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 And this is why you don't try and one up your dad
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Oct 10, 2022 18:58
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Anonymous Zebra posted:I think Alicent and Rhaenyra really genuinely were trying to make up at that dinner. That's why the dinner is a tragedy. Yeah, I think she was genuine, but at the same time she knows it’s too late to change course now. I don’t think Viserys’ last words about Aegon ultimately mattered that much. That Velaryon dude got his head cut in half because of what she and Otto have been saying and she was already responsible for several other deaths before that. She knows her son sucks but she also knows her kids and her dad will have no reason to play nice after the king’s dead. This was a good episode for Alicent, I had some sympathy for her situation even though it’s partly of her own making. I hope Otto gets thrown out of a castle window though, this is all his fault.
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Oct 10, 2022 18:58
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I wonder if Aemond and Viserys ever bonded over having two eyes between them.zoux posted:Also Aegon looks like if Evan Peters was cast as Jack White. It’s amazing how right you are with this.
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Oct 10, 2022 18:59
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https://twitter.com/CultureCrave/status/1579352694963437573
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Oct 10, 2022 19:11
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That DICK! posted:at first i thought he was laughing at the fact that aemond couldn't see the meal in front of him, because of the missing eye luke had given him. i was like wow, this kids a fuckin jerk. I think people aren't giving Aemond enough credit for his "slanders" being 100% true, and materially impacting his own ambitions. Rhaenyra's kids are bastards, a fact which if publicly acknowledged would make Aemond 2nd in line for the throne*, instead of like 6th or 7th or whatever it is now. Plus, the whole eye thing. He has legitimate reasons to be pissed at Rhaenyra's family, even if the whole thing isn't entirely their fault (except the eye). (I didn't see if Aegon had sons in the episode, his actual place in the succession might be 3rd-5th if Aegon has sons. Still, his grievance with Rhaenyra's illegitimate children inheriting stands.) DJ_Mindboggler fucked around with this message at 19:20 on Oct 10, 2022 |
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Oct 10, 2022 19:17
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I don’t think it’s true that things were too late at that dinner. I genuinely think that dinner could have been a turning point in their relations, in spite of all the bad blood between the kids. The trouble is the deathbed prophecy. Alicent has consistently been shown to want to do the right thing. And what’s more right than saving the loving world? That scene was the equivalent of a religious revelation.
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Oct 10, 2022 19:21
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My Crusader Kings experience tells me this ambitious claimant with 20 martial and 20 prowess needs to be given just enough holdings and court positions to offset his ambition but instead we got an event about insulting him at a feast and now he's -100 towards us.
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Oct 10, 2022 19:26
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wilderthanmild posted:My Crusader Kings experience tells me this ambitious claimant with 20 martial and 20 prowess needs to be given just enough holdings and court positions to offset his ambition but instead we got an event about insulting him at a feast and now he's -100 towards us. Gotta hope for one of those "Your courtier's been loving around" events with free imprisonment, otherwise you'll have to face him in the field.
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Oct 10, 2022 19:28
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Vegetable posted:I don’t think it’s true that things were too late at that dinner. I genuinely think that dinner could have been a turning point in their relations, in spite of all the bad blood between the kids. yeah i didn't think this was "everyone is playing nice" either. it was legit, which was why they kept cutting to otto looking like fuckin gargamel off in the corner brooding. it was supposed to bum you out that things were this close to getting resolved amicably and only failed due to one last big series of miscommunications. it worked, for me, even if the deathbed confessional was kinda comical
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Oct 10, 2022 19:29
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grittyreboot posted:
One thing I didn't understand is if she thinks Rhanerya killed her son why isn't she hellbent on revenge against her and Daemon
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Oct 10, 2022 19:33
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What? No it wasn't. The whole sequence with Daemon appearing behind his brother to help him is based on the crown being on the ground. There's dialogue for it! There's a perfectly framed close-up shot of it being picked up!
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Oct 10, 2022 19:35
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I think the kids' attitudes have been poisoned enough after almost 2 decades of animosity between Alicent and Rhaenyra combined with their pretty deep personality flaws and interpersonal rivalries among themselves, that there is nothing Queen and Princess could do or could have done for quite some time to stop a pretty violent crash that we're heading towards.
