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In other games, you add your skill to your dice roll and try to beat the difficulty. In our uniquely innovative system, you instead subtract your skill from the difficulty.
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Sep 1, 2022 15:39
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This system sounds so late 90s it might as well have flannel tied around its waist.
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Sep 1, 2022 15:46
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Coolness Averted posted:I'd argue getting rid of botches is good design, unless specifically aiming for a game that emulates comedic or grisly incompetence.
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Sep 1, 2022 15:48
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Are we going to see the death of the gaming cafe with the coming recession? I've seen several messages from local ones I follow all sharing the same problems. A gaming cafe has similar energy costs as a regular cafe - they have to warm food, keep it hot, etc. - but far lower turnover than regular cafes because people who don't want to play games assume their food will be worse and more expensive. With energy bills going high, it's pinching some nearly to death. If they raise their food prices, they prove the cynics right. If they raise their gaming table prices, they put off their core customer base. Also a botched roll in Marvel is a The Boys episode.
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Sep 1, 2022 15:49
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Falstaff posted:This system sounds so late 90s it might as well have flannel tied around its waist. But from what I remember, even the old FASERIP game is strictly better, at least in terms of the basic mechanics. At least, ime.
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Sep 1, 2022 15:59
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Nuns with Guns posted:The design team, lead by Matt Forbeck, who did a lot of work on various games in the 90s and early 2000s, including his edgy superhero RPG: Brave New World, made a bespoke new system for the Marvel RPG: the "All-New, All-Different d616 System"  Good lord lol. You know what I don't want to deal with when I'm playing a tabletop game? Opening the calculator on my phone to figure out if I managed to do the thing I was trying to do.
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Sep 1, 2022 16:09
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joylessdivision posted:Ahahahahahahah.
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Sep 1, 2022 16:13
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Splicer posted:Botches as high-larious fuckups are one very specific implementation of failure rolls, and honestly the worst. A seriously botched roll in Marvel would be, e.g., Gwen Stacey. I don't think death of important characters if emulating Marvel comics should be left to dice rolls. Even stuff like "New York hates Spiderman and thinks he's a murderer" are bigger story arcs all parties should agree to vs "you hit the 5%* whoopsie chance" Like I'm completely on board with botches in some systems, but they need to be deliberate and part of far tighter design than what is going on here. *At least by accident it looked like botches in this system were less than half a percent.
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Sep 1, 2022 16:13
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Coolness Averted posted:I don't think death of important characters if emulating Marvel comics should be left to dice rolls. Even stuff like "New York hates Spiderman and thinks he's a murderer" are bigger story arcs all parties should agree to vs "you hit the 5%* whoopsie chance" To use a less defining moment, Cyclops is always getting his visor knocked off, often with non-comedic results. "It gets knocked off on a despair, more despairs equal more consequences" is a fine way to model this.
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Sep 1, 2022 16:27
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I don't understand what Ranks are, and why you would need a table for them. Difficulty of the task and character skill are both mentioned separately as modifiers, so it's not those. What the hell is it then? What else is there when you want to see if someone climbed a wall or something?
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Sep 1, 2022 16:32
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Finster Dexter posted:But from what I remember, even the old FASERIP game is strictly better, at least in terms of the basic mechanics. At least, ime. FASERIP is the system I broke my gaming teeth on at the tender age of 10. It has some massive, massive problems, but yeah, it handles the material way better than this seems to - tracks movement via areas, has a fun critical hit system, and has a stunting system for breaking the rules when you need to. It's very much a product of its time (with a few exceptions like its meta-currency), but at the very least it doesn't worry so much about reloading in an action economy or measuring movement in 5-foot increments. If I'm playing a Supers game, I want my character to be able to punch my opponent through walls or even buildings. I want fights to start on a rooftop, move through a subway station, and end up on an aircraft carrier or the moon or something. If I've use guns, I want to rain bullets through a room like a thunderstorm - blankets of little pieces of lead that perforate everything in sight. I want to move so fast that I can disarm every opponent in a three-mile radius in the blink of an eye. And if I get really crazy, go to the really high-end of things, I want to be able to do poo poo like steal sunlight and talk buildings into committing suicide. I don't want to make 5-foot steps or worry about tracking my goddamn ammo. I definitely don't want to break out a calculator. WTAF? The early/mid-2000s Marvel game was broken, but at least it tried to push things in a novel direction. This is... I don't know why anyone thought this was a good idea, that anyone was crying out for d20 supers game but with 3d6... Especially when systems like Mutants and Masterminds and Silver Age Sentinels are right over there, collecting dust.
