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The main drivers were size, weight and the extremely long block & crankshaft. A straight 8 is smoother than a V8 by far, but it's far easier & there are fewer pitfalls/defects when making a crankshaft & block that's thicker & half the length. Increases in horsepower may have been stretching the metallurgy limits for the crank & block for mass-produced auto engines. The compact size of the V8 gave body designers far more options for body proportions. PainterofCrap fucked around with this message at 16:11 on Oct 15, 2022 |
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Oct 15, 2022 16:09
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Yeah, it's mostly packaging. Much easier to move a V8 engine around inside the chassis than a straight-8.
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Oct 15, 2022 16:11
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this is the stupid question thread so please enjoy my  / I wasn't entirely convinced so I started looking up bore spacing or  cylinder spacing; looks like BMW, popular inline-6 manufacturer has been using 91mm for a long time, and the new B58 block uses a bore spacing of 89.6mmThis gives BMW a "minimum block length" (my term) of 537mm or 21.1 inches for a 6 cylinder, or an imaginary bmw made inline-8 of the same spacing would yield 719mm or 28.3 in According to this nutter* the packard block has a bore spacing of 4.125 (104.77mm) and dodge 4.07 (103.4) yielding minimum block lengths of 838.16 (33.0in) and 827.2 (32.5) BMW cylinder wall thickness (I think I'm doing this right? please correct my math) of bore spacing (89.6) vs bore (82) gives a minimum cylinder wall thickness of 5.6mm. Looks like Buick made straight eights with bore of 73-87mm which would imply using modern materials and construction techniques you could get the block down to ~28 inches Ford 351 has bore spacing of 4.380 with two rows of 4 cyl giving you 445mm or 17.5in so yeah it is about 10 inches shorter which is... a lot more crank, even if you have 9 main bearings That said, if you used an electric water pump, and put the alternator on the side, rater than on the front, you could maybe cram a straight eight into the space of a regular ford v8   ***https://rlg0613.wordpress.com/block/ ** https://performanceparts.ford.com/download/pdfs/EngineDimensions.pdf edit: kind of curious to see what the transmission tunnel of a packard looks like now, probably catheral-like Hadlock fucked around with this message at 18:13 on Oct 15, 2022 |
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Oct 15, 2022 18:02
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God I wish we still had interesting poo poo like slant sixes and straight eights being made. But then maybe its only interesting because they're old and/or historical curiosities.
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Oct 15, 2022 18:43
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I just want one of these https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SelMf0ILESc
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Oct 15, 2022 18:49
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wesleywillis posted:God I wish we still had interesting poo poo like slant sixes and straight eights being made. Currently rewatching all the jay Leno's garage episodes about the Bugatti type 35-50 I think if I build a car it'll be like that; I've wanted something like a super 7 but the idea of scratch building a car and then sticking an inline 4 in it drains my soul (apologies to the caterham 7 owner here) Bugatti type 35 style body with... A Pontiac or Buick straight eight flat head would be a fun project. Looks like you can get an engine that'll turn over on ebay for around a grand and parts aren't impossible to find, transmission bell adapters are easily available
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Oct 15, 2022 19:28
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taqueso posted:I just want one of these disappointed that this didnt transition to the thx sound
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Oct 15, 2022 20:10
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One big issue is the older straight 8s were a 5 main design, which results in a lot more crank flex since you have two pistons and rods on each span that's nearly twice as long without a bearing supporting the crank in between. Adding a main between each will probably increase the engine length slightly. Also remember that coefficient of thermal expansion is linear, so an inline 6 (assuming exact same bore spacing) has 50% more difference in length change for, say, an aluminum head on an iron block than a V8 will, and a straight 8 will have fully 100% more than the same bore spacing V8 heads will have, and 33% more than that inline 6. This can result in significant gasket scrub and stuff not lining up as well as manifold stress - even regular old 91-99 Jeep 4.0Ls with an iron block, iron head, and steel header are famous for cracking the 2:1 collector between the front and back halves of the header, a straight 8 will have even more built up stress. Add that to packaging (the long nose thing of the 30s to 50s has mostly gone away, hell, it can be hard to package even an inline 6) and realize that most people are fine with an i4, V6, or V8 and most companies will just build those three, especially since you can get rid of most of the vibration concerns with more crank counterweight. Shorter wider blocks are better for crash safety as well - allows you much more space in the front for absorbing kinetic energy and presents a much wider block to shove into or under the firewall without punching through it. Subaru actually designed their vehicles for many years with the engine, transmission, and rear driveshaft specifically designed to cause the engine to ride back and under the floor as much as possible instead coming back into the firewall for crash safety.
