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Bellmaker
Oct 18, 2008

Chapter DOOF



Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

According to Gallup, the "young voters are much more left-wing than older voters" fact is due entirely to younger women.

The number of younger women who identify as liberal has risen 52% since 1998.

The number of younger men who identify as liberal has actually decreased 11% since 1998.

Up until about 2011, there was little to no major gender gap in ideology among the 18-29 age group.

The biggest changes for women were in 2018 and the biggest for men were in 2016.



2014 was the start of Gamergate I believe so the widening split between men and women beginning there isn't too much of a surprise to me.

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FLIPADELPHIA
Apr 27, 2007

Heavy Shit
Grimey Drawer

Bellmaker posted:

2014 was the start of Gamergate I believe so the widening split between men and women beginning there isn't too much of a surprise to me.

That's also the timeframe when Ben Shapiro and Joe Rogan began to really dominate "engagement" or whatever the gently caress it's called on social media.

UCS Hellmaker
Mar 29, 2008
Toilet Rascal

JohnCompany posted:

I was on the twits earlier, and came across an interesting retrospective of the discussions around whether or not HRC's conduct was indictable. Which lead me to a politico article quoting one Rudy Giuliani. Regarding the current right-wing talking point that "it's okay, Trump was just taking his work home," there's always a tweet.

It's Rudy though, he forgets everything but the taste of shoe polish when he wakes up anymore, and his liver is currently screaming because all it takes in anymore is shoe polish since his brandy fund ran out.

PhazonLink
Jul 17, 2010

Rappaport posted:

A4 has the nice number in inches, though

yeah but its based on that metric crap. why the gently caress would I care that the ratio of the long side/ short side = root 2, and that sizing up to A0 is an area of 1 meter^2?


Also reminder that fuckboys literally believe that Musk is a reallife ironman rick. and if and when they bother to vote, they have the same weight as you.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Jaxyon posted:

My assumption is that targeted advertising is keeping young men from having a similar trajectory. I have no evidence, granted.

My assumption is that one party is telling young white men that they are the best humans who have ever existed and the other treats them suspiciously at best.

Kalit
Nov 6, 2006

The great thing about the thousands of slaughtered Palestinian children is that they can't pull away when you fondle them or sniff their hair.

That's a Biden success story.

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

According to Gallup, the "young voters are much more left-wing than older voters" fact is due entirely to younger women.

The number of younger women who identify as liberal has risen 52% since 1998.

The number of younger men who identify as liberal has actually decreased 11% since 1998.

Up until about 2011, there was little to no major gender gap in ideology among the 18-29 age group.

The biggest changes for women were in 2018 and the biggest for men were in 2016.



Do you have a link to the Gallup data from this? I'm trying to find it, but not having much luck. I can only find the original article from Survey Center on American Life's website in May here.

Tayter Swift
Nov 18, 2002

Pillbug
I'm a little surprised A4 didn't lean into convenient numbers and go 200mm x 300mm, but 297/210 is about the square root of 2 so I guess they considered that more important.

projecthalaxy
Dec 27, 2008

Yes hello it is I Kurt's Secret Son


Tayter Swift posted:

I'm a little surprised A4 didn't lean into convenient numbers and go 200mm x 300mm, but 297/210 is about the square root of 2 so I guess they considered that more important.

Yeah i think it's like A1 is a square meter of paper, then A2 is A1 folded in half, A3 is A2 folded in half... on to infinity so mockups always look exactly right as full A1 poster prints or whatever. Something like that.

E:


Yeah this. Its all halves of halves of halves

projecthalaxy fucked around with this message at 17:38 on Aug 15, 2022

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

Kalit posted:

Do you have a link to the Gallup data from this? I'm trying to find it, but not having much luck. I can only find the original article from Survey Center on American Life's website in May here.

Part of it is behind a paywall. But, it's just taking the results from the annual Gallup social survey for "age 18-29" for each year and putting it on a graph divided by gender.

The detailed crosstabs are behind the paywall.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/388988/political-ideology-steady-conservatives-moderates-tie.aspx
https://www.gallup.com/175307/gallup-poll-social-series-methodology.aspx

Solkanar512
Dec 28, 2006

by the sex ghost

Jaxyon posted:

My assumption is that targeted advertising is keeping young men from having a similar trajectory. I have no evidence, granted.

I really wish there were a better way to measure this, because I think you're absolutely right.

