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projecthalaxy posted:Yeah I guess you're right, its just kinda irritating/discouraging that Abbott and DeSantis and their pals just get to Do Whatever and brag about it on TV and say they'll do it over and over and all the magas at my work get to taunt me about it and there's nothing I can point to besides Biden at a Hispanic Rights dinner asking them to maybe knock it off instead of having some sort of like actual response. He didn't even say we'd have social services waiting on the tarmac like you suggested! Unfortunately, pressuring inconvenient poor people to board a bus going across the country with zero arrangements for their arrival in the destination is a lot more common than people think. It's especially unforgivable when they're doing it to mental health patients the local hospital doesn't want to take care of anymore. If there's one thing I hope to see from this stunt, it's driving awareness for that. Many of these homeless-trafficking programs are based in major liberal cities like NYC or San Francisco, where I'm sure the politically-inclined are very enraged that Abbott would dare to put vulnerable people on a one-way bus going out of state, even though their own cities do that on a routine basis. If this becomes an opportunity to mobilize them against their own cities' policies for shipping the poor and vulnerable elsewhere, that might very well be worth it. Phenotype posted:So in the Trump documents case, he's got the special master now, and the special master asked them to tell us if he declassified any of the documents, and they say "nuh uh we don't want to say if we declassified anything because that will damage his criminal defense." He knows full well that he didn't declassify anything and that lying to the court about it won't end well. But he doesn't want to openly admit that he didn't declassify anything, because he's been telling his followers outside the courtroom that he declassified everything and it's all a big witch-hunt.
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Sep 20, 2022 19:17
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The special master doesn't appear to be having any of it. Unlike Cannon, he's basically said that he considers the classification markings as prima facie evidence of classification and they have to actually claim which documents are unclassified.
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Sep 20, 2022 19:27
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Phenotype posted:Why are they trying to keep the waters murky regarding declassification? If he's gonna say it's fine that he had them because they were all declassified, then how does it hurt him to say that now? I've heard people online saying "well, if he says these 10 documents were declassified, then he's admitting the others weren't" but why can't he just say "yeah they're all declassified"?
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Sep 20, 2022 19:36
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ryde posted:The special master doesn't appear to be having any of it. Unlike Cannon, he's basically said that he considers the classification markings as prima facie evidence of classification and they have to actually claim which documents are unclassified. I guess the ideal outcome here is the special master comes back in five minutes with a document that says "I agree with the DOJ on everything, please proceed with the case."
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Sep 20, 2022 19:39
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haveblue posted:I guess the ideal outcome here is the special master comes back in five minutes with a document that says "I agree with the DOJ on everything, please proceed with the case." I suspect it won't matter for Judge Cannon. I think the real hope is that the appeal process ends up with enough non-chudge R judges that it gets put in front of the right people.
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Sep 20, 2022 19:45
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ryde posted:The special master doesn't appear to be having any of it. Unlike Cannon, he's basically said that he considers the classification markings as prima facie evidence of classification and they have to actually claim which documents are unclassified. I don't understand why Dearie was on Trump's list. Why even list someone who seems rational? Put sycophants and hope Cannon bites. Or is that going a little to far and risk the strategy of delay?
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Sep 20, 2022 19:46
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Here is the messaging to get at Human Trafficker Ron. Ron deSantis cares more about the people in Martha's Vineyard than he does about Floridians and he is spending tax payers money to own the libs instead of helping Floridians. Just show that Human Trafficker Ron doesn't care about Florida at all. Hammer the message home. Call him a human trafficker so much that that becomes a part of his name like a stain.
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Sep 20, 2022 19:52
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BDawg posted:I don't understand why Dearie was on Trump's list. Why even list someone who seems rational? Put sycophants and hope Cannon bites. They thought he would be skeptical of the FBI because he was on the FISA court? Very little law knowledge but seems like his lawyers are morons. https://www.axios.com/2022/09/18/trump-special-master-dearie-fbi-skeptic quote:Raymond Dearie's appointment as special master to review records the FBI seized from Mar-a-Lago was a positive development for former President Trump, whose lawyers recommended him. But their call for the low-profile New York judge was befuddling given Dearie has no apparent connection or loyalty to Trump.
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Sep 20, 2022 20:00
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Bugsy posted:They thought he would be skeptical of the FBI because he was on the FISA court? Very little law knowledge but seems like his lawyers are morons. It's been said before, but it bears repeating that his decades-long practice of stiffing his attorneys and dodging huge legal bills for months and years means he really isn't getting the top-flight legal advice someone of his wealth/prominence should at least theoretically get.