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Sep 1, 2022 16:33
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Funzo posted:I don't understand what Ranks are, and why you would need a table for them. Difficulty of the task and character skill are both mentioned separately as modifiers, so it's not those. What the hell is it then? What else is there when you want to see if someone climbed a wall or something? I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess: Rank determines your Thac0, character skill is your to-hit bonus.
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Sep 1, 2022 16:35
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Splicer posted:Hmmm. Would play this so hard
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Sep 1, 2022 16:44
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Funzo posted:I don't understand what Ranks are, and why you would need a table for them. Difficulty of the task and character skill are both mentioned separately as modifiers, so it's not those. What the hell is it then? What else is there when you want to see if someone climbed a wall or something? I think, think, that rank is nominally supposed to be like heroic/paragon/epic in 4e D&D or even Unknown Armies' street/global/cosmic where it's both a fluff/genre choice of what kind of tropes and stakes will be involved in the story but also an associated set of mechanical toggles and dials to support that. But it's very hard to tell that because they muddled the implementation so hard that it seems just be analogous to levels in D&D except it's more like 5e/3.X CR in that it's an entirely meaningless number since they hosed up the system so badly.
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Sep 1, 2022 17:00
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Funzo posted:I don't understand what Ranks are, and why you would need a table for them. Difficulty of the task and character skill are both mentioned separately as modifiers, so it's not those. What the hell is it then? What else is there when you want to see if someone climbed a wall or something? I think Ranks were for character generation and campaign power levelling, so that you don't end up with with Dazzler vs Galactus.
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Sep 1, 2022 17:00
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Funzo posted:I don't understand what Ranks are, and why you would need a table for them. Difficulty of the task and character skill are both mentioned separately as modifiers, so it's not those. What the hell is it then? What else is there when you want to see if someone climbed a wall or something? Ranks are "a narrative representation of a character's power level." The most recent errata also noted they're "not an experience-point-based level system." So I'm not really sure if it's possible to advance your rank or not in-game. I'd have to spend $10.00 on Roll20 (the official platform for the game) to find out, and I'd have to decide if it's worth giving money for this crap. Originally ranks and relative scale was anchored to each character's Archetype. No idea how completely removing the archetypes will impact this, probably a ton though? Here's what one of the Archetype's table of modifiers and scores looked like before: 
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Sep 1, 2022 17:00
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joylessdivision posted:
there's fun things to do with calculators in tabletop rpgs (detailed inventory management, budgeting, complicated build systems for vehicles or strongholds) but none of them are in the basic task system yikes
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Sep 1, 2022 17:39
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Well, they seem to have changed everything we told them to in the episode we did on it, but I assume that's just because everything we pointed out was obviously bad from space.
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Sep 1, 2022 18:09
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hyphz posted:Are we going to see the death of the gaming cafe with the coming recession? If they also do gaming sales, that’s going to be hard too - the industry from a small retailer perspective is only getting rougher. But in general I expect fancy cafes, including gaming ones, to suffer in most areas as wealth concentrates. They rely on discretionary income, after all. Gaming cafes have never made a ton of sense to me as a business synergy so I can’t speak to their particulars but it’s a bad time for small businesses in general, for small game retailers in particular, and it seems likely to only get worse in most places.
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Sep 1, 2022 18:19
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PST posted:WotC is absolutely taking strides to address racism and sexism, totally moths posted:I'm being intensely charitable here, but I hope this was Planet of the Apes or Project X homage before it went REALLY loving WRONG. It was outright stated before release that they were doing a Planet of the Apes reference. So this was a bad looking coincidence. Arivia posted:why did they take the 3.5 version (which was in a book about water sailing) and not the original 2e version? They didn't that part is from the fan wiki. But the way the twitter guy posted it is a bit misleading. MonsterEnvy fucked around with this message at 18:39 on Sep 1, 2022 |
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Sep 1, 2022 18:36
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hyphz posted:Are we going to see the death of the gaming cafe with the coming recession? All of the ones I'd been to have closed shop since the pandemic, though even without that were probably not long of this world, since they had to be in nicer areas it also meant their rents were already high. Where I'm at financilization of real estate already has lead to perverse stuff like "It's better to have an empty building with rent of X, vs filled with a lower rent" since the goal is always to flip or mortgage to buy new property.