Kalit
Nov 6, 2006

The great thing about the thousands of slaughtered Palestinian children is that they can't pull away when you fondle them or sniff their hair.

That's a Biden success story.

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

Part of it is behind a paywall. But, it's just taking the results from the annual Gallup social survey for "age 18-29" for each year and putting it on a graph divided by gender.

The detailed crosstabs are behind the paywall.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/388988/political-ideology-steady-conservatives-moderates-tie.aspx
https://www.gallup.com/175307/gallup-poll-social-series-methodology.aspx

Gotcha, thanks. At a glance, it looks like most of that convergence between young women/men are a subset within Democratic voters, just moving from conservative to liberal.

It would be interesting to see if there's a relationship between these self-identification trends and changes in participation in primary elections. Although I have a feeling that would also change with 2022 primary election turnouts as well.

TheDisreputableDog
Oct 13, 2005
My first job was at a European bank, and there was a constant battle between Americans and expats switching out letter and A4 paper trays, it was literally a bigger issue than the language barrier.

As an IT guy, I just changed the name of one printer to include LETTER and the other one A4, just doing my part for globalism.

Cranappleberry
Jan 27, 2009

TheDisreputableDog posted:

My first job was at a European bank, and there was a constant battle between Americans and expats switching out letter and A4 paper trays, it was literally a bigger issue than the language barrier.

As an IT guy, I just changed the name of one printer to include LETTER and the other one A4, just doing my part for globalism.

Satanic Minion of The New World a Hero would say

Barrel Cactaur
Oct 6, 2021

Don't forget legal, which is 27% longer because???

bad boys for life
Jun 6, 2003

by sebmojo

Bellmaker posted:

2014 was the start of Gamergate I believe so the widening split between men and women beginning there isn't too much of a surprise to me.

The completed a bachelors degree metric sort of lines up with that graph:

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2021/11/08/whats-behind-the-growing-gap-between-men-and-women-in-college-completion/

quote:

Young women are more likely to be enrolled in college today than young men, and among those ages 25 and older, women are more likely than men to have a four-year college degree. The gap in college completion is even wider among younger adults ages 25 to 34.

Id wager its more of an education issue than anything.

dpkg chopra
Jun 9, 2007

Fast Food Fight

Grimey Drawer

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

The number of younger men who identify as liberal has actually decreased 11% since 1998.

Not that I'd be surprised that the decrease is real, but I wonder if that 11% includes younger men who identify as communist/socialist/etc. and whether that has a significant impact on the final number.

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

dpkg chopra posted:

Not that I'd be surprised that the decrease is real, but I wonder if that 11% includes younger men who identify as communist/socialist/etc. and whether that has a significant impact on the final number.

It doesn't. Gallup uses:

- Very Liberal
- Liberal
- Moderate
- Conservative
- Very Conservative

"Moderate" is the one that has seen the most growth among younger men.

Sephyr
Aug 28, 2012

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:


"Moderate" is the one that has seen the most growth among younger men.

Which can mean anything. I believe my ideology of having a 99% tax rate after US$ 10 million is quite moderate. So does the guy down the street who thinks George Soros is spawning plague immigrant caravan and aiming them as the US of A.

Nenonen
Oct 22, 2009

Mulla on aina kolkyt donaa taskussa

Barrel Cactaur posted:

Don't forget legal, which is 27% longer because???

So you can insert all the legal fine print in the footnote :haw:

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

Barrel Cactaur posted:

Don't forget legal, which is 27% longer because???

Nenonen posted:

So you can insert all the legal fine print in the footnote :haw:

You're not too far off.

The actual non-funny answer is because they used to write contracts on legal sized paper and they made it wider and longer to make it easier to make longer annotations or edits in the margin before word processing was common.

Most contracts and legal forms are just written up in letter format in Microsoft Word nowadays, but some people still prefer legal sized paper because of tradition or for annotation purposes.

nerox
May 20, 2001

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

You're not too far off.

The actual non-funny answer is because they used to write contracts on legal sized paper and they made it wider and longer to make it easier to make longer annotations or edits in the margin before word processing was common.

Most contracts and legal forms are just written up in letter format in Microsoft Word nowadays, but some people still prefer legal sized paper because of tradition or for annotation purposes.

I've noticed a dramatic change to using mostly letter sized paper in the past few years ever since Georgia went to a flat filing fee vs. per page filing fees in the real estate records. Of course, they still charge 50 cents per page to make copies using their copier. Those camera scanning apps have saved me thousands of dollars.