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Sep 20, 2022 20:08
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Main Paineframe posted:
I hope you were being cynical here. Alex freaking Jones lied serially to the court, mocked the judge to her face and then on the media, and the system has zero will to go after him. If you think they'll be more willing to stick out their necks for a popular former president, who also appointed a swarm of crazies to the judiciary thanks to Uncle Mitch, meaning they can muck up legal proceedings on a national level is crossed, you must really know something I don't.
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Sep 20, 2022 20:09
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Madkal posted:Here is the messaging to get at Human Trafficker Ron. Ron deSantis cares more about the people in Martha's Vineyard than he does about Floridians and he is spending tax payers money to own the libs instead of helping Floridians. I have unfortunate news for you about the vitriol of Charlie Crist
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Sep 20, 2022 20:16
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Madkal posted:Here is the messaging to get at Human Trafficker Ron. Ron deSantis cares more about the people in Martha's Vineyard than he does about Floridians and he is spending tax payers money to own the libs instead of helping Floridians. Using tax money to hurt people is the only use of tax money that's approved by Republicans.
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Sep 20, 2022 20:29
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Captain_Maclaine posted:It's been said before, but it bears repeating that his decades-long practice of stiffing his attorneys and dodging huge legal bills for months and years means he really isn't getting the top-flight legal advice someone of his wealth/prominence should at least theoretically get. This is a talking point that gets bandied about but I haven’t been able to find any thing that substantiates it. Do you have any evidence of this claim? On a lighter note, there’s been quite the tizzy over the size of this teachers breasts. How big is too big anyways? In the immortal words of Potter Stewart, “ Decide for yourself  https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11224383/amp/High-school-defends-transgender-teacher-large-prosthetic-breasts.html quote:Canadian high school teacher has sparked controversy after pictures emerged of her wearing large breast prosthetics while teaching students. Sounds like the school has her back and she’s popular w the students so hopefully this blows over with out much kerfuffle. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Sep 20, 2022 20:31
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BIG-DICK-BUTT-gently caress posted:This is a talking point that gets bandied about but I haven’t been able to find any thing that substantiates it. Do you have any evidence of this claim? Sure; last month the Washington Post published this entitled, Trump is rushing to hire seasoned lawyers — but he keeps hearing ‘No’. I think he was able to finally get at least one decent lawyer, but had to pay a huge retainer up front because, again, nobody trusts him to pay his eventual bills. Above and beyond the money factor, there's also the fact that he doesn't listen to anything he doesn't like, nor follow the cardinal rule all good lawyers drum into people in legal trouble: "sit down and shut the gently caress up."
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Sep 20, 2022 20:41
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BIG-DICK-BUTT-gently caress posted:Sounds like the school has her back I hope someone does.
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Sep 20, 2022 20:41
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Captain_Maclaine posted:Sure; last month the Washington Post published this entitled, Trump is rushing to hire seasoned lawyers — but he keeps hearing ‘No’. D’oh! Dunno how I missed this. It was always plausible but sometimes truth and fiction get blended together with these Trump legends, so I wanted to ask before repeating a falsehood and spreading “Fake News”  . Much obliged
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Sep 20, 2022 20:44
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BIG-DICK-BUTT-gently caress posted:D’oh! Dunno how I missed this. It was always plausible but sometimes truth and fiction get blended together with these Trump legends. Much obliged No prob. With our big wet boy it's always hard to tell the crazy-sounding but real stories from the plausible but unfortunately false ones like the Gorilla Channel. Psikotik posted:I hope someone does. 
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Sep 20, 2022 20:46
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BIG-DICK-BUTT-gently caress posted:This is a talking point that gets bandied about but I haven’t been able to find any thing that substantiates it. Do you have any evidence of this claim? I started to express an opinion on this, but I actually think completely ignoring the Daily Mail is the better approach and I encourage you all to do the same.
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Sep 20, 2022 20:47
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Madkal posted:Here is the messaging to get at Human Trafficker Ron. Ron deSantis cares more about the people in Martha's Vineyard than he does about Floridians and he is spending tax payers money to own the libs instead of helping Floridians. That'd be a great plan if we didn't live in a country where a third to a half of the electorate didn't think that both DeSantis and human trafficking (of most shades of human) were both extremely cool and good. Unfortunately, America.
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Sep 20, 2022 20:48
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What does a Canadian teacher's large breasts have to do with US Current Events
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Sep 20, 2022 20:49
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American Right Wing media is talking about it still a valid question, but one that should be posed to Fox News et al
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Sep 20, 2022 21:20
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Yeah but right wing media and the Daily Mail appear to be talking about it from a trans panic angle. It's been brought up in the D&D LGBTQIA+ thread and is probably better suited there.
