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Are Arkane games underrated? In my anecdotal experience they are treated as one of the better studios. Definitely the current heir to looking glass type games at least
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Sep 2, 2022 19:20
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Theyre Cult games well respected but not particularly popular
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Sep 2, 2022 19:29
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Since the first one I've played is Prey, should I give Dishonored or any others a try?
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Sep 2, 2022 20:04
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I rate both Dishonored installments very highly. I think Prey is my favorite of all their releases but they're up there. play them in order if you're going to play them both, if you only play one do the second. keep in mind #1 is pretty old at this point.
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Sep 2, 2022 20:10
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uber_stoat posted:I rate both Dishonored installments very highly. I think Prey is my favorite of all their releases but they're up there. play them in order if you're going to play them both, if you only play one do the second. keep in mind #1 is pretty old at this point. Both? You forgot about Death of the Outsider and Deathloop.
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Sep 2, 2022 20:19
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Tagaziel posted:Both? You forgot about Death of the Outsider and Deathloop. haha i forgot about that easter egg in Deathloop.
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Sep 2, 2022 20:33
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Dishonored is great. I personally think Prey is overall their best game but everything post Arx Fatalis is at least good fun. (Arx is good too but it needs a fair amount of mod wrangling to be particularly approachable these days.) also apparently arkane made a game called KarmaStar on iOS and I’ve never heard of Oh it was published by Majesco, was probably terrible
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Sep 2, 2022 21:17
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The world design in Dishonored 1 and 2 (and the expansions) is best in class. The games are divided into levels and far less free-form than Talos in Prey, but the setting in Dishonored just feels real in a way that very few other games can achieve. The guy that did Half-Life 2's world design also did Dishonored, so that you have an idea. I like walking around in Dishonored 1/2 more than Prey, but I admire Prey more just for being so perfectly self-contained. Deathloop has some great characterization and voice acting, and it's a blast to play, but it doesn't have the legs that Prey or the Dishonored series have. Weird West is pretty fun too. Some big-name devs left Arkane and founded a new studio, and WW is their first game. It's not at all like Arkane's games, but it still has that imm-sim thing where experimenting with the in-game systems can lead to some hilariously unexpected outcomes.
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Sep 2, 2022 21:18
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Weird West's gameplay feels kinda shonky at times since it's one of those weird isometric real-time action-RPG hybrids, but it definitely tries some interesting things. I do like that indiscriminately wiping out "bad guys" has believable consequences, like creating ever-escalating vendettas or causing the towns they run to become even more brutal and lawless.
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Sep 2, 2022 21:26
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I came back to games after a giant, near 20 year hiatus and the one studio I know I can rely on for a really solidly made game is Arkane. I used to work in games dev back in the day, and the work they put into making a game work no matter how you choose to play it is astonishingly good. There are no obvious bottlenecks; if you want to do a thing and if you can make it happen, the game will accommodate.
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Sep 2, 2022 21:28
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Prey's just such a solidly structured time, and that's really refreshing in the era of seemingly everything being built to be a mega-franchise by choice or by publisher demand. It would have been real easy to cut the third act differently and flat rewrite the ending to leave more open for future sequels, cheapening the game's experience rather than delivering on a beautiful, full circle story. Bioshock 2 wasn't horrific by any means, but I can understand Ken Levine for deciding he's said all he wants to say about Rapture. I was about to ask about other non-Arkane games, but I bought Dishonored 2 and Death of the Outsider already. Didn't even know about Deathloop so that's a nice surprise.
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Sep 2, 2022 21:37
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Old Doggy Bastard posted:Since the first one I've played is Prey, should I give Dishonored or any others a try? Dishonored is to the old Thief games what Prey is to System Shock. The game is broken up into quasi-linear levels that aren’t connected. You usually start each mission with a target that you have to locate, deal with, and then make your escape. Stealth is a major focus, as is exploring the sprawling levels. Personally while I think Prey has better environment design, the level design of Dishonored is just masterful. You never really feel railroaded into one angle of approach, and so the exploration rewards you with both useful items as well as different paths to your target. Story-wise, the world building is great and original, but the actual plot of the first game is so-so. The DLC improves this, and 2 has a generally more compelling narrative overall (although I find the art direction less cohesive). My main issue with Dishonored is that the stealth gameplay is good and clearly how the game is “supposed” to be played (from a narrative standpoint) but the combat is where all the interactivity went. The sheer number of ways you can kill enemies is hilarious. There are these proximity mines that you can attach to objects, and you can, for instance: Put down a mine and wait for enemies to pass Put down a mine and make a noise to draw enemies toward it Attach the mine to a bottle or other small object then throw the object at some enemies Freeze time, walk up to some enemies and put the mine down in the middle of them Freeze time, shoot a crossbow bolt at some enemies, attach the mine to the bolt while it’s frozen in midair, and then unfreeze time Put the mine on a rat, possess the rat, then walk up to a group of enemies etc. The stealth/nonlethal options aren’t nearly as interesting or inventive, it’s mostly just figuring out how to separate groups of enemies so you can sleep dart or choke them out one by one. 2 develops on this a little bit but not enough imho.