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Oct 16, 2022 01:30
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Volvo did the same thing with the 240 regarding directing the engine under the car in a crash and I suspect they and Subaru aren't the only ones that have. In terms of I8 vs V8, look at it the other way around. What advantage does an I8 have over a V8? It's smoother running but... that's about it. A cross-plane V8 with sufficiently soft engine mounts is smooth enough for most buyers anyway. Every other mechanical problem about an engine is made worse with a long, skinny engine, especially in the era when I8s disappeared. Imagine you want to build an economy-option eight cylinder with a single two-barrel carb, so you have something to sell the middle of the market. How do you manage to maintain the same air/fuel ratio with wildly different intake runner lengths? It'd be somewhat easier to solve with port fuel injection, but that wouldn't have been on the table then.
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Oct 16, 2022 06:04
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Easy just put two straight 8s next to each other!
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Oct 16, 2022 14:51
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Quick question just to make sure I haven't hosed something up. I replaced the clutch master and slave cylinders on my 2nd generation Tacoma with Aisin parts. Install went fine, and as far as I can tell I've got everything bled. Now, the range of the pedal travel for slave cylinder actuation is very short, light, and all near the top of the pedal stroke. Engagement is positive, no clutch slippage, and the mc pushrod is adjusted correctly (i think, there is 10ish mm of pedal free play before it engages the mc pushrod). Before, it was a long pedal stroke, more resistance, and though there was no clutch slippage, I could slip it for a substantial portion of the pedal stroke (I did my best to not slip the clutch). No leakage from cylinders, no observable consumption of fluid from the reservoir. Does anything stand out as odd? Am I just not used to feeling a well-working clutch?
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Oct 16, 2022 16:27
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That's how it's been every time i've done a cylinder swap and proper bleed on a vehicle with a still-good clutch. As long as it's fully engaged with your foot off the pedal i say roll with it
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Oct 16, 2022 16:34
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You also haven't broken in the clutch yet. The feel will change quite a bit over the next couple of hundred miles.
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Oct 16, 2022 17:36
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HenryJLittlefinger posted:
You got really used to a gushy clutch. I had exactly the same problem when I redid my brakes and calipers and bled everything. The brakes were biting so quickly I thought something was out of whack. nitrogen fucked around with this message at 18:15 on Oct 16, 2022 |
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Oct 16, 2022 18:11
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KakerMix posted:Easy just put two straight 8s next to each other! Bugatti briefly did a run of U-16 engines which looks exactly like what a 6 year old would design with those instructions https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bugatti_U-16
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Oct 16, 2022 18:13
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Hey guys I could use some help here. 2 weeks ago I was using my windshield wipers in my 2001 Oldsmobile aurora and now they won't turn off. I went ahead and pulled the circuit thingy but of course that's no long term solution. I want to find the cable that I can cut, under the steering wheel, that would disable it, run that cable through a light switch and then just use that for an on/off toggle. Any advice on figuring out which wire I should cut or maybe this is simply a bad idea that seems good at face value?
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Oct 16, 2022 19:47
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Yes, this is simply a bad idea. Wipers are safety equipment. The correct part is under $200 new. You should be able to get it for about $30 at a pick and pull.
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Oct 16, 2022 20:31
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You make me sad. Do you think it's just the switch that needs replaced?
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Oct 16, 2022 20:44
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memento mori posted:You make me sad. Do you think it's just the switch that needs replaced? I think diagnostics are important before throwing parts at something, but it's overwhelmingly likely that if you can't turn your wipers off it's the wiper switch. There may be a relay or relays but I doubt there are or any kind of PCM control on a 2001 GM. Someone more GM experience should be along shortly to narrow the odds of what this probably is. But the question is going to be the same: do you have any sort of tools or experience? Because those are going to be important and fixing it right is going to be a lot safer and likely easier to make reliable than whatever you're thinking of. Not even sure if the wiper will go into a park position on that without a proper switch. You're certainly not going to have speeds. This is wiring diagram and multimeter/test light time.
