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Golden Bee
Dec 24, 2009

I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.
That and guard dogs reward Ally healing, especially with the Mirror. I’ve done that build so many times, but it’s absolutely top-tier for aloof or low health enemies.

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PaybackJack
May 21, 2003

You'll hit your head and say: 'Boy, how stupid could I have been. A moron could've figured this out. I must be a real dimwit. A pathetic nimnal. A wretched idiotic excuse for a human being for not having figured these simple puzzles out in the first place...As usual, you've been a real pantload!

KPC_Mammon posted:

I feel like it made a huge splash when it was first published but people stopped playing it because it is pretty fairly priced and really slow.

When the game is challenging and things are going wrong you can't usually afford to pay one.

2x Surveillance Team basically does roughly the same amount of thwarting as running 1x Beat Cop and makes it much easier to play alongside other cards. Monica Chang being able to tutor and buff them is even better is she takes the place of a third Beat Cop. There's also the synergy with the other yellow SHIELD cards.

The sacrifice to damage a minion ability is good, but has niche use, but it is great for when you draw lethal damage and the enemy tosses out a minion with guard.

CitizenKeen
Nov 13, 2003

easygoing pedant
The risk really seems to be getting it later in the game. But in the first turn or two? I've always loved Black Cat, and Black Cat but Thwart for one more feels really nice. You may be entirely right, though - I'm probably not playing at a high enough level.

PaybackJack
May 21, 2003

You'll hit your head and say: 'Boy, how stupid could I have been. A moron could've figured this out. I must be a real dimwit. A pathetic nimnal. A wretched idiotic excuse for a human being for not having figured these simple puzzles out in the first place...As usual, you've been a real pantload!
Gambit is up and boy is he good.

That Alter-ego ability is just <insert gif of cartoon wolf sees a woman>.

DLC Inc
Jun 1, 2011

Looks like there's no limit to charge counters on Gambit, which is nice. I really do like how many thievery alter-ego stuff he has going on; I wasn't sure how they'd make Justice work with Gambit but in retrospect, thwarting stuff is naturally something a master thief would do. In two-hero games he's going to be really good at chilling out in Alter-Ego while still thwarting with those new Justice cards---I didn't think Breaking and Entering was all that special til I realized it could be played anytime for Gambit. Now I just need to see if he gets a Bo Staff weapon equip.

Release date for February is rough ughhhhh but at least Wolverine is next month.

KPC_Mammon
Jan 23, 2004

Ready for the fashy circle jerk

CitizenKeen posted:

The risk really seems to be getting it later in the game. But in the first turn or two? I've always loved Black Cat, and Black Cat but Thwart for one more feels really nice. You may be entirely right, though - I'm probably not playing at a high enough level.

Black Cat helps deal with tough, 1 hp remaining on minions, and can be buffed to be obscene. She's also cheaper and easier to play. She's significantly better than Beat Cop. Leadership Spiderman primarily revolves around making her better than most heroes.

Golden Bee
Dec 24, 2009

I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.
The real combo is leadership Spidey, aggression venom, guardian spear. With an honorary guardian almost every non X-Men upgrade in the game can be put on her. Ran through mad shadow that way and had a great time.

The Black Stones
May 7, 2007

I POSTED WHAT NOW!?
Man Gambit looks insanely good and those new thwarting cards look amazing. If it’s a Feb release I hope it would be mid Feb as I have a week off from work.

CitizenKeen
Nov 13, 2003

easygoing pedant
Just played four games of Unmatched (3 of Volume 1, one of Volume 2).

I was a big Epic Duels fan for six months back in college, so maybe some nostalgia driving my review, but I had an absolute blast.

The three player game on the box is a lie: it's 2 or 4, and 3 players is one person playing double handed. (Double handed is rough against two thinking opponents. I can double hand Marvel Champs but this seemed a lot harder.)

One game was 2v1-double handed, but the other three were 2v2. Overall, 5 people played, and I had played Epic Duels but nobody had played Unmatched. A tactically rich 2v2 game with high production values, lots of expansions, and a 5 minute teach is... very compelling.

I haven't played enough to comment on its shelf life, but based on four games, strong recommend.

Kalko
Oct 9, 2004

Glad to hear you enjoyed it. It's no more than a light tactical battler, but it's very good at being that thing. The expansions go a long way towards prolonging its shelf life and the asymmetric design of the legends lets them get pretty creative. My pet peeve is that all of the box inserts have space for sleeved cards except for the first Jurassic Park one so I have to keep its cards in a separate box.

Magnetic North
Dec 15, 2008

Beware the Forest's Mushrooms

CitizenKeen posted:

Just played four games of Unmatched (3 of Volume 1, one of Volume 2).

