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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:what possible difference does it make if humanity hates the eternals? aside from the occasional stint as avengers, they mostly live in their secret cities. most humans had never heard of eternals before this, and could not tell one from any other random superhuman in a costume. Well the fact that one of us dies every time they get resurrected is certainly a question of ethics and would lead to a significant backlash. But yeah... there's like 40 Eternals or whatever, right? Seems like this is a low-risk thing for people to be universally angry about. If anything, humanity's response should be "stop doing things that get you killed?"
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Oct 26, 2022 20:25
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there's only a backlash if the eternals come out and deliberately take it. they don't live with humanity. most of them don't even visit. they aren't super heroes. their main job is periodically genociding deviants, a group that humans have also never heard of. it's like the public collectively getting real mad at counter earth. no one's gonna go all the way over there to yell at the animal people.
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Oct 26, 2022 20:32
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There is a lot to go over here, but it does strike me as one more reason why some near-future editorial mandate is going to end up hitting some kind of massive Secret Wars-y reset button. I know it's Marvel, and they're going to handwave it with "people are used to the weird poo poo by now," but there's so much to go over here and none of it involves just going back to normal afterward. Either they do another big event to "fix" this one, the setting's going to drift even further into crazy post-human science fiction (which I'd be overall okay with), or it's gonna be another one of those Marvel events where the only time they mention it is the occasional "Hey, remember when that Celestial demigod murdered most of us? Crazy, right?" danbanana posted:But yeah... there's like 40 Eternals or whatever, right? Seems like this is a low-risk thing for people to be universally angry about. If anything, humanity's response should be "stop doing things that get you killed?" Gillen made a point of showing in his Eternals book that there are 100 Eternals in total, which doesn't appear to count Eros or Thanos going by the list in issue #1.
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Oct 26, 2022 21:17
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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:there's only a backlash if the eternals come out and deliberately take it. they don't live with humanity. most of them don't even visit. they aren't super heroes. their main job is periodically genociding deviants, a group that humans have also never heard of. it's like the public collectively getting real mad at counter earth. no one's gonna go all the way over there to yell at the animal people. It's only an issue in that the heroic Eternals, who consider mankind a integral part of the machine they are supposed to protect, are gonna have a slightly harder time doing that. Wanderer posted:I know it's Marvel, and they're going to handwave it with "people are used to the weird poo poo by now," but there's so much to go over here and none of it involves just going back to normal afterward. Either they do another big event to "fix" this one, the setting's going to drift even further into crazy post-human science fiction (which I'd be overall okay with), or it's gonna be another one of those Marvel events where the only time they mention it is the occasional "Hey, remember when that Celestial demigod murdered most of us? Crazy, right?" I'm also not sure anything in this event needs fixing. Sadly, there is likely a expiration date on mutant resurrections that will occur whenever Marvel decides to take them back to a local hero/school status quo. All this means is that until then, if Marvel writers want to use the mutants as a deus ex to revive a supporting character, they can do so.
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Oct 26, 2022 21:32
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honestly as soon as i read that phoenix foundation poo poo i thought to myself "this will literally never be referenced again" lol and i could see another secret wars for the movie synergy given that, afaik, omega is the final eternals book i would imagine that the difference will mainly be for them and that it won't really come up until the next eternals book comes out years from now, if at all
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Oct 26, 2022 21:39
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A lot of build up to another Cyclops was right moment but I'm fine with that!
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Oct 26, 2022 23:41
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danbanana posted:Is there some textual evidence that Orchis was a publicly known group prior to the boy holding the Nimrod balloon? Am I just jealous because I want a Nimrod balloon? Yeah. I think AXE #5 showed Orchis propaganda fliers strewn around, and we know've known for a while that they have an "Oblique Strategies" branch that includes Cultural projects, Narrative control, sociology, etc.. (iirc the 90s Spidey villain Judas Traveller has been linked with these). So like yes, parts of their organization are secret but they are actively invested in trying to win the hearts and minds of humanity and that isn't new information.
