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I think in at least Craig’s case, and probably the book’s character, it’s kind of the logical conclusion. Craig’s Bond, who I feel is heavily inspired by the novels, is not particularly celebrated even by himself. He’s frequently portrayed as being unable to break away from his lifestyle, his profession, his emotional scarring, etc. He attempts to, like at the end of Casino Royale and Spectre, but he’s unable to maintain it. His life is ultimately going to lead to the kind of conclusion you’re referring to. It’s a much darker take than what the average movie goer would expect out of Bond, but I think it’s very in line with the tone of the source material.
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Aug 31, 2022 15:46
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I think it's how we consume media now. We were perfectly happy before with watching one singular Bond adventure. They were mostly unrelated to each other. What happened in one adventure didn't matter to another. But now everything has to have an origin story, an overarching character development story, and a definitive conclusion. Marvel is a good example. Every Avenger needs their own series that follows that model. We also have a need for everything to be explained to us. We want explicit. We don't want implicit, vague, or left up to interpretation. Anything not explicit is going to have dozens of YouTube videos of "Ending EXPLAINED." If you don't want your story to be misinterpreted and told by someone else, then you need to wrap it up tight and put a bow on it. And there is a pretty easy way to do that.
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Aug 31, 2022 17:24
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Salami Surgeon posted:I think it's how we consume media now. We were perfectly happy before with watching one singular Bond adventure. They were mostly unrelated to each other. What happened in one adventure didn't matter to another. But now everything has to have an origin story, an overarching character development story, and a definitive conclusion. Marvel is a good example. Every Avenger needs their own series that follows that model. I don't know if I'd agree with that, at least in the Marvel case, since outside of a couple of important characters (Iron Man, Captain America, Black Widow, etc.), they pretty much all end in an open-ended position where their story could continue in the next movie or Disney+ show. (Assuming everything works out and the actor takes the pay day to come back, etc. I mean, not Marvel specific but even Ben Affleck is coming back to DC for a bit part in the next Aquaman movie, and I would have pegged that scenario as one of the "never gonna happen" ones until a week or so ago. And who knows what else that return could lead to? To say nothing of Michael Keaton returning after 30-some years.) So, I don't know that we're currently in a general place where the audience wants "definitive conclusions," considering that the current Marvel movie methodology that everyone is working off of/trying to work to amounts to little more than "Buy next ish! - Ed." in giant $100 million light shows. And to bring it back to Bond and my general question, does this look to be a trend with the Bond franchise at the moment (where any time we reach the end of an actor or author's tenure we have to blow everything up and start again)? Or is this just a weird coincidence of timing? Ultimately, it doesn't matter, since even in those scenarios we get the safe reassurance that "James Bond Will Return", but I kinda preferred the old model where you just assumed that Timothy Dalton picked up from Roger Moore immediately with no mention of anything, even if the very presence of a new actor was a soft reboot that just didn't call attention to itself.
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Aug 31, 2022 20:05
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Salami Surgeon posted:Mum M calls him out on this several times. Are people still on this, sixteen years later? Craig is saying "ma'am," not "mum."
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Sep 1, 2022 00:49
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James Bond's Day Off. He doesn't even kill anyone.
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Sep 1, 2022 01:44
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They need to adapt 007 in New York so we can watch Bond make scrambled eggs.
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Sep 1, 2022 01:50
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And go to an S&M club and a bar frequented by trans ladies
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Sep 1, 2022 09:20
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Timby posted:Are people still on this, sixteen years later? Craig is saying "ma'am," not "mum." This got me with lots of British media for a long time until I started using subs for everything.
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Sep 1, 2022 13:34
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Timby posted:Craig is saying "ma'am," not "mum." nah
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Sep 1, 2022 15:09
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Timby posted:Are people still on this, sixteen years later? Craig is saying "ma'am," not "mum." Okay, so I know this has come up a lot before, and I know accents can be complicated, but I'm sorry, they sound exactly the same to anyone not English. Like, here's a random example I just came across. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGcOdkWhgho&t=99s It's time stamped for when, just a few seconds in, Sandi's son says, "No, Mum," to his actual mother. And I'm sorry to say that how he says "Mum" sounds exactly like how Craig says, "Ma'am". I couldn't find a YouTube clip of Craig, but here. https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/f66ef738-b0d5-431e-97ce-aefb9f45bbb4 Exactly the loving same. I understand they're different because I've been told they're different. But you have to understand why we Americans heard Craig say it and heard him saying, "Mum" and remain legit confused, to the point where we wonder if we're being trolled, right?