:hfive: Happy to hear you got on well with it. Still have only played on TTS. I've got a friend who love-love-loves Epic Duels (to the point he suggests it for modern game nights) and I'm always like, "Heey, ya know, there's this game, I told you about this many times, I think you'd like it, dot dot dot." but no dice.

DLC Inc
Jun 1, 2011

I'm on a somewhat legendary losing streak in Champions to the point where I need to really tool my decks from poo poo on the MCDB. Both games lately against Sandman + a Venom game collapsed due to Thor or Vision's nemesis coming out at the worst times. Loki in particular was laughably bad due to resurrecting twice and Ultron is just a really nasty gently caress for Shadows Of The Past to summon. I think I've gone 1 for 10 in my past few games so maybe my weirdass decks I've played around with def aren't working (particularly a Leadership Spider-Man deck I forgot why I constructed and quickly realized it had no synergy.)

McGurk
Oct 20, 2004

Cuz life sucks, kids. Get it while you can.

I’m also losing a lot lately. I’m being extremely stubborn playing solo Rocket Aggression vs the GMW campaign. On part 3 and I come so close but the third stage is brutal with threat.

Doctor Spaceman
Jul 6, 2010

"Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."
I'm trying to track down a copy of The Antlered Crown for the LotR LCG. It's the last thing I need for that cycle and is quite out of print. Does anybody have any advice for tracking down a copy?

I'm in Australia but can get stuff sent to a friend in the US.

DLC Inc
Jun 1, 2011

dumb question but how does the Venom scenario react to stuff like retaliate/upgrades that do damage when defending? Assumed it still counts as "damage done to Venom with card you control" but can it be diverted to the bell tower as well? Also I'm never sure if I should count something like "Black Panther equipped with vest does 1 retaliate/1 damage with vest" as one chunk of damage or two separate one. It's just a bit of a headache to figure out those semantics when the chimes are rapidly being taken off and on like that.

PaybackJack
May 21, 2003

You'll hit your head and say: 'Boy, how stupid could I have been. A moron could've figured this out. I must be a real dimwit. A pathetic nimnal. A wretched idiotic excuse for a human being for not having figured these simple puzzles out in the first place...As usual, you've been a real pantload!

DLC Inc posted:

dumb question but how does the Venom scenario react to stuff like retaliate/upgrades that do damage when defending? Assumed it still counts as "damage done to Venom with card you control" but can it be diverted to the bell tower as well? Also I'm never sure if I should count something like "Black Panther equipped with vest does 1 retaliate/1 damage with vest" as one chunk of damage or two separate one. It's just a bit of a headache to figure out those semantics when the chimes are rapidly being taken off and on like that.

You have to actually use an attack to damage the bell tower but every instance of damage after that gets bumped by 1. Retaliate gets combined so if you have Black Panther and he's getting Retaliate 1 from something like Dauntless then that's Retaliate 2, so Venom would take 3 total damage(BP Hero Text + Dauntless + Bell Tower) but if he has say an Energy Barrier then that's a separate instance so Venom would take 4 damage (BP hero text retaliate 1 + 1 Bell Tower, and Energy Barrier 1 + 1 Bell Tower).

Because of this Venom is very easy to deal with in protection as you can mitigate his damage which prevents the bell tower from losing chimes, and then any chip damage you have from Flow Like Water, Side Step, Electrostatic Armor, etc. is all doubled.

DLC Inc
Jun 1, 2011

PaybackJack posted:

You have to actually use an attack to damage the bell tower but every instance of damage after that gets bumped by 1. Retaliate gets combined so if you have Black Panther and he's getting Retaliate 1 from something like Dauntless then that's Retaliate 2, so Venom would take 3 total damage(BP Hero Text + Dauntless + Bell Tower) but if he has say an Energy Barrier then that's a separate instance so Venom would take 4 damage (BP hero text retaliate 1 + 1 Bell Tower, and Energy Barrier 1 + 1 Bell Tower).

Because of this Venom is very easy to deal with in protection as you can mitigate his damage which prevents the bell tower from losing chimes, and then any chip damage you have from Flow Like Water, Side Step, Electrostatic Armor, etc. is all doubled.

Ah, I had been playing this slightly wrong because I took the bell tower's ringing state "forced interrupt" as sometimes removing chimes even if I had defended certain things. Also sometimes was a bit confused on if Retaliate counted as an "attack" i.e. if Venom attacked me, would the Retaliate damage count towards adding chimes on the quiet side or not.

Golden Bee
Dec 24, 2009

I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.
Retaliate and damage without the attack parenthetical are very useful when the bosses retaliate or have abilities that trigger from attacks.

DLC Inc
Jun 1, 2011

Golden Bee posted:

Retaliate and damage without the attack parenthetical are very useful when the bosses retaliate or have abilities that trigger from attacks.

ah, good point. I definitely hosed myself over by adding more boost cards to Venom by way of also counting for Panther's retaliate and electrovest....probably explains how it got out of hand very quickly lol.