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Oct 10, 2022 19:36
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Zenithe posted:As someone who works with frail and elderly folk him walking to the throne was some hardcore anxiety Compare old Viserys’ final tortured walk to his thrown and young Daemon’s 100 yard murder dash in the stepstones. These are brothers who are different men with different motivations, but they are both capable of heroic feats of endurance when the moment calls. Both incidents end with Daemon offering a crown to his brother that he had earned or could have kept through simple right of force. Seriously, though, comparing the two scenes is peak English 201 essay question and this episode earned it.
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Oct 10, 2022 19:36
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Ubersandwich posted:I think the kids' attitudes have been poisoned enough after almost 2 decades of animosity between Alicent and Rhaenyra combined with their pretty deep personality flaws and interpersonal rivalries among themselves, that there is nothing Queen and Princess could do or could have done for quite some time to stop a pretty violent crash that we're heading towards. there's certainly no guarantee it'd work out but if they could keep cool for long enough for aegon + helaena and baela and jace to pop kids out you can see a way things end up amicably resolved through marriage imo
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Oct 10, 2022 19:40
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its a funny and interesting parallel that otto is all in on this plan because he wants his blood on the throne and doesn't give a poo poo about names, while corlys is all in on the opposite side because he wants his name on the throne and doesnt give a poo poo about blood (yeah i know jace has to take the throne as a targ but the history books have to acknowledge he is by birth a velaryon)
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Oct 10, 2022 19:44
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That DICK! posted:its a funny and interesting parallel that otto is all in on this plan because he wants his blood on the throne and doesn't give a poo poo about names, while corlys is all in on the opposite side because he wants his name on the throne and doesnt give a poo poo about blood (yeah i know jace has to take the throne as a targ but the history books have to acknowledge he is by birth a velaryon) I also think Corlys would have been ecstatic about the marriage proposals because it would have ensured that at least Jace's children and therefore a future king or queen would have been guaranteed to have Velaryon blood.
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Oct 10, 2022 19:51
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Viserys's walk to the throne was the first moment to get me emotional beyond haha entertaining so good job. I do not like the misunderstanding at the end probably pushing Alicent back to war because the reconciliation was more believable. Gonna need more than that. Vaemond had a point and I was even agreeing with him until he called rhaenyra a whore. Alas his actor was bad and the show is better off with him gone so I do not care hooray Daemon. Baela and rhayna felt a bit non-existent here, like they aren't going to be important other than as silent wives which feels out of step for the show And aemond's actor did not disappoint Very good episode
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Oct 10, 2022 19:53
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I love Coryls' pragmatism, normally that's a top tier trait to have in this setting. Still counts, because has hasn't fallen victim to politics I suppose.
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Oct 10, 2022 19:54
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PostNouveau posted:What? No it wasn't. The whole sequence with Daemon appearing behind his brother to help him is based on the crown being on the ground. There's dialogue for it! There's a perfectly framed close-up shot of it being picked up! I'm assuming they mean it happened in a wide, but then they liked it so much they changed up the later shots to fold it in and frame it, with an unknown and possibly non-existent amount of footage remaining from the original take. Or even it could've been in an earlier prop/blocking rehearsal and they liked the improv ; that's how about 2/3rds of Taxi Driver happened. Which isn't a crazy thing with how things are shot, especially if Smith legit had a full-on Brando-with-the-glove moment and did that because 1) loving wow and 2) that's a really, really good detail that is better than whatever they had written. I mean, it could be totally made up marketing, but Smith is a legit serious actor and it doesn't seem so unlikely that I'd call shenanigans. If it's fabricated, they bothered to craft something pretty believable.
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Oct 10, 2022 19:56
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Are Baela and Rhayna dragon riders?
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Oct 10, 2022 19:57
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at least one is not, given she wanted to tame vhagar. that pentos guy mentioned three dragons so the other one had one
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Oct 10, 2022 19:58
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wilderthanmild posted:Are Baela and Rhayna dragon riders? Baela is Rhayna was the one praying for a dragon who was super pissed about Aemond taking her mother's.