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Oct 16, 2022 20:52
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memento mori posted:Hey guys I could use some help here. 2 weeks ago I was using my windshield wipers in my 2001 Oldsmobile aurora and now they won't turn off. I went ahead and pulled the circuit thingy but of course that's no long term solution. I want to find the cable that I can cut, under the steering wheel, that would disable it, run that cable through a light switch and then just use that for an on/off toggle. This is the sort of thing you do when you have a car that is one step away from the junkyard and you need to keep it going until the end of the month. If it is a car you care about, just fix it.
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Oct 16, 2022 20:56
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The car sat for several months before I got it a year ago. This will be the fourth repair since then. If I add the repairs up it averages about $130 a month over the last year. Still better than car payment, it just gets a bit frustrating.
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Oct 16, 2022 21:39
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I would be opening up the switch to see if it can be cleaned out and repaired and failing that putting in a junkyard part, but I'm pretty handy with small electronics and mechanicals. It's always a good feeling to fix something yourself, and properly.
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Oct 16, 2022 21:44
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memento mori posted:The car sat for several months before I got it a year ago. This will be the fourth repair since then. If I add the repairs up it averages about $130 a month over the last year. Still better than car payment, it just gets a bit frustrating. Are all of those things actually repairs? Because I'm guessing they are not. Brakes are not repairs. Fluids are not repairs. Tires are not repairs. Cars require maintenance and anything in maintenance debt can easily add up to $130/mo and a lot more.
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Oct 16, 2022 23:20
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Consumables are the barrier to entry. If that is excessive. A lease is a good alternative. You'll need to invest in a multimeter or borrow one. Test the timer module Test the multifunction switch Test the return to park loop on the wiper motor transmission itself. Be sure to check for faulty ground paths.
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Oct 16, 2022 23:48
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It's most likely the switch, followed closely by the wiper motor. There's a "park" switch in the motor it that senses when it's reached the end of travel, it's supposed to stop if it knows the switch is off - if that part of the motor is bad, they'll keep going. Also, if it's equipped with automatic wipers, the sensing circuit for that may have gone wonky (there should be a full off position on the switch though). FWIW, my grandfather owned several GM dealers when he was alive, and one of the cars he sold was Auroras. This was a very common issue on everything that used that stupid switch. These cars are a bit more complicated than most GMs of the era (the electronics are essentially early 00s Cadillac), but you should get a service vehicle soon message if the car thinks the body control module is acting up. Unfortunately, you're driving an older luxury vehicle that didn't sell in high numbers - GM used it as a bit of a test bed on top of that. 01 is the first year of the second generation, but should share some (non-drivetrain) parts with the Cadillac Deville and Buick Park Avenue. It'll be more expensive to keep everything working properly vs, say, a Chevy Malibu, but the Aurora was a very nice car and very upmarket. Upside is you got the most durable (not saying much) FWD automatic transmission that GM made at the time. The multifunction switch isn't a massive deal to replace if that's what it is. You may need to remove the airbag and steering wheel (not sure on that TBH - I didn't have to on my current car, but I'm not driving a GM), but those are pretty easy to handle as long as the battery has been disconnected for a bit. randomidiot fucked around with this message at 02:11 on Oct 17, 2022 |
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Oct 17, 2022 02:08
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I really want to do this myself but I'm afraid I'm in over my head. The weather is nice this week so I got a little time to think about it. I appreciate the replies everyone, thanks.
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Oct 17, 2022 03:58
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Friend got a free 2002 Saturn L100. The front driver's seat is completely worn out. What's the best option for snagging a cheap front seat to replace it with? I can't find any of that exact seat at any of the local junkyards.
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Oct 17, 2022 03:58
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spacetoaster posted:Friend got a free 2002 Saturn L100. The front driver's seat is completely worn out. if you've been just checking the pick n pulls, you might also check car-part.com for the full-service inventories around you. if you can find something that's the right shape, but has the wrong color or fabric, maybe you can swap your existing seat cover onto the un-hosed junkyard seat foam/frame/etc. that is, assuming the cover is in ok shape. i am totally ignorant about those specific cars, but did saturn share interior bits with other GMs of that era? maybe someone else here knows.