Killer robot
Sep 6, 2010

I was having the most wonderful dream. I think you were in it!
Pillbug

Sephyr posted:

Which can mean anything. I believe my ideology of having a 99% tax rate after US$ 10 million is quite moderate. So does the guy down the street who thinks George Soros is spawning plague immigrant caravan and aiming them as the US of A.

Yeah, I've met both people that say that as a moderate it makes sense to call the ACA communist and people who say that they could stomach "a center right guy like Bernie" in charge and I don't think either really means anything.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006




Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

It doesn't. Gallup uses:

- Very Liberal
- Liberal
- Moderate
- Conservative
- Very Conservative

"Moderate" is the one that has seen the most growth among younger men.

There is a growing segment particularly of younger online folks that will understand something different by the word liberal than that survey intends it to mean. Gallup probably needs to rework its categories too.

Kalit
Nov 6, 2006

The great thing about the thousands of slaughtered Palestinian children is that they can't pull away when you fondle them or sniff their hair.

That's a Biden success story.

Bar Ran Dun posted:

There is a growing segment particularly of younger online folks that will understand something different by the word liberal than that survey intends it to mean. Gallup probably needs to rework its categories too.

Nah, I say leave it. Then everyone who's on the left and views the word liberal as an insult can complain about how terrible/biased/etc Gallup is.

FizFashizzle
Mar 30, 2005







Wonder why he was double checking on his passports.

https://twitter.com/bnonews/status/1559236120759640067?s=21&t=6h0egaXM57Wf7o0PBjsRJg

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

Bar Ran Dun posted:

There is a growing segment particularly of younger online folks that will understand something different by the word liberal than that survey intends it to mean. Gallup probably needs to rework its categories too.

I think it is pretty likely that anyone who is clued in enough to have hit that level of introspection probably also recognizes what the scale is trying to measure and isn't going to respond with "Moderate" or "Conservative" to indicate they have left-wing views.

Rigel
Nov 11, 2016

If I was going to toss in a guess based on no data or information whatsoever, I might also wonder if maybe young women are more likely to be politically active than young men, since a lot of the important social issues directly impact their lives much more. If you don't know/don't care at all about politics and are being asked, most people are just going to default to saying moderate.

Charliegrs
Aug 10, 2009
I saw there was a bunch of updates in this thread I bet something big is going on.

Oh everyone is just talking about paper...

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006




Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

I think it is pretty likely that anyone who is clued in enough to have hit that level of introspection probably also recognizes what the scale is trying to measure and isn't going to respond with "Moderate" or "Conservative" to indicate they have left-wing views.

Yes or they might go “lmao, gently caress it and gently caress Gallup” and self exclude.

Randalor
Sep 4, 2011




Honest question, if you're travelling by your own plane to another country, do you still have to present your passport at the US airport? I thought he owned at least one plane he bragged about, but I'm not sure of the laws regarding air travel via your own personal aircraft.

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

Randalor posted:

Honest question, if you're travelling by your own plane to another country, do you still have to present your passport at the US airport? I thought he owned at least one plane he bragged about, but I'm not sure of the laws regarding air travel via your own personal aircraft.

Yes. You still need to get your passport stamped and go through customs if you are travelling internationally. It doesn't matter what type of plane you are on.

Veryslightlymad
Jun 3, 2007

I fight with
my brain
and with an
underlying
hatred of the
Erebonian
Noble Faction

Randalor posted:

Honest question, if you're travelling by your own plane to another country, do you still have to present your passport at the US airport? I thought he owned at least one plane he bragged about, but I'm not sure of the laws regarding air travel via your own personal aircraft.

Absolutely, assuming you're flying legally and want to also land.

projecthalaxy
Dec 27, 2008

Yes hello it is I Kurt's Secret Son


Per this link for a private jet hiring company, it's the job and responsibility of the flight crew/jet company to check your passports and visas before takeoff just like it's Delta's or whoever at the airport desk. They have to certify at their own risk that they did so. Would Trump's jet managers lie for him? I do not know.

Randalor
Sep 4, 2011



Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

Yes. You still need to get your passport stamped and go through customs if you are travelling internationally. It doesn't matter what type of plane you are on.