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Oct 10, 2022 20:05
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PostNouveau posted:They coulda given Criston Cole a beard or something. Him and Daemon being ageless must freak everyone else out I agree that Criston could have been aged up a bit, but I think Daemon is OK as Matt Smith is such a weird-looking guy it's hard to pin down his age. Also if in the future they need to show a 60-year old Daemon, Smith will just become an old man through acting because he's so drat good, just like Paddy Consadine. I initially thought he was an odd casting choice for Daemon, but now I can't imagine anyone else playing the part.
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Oct 10, 2022 20:06
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DJ_Mindboggler posted:I think people aren't giving Aemond enough credit for his "slanders" being 100% true, and materially impacting his own ambitions. Rhaenyra's kids are bastards, a fact which if publicly acknowledged would make Aemond 2nd in line for the throne*, instead of like 6th or 7th or whatever it is now. Plus, the whole eye thing. He has legitimate reasons to be pissed at Rhaenyra's family, even if the whole thing isn't entirely their fault (except the eye). Viserys was also right, that they are his true born grandchildren and the children of his named heir. Like, if Paddy had never gotten remarried or he had but elf leprosy made his dick fall off, people would be grinning while gritting their teeth about how good of a Targaryen king Jacaerys, who was definitely the son of his gay black father Laenor, is gonna be. Real world succession crises are resolved by armies, not by laws. The ones that the asoiafCU is based on comes from English history. It begins with the sons of William the Conqueror (Who Aegon I is supposed to be in the very loose pastiche of post Anglo-Saxon England that Westeros is supposed to represent) who famously hated each other and jockeyed like hell to take the crowns of Normandy and England. William I followed the Norman succession tradition, which gave the hereditary seat in Normandy to the eldest, Robert Curthose. William Rufus, the 3rd son (but second living) was given England, as was traditional with conquered lands (also everyone wasn't so sure about England at the time) and the youngest son Henry was given lands and a title(Which were later seized by William Rufus when Henry joined Robert's Norman court as Robert was preparing an invasion of England to take the throne of Rufus.) Then Robert went off to fight in the first crusade, William died in a hunting accident, and Henry used that opportunity to seize the crown while his brother was away in Palestine. Robert comes back, raises hell, tries to invade England and gets repulsed by forces under the more popular Henry. Robert went back to Normandy and kept agitating there and making himself a nuisance to his brother, who eventually had enough of it, invaded Normandy and imprisoned his brother for the rest of his life. The throne of England would be secure for like 10 years until Henry's only son and heir drowned with 300 other people in what came to be known as the White Ship disaster, so when he died, there were two competing claims: his daughter Matilda (sound familiar?) and his nephew Stephen of Blois. The 15-year war between these claimants is known as The Anarchy because the war was brutal even by the standards of the time. The war was eventually won by Matlida's son Henry, who became Henry II, the first Plantagenet king. His son, Richard I, eventually rose up against him and they were still in conflict when Henry II died and Richard became king and promptly hosed off to the Holy Lands for the third crusade and spent no more than six months in England as king. He left the realm in the care of his youngest brother King John, who sucked so bad we still know him as the ultimate bad guy in Robin Hood stories and for the signing of the Magna Carta, which was good for us peasants but ruinous for the autocratic monarchy. But it was okay because no one abided by the agreement so there was another civil war, this time between the nobility and the throne. John died of dysentery on campaign and his 10 year old son Henry was crowned Henry the III and ruled for 56 years. After that, House Plantagenet held the throne for 300 years until two cadet branches, the Lannisters and the Star- I mean the Lancasters and the Yorks fought each other to death and allowed Henry VII of the House of Tudor to usurp the throne from the evil and cruel troll of a king Richard III. This dynasty did not rule over a peaceful time in English history, as the Plantagenets spent all their free time pressing their claim on the French throne that they kept making up various claims on or fending off challenges from other distant relatives. I think it's pretty clear that the Targaryens are supposed to resemble closely the Plantagenets, they both had that same "flip a coin" dynamic. You had absolutely S-tier kings like Edward III and Henry V and then also weak, stupid, or mad kings like Edward II and Henry VI. I also think that, with few exceptions, there aren't any 1-to-1 character to real guy correlations, I think he took an event from here and a personality trait from there and gave them to this or that person, which is fine. You see plently of historical elements in GoT, but they don't match exactly with the times and characters of the actual Plantagenet family. PostNouveau posted:What? No it wasn't. The whole sequence with Daemon appearing behind his brother to help him is based on the crown being on the ground. There's dialogue for it! There's a perfectly framed close-up shot of it being picked up! Probably it happened in rehearsal and Matt Smith was in the moment as Daemon and did the natural thing for a brother to do and everyone loved it so they incorporated it into the show. zoux fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Oct 10, 2022 |
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Oct 10, 2022 20:11
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aging criston up would have been super easy. young, clean shaven long hair. old, short hair, big ol tom selleck mustache. blown opportunity. missed opportunity.