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Oct 17, 2022 04:49
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Raluek posted:i am totally ignorant about those specific cars, but did saturn share interior bits with other GMs of that era? maybe someone else here knows. Unfortunately, not anything you're going to find in better numbers in the US. The platform was mostly shared with non-US models like the Vectra and Calibra, and similarly low-selling vehicles like the Saab 9-3 and 9-5. Spacetoaster, "free" is only slightly less than what a running, driving L-series is worth at this point. Everything STR said about the Aurora is probably going to be worse for the L-series, because it shares even less than a typical GM platform-shared product and you're dealing with a car that was treated as disposable from new. This isn't me saying your friend should ditch the car, a free running and driving car is a hell of a thing in 2022, and it can likely be made to soldier on inexpensively for quite a while as long as certain faults (like a shredded driver's seat) are things that can be tolerated. As far as other solutions? If they're willing to spend a few hours taking things apart to learn, I'd pull both front seats and see how viable it would be to swap the seat mechanism and/or seat cushions side to side. It's generally far easier to find a good-enough passenger seat in a junkyard. If not, then your best option is to reuphoslster the seat you have. There's always the comedy option of "swap a different seat in" but that will probably require some fabrication.
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Oct 17, 2022 05:45
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Got 4 quotes for the timing chain on my 09 Acura TSX Place 1: performance-y honda/acura place. Let me speak with the mechanic who went through everything with me and stated it'll be about 1900. Place 2: place it was diagnosed. Just said 2000-3000 Honda/Acura Dealer: 2300, includes an oil change and a loaner! Some random repair shop: some old country dude said he didn't trust the computers and he'd do it for 700 bucks, also that Acuras never really need their timing belt changed. I'm thinking of going with the performance-y honda/acura place.
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Oct 17, 2022 18:14
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FizFashizzle posted:Got 4 quotes for the timing chain on my 09 Acura TSX Just to be clear, your car has a timing chain and they generally aren't supposed to be replaced. Sometimes on a high-mileage engine you need to, but it's not common. It was pointed out earlier that specifically with Acuras, they can develop problems and need to be replaced more often. A timing belt is made of rubber and is intended to be replaced about every 100k miles.
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Oct 17, 2022 18:19
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FizFashizzle posted:I'm thinking of going with the performance-y honda/acura place. Probably what I would do as well if I got good vibes talking to the mechanic.
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Oct 17, 2022 18:29
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Place 1 if you have a backup car Dealer if you do not.
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Oct 17, 2022 18:43
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cursedshitbox posted:Place 1 if you have a backup car yeah
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Oct 17, 2022 18:48
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Wife's 2012 Kia Forte that we rarely use had a solvent smell to it when I fired it up after a month or so of disuse. Google suggests it's a faulty oxygen sensor -- does that sound right? A/C also stopped working this summer so I'm worried about the compressor and the brakes squeal. I wonder if one of those online used car companies are still handing out dumb amounts of money...
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Oct 17, 2022 19:00
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Hello AI. This is a "vaguely planning new vehicle" kind of question: Does anyone know of a non-pickup vehicle for sale in the US that could accommodate 4-foot wide plywood? Without having to strap the panel to a roof rack, that is. Basically anything] (well, most likely an SUV) whose rear opening is wide enough to either horizontally or diagonally fit the US-standard 4' plywood sheets. I usually get 4'x4' panels vs. full 8-foot long panels, so I wouldn't have a huge section of it hanging out the back. Does such a wagon/hatchback/SUV exist?
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Oct 17, 2022 19:10
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Chad Sexington posted:Wife's 2012 Kia Forte that we rarely use had a solvent smell to it when I fired it up after a month or so of disuse. Google suggests it's a faulty oxygen sensor -- does that sound right? Not really. Get the codes read out to see if there's any O2 sensor performance codes or rich codes.
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Oct 17, 2022 19:17
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Trabant posted:Does such a wagon/hatchback/SUV exist? latest gen Explorer is 48.1 between the wheel wells. They stick out a bit but you can ratchet strap the gate down np
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Oct 17, 2022 19:19
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Trabant posted:Does anyone know of a non-pickup vehicle for sale in the US that could accommodate 4-foot wide plywood? A full size van. There's a reason they are the choices of the trades. But if you're asking this question for the couple times a year you likely do this you should rent the pickup at home depot or buy a trailer for your current vehicle.
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Oct 17, 2022 19:19
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I'm pretty sure I could get a 4x4 sheet of plywood in almost any midsize CUV on the market if you can put it in at an angle and drop the 2nd row of seats. Could you clarify your requirements a bit?
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Oct 17, 2022 19:29
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