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whoever arranged that chart can bite my dick jfc
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Sep 20, 2022 20:58
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Denken got done dirty wtf 48?? He should be top 20 at least
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Sep 20, 2022 21:00
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Fellis posted:Denken got done dirty wtf 48?? He should be top 20 at least Meanwhile, the Hero of the South is all the way down at 74. Ain't no justice in these things.
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Sep 20, 2022 21:03
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Fellis posted:Denken got done dirty wtf 48?? He should be top 20 at least He should be in the top ten for the first fight alone!
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Sep 20, 2022 21:26
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Ice cream or parfait or whatever it was is rocking the chart.
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Sep 20, 2022 21:34
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Lot of people read one maybe 2 volumes and rushed to the polls
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Sep 20, 2022 21:35
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The same picture being used for 1 and 100 is just too perfect
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Sep 20, 2022 21:46
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ninjoatse.cx posted:whoever arranged that chart can bite my dick jfc It was clearly a demon. No human mind conceived this layout.
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Sep 20, 2022 22:40
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screw the chart, frieren and the mimic obviously tied for first place.
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Sep 20, 2022 23:11
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Chapter 100 
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Sep 20, 2022 23:44
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"So my opponent is the very history of mankind's magic itself" is really cool. I really like the weight of history aspect to Frieran Good chapter
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Sep 21, 2022 00:10
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Wow, I can't believe Macht used that spell. There is no chapter next week.
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Sep 21, 2022 00:32
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Fellis posted:Denken got done dirty wtf 48?? He should be top 20 at least Did you really expect him to stand up against the likes of a delicious-looking sundae, a random dragon that got killed in twenty seconds, and the old guy with a straw hat who met Frieren as a kid? seriously what is up with that character poll, most of the top 20 don't even have actual names
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Sep 21, 2022 00:53
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Do people really like these characters, or are they just trolling? What do these polls even look like
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Sep 21, 2022 02:11
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There's no way it's a real poll because mimic wouldn't be in 100th place if it was.
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Sep 21, 2022 02:46
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That's the list of characters eligible for votes, not the results. Results will be released in November.
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Sep 21, 2022 03:02
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Ah, in that case Frieren & the mimic should tie for first.
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Sep 21, 2022 03:03
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Doodles posted:Ah, in that case Frieren & the mimic should tie for first. Somehow, the winner is Kobeni's car.
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Sep 21, 2022 03:21
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Fellis posted:Denken got done dirty wtf 48?? He should be top 20 at least The man chose to have an honorable fist fight with a bunch of depressed mages because he knew it was the best way to help them cope with failure and nobody seems to respect that in the poll.
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Sep 21, 2022 05:13
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Sumigahara Haseo posted:That's the list of characters eligible for votes, not the results. Results will be released in November. Don't worry, Forums Ghost, I can see your posts.
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Sep 21, 2022 06:22
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I legit thought Denken was going to punch Macht because he knew Macht would never expect physical combat from his sorcerer student.
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Sep 21, 2022 07:26
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Donkringel posted:I legit thought Denken was going to punch Macht because he knew Macht would never expect physical combat from his sorcerer student. I considered it. But Macht has a sword and as a demon is physically superior to even a fit human. On the other hand, it wouldn't surprise me if it ended with a punch. These fights have been very good for Frieren's standards.
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Sep 21, 2022 09:05
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There has been so much build up around the feeling of malice and the cursed bracelet, it seems Macht's end almost has to involve it somehow. Maybe because his foe is the entire history of human magic, he finally experiences and understands what malice feels like, the bracelet activates, and dies content. It would be a very Friereneque conclusion.
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Sep 21, 2022 09:36
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Macht you fool, you really should have subscribed to Magic Association newsletter.
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Sep 21, 2022 11:16
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It's really funny to me that the entire OG party beats the two newbies
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Sep 21, 2022 15:25
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Sumigahara Haseo posted:That's the list of characters eligible for votes, not the results. Results will be released in November. Well at least that partially explains the absolute nonsense way its laid out
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Sep 21, 2022 15:44
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Its also layed out, apart from the first 6, top to bottom, right to left. Like how you can write japanese
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Sep 21, 2022 16:04
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Sumigahara Haseo posted:That's the list of characters eligible for votes, not the results. Results will be released in November. RareAcumen posted:Don't worry, Forums Ghost, I can see your posts.
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Sep 21, 2022 16:34
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Good chapter. Macht vs Denken is very interesting, and I like the logic behind this development. Solitar's speculation on Frieren's state of mind is a bit abstract to me. She's a monster because she has listened to her opponents beg for mercy for thousands of years and never once hesitated to slay them anyway? Is the statement that Frieren is a monster because of her absolute conviction in her decision that demons are irredeemable and must be slain? I get the logic behind it, but I dunno, if I pause to think that Frieren says she's seen this situation play out countless times and has probably seen more than one human fall for a demon's tricks, and so empirically observed their lies again and again, Solitar's accusation falls a little flat for me. I really like Solitar's characterization as a behavioral scientist sort of demon though.