Golden Bee
Dec 24, 2009

I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.
Between Forge, Jamie Madrox, and a few others, this is going to be very relevant.

https://youtube.com/clip/Ugkxwi_RMfUwBJoMZrhiIe9od0jCwWQ-kJJ9

PaybackJack
May 21, 2003

You'll hit your head and say: 'Boy, how stupid could I have been. A moron could've figured this out. I must be a real dimwit. A pathetic nimnal. A wretched idiotic excuse for a human being for not having figured these simple puzzles out in the first place...As usual, you've been a real pantload!

Golden Bee posted:

Between Forge, Jamie Madrox, and a few others, this is going to be very relevant.

https://youtube.com/clip/Ugkxwi_RMfUwBJoMZrhiIe9od0jCwWQ-kJJ9

I kept clicking on that link thinking "why the gently caress does YouTube keep sending me to the botchamania I just watched?!?". I figured it out.

Which characters we see from X-Factor is kind of an interesting question. Havok has been in movies so he'll probably be in, and they'll presumably pair him with Polaris as that's kind of classic. Madrox and Siryn is another M/F pair, then Strong Guy and Wolfsbane maybe? I'd rather see M in there personally, but Wolfsbane could have a unique hero transformation thing happening that makes her the more interesting to play.

Madrox is a top 5 X-man for me so I'm hoping to see some crazy cool hero deck out of him.

bagrada
Aug 4, 2007

The Demogorgon is tired of your silly human bickering!

They should release 4 Madroxes with varying stats so you can run him as the whole team with each aspect, plus have several of him as allies.

CitizenKeen
Nov 13, 2003

easygoing pedant
In case you missed it: MJ Newman stepped down from Arkham Horror to work on something new at FFG.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjoXSe8tPVg

"New" might be relevant to this thread. Speculation abounds, but that's what we know.

Mechayahiko
May 27, 2011

Doctor Rope
I'm thinking of playing sinister motives, is the prebuilt decks for Miles, Gwen, Spider Ham and Spidr good and fun or should I hunt for decklists?

Golden Bee
Dec 24, 2009

I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.
It’s always more fun to customize a bit. I don’t think you need a decklist to beat those campaigns though. Pre-generated decks are mostly “here are all the copies you might need of a card“ rather than a truly coherent engine.

The Black Stones
May 7, 2007

I POSTED WHAT NOW!?

Mechayahiko posted:

I'm thinking of playing sinister motives, is the prebuilt decks for Miles, Gwen, Spider Ham and Spidr good and fun or should I hunt for decklists?

All of those decks are pretty good as is, but if you can swing some tweaking I would do so. I kept both Gwen and Penny as defence but tweaked the cards and they’re amazing. Ham is okay, but mechanically boring. Great if you want something easy to play or hand off to a kid.

Failboattootoot
Feb 6, 2011

Enough of this nonsense. You are an important mayor and this absurd contraption has wasted enough of your time.
Penny is pretty great yeah. Also played her as protection and once her engine gets going she gets to be incredibly silly. Might change my mind if I don't get an early avenger's mansion next time. That's kind of been the tipping point for the other small hand-size heroes. Get Mansion early? Game probably fine. Don't? Bad time imminent.

Golden Bee
Dec 24, 2009

I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.
One way or another, clear the area, skilled investigator, all cheaper and probably better for low hand size.

The Black Stones
May 7, 2007

I POSTED WHAT NOW!?
Canadian Distributor for Marvel says Phoenix not out for another two weeks at best. Come on FFG. Get your poo poo together.

Golden Bee
Dec 24, 2009

I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.
The real Phoenix deliveries in Canada are at the bottom of the lake. The ones you see now are a clone. There is an egg involved

The Black Stones
May 7, 2007

I POSTED WHAT NOW!?
I just bit the bullet and imported a copy from US Amazon, best case scenario I get it before, worst case it arrives around when Canada *might* get it.

The Black Stones
May 7, 2007

I POSTED WHAT NOW!?
Ugh. The only thing that sucks about doing solo two hand play is when I miss something and it’s ruined a round and I don’t know how to claw it back. Tried to fight against Magneto and things were going quite well, except I got to a round where he got lucky and a stupid magnet card did 3 damage and knocked out Black Panther. I was a little upset I lost to stupid magnets but then I looked and I had Vision in alter ego and was having Magneto attack him so I was giving him extra counters when I wasn’t supposed. Then I couldn’t remember if I had even planned to do that.

He was getting close enough to dead I just called it a win on my part. Late game just has so many moving parts I ultimately wind up losing track of something. It gets annoying because I feel like I’ve wasted 2 hours. I guess I at least have a better understanding of the fight.

KPC_Mammon
Jan 23, 2004

Ready for the fashy circle jerk

The Black Stones posted:

It gets annoying because I feel like I’ve wasted 2 hours. I guess I at least have a better understanding of the fight.