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Sep 2, 2022 21:59
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Yeah Dishonored is Thief if Garrett was explicitly about turning people inside out with magic. It also does that fun bit where the levels reflect how you play which I appreciate
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Sep 2, 2022 22:02
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Dishonored is nothing like Thief. Thief is a game about having very limited mobility and about gaining level knowledge and using it to your advantage. Dishonored gives you insane amounts of mobility and is goal oriented
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Sep 2, 2022 22:05
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Gaius Marius posted:Dishonored is nothing like Thief. Thief is a game about having very limited mobility and about gaining level knowledge and using it to your advantage. Dishonored gives you insane amounts of mobility and is goal oriented All that mobility is optional though; the game still holds up on powerless runs because of the level design. Sure the gameplay is goal oriented but that’s the whole difference of being an assassin/agent vs being a thief; having an immediate objective you’re working towards vs trying to make as much money as you can
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Sep 2, 2022 22:50
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Gaius Marius posted:Dishonored is nothing like Thief. Thief is a game about having very limited mobility and about gaining level knowledge and using it to your advantage. Dishonored gives you insane amounts of mobility and is goal oriented it is fun that you can just say whatever on the internet
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Sep 2, 2022 22:54
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I had Dishonored 1 on my steam library for years, before playing it this year for the first time. I remember buying it on the cheap and considering it's from 2013 it was a pretty amazing game. I pretty much did the low chaos run and mostly choked my way through. DLC wasn't as good but pretty solid Dishonored 2 has some of the best level designs i've ever experienced, still choked my way through and mostly didn't kill any humans, it really rewards you for using creative approaches to certain problems. I actually kind of liked the story for both the games in terms of their world building. Deathloop was ultimately great even though it took me a few months to finally dive into it. The flaws I thought were how you could miss advancing the story if you accidently missed a piece of paper or recording after clearing out a level. Also I think they could have made multiple ways to complete the loop instead of giving you only one real way to do it at the end.
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Sep 2, 2022 23:08
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Scrub-Niggurath posted:All that mobility is optional though; the game still holds up on powerless runs because of the level design. Even without using blink you still have sliding and a much higher jumping and mantling ability. Dishonored sneaking tens to emphasize being out of physical sight whereas Thief is about cloaking your body in shadows and your footsteps. And having the main gameplay conceit being different makes a huge difference. In theif you need to constantly keep your eyes peeled and ears open because you need the loot and supplies to succeed. Dishonored's heart gives you a tip off so you don't need to search as hard, having ways to not get mulched instantly disincentives having to maintain constant vigilance aurally and visually which means you have the luxury of using an object like the heart which puts out enough white noise you'd be unable to use it in Theif unless you already bagged all the guards, Dishonored also give you a much bigger tool kit that means you aren't put in situations where you aren't sure if you should use a rope or moss arrow because you aren't sure what's coming up. Their similarities in gameplay are shared by most immersive sims it's only the aesthetic considerations that makes people bind them so tightly together
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Sep 2, 2022 23:22
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Ok.
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Sep 2, 2022 23:52
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The intentions of Thief and Dishonored are just on opposite spectrums. If you're seen in Thief, it's because you're loving up and you'll probably start over/die. Dishonoured you're free to be seen, not being seen is just an aesthetic or gameplay preference but the game fully facilitates you using whatever tools as sloppily or elegantly as you decide.
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Sep 2, 2022 23:52
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infraboy posted:I had Dishonored 1 on my steam library for years, before playing it this year for the first time. I remember buying it on the cheap and considering it's from 2013 it was a pretty amazing game. I pretty much did the low chaos run and mostly choked my way through. DLC wasn't as good but pretty solid It's balanced towards high chaos. Low chaos is supposed to be the challenge mode. A lot of people don't get that and either a) bounce off it really hard trying to play low chaos the first time or b) wonder why there aren't more stealth options
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Sep 3, 2022 00:18
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I've never played Thief or System Shock. Checking on Wikipedia, the only immersive sims I've played are Prey and BioShock. I grabbed Dishonored 2 and Death of the Outsider, checking out Dishonored 2 right now. I bought a bunch of games on sale a long time ago, Deus Ex: Game of the Year Edition, Deus Ex: Invisible War, Deus Ex: Human Revolution - Director's Cut, and Deus Ex: The Fall. Any of those worth playing, essential to play, or are bad enough to be best skipped? I also have System Shock: Classic, System Shock: Enhanced Edition, and System Shock 2, but since the remake is around the corner I figured just wait for that to come out.
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Sep 3, 2022 02:46
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Skip the fall and invisible war. Deus Ex one is the greatest game of all time.