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Sep 20, 2022 21:22
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Fritz the Horse posted:What does a Canadian teacher's large breasts have to do with US Current Events If you're queer and especially if you're trans, unfortunately a lot. I knew it was something being blown out of context, but holy poo poo are the chuds running with it. Fritz the Horse posted:Yeah but right wing media and the Daily Mail appear to be talking about it from a trans panic angle. It's been brought up in the D&D LGBTQIA+ thread and is probably better suited there. Didn't know this was a thing so it's probably better discussed there.
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Sep 20, 2022 21:22
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ryde posted:The special master doesn't appear to be having any of it. Unlike Cannon, he's basically said that he considers the classification markings as prima facie evidence of classification and they have to actually claim which documents are unclassified. https://mobile.twitter.com/KlasfeldReports/status/1572289427766136834 https://mobile.twitter.com/KlasfeldReports/status/1572290983684935680 Is both what Dearie would do if he wants to see Trump's hack squirm and what he'd do if he wants to give his lawyers a chance to elaborate on their (woefully inadequate) pleaded arguments. Also, arguably, if he's bored and wants to fill time. I think you have the right interpretation, but it's hardly the only valid one. Phenotype posted:So in the Trump documents case, he's got the special master now, and the special master asked them to tell us if he declassified any of the documents, and they say "nuh uh we don't want to say if we declassified anything because that will damage his criminal defense." Dearie's comment https://mobile.twitter.com/KlasfeldReports/status/1572291949104877570 reflects the reality of Trump's strategy. Suggest in public and have your flacks flood the airwaves with hints that you did declassify everything, to justify truly extraordinary relief and mute public outcry. Then, in court, claim that you really do want to specify but the court can't force you to (or hold your refusal against you) because it'd harm your defense in a potential future criminal case. Important to remember here (and it apparently tripped up Trump's legal team w/r/t seating arrangements), Trump's not the defendant here.... and it's a civil, not criminal proceeding. The burden is on him.
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Sep 20, 2022 21:24
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Sephyr posted:I hope you were being cynical here. Alex freaking Jones lied serially to the court, mocked the judge to her face and then on the media, and the system has zero will to go after him. If you think they'll be more willing to stick out their necks for a popular former president, who also appointed a swarm of crazies to the judiciary thanks to Uncle Mitch, meaning they can muck up legal proceedings on a national level is crossed, you must really know something I don't. I think you may be misinformed, because Jones and his lawyers have both suffered considerable consequences from defying the courts and pissing off the judges. Most obviously, he lost all his court cases by default without even going to trial, because the judges decided he was loving around too much with discovery, and just awarded an automatic win to the people suing him. Moreover, his continued loving around has resulted in him being sanctioned in various ways, such as having certain lines of defense forbidden to him. His lawyers aren't off the hook either, with serious possibilities for sanctions against them (though the judges are content to leave that till after the Jones trials themselves). The number one rule of court is to never piss off the judge. They may not immediately destroy you with all of their power, but that's because they can afford to let things wait. They run the courtroom, they don't need to rush to interrupt someone who can't stop digging the hole deeper.
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Sep 20, 2022 22:17
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projecthalaxy posted:That'd be a great plan if we didn't live in a country where a third to a half of the electorate didn't think that both DeSantis and human trafficking (of most shades of human) were both extremely cool and good. Unfortunately, America. Plus, in the eyes of his supporters, what he's doing IS good for Florida, because now there aren't any dirty immigrants stealing all of the jobs and doing all of the crimes and stealing all of the welfare, which is stuff that absolutely definitely happens in their world.
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Sep 20, 2022 22:19
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Everything DeSantis does is calculated to appeal to his base. He (correctly, in my view) feels like there’s no legitimate opposition to him in this state and can just do whatever he wants with no consequences. If the Feds get involved, even better, because then he can claim that Biden is targeting him specifically. It’s really win/win the majority of the time.
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Sep 20, 2022 22:26
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Main Paineframe posted:I think you may be misinformed, because Jones and his lawyers have both suffered considerable consequences from defying the courts and pissing off the judges. Have the financial consequences been larger than "what he can earn back in a few days"?
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Sep 20, 2022 22:27
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Jaxyon posted:Have the financial consequences been larger than "what he can earn back in a few days"? Considering his lawyers are currently in court trying to minimize the amount he has to pay in damages... there's a good chance they will be?