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Oct 10, 2022 20:12
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zoux posted:Probably it happened in rehearsal and Matt Smith was in the moment as Daemon and did the natural thing for a brother to do and everyone loved it so they incorporated it into the show. Yeah, that makes sense. I'm just mad at the tweeter for saying it happened during shooting.
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Oct 10, 2022 20:14
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You know you guys can just read the article that was linked where the director talks about it.
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Oct 10, 2022 20:19
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"“When we were shooting that – I think the rehearsal again, the first day – the crown fell off of Paddy’s head and Matt picked it up and we just kept going. We didn’t stop [filming]. There was a discovery there of this moment." Why read it when I can perfectly ascertain what happened from even the fuzziest detail.
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Oct 10, 2022 20:21
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PostNouveau posted:What? No it wasn't. The whole sequence with Daemon appearing behind his brother to help him is based on the crown being on the ground. There's dialogue for it! There's a perfectly framed close-up shot of it being picked up! It doesn't seem unreasonable. Actors of the calibre of Paddy and Matt would have no issue ad-libbing an unexpected event because they really understand their characters and know instinctively how they would react. The shot of a hand picking up the crown could easily have been filmed as a pick-up. It would be a pick-up pick-up  The scene is already being universally praised. They don't need to add any BS to make it sound even better.
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Oct 10, 2022 20:21
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That DICK! posted:aging criston up would have been super easy. young, clean shaven long hair. old, short hair, big ol tom selleck mustache. blown opportunity. missed opportunity.  I can see it
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Oct 10, 2022 20:25
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Getting some real anime-cyborg-space-pirate vibes from the new Aemond. Edit: 50/50 Waluigi and Raiden from Metal Gear.
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Oct 10, 2022 21:05
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Daemon hitting him with the I'm Your Huckleberry when he was trying to fight with Jace 
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Oct 10, 2022 21:07
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mweber posted:Getting some real anime-cyborg-space-pirate vibes from the new Aemond. Yeah, now that you mention it. A robot arm would fit right into his look.
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Oct 10, 2022 21:08
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Matt Smith already did old man makeup for Doctor Who (it looked like poo poo)
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Oct 10, 2022 21:09
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Otto is a piece of poo poo. Why exactly did Viserys bring him back?
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Oct 10, 2022 21:33
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Ubersandwich posted:I think the kids' attitudes have been poisoned enough after almost 2 decades of animosity between Alicent and Rhaenyra combined with their pretty deep personality flaws and interpersonal rivalries among themselves, that there is nothing Queen and Princess could do or could have done for quite some time to stop a pretty violent crash that we're heading towards. Agreed, even if the moms buried the hatchet the kids would try to kill each other anyway because they all hate each other.
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Oct 10, 2022 21:33
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Can't wait to find out what "beware the beasts beneath the boards" winds up meaning. I kinda like Aegon's psychic sister/wife being a foreshadow vehicle.
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Oct 10, 2022 21:34
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SirPablo posted:Otto is a piece of poo poo. Why exactly did Viserys bring him back? His other Hand died in an accidental fire and like most Goons King V only has 2 friends
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Oct 10, 2022 21:34
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SirPablo posted:Otto is a piece of poo poo. Why exactly did Viserys bring him back? Viserys was pretty much checked out by that point. I'm assuming Alicent just kept badgering him and he went "fine, whatever", and went back to painting his minis.
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Oct 10, 2022 21:41
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Hm, weak. That was never really explained well, or at all. It was basically "oh, you're back... I guess?"
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Oct 10, 2022 21:42
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