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Sep 3, 2022 02:47
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As someone who grew up playing Deus Ex, I think it might be rose-tinted glasses saying it's the best game of all time if you played every game ever back to back right now. But it's deservedly a legend - for its time, it was definitely one of, if not the best. I think PC Gamer called it #2 behind Tetris. It was that important. Don't take this as saying it doesn't hold up or anything - it absolutely does, much more than most games of its era. So yeah, play the OG Deus Ex.
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Sep 3, 2022 02:55
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Didn't play it until 2012
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Sep 3, 2022 03:02
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The combat does not quite hold up but yes, I was discovering new things in it 21 years after I first played. It is the GOAT
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Sep 3, 2022 03:05
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Oh, what about Deus Ex: Human Revolution?
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Sep 3, 2022 03:08
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It's really good. Really strong sense of aesthetics and a not terrible story. The gameplay is slightly stifled from it's predecessor, but as a whole it's a better legacy sequel than anyone was expecting.
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Sep 3, 2022 03:10
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It's sequel is also very good. There's some niggling things to complain about that Square Enix did with the Deus Ex world*, but both Human Revolution and Mankind Divided are great games and worthy of the series. *among them, shelving the loving IP before finishing out the story of the new games
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Sep 3, 2022 03:39
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Scrub-Niggurath posted:All that mobility is optional though; the game still holds up on powerless runs because of the level design. Also, Thief is itself very goal-oriented; with very few exceptions every level has some specific objective you need to complete (sometimes, but not always, "steal this specific high-value object") and while you're going to be pocketing as much loot as you can en route to it (and on higher difficulties are obligated to do so), your approach to the level is going to be informed by what your actual target is. (And similarly, Dishonoured strongly incentivizes exploring the entire level and grabbing as much loot as you can in the same way Thief does; it's not like you get free gear refills between levels or anything, everything you use is either OSP or purchased from the black market.) Gaius Marius posted:It's really good. Really strong sense of aesthetics and a not terrible story. The gameplay is slightly stifled from it's predecessor, but as a whole it's a better legacy sequel than anyone was expecting. DXHR was good but I'd still recommend DX1 over it; my main beefs with HR are: - nonlethal ghost gameplay has very strong mechanical incentives, between the faster, quieter takedowns and huge XP bonuses, while DX1 was equally rewarding whether you approached it as CyberGarrett or as the Terminator - the boss fights suck rear end and investing in the "delete this combat encounter" aug is highly recommended, since (unlike DX1) there is no non-combat bypass for them - the ending but all that said I don't feel like I wasted my time playing it, it's just not going to be an evergreen favourite like DX1 was. (My main beef with DX1 is that implant management is a chore once you have more than one or two of them, and I really appreciate stuff like BioMod that makes implants smarter about automatically turning on and off.)
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Sep 3, 2022 04:30
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If they were to do a Deus Ex 1 remaster (and they should, the game is bitrotting) BioMod should be bundled by default.
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Sep 3, 2022 04:42
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ToxicFrog posted:- the boss fights suck rear end and investing in the "delete this combat encounter" aug is highly recommended, since (unlike DX1) there is no non-combat bypass for them They actually did implement other options in Director's Cut, but yeah that's a miss overall.
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Sep 3, 2022 05:01
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SCheeseman posted:If they were to do a Deus Ex 1 remaster (and they should, the game is bitrotting) BioMod should be bundled by default. Do you suggest adding the BioMod for my first playthrough?
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Sep 3, 2022 06:31
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Don't sleep on Dishonored's DLC either; not only is it great (probably a notch higher than the base game's levels) but it explicitly sets up several characters and villain of 2 and Death of the Outsider.
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Sep 3, 2022 07:16
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Old Doggy Bastard posted:Do you suggest adding the BioMod for my first playthrough? Yes
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Sep 3, 2022 07:22
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BioMod also fixes or adds so many other little things. It's just a stellar extra layer of polish that modernizes the game.
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Sep 3, 2022 07:43
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I've been playing some of Deathloop, which so far is kind of cool. The fact I can't open my weapon inventory so I can compare guns or can only pick up a rare bottle among mountains of stiff environment can piles ( unlike in Prey where you delightfully can pick up every single rock ) makes the came feel a little stiff compared to how swift and fluid Prey was, or how Dishonored 2 seems to be. Just started it out and it looks super cool, other than that whoever decided Ctrl-L is the ideal dodge key should be shot ( Spiderman does the same, but I'll rebind it ).
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Sep 3, 2022 11:30
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I beat Deus Ex for the first time like 5 or 6 years ago, after a few unsuccessful tries; the very first level is probably the worst but it gets way better after that. DXHR is terrific too, and it regularly goes on sale these days
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Sep 3, 2022 15:54
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I like that Liberty Island is very action oriented, though, even if there's too much open space. "Here's some tools, some goals, go have fun." That slow technobabble-laden walk through the beginning of DX:HR is really dire.
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Sep 3, 2022 15:58
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Man, just realized I can change the key configuration in Deathloop and Dishonored 2 to be the same.
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Sep 3, 2022 16:06
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