for LoS checks and the like. Also third party 3D printed units are generally A-OK. Sarna.net is more or less the Battletech wiki and even includes a good bit of the rules. Megamek is a java-based program that can be used to build forces and even play games out against friends or a not exactly competent bot with the game handling all the rules and rolls. The MekLab mentioned above is part of Megamek. MekHQ adds a strategic/campaign layer option and can be run with either megamek or tabletop games, though inputting the latter can be a bit complicated.
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Jul 25, 2022 03:48
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I'm trying to get my wife into Battletech. She want's to paint her Mech's...pink.. Apart from doing a Panther (I know there was one Mercenary group called the Whippits that used it for one Mech) that had one painted in that colour, are there are any other in-universe units that use that colour? I had a look at the Camo Spec's site but somewhat disappointingly it doesn't provide much of an answer. In other returning vet questions, how do you all choose what Mech you want to buy the miniature for? I presume there's a lot of "This Mech counts as this other Mech" so long as you can tell them apart and facing but I'm wondering how everyone decides to choose what Mech to represent on the table.
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Jul 25, 2022 10:05
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Comstar posted:In other returning vet questions, how do you all choose what Mech you want to buy the miniature for? I presume there's a lot of "This Mech counts as this other Mech" so long as you can tell them apart and facing but I'm wondering how everyone decides to choose what Mech to represent on the table. I use cardboard chits with pencil marks for most things except my favorites that I have minis for and care about the most
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Jul 25, 2022 10:40
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Comstar posted:I'm trying to get my wife into Battletech. She want's to paint her Mech's...pink.. Unfortunately, there aren't. The Camacho's Caballeros mercenary regiment allows their Mechwarriors to paint their 'Mechs in any scheme they like; and it wouldn't be unusual for a group of mercs to use pink in an alien world/exotic/dazzle camo that was very bright and flashy. Comstar posted:In other returning vet questions, how do you all choose what Mech you want to buy the miniature for? I presume there's a lot of "This Mech counts as this other Mech" so long as you can tell them apart and facing but I'm wondering how everyone decides to choose what Mech to represent on the table. I buy the 'Mechs I like, which is (unfortunately for me) nearly all of them. As far as proxying, as long as I can identify each of the miniatures it's trivially easy to write down on the top of the record sheet that the bright blue Mad Dog on the table counts as a Black Lanner or an Archer or a Jade Hawk. As long as you can identify it and aren't likely to confuse it with something else mid-fight, you're good.
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Jul 25, 2022 11:45
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