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Sep 2, 2022 23:10
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It's M for Mumsy.
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Sep 3, 2022 10:09
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https://twitter.com/rareltd/status/1569693409467662337?s=46&t=USnp4ae3IQgEjnKmGJPrXw
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Sep 13, 2022 17:17
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chitoryu12 posted:https://twitter.com/rareltd/status/1569693409467662337?s=46&t=USnp4ae3IQgEjnKmGJPrXw Rediscover the magic of this game that was never actually that good, even for the time
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Sep 13, 2022 17:55
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Goldeneye holds up very well. People deriding it haven't actually played it, or haven't in decades but still feel the need to chime in.
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Sep 13, 2022 17:56
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chitoryu12 posted:https://twitter.com/rareltd/status/1569693409467662337?s=46&t=USnp4ae3IQgEjnKmGJPrXw It’s odd, XBox is getting the remaster, but only local multiplayer. The Switch is getting, it seems, no remaster, but online multiplayer. It would be great to have both the remaster and online multiplayer on either system, but that’s apparently not happening.
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Sep 13, 2022 18:12
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Gaius Marius posted:Goldeneye holds up very well. People deriding it haven't actually played it, or haven't in decades but still feel the need to chime in. The single player is very underrated but the multiplayer is gonna be a stark reminder that perfect dark multiplayer rendered goldeneye a little bit obsolete That said I agree that every boomer shooter fan stumbling all over themselves to be the first one to remind everyone that, actually, Goldeneye isn't good is tiresome. Its a nice overall package that no one under the age of 30 will give a poo poo about but I think will hold up just fine for the target audience
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Sep 13, 2022 18:27
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Goldeneye was great but XIII was superior multiplayer
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Sep 13, 2022 19:13
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Goldeneye was one of the first shooters where it felt like I was a character who actually had a mission. Not just "here's some miscellaneous rooms and hallways with enemies to shoot", you actually had mission objectives and the levels felt like real locations.
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Sep 13, 2022 19:19
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Perfect Dark was technically a better game in every way, it's a shame more people didn't play it. You have to get used to the 10fps framerate though.
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Sep 13, 2022 19:21
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As console games go in 1997, Goldeneye is good. But this idea that it's an evergreen game does not hold up to a laugh test, it's a millennial nostalgia trip game. It's not a crime to enjoy Goldeneye or appreciate it for what it is historically, but it's not that good on balance.
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Sep 13, 2022 19:56
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Nah, Goldeneye was good and still is good. It's just that without nostalgia there's no reason to go back because there's a ton that's better. That doesn't make it bad and unfun.
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Sep 13, 2022 20:35
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I mean, regardless if it was good or bad or if Perfect Dark was just better or if the Timesplitters games demonstrate the formula's longevity or not, it was huge and influential. 4 player couch co-op existed with multi-taps and Mario Kart battle mode, but this Goldeneye multiplayer was a revelation. I seem to recall it was added as an afterthought, but I don't know for certain.
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Sep 13, 2022 20:35
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drat it, why did you mention timesplitters. I want a remaster for those games so bad now.
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Sep 13, 2022 20:37
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FoolyCharged posted:Nah, Goldeneye was good and still is good. It's just that without nostalgia there's no reason to go back because there's a ton that's better. That doesn't make it bad and unfun. There are very few games to this day that have that combination of: Multiple different objectives that increase in number on higher difficulties that can usually be completed in any order, adding additional content on replays Memorable Virtua Cop inspired enemy animations where body parts not only do different levels of damage but yield unique animations that can be taken advantage of while fighting groups Rewarding speed running with unlockable cheats ranging from conventional stuff to silly effects like DK mode, Tiny Bond, Turbo Mode Huge and satisfying arsenal including the more gadgety stuff like the various mines, the Watch Laser, etc Functional stealth and repercussions for going loud or letting enemies activate alarms, which you can destroy to prevent, same with cameras Multiplayer featuring tons of customization options A fantastic soundtrack Multiple control schemes that actually made good use of the N64 controller The only shooters I know of like this are GE, PD and the Timesplitters games, and we haven't gotten a new one of those in ages. They're like the console counterparts to the PC ImSims like Deus Ex, SS2, etc. Much simpler and more arcade-y of course, given their console origins, but deeper then most people give them credit for. What modern FPS games have all these features? I feel like a lot of the modern hate for GE comes from people who rush through Agent mode like a bull in a china shop and don't utilize tons of the built in gameplay systems or controls...