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Oct 26, 2022 23:48
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BTW, X-Terminators remains fantastic and I love that so far it's just a cheesecake book about sexy girls blowing poo poo up.
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Oct 27, 2022 00:01
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How Wonderful! posted:Yeah. I think AXE #5 showed Orchis propaganda fliers strewn around, and we know've known for a while that they have an "Oblique Strategies" branch that includes Cultural projects, Narrative control, sociology, etc.. (iirc the 90s Spidey villain Judas Traveller has been linked with these). So like yes, parts of their organization are secret but they are actively invested in trying to win the hearts and minds of humanity and that isn't new information. wait Judas Traveller is a dude's name? i thought it was a title. The Judas Traveller. man's name is Judas Traveller????
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Oct 27, 2022 01:06
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Alaois posted:wait Judas Traveller is a dude's name? i thought it was a title. The Judas Traveller. man's name is Judas Traveller???? Yeah, it's a very Terry Kavanagh name. I very clearly remember learning about him from The Jackal Files in a Home Depot in 1995.
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Oct 27, 2022 01:11
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How Wonderful! posted:Yeah. I think AXE #5 showed Orchis propaganda fliers strewn around, and we know've known for a while that they have an "Oblique Strategies" branch that includes Cultural projects, Narrative control, sociology, etc.. (iirc the 90s Spidey villain Judas Traveller has been linked with these). So like yes, parts of their organization are secret but they are actively invested in trying to win the hearts and minds of humanity and that isn't new information. I read the flyer thing as a small scale diy recruitment thing. And even then, that's from an issue 3 weeks old. The JT thing from the Thunderbird book was similarly underground. It feels like a sudden change in characterization of the main villains in the Krakoa Era to suddenly be selling balloons of their sarcastic super Sentinel.
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Oct 27, 2022 01:29
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danbanana posted:I read the flyer thing as a small scale diy recruitment thing. And even then, that's from an issue 3 weeks old. The JT thing from the Thunderbird book was similarly underground. It feels like a sudden change in characterization of the main villains in the Krakoa Era to suddenly be selling balloons of their sarcastic super Sentinel. Why? They want to paint themselves as humanity's saviors and this gave them the chance to seize on that. They've been running PR against Krakoa, so now here's a good chance to run PR for themselves.
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Oct 27, 2022 01:46
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Mirror Dazzler putting Dazzler in a Scorpion Deathlock is far and away the best moment in comics this year. Don't @ me, just bask in the glory of X-Terminators.
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Oct 27, 2022 02:36
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Tragic that Jubes is a Fed watcher and not AEW. Jubilee should be #AllElite.
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Oct 27, 2022 02:37
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I thought the finale was fine, though I'm a little confused how the Progenitor was finally "defeated." The team utilized...facts and logic? Did they really convince it to hit the self-sacrifice reset button by saying "If you finish doing the thing you've been doing all along you'll feel really bad about it"?site posted:honestly as soon as i read that phoenix foundation poo poo i thought to myself "this will literally never be referenced again" lol
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Oct 27, 2022 02:53
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well mainly because i don't think this is gonna stop every book from having the mutants die and be resurrected constantly so it won't get any page time, and that everybody already has their own plots going on and even immortal has sins of sinister coming down the pipe. and after that it'll be so far past this moment it'll be another footnote like the super pills
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Oct 27, 2022 04:14
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rantmo posted:Tragic that Jubes is a Fed watcher and not AEW. Jubilee should be #AllElite. Still waiting for Steve Orlando to reveal Danhausen is a mutant with a curse ability. Possibly a member of the Brotherhood of Very Nice Very Evil Mutants.
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Oct 27, 2022 04:50
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I think it's fine if mutants rezzing sick kids is just a general background aspect of the ongoing status quo like the Krakoan drugs (something that certainly has been referenced throughout the books). The current X-line worldbuilding is very dense and not everything has to be mentioned in every issue to be part of the overall story. Not every concept has been handled well (to this day I still don't understand how the Waiting Room is supposed to replace what the Crucible does and I'm not sure the writers do either) but I genuinely can't think of any ongoing story beats that have been outright brushed off.