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Sep 20, 2022 22:32
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The end result of the Alex Jones trials is going to be years more of lawsuits trying to claw back the money from the fake companies he's hidden it in while he uses the lawsuits as easy content for his shows. paywall free NYTimes article about how he's hidden like $70m over the past few years. https://archive.ph/N3moe#selection-1269.0-1272.0
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Sep 20, 2022 22:36
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Jaxyon posted:Have the financial consequences been larger than "what he can earn back in a few days"? Not from the first trial, as Texas has a very low cap on punitive damages (I wanna say they top out at $750k),* and his lawyers for all their pants-on-head incompetence did manage to persuade the jury to level much heavier punitive than compensatory damages (which are not capped). The plaintiff's are trying to get around that but the odds aren't amazing. No idea about the sanctions consequences as those are being held until after both trials are complete I believe, nor what limits if any Connecticut has on damages. EDIT: /\ /\ /\ Oh yeah, and this. He's done all he can to dump assets in places he hopes can't be touched. *A component of this delightful law was that the plaintiff's attorneys were bound from informing the jury of just how low the punitive damages cap is. Captain_Maclaine fucked around with this message at 22:44 on Sep 20, 2022 |
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Sep 20, 2022 22:37
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Digamma-F-Wau posted:American Right Wing media is talking about it There's a Right Wing Media thread: https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3512233
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Sep 20, 2022 22:43
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Jaxyon posted:Have the financial consequences been larger than "what he can earn back in a few days"? He's got two more trials, plus the whole bankruptcy thing going on. There's a reason the lawyers are all making sure to emphasize very strongly how much money he made off these. Just because he's going to continue to make lots of money doesn't mean it won't sting when he loses tens of millions of dollars.
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Sep 20, 2022 22:52
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haveblue posted:New York and Delaware should buy a one-way ticket to Florida for any
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Sep 20, 2022 23:00
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Biden should really dick with DeSantis via the FAA
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Sep 20, 2022 23:23
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:The actual potential crime would be leading them there under false pretenses with a promise of financial gain. It seems that might have happened, but it's also not totally clear what was said/promised/what the migrants understood from the information that is public. The most likely way I see this stopping is from lower level GOP officials having plausibly-successful civil suits and criminal investigations aimed at them and future minions being spooked about continuing. (Bexar county, TX where the refugees were lured from has a criminal investigation running, in addition to this civil suit)
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Sep 20, 2022 23:28
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Main Paineframe posted:He's got two more trials, plus the whole bankruptcy thing going on. There's a reason the lawyers are all making sure to emphasize very strongly how much money he made off these. Well as long as he feels a slight sting, ok then.
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Sep 21, 2022 01:09
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Main Paineframe posted:He's got two more trials, plus the whole bankruptcy thing going on. There's a reason the lawyers are all making sure to emphasize very strongly how much money he made off these. funny story about that bankruptcy thing https://twitter.com/NYTLiz/status/1572378741686562817 what that means is, alex jones' lawyer just got fired by the bankruptcy judge, as did his puppet officer running infowars https://twitter.com/NYTLiz/status/1572380857268314112?s=20&t=7BHlWQ61dSv4B42a17xijw and what that means is that an independent person is now appointed to run infowars. what is that independent person's job? well, it's mostly to spend infowars' money suing alex jones, and hiring lawyers to do that: https://twitter.com/NYTLiz/status/1572381575001657347?s=20&t=7BHlWQ61dSv4B42a17xijw this is an astounding reversal of fortune. you may ask "can alex jones decide oops, i don't want infowars to be in bankruptcy anymore" and the answer is no, he doesn't get to make decisions for infowars anymore, the appointed trustee will be doing that and will be deciding that bankruptcy is an ideal forum to sue alex jones in
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Sep 21, 2022 01:56
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basically short of that NYT reporter wildly misreporting what happened the only way that bankruptcy could be going worse is if the judge put Jones in jail himself
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Sep 21, 2022 01:57
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Jaxyon posted:Well as long as he feels a slight sting, ok then. It's difficult to know exactly how much of a sting, given his efforts to obscure his finances. But a forensic economist called during the Texas trial estimated that the combined net worth of Jones and his companies is somewhere between $135 million and $270 million. Probably about half of that is his own money, though it's not that hard for him to embezzle some from the company if he needs it. Which is a lot of money, sure. But the number the Texas jury arrived at was $49 million, somewhere between one-third and one-fifth of his empire. And while the damages cap limited his effective payout to only a few million, he's facing two more trials he's already lost. And if even a Texas jury thought he was that bad, his prospects are not good in CT, especially not in a courtroom twenty miles from Sandy Hook. Especially since the CT plaintiffs are putting more of a focus on Jones' profits, and also have a legit legal path to evade damage caps. And it's not just those cases, either. The fact that one of his lawyers accidentally leaked a copy of his phone data is damaging in all sorts of ways, and it'll hurt him even in other, unrelated lawsuits. For example, his ex-wife is very interested to see if anything in his texts could be relevant to her ongoing court battles with Alex for custody of the kids. It's already come out that he engaged in extensive secret surveillance of both his ex-wife and current wife, and also that he sent his current wife's nude photos to Roger Stone without her knowledge or consent.
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Sep 21, 2022 02:52
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