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Sep 13, 2022 21:12
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Big Bizness posted:There are very few games to this day that have that combination of: The backlash to GE (maybe my sample size is too small because I only ever see it on these forums) always seems to come from dudes who think quake 1 is the height of culture I agree with all your points btw
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Sep 13, 2022 21:19
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Magnetic North posted:I mean, regardless if it was good or bad or if Perfect Dark was just better or if the Timesplitters games demonstrate the formula's longevity or not, it was huge and influential. 4 player couch co-op existed with multi-taps and Mario Kart battle mode, but this Goldeneye multiplayer was a revelation. I seem to recall it was added as an afterthought, but I don't know for certain. Most game development, but especially in this timeframe, is absolute chaos.
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Sep 13, 2022 21:20
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chitoryu12 posted:https://twitter.com/rareltd/status/1569693409467662337?s=46&t=USnp4ae3IQgEjnKmGJPrXw Hell yeah
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Sep 13, 2022 21:21
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Magnetic North posted:Goldeneye multiplayer was a revelation. I seem to recall it was added as an afterthought, but I don't know for certain. It was indeed a skunkworks side project by one of the programmers.
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Sep 13, 2022 21:35
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Gaius Marius posted:Goldeneye holds up very well. People deriding it haven't actually played it, or haven't in decades but still feel the need to chime in. While Goldeneye was out, I was playing Quake 1/2 where people had modded grappling hooks and stuff into the game and balanced perfect FPS play with M+K while playing on early high speed Internet at 30fps. Meanwhile I was stuck being nice to my friends playing a game with a single analog where you could look in each other's screens and couldn't move properly that didn't use any real 3d properties of the map and was extremely flat running where I could count frames. It was so ridiculously annoying going from a game where I'm playing full CTF (and it was just a little before Half Life too) where I'm feigning myself all over the map in full 360 axis, turning and shooting people Spider-manning through mid air and using my brain to play to Goldeneye. Same issue with Halo from CoD, Counterstrike, and Unreal Tournament. It wasn't that good *for its time,* it was just kids first FPS because they were too young to figure out how to PC online yet and has a heavy bit of nostalgia attached to them fighting to work around the controls and dealing with it via muscle memory and excusing it. Didn't this site even start off Quake adjacent? I seem to remember first coming in the late 90s due to some old FPS stuff. Darko fucked around with this message at 01:34 on Sep 14, 2022 |
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Sep 14, 2022 01:27
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:Goldeneye was great but XIII was superior multiplayer Unless I'm missing some kind of joke, XIII was more than 5 years later and another console generation...
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Sep 14, 2022 01:58
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Darko posted:It wasn't that good *for its time,* it was just kids first FPS because they were too young to figure out how to PC online yet and has a heavy bit of nostalgia attached to them fighting to work around the controls and dealing with it via muscle memory and excusing it. Cool story. The year Goldeneye came out, according to this website, only 18% of US households had home internet. This is half the rate of houses with computers at all at 36%. (I have no idea what this website is, forgive me if it's not to be trusted, but I wanted data rather than speaking purely anecdotally to describe the lack of home internet 25 years ago.) Sure, people were absolutely playing Doom and Quake, at least the shareware versions, but they were getting it from floppy disks passed around. This isn't just "I'm 13 and I like what is in front of me." Rather, this is "I'm 13 and we have a family PC, but we have to go to the library to use the internet. The idea of playing with friends has probably occurred to me. I mean, I saw something reference Dwango in one of those awful D!Zone CDs I got, but even if I understand it, I don't a credit card anyway. Or internet, as previously established."
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Sep 14, 2022 02:13
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Darko posted:While Goldeneye was out, I was playing Quake 1/2 where people had modded grappling hooks and stuff into the game and balanced perfect FPS play with M+K while playing on early high speed Internet at 30fps. Meanwhile I was stuck being nice to my friends playing a game with a single analog where you could look in each other's screens and couldn't move properly that didn't use any real 3d properties of the map and was extremely flat running where I could count frames. You do realize that every game you mentioned besides Quake also had console releases. And yet God knows how many people still loved halo and Goldeneye. Also, it says a lot about Quake that you remember it after people modded it to the gills and had nothing about the base game or its campaign in there. But it says even more that you thought the defining feature of split screen was looking at each other's screen and not having your friend next to you while you played.