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Sep 21, 2022 18:26
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This thread had a massive derail about how portraying the demons as irredeemable was a bad thing because assigning sentiet humanoid beings the racial trait of absolute evil is a bad thing for an author to do. Solitar is doing something similar
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Sep 21, 2022 18:38
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M_Gargantua posted:This thread had a massive derail about how portraying the demons as irredeemable was a bad thing because assigning sentiet humanoid beings the racial trait of absolute evil is a bad thing for an author to do. For all the problematic elements, you gotta at least hand it to the manga for really going all in on exploring the implications of having an 'inherently evil' species in the setting rather than just having goblins or whatever as an unexamined backdrop.
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Sep 21, 2022 19:34
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the demons say stuff to mess with people and if someone is hard to mess with you have to do probing attacks to figure out what they respond to. the fundamentally novel characteristic of demons in the frierenverse is that they say a lot of stuff to non-demons for effect and not meaning (it’s often not that they hope you believe the lie, it’s that it will produce a range of outcomes weighted towards favorable effects). part of the fun in reading them is working out what dialogue is informational and what is tactical. the first time you see them you fall for the face value trick and think you are correcting when you then assume they consciously lie to deceive, then when they are talking among themselves you realize you misunderstood: they mostly don’t understand what they are saying either. but the older great demons do have some understanding, which they use to construct much more complex things to say for effect. some of the characters also have an understanding of what the limits of meaningful communication with great demons are, so they don’t bother taking conversations into useless places. in particular the denken/macht interactions are unusually “real” and this persists in their battle. denken probably can’t win his fight with magic so i expect he will manage to say something that wins it, in some kinda ironic outcome. frieren i reckon will pull out a solidly technical magic win since the series really does seem to like to say she is a monster in the sense that others who are well used to defeating the weaknesses of others encounter her and meet a wall. that’s also what is going on with solitar. she is probing verbally and getting a lot of disaffected “whatever”
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Sep 21, 2022 20:15
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the demons have the racial trait of being aliens, not absolute evil. They look like a Star Trek race of basically human but with rubber ears but actually they'd be more at home in a sci-fi story of alien intelligences amongst the stars. They've sort of puzzled out a rough psych model of humans but they don't 'get it'. It's just odd to have them in a fantasy setting really. Frieran comparing Solitar to a (alien)researcher poking (human)animals to see what they do is spot-on. You can definitely write a story where the two peoples reach some kind of peace without having the demons be just misunderstood humans with rubber ears. It might even be something that happens in the future, but given that the demons aren't lightyears away, and are very powerful, and don't mind using that power, it's not crazy to shoot first you know? As non-humans become more adept at tech and magic, and the most powerful demons get killed, maybe they can have a ceasefire or something
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Sep 21, 2022 20:39
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Also solitar and macht (and presumably a few other demons 'uplifted' by the demon king) are weirdoes by demon standards. Theyre in no way representative of what demons think like.
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Sep 21, 2022 21:48
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The demons do not really have conscious thought and only think of survival. The idea of pondering “what is my favorite color?” is simply a waste of energy to them, and humans asking a question like “how are you feeling?” is to them an attack, because it makes them waste energy deciphering something pointless to their survival.
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Sep 21, 2022 22:01
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PringleCreamEgg posted:The demons do not really have conscious thought and only think of survival. The idea of pondering “what is my favorite color?” is simply a waste of energy to them, and humans asking a question like “how are you feeling?” is to them an attack, because it makes them waste energy deciphering something pointless to their survival. Though its not really pointless for their survival if you think about it. Answering the question would reduce the chances of being attacked by humans and thus increase their chances of survival. But demons be alien in thier though processes and I think thats a good thing about this series.
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Sep 21, 2022 22:08
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PringleCreamEgg posted:The demons do not really have conscious thought and only think of survival. The idea of pondering “what is my favorite color?” is simply a waste of energy to them, and humans asking a question like “how are you feeling?” is to them an attack, because it makes them waste energy deciphering something pointless to their survival. That's "Blindsight". We see with Macht that demons have interiority, and can even want to understand humans. It's just that they very much aren't human, and the interactions usually don't go well for anyone involved.
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Sep 21, 2022 22:11
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which reminds me i never did buy the Blindsight sequel
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Sep 21, 2022 22:12
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It's kinda funny that you can drop a reference to Blindsight, out of all things, in the discussion about a fantasy manga where a cute elf and her friends are going on a trip to the end of the earth/afterlife and it being 100% relevant.
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Sep 21, 2022 23:21
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| # ? Jun 7, 2024 01:44 |
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PringleCreamEgg posted:The demons do not really have conscious thought and only think of survival. The idea of pondering “what is my favorite color?” is simply a waste of energy to them, and humans asking a question like “how are you feeling?” is to them an attack, because it makes them waste energy deciphering something pointless to their survival. i don't know if survival is really their motivation, since the easiest way to do that is to avoid humans, avoid killing them, etc., and it's not like they don't understand enough to know that humans are more likely to kill them if they kill humans first. in the moment of immediate danger they may say something to save themselves, but they seem to have some other compulsions that are a bit mysterious. we don't really have a concept of their ecology: where they come from, what they need in terms of sustenance, how they regulate internal competition, etc., which are really required to construct a model of their motivations, which in turn is a prerequisite to model their cognition. what's really fascinating is the question of how the existence of the demon king could have really fit together with all these different parts
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Sep 22, 2022 00:01
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