Did you have fun? I think that is a better indicator of whether you wasted two hours than winning.

If you had a miserable time and won you wasted your time more than if you had an exciting loss.

Perry Mason Jar
Feb 24, 2006

"Della? Take a lid"
Bringing chat form Board Games thread over here:

Inadequately posted:

Perry Mason Jar posted:

One table had Marvel Champions going which I've been itching to try but they were capped at 4. Don't think they managed to finish the game. It's always compared to Arkham Horror TCG, what does the thread favor? If I pick up either - not any time soon - I'll be eyeing whichever plays better solo since the LGS has most multiplayer covered and I can only get friends and family to the table once a week or every other week (usually for two players) besides the holidays.

The two games are pretty different in playstyle. Arkham Horror LCG is fairly comparable to Arkham/Eldritch Horror the board game as far as general gameplay goes: each scenario generally has investigators run around a map, picking up clues and avoiding enemies, while trying to complete objectives (that usually require cashing in clues to advance) before the doom clock runs out. Marvel Champions doesn't really do maps, just each hero's abstracted zone of control. Gameplay revolves around delaying the villain's evil scheme while punching the villain, with the heroes losing if the villain completes their scheme or defeats all the heroes.

The big difference between them gameplay-wise is the overall structure of the game. Arkham Horror generally revolves around scenarios linked together in a campaign, with experience from previous scenarios spent on upgrading your deck for the next one. Defeat in any single scenario is rarely the end, though it does result in accumulated trauma that may eventually result in the permanent end of an investigator (for that campaign). There's rules for playing each scenario standalone, and certain scenarios designed for that which are narratively disconnected from any campaign, but overall planning for the whole campaign and upgrading your deck is a big part of the game, and you'll be missing out on quite a bit if you don't have a regular group of players to advance through a campaign with.

Marvel Champions doesn't have much of that, it's generally just 'pick 1-4 heroes, pick a villain and a couple of encounter sets, fight'. There are a few 'campaign's they've released with a set of villains designed to be played one after another, but even then you can play each of those villains standalone without missing much. I personally prefer Arkham Horror's campaign style, but there's no denying that Marvel Champions generally works better if you don't have a regular group and just want to get into a quick game.

I didn't really like Marvel Champions deckbuilding though. Each hero deck generally consists of 50% hero-specific cards, 50% neutral cards or cards from one of four classes. If you're into deck customization, there's not a lot of room for that, and all the decks end up feeling really samey. I'd much rather just play Sentinels and have fully preconstructed hero decks rather than a half-assed style like that.

This really makes it seem like playing Arkham Horror solo is giving up a lot of the best experiences. So I think I'll axe it - what LCG plays solo better or else is just a great solo and co-op game?

Bottom Liner
Feb 15, 2006


a specific vein of lasagna
Marvel is the best evolution of the coop system if you don’t want to deal with the greater upkeep and fiddliness of Arkham. Easiest to collect too, if you find yourself wanting it all.

Golden Bee
Dec 24, 2009

I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.
Most deck builders are probably better with two people because it diffuses the randomness of not getting your set up.

Bottom Liner
Feb 15, 2006


a specific vein of lasagna
That’s one of the major advantages of Arkham. The token bag is a brilliant way to adjust difficulty and create new effects. I’ve seen plenty of variants on BGG for Marvel that involve extra starting draws or picking your starting hand but playing against the Expert standard set for solo, which also works pretty well.

The Black Stones
May 7, 2007

I POSTED WHAT NOW!?

KPC_Mammon posted:

Did you have fun? I think that is a better indicator of whether you wasted two hours than winning.

If you had a miserable time and won you wasted your time more than if you had an exciting loss.

I mean, kinda? There were some great moments, but it kinda takes the wind out of your sails. I definitely didn’t waste the time and I think the fight is really neat. I absolutely love the mechanic they use to help the player out as the fight goes on. Just to end like that hurts. Will definitely try again with friends.

Just had to vent a bit as well.

Kalko
Oct 9, 2004

Perry Mason Jar posted:

This really makes it seem like playing Arkham Horror solo is giving up a lot of the best experiences. So I think I'll axe it - what LCG plays solo better or else is just a great solo and co-op game?

AH is an excellent solo game and a lot of people also play it two-handed that way, but if you specifically want a group multiplayer experience then yeah you'll want to be in a position to have regular sessions.

There is a Arkham Horror LCG Thread with more info about the game if you haven't seen it.

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CitizenKeen
Nov 13, 2003

easygoing pedant
STAR WARS IS BACK, BABY!

https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2022/11/3/battle-for-the-galaxy-1/

Edit: Never mind, not a proper LCG. My bad.

CitizenKeen fucked around with this message at 18:18 on Nov 3, 2022

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