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Sep 1, 2022 18:41
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MonsterEnvy posted:I should note that the second quote this guy takes is from the Wiki from back in Stormwrack 17 years ago, and is not part of the current lore. Only the first screenshot he has is from the current book, where it's still not great, but there is a no happiness in servitude to elves stuff. Also the Stormwrack citation in the wiki is wrong."Hadozee have long been hired on as sailors, for they are known as hard workers and skilled warriors. They like working on elf ships or alongside an elf crewmate." is the full extent of elves and hadozee being mentioned in relation to eachother in Stormwrack. The references to fang baring and wooping and other monkey behavior are present in 2nd edition and not unique to Stormwrack. The wiki's particularly bad wording, is also either unique to the wiki or from a the new 5th edition book I don't have access to.
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Sep 1, 2022 19:15
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Terrible Opinions posted:You might not be able to see it on mobile, but the first tweet has a second image in it from dndbeyond Should have been more clear These parts are from the current book, which are not great.   This part he linked in a follow up tweet are from a Wiki, and not the current version of the game being at minimum 17 year old info the last appearance of the Hadozee. It's pretty bad, and while not actually connected to the above makes the above seem worse by being put beside it. 
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Sep 1, 2022 20:05
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Okay but... why did the sapient hadozees apparently gently caress into extinction the non-sapient hadozees?
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Sep 1, 2022 20:14
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Darwinism posted:Okay but... why did the sapient hadozees apparently gently caress into extinction the non-sapient hadozees? I don't really know, I did not write the lore, nor I am trying to excuse it, just trying to clear up a misconception I have seen some people have.
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Sep 1, 2022 20:24
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Dawgstar posted:Which is certainly a weird kludge. So Matt Forbeck is saying the Punisher can thumb a bunch of shells into a shotgun faster than he can swap out a clip. Very odd. It could lead to the optimal firearm strat going around with a bunch of derringers or something. Also I'm gonna be honest, a Marvel game that really cares to get into the differentiation of various firearms seems like a really weird place to be. Brave New World had this whole thing about how even in a superpowers setting everyone carried guns and, like, how high noon duels had come back into vogue in the dystopian US and it was all real dumb but like okay, that's Matt Forbeck's baby, he can do that if he wants, but I'm not sure that if you were to ask me what I thought the most important things to mechanically represent in a Marvel Comics RPG were that I would have anywhere on my list "make sure that pistols and shotguns and SMGs all have their own unique rules."
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Sep 1, 2022 20:39
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I don't like to Well Akshually about what belongs in what genre, but BNW struck me as not really a superhero game. Like, it's a common observation that too many superhero RPGs are mainly trying to be some kind of multiversal combat simulator. But BNW, in particular, restricts every PC to a narrow powerset and a lot of them don't do anything but kill people. Like, one of them is supernaturally good at shooting guns, and two of them are human bombs.
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Sep 1, 2022 20:55
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Halloween Jack posted:I don't like to Well Akshually about what belongs in what genre, but BNW struck me as not really a superhero game. Like, it's a common observation that too many superhero RPGs are mainly trying to be some kind of multiversal combat simulator. But BNW, in particular, restricts every PC to a narrow powerset and a lot of them don't do anything but kill people. Like, one of them is supernaturally good at shooting guns, and two of them are human bombs. I played a Human Bomb once, my schtick was to use my power for intimidation instead.I very rarely actually blew up. My Dm let me do that as a custom power lol. BNW isn't well-designed.
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Sep 1, 2022 21:13
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Halloween Jack posted:I don't like to Well Akshually about what belongs in what genre, but BNW struck me as not really a superhero game. Like, it's a common observation that too many superhero RPGs are mainly trying to be some kind of multiversal combat simulator. But BNW, in particular, restricts every PC to a narrow powerset and a lot of them don't do anything but kill people. Like, one of them is supernaturally good at shooting guns, and two of them are human bombs. BNW is not a superhero game. It's a deific war with invested humans as proxies.