Veryslightlymad posted:

Absolutely, assuming you're flying legally and want to also land.

projecthalaxy posted:

Per this link for a private jet hiring company, it's the job and responsibility of the flight crew/jet company to check your passports and visas before takeoff just like it's Delta's or whoever at the airport desk. They have to certify at their own risk that they did so. Would Trump's jet managers lie for him? I do not know.

Oh, okay. So in theory he could still be a flight risk, but he would have to be able to find a place to land that is both in range of his plane and also willing to piss off the US by aiding and abetting someone who just fled the US because they were being investigated for espionage? So basically, by taking his passports, the FBI made sure he couldn't run far?

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

I'm wondering why he had three passports.

He said one is expired.

You can technically have two passports legally, but I'm not sure why Trump would. The main reason people have two is usually for weird country squabbles (like, you can get two passports if you travel to Israel and need to go to Lebanon. Lebanon will not admit people who have been to Israel, so you can get a second passport to collect the Israeli stamp), but you need special permission from the State Department to get the second passport. I can't really think of any reason Trump would need that.

Even if he had some urgent business in Lebanon, I think he is probably famous enough that he isn't going to trick the customs guy into thinking he has never been to Israel or that Lebanon would deny him entry on that basis.

projecthalaxy posted:

Per this link for a private jet hiring company, it's the job and responsibility of the flight crew/jet company to check your passports and visas before takeoff just like it's Delta's or whoever at the airport desk. They have to certify at their own risk that they did so. Would Trump's jet managers lie for him? I do not know.

That's for taking off. You will still have to go through customs if you land in a private jet and they will need a passport and a search for contraband.

Kalli
Jun 2, 2001



I mean if Trump is ready to flee the country then isn't it better if he does? The odds of justice being served by the American justice system seems so astronomically low him spending the rest of his days doing tv spots with Steven Seagal in Russia sounds a hell of a lot better of an option for america politically then what will likely happen if he just rides it out being Trump.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siFmJz7CZSM

Madkal
Feb 11, 2008

Fallen Rib

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

I'm wondering why he had three passports.

He said one is expired.

You can technically have two passports legally, but I'm not sure why Trump would. The main reason people have two is usually for weird country squabbles (like, you can get two passports if you travel to Israel and need to go to Lebanon. Lebanon will not admit people who have been to Israel, so you can get a second passport to collect the Israeli stamp), but you need special permission from the State Department to get the second passport. I can't really think of any reason Trump would need that.

Even if he had some urgent business in Lebanon, I think he is probably famous enough that he isn't going to trick the customs guy into thinking he has never been to Israel or that Lebanon would deny him entry on that basis.

That's for taking off. You will still have to go through customs if you land in a private jet and they will need a passport and a search for contraband.

The only thing I can think of is do people in government get new passports to indicate they are in the government ie would the president have the same kind of passport as a regular citizen of the USA?

FlamingLiberal
Jan 18, 2009

Would you like to play a game?



Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

I'm wondering why he had three passports.

He said one is expired.

You can technically have two passports legally, but I'm not sure why Trump would. The main reason people have two is usually for weird country squabbles (like, you can get two passports if you travel to Israel and need to go to Lebanon. Lebanon will not admit people who have been to Israel, so you can get a second passport to collect the Israeli stamp), but you need special permission from the State Department to get the second passport. I can't really think of any reason Trump would need that.

Even if he had some urgent business in Lebanon, I think he is probably famous enough that he isn't going to trick the customs guy into thinking he has never been to Israel or that Lebanon would deny him entry on that basis.

That's for taking off. You will still have to go through customs if you land in a private jet and they will need a passport and a search for contraband.
I mean I have one valid passport and two expired old ones in my house. I have no idea if he has some kind of old diplomatic passport from when he was President or what. I have no idea how that works.

Cranappleberry
Jan 27, 2009

Veryslightlymad posted:

Absolutely, assuming you're flying legally and want to also land.

yep. Even with a private charter/landing at a private airport, you need to file a flight plan and go through customs.

Also if Trump wants to use his own plane, the airport has to be 757-200 compliant.

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Josh Lyman
May 24, 2009


Madkal posted:

The only thing I can think of is do people in government get new passports to indicate they are in the government ie would the president have the same kind of passport as a regular citizen of the USA?
You’re supposed to get a government passport if you’re traveling internationally on government business, but you’re supposed to return it when you leave the job. Though presumably he would’ve had a diplomatic passport?

Josh Lyman fucked around with this message at 19:46 on Aug 15, 2022

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