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Sep 14, 2022 02:17
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I don't really care about Goldeneye vs Quake because I liked both but I have always found the split screen arguments funny. Like there was something wrong with being able to see what other players were doing or that it was cheating. Was it also wrong in Mario Kart to see your friend's position on the course, or look behind you, or know what weapon they had? Never heard a peep about that one. It's not like anyone had an advantage, if you can look at my screen then I can also look at yours.
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Sep 14, 2022 03:02
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Perfect Dark and Unreal Tournament superiority. I remember doing UT deathmatches in high school with friends when we were supposed to be doing work in the computer lab. If I thought I could get Unreal Tournament 2004 working on my Linux machine, I'd install it in a second. I never played Quake.
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Sep 14, 2022 03:09
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console trash
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Sep 14, 2022 03:20
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F_Shit_Fitzgerald posted:Perfect Dark and Unreal Tournament superiority. I remember doing UT deathmatches in high school with friends when we were supposed to be doing work in the computer lab. If I thought I could get Unreal Tournament 2004 working on my Linux machine, I'd install it in a second. UT2K4 had a Linux (and Mac) official port so that should be easy. Even if it doesn't run under modern Linux it had both DX9 and OpenGL renderers so I have to imagine it would run perfectly in Wine or a VM.
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Sep 14, 2022 04:34
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Splitscreen shooters are basically designed for you to triangulate your friend's position and hunt each other down. In that way it at least keeps the action heavier than if people are playing opposite sides of a map.
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Sep 14, 2022 04:41
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FoolyCharged posted:You do realize that every game you mentioned besides Quake also had console releases. And yet God knows how many people still loved halo and Goldeneye. Also, it says a lot about Quake that you remember it after people modded it to the gills and had nothing about the base game or its campaign in there. It literally makes you not think. Finding a sniper in Battlefield 1942 took a LOT of effort. Depends on if you prefer levity in games or prefer advantages based on skill or thought. I'm the latter.
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Sep 14, 2022 04:56
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FoolyCharged posted:You do realize that every game you mentioned besides Quake also had console releases. And yet God knows how many people still loved halo and Goldeneye. Also, it says a lot about Quake that you remember it after people modded it to the gills and had nothing about the base game or its campaign in there. It's a common denominator argument. As an ex game developer, we had to literally invent ways for console players to play with computer players once PC adoption raised. Thats where dual analog, aim assist, all that stuff came from. Where now, console Warzone players can almost play 75 percent as good as PC players at the same skill. That's the absolute best we could come up with. For reference, Quake came out with no analog control on multiple consoles without even the CTF mod , the best Unreal was on Dreamcasts bad analog which was open to PC and they couldn't even play with PC players, who would solo them, everything else was years layer with multiple sequels ahead of them. I have no idea what youre even arguing. PC FPS games were always multiple years ahead of console versions which almost kind of stopped now where the PC players are only slowed down by server side lag. Goldeneye was the best console FPS, which was years behind the PC at the time, which is why people say it was bad that are older. Without nostalgia, no one would play Goldeneye over modded Quake, which was BEFORE it. The console ports were garbage because consoles didn't have *mouse look* which was the defining difference until Halo. Mouse look is like 90 percent of a FPS. I think Unreal Dreamcast tried to work around it somehow, while PC players were just jumping around them and killing them. Mouse look is the single most important FPS aspect outside of basic movement. Darko fucked around with this message at 05:25 on Sep 14, 2022 |
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Sep 14, 2022 05:04
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Lobok posted:I don't really care about Goldeneye vs Quake because I liked both but I have always found the split screen arguments funny. Like there was something wrong with being able to see what other players were doing or that it was cheating. Was it also wrong in Mario Kart to see your friend's position on the course, or look behind you, or know what weapon they had? Never heard a peep about that one. It's not like anyone had an advantage, if you can look at my screen then I can also look at yours. Mario Kart 64 on is an entirely non competitive broken game that is based on wandering near the back or middle till the final round where you use your superior power upside to an advantage. It rubber bands the front so they go slower while giving the back superior powerups and makes them faster. They're barely a level above Mario Party. Only the original and Gameboy Advance don't have this. Looking at screens completely ruins camp vs aggressive strategies which are both viable and the metagame of any FPS. Learning to recognize where someone may be camping and working around it and outsmarted them is one of the best fun of any FPS, and on the counterside, figuring out great unexpected spots and working around aggressors is equally as fun. Losing that aspect of a FPS is just sad, and this was established by 1997 or so.
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Sep 14, 2022 05:12
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