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Sep 1, 2022 22:06
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Splicer posted:Hmmm. Yeah! I would do beneficial effects too. And some of those effects that interact are themselves achievements/tags that the game generates ("if you were killed by your own fire breath in a previous life and you do XYZ, then...") so that the experimentation and grisly deaths can be useful as well as entertaining. In order for it to be fun for most groups, players probably need to know when they have exhausted all the pre-generated possibilities for a given thing. They probably also need some guidance regarding what might go with what; I am thinking of Mutant City Blues' "Quade Diagram," which shows the health changes that are attached to superpowers so that investigators can attach a modus operandi to suspects in crimes they're investigating). So they know if it generated harmless cold blue light in addition to the effect, that is a clue that tells them what else it might be good for. In order for it to be fun for most GMs, the generation stage needs to either come in chunks/packages so that it's not 1,500 rolls on charts, or be routinized by a website or app, or both. It sounds like a math/optimization problem as much as a design problem. MonsieurChoc posted:I played a Human Bomb once, my schtick was to use my power for intimidation instead.I very rarely actually blew up. Not relevant to the first quote, but I have at times taken a lot of public transit, so I have heard some monologues by the eccentric and mentally ill. My total favorite was a guy telling everybody and nobody something like: "My buddy is gonna get me a job for the TSA. The TSA! I'm the man for the job. They better hire me. I'm tough. I'm fierce. Fearsome. Fearless! If you come at me with a knife, you can't kill me. If you're gonna shoot me, you better shoot me twice. You tell me to fight, I'll fight anyone. I'll fight a bomb." Years later I still think about the guy who would fight a bomb.
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Sep 1, 2022 22:48
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My bomb is fight
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Sep 1, 2022 22:51
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Splicer posted:Hmmm. I think this was the elevator pitch of Vel Mini's abandoned Skulldiggers RPG.
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Sep 1, 2022 22:55
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Darwinism posted:Okay but... why did the sapient hadozees apparently gently caress into extinction the non-sapient hadozees? If they are a Planet of the Apes reference as mentioned, that's a plot point from one of the old movies - some of the intelligent apes get thrust back in time to the then-present day and while at first they're public darlings and a media sensation, government figures learn about the future of Earth and the intelligent apes and plot to sterilize or kill them to prevent them from loving intelligence into the general ape population.
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Sep 1, 2022 23:14
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Kai Tave posted:Also I'm gonna be honest, a Marvel game that really cares to get into the differentiation of various firearms seems like a really weird place to be. Brave New World had this whole thing about how even in a superpowers setting everyone carried guns and, like, how high noon duels had come back into vogue in the dystopian US and it was all real dumb but like okay, that's Matt Forbeck's baby, he can do that if he wants, but I'm not sure that if you were to ask me what I thought the most important things to mechanically represent in a Marvel Comics RPG were that I would have anywhere on my list "make sure that pistols and shotguns and SMGs all have their own unique rules." I feel like there was a period of time where if you included guns in your game at all having sub-rules for every conceivable type of gun was just like, an automatic inclusion.
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Sep 2, 2022 00:08
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Yeahhhhh, there's no way to make a coherent super power hero with different scales of power mechanically granular like that without the numbers getting huge or the game just not making sense. Masks does it well. You want to use your powers? Yeah, you just do whatever that is. Reloading guns should not require detailed action economy rules when there are presumably Avenger level super powers flying off left and right. Though, if their goal was to capture the barely coherent rules of the MCU then they're right on track.
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Sep 2, 2022 00:13
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Doctor Zaius posted:I feel like there was a period of time where if you included guns in your game at all having sub-rules for every conceivable type of gun was just like, an automatic inclusion. I think maybe the Punisher might want rules for different guns, but mostly in a 'You pull out a gun. Explain how it is the coolest and most perfect kind of gun for this type of fight, then Roll + Violence' kind of way.
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Sep 2, 2022 00:52
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I have trouble even remembering any 90s game, no matter how rules light, that don't have a page and a half dedicated to covering fire and machine gun bursts
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Sep 2, 2022 01:01
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Everyone should just be using Rolemaster Standard's Firearms Law, where you use the full page attack chart based on the muzzle velocity of your gun.
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Sep 2, 2022 01:05
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theironjef posted:I have trouble even remembering any 90s game, no matter how rules light, that don't have a page and a half dedicated to covering fire and machine gun bursts And the only time it was fun was Feng Shui.
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Sep 2, 2022 01:17
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theironjef posted:I have trouble even remembering any 90s game, no matter how rules light, that don't have a page and a half dedicated to covering fire and machine gun bursts Gun porn was a big thing in RPGs around the turn of the millenium. Years ago I had an idea for a Paranoia-like satirical RPG set in an apocalyptic mall run by an AI whose creators were long since dead, and whose primary purpose was to ensure the steady flow of commodities. Players would play tribal humans for whom the mall was all that existed, and they came up with ridiculous myths to explain the world around them. The rulebook would be bound up in crass commercialism, and I'd planned on including several pages of literal gun porn in the style of furnitureporn.com, with the guns presented in "provocative" ways. All the guns, of course, had identical stats. I never really got past the initial planning stages and a few concept sketches, though.
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Sep 2, 2022 01:51
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