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Oct 27, 2022 05:04
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I wonder what happened to the hospital named after Moira lmao.
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Oct 27, 2022 08:02
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Open Marriage Night posted:Still waiting for Steve Orlando to reveal Danhausen is a mutant with a curse ability. Possibly a member of the Brotherhood of Very Nice Very Evil Mutants. Now I want a book with Danhausen, Longshot, and Domino where it's just issue after issue of pure chaos.
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Oct 27, 2022 12:45
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Wanderer posted:There is a lot to go over here, but it does strike me as one more reason why some near-future editorial mandate is going to end up hitting some kind of massive Secret Wars-y reset button. It’s only an issue if people make it an issue. I don’t think a ton of people actually care about this? DC tried to address this and has been stuck in an endless loop of tedious nonsense for decades.
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Oct 27, 2022 12:57
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rantmo posted:Now I want a book with Danhausen, Longshot, and Domino where it's just issue after issue of pure chaos. Not a mutant, but Black Cat had bad luck powers for a time.
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Oct 27, 2022 13:58
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Open Marriage Night posted:Not a mutant, but Black Cat had bad luck powers for a time. True, but I just want Vulpes to write her forever.
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Oct 27, 2022 14:36
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Open Marriage Night posted:Not a mutant, but Black Cat had bad luck powers for a time. I think she still does? But now it's related to some machine/computer in her body? I just remember the issue of Black Cat where she walks into Stark Industries she mentions in her monolgue that she had to turn it off so Stark's sensors wouldn't detect it.
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Oct 27, 2022 18:20
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it's a power broker thing, no?
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Oct 27, 2022 19:10
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Not sure of her powers current origin, but it was explicitly referenced early in Vulpes run when she was fighting that one Dr. Strange villain while robbing Dr. Strange. Apparently magic and luck based powers don't mix.
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Oct 27, 2022 19:23
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It's a quantum probability pulsator, a piece of hardware implanted by Doc Tramma along with her claws (as seen in Web of Spider-Man Vol.2, #11, a reaaaaal early Pepe Larraz story).
Vulpes Vulpes fucked around with this message at 20:28 on Oct 27, 2022 |
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Oct 27, 2022 20:23
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I forgot they brought back Web Of during that time. Congrats on having three books out this week, Vulpes!
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Oct 27, 2022 21:38
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Open Marriage Night posted:I forgot they brought back Web Of during that time. Congrats on having three books out this week, Vulpes! And three very good books at that! Kind of hope Marc's kid gets to show up more often, though hopefully less imperiled.
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Oct 27, 2022 21:50
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I don't know if I'm going to beat last year's record of 44 issues, but it won't be for lack of trying.
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Oct 27, 2022 22:12
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BrianWilly posted:
They aren't the same. The crucible is an event a depowered mutant can use to be repowered immediately. It's an answer for 'why don't depowered mutants just suicide' The waiting room is a magic afterlife room that dead mutants from before there was a cerebro brain scan system could wait in to be revived.
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Oct 27, 2022 23:00
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frodnonnag posted:They aren't the same. It's also a physical location connected by a Krakoan gate so you can go hang out there if you don't want to ritualistically get murdered for resurrection. I think Crucible as a concept was sort of retired in favor of it? I haven't seen in mentioned since. I guess it's slightly confusing because of the fact that it has a gate that goes into an alternate dimension, but it's also what Legion has going on with the gate on Arakko that goes into the astral plane.
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Oct 27, 2022 23:26
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Abroham Lincoln posted:It's also a physical location connected by a Krakoan gate so you can go hang out there if you don't want to ritualistically get murdered for resurrection. I think Crucible as a concept was sort of retired in favor of it? I haven't seen in mentioned since. they're still quite separate things. The waiting room is only for revival of mutants that are already long dead, more specifically ones without a cerebro scan backup. Crucible is a ritual depowered mutants can use to be repowered and not have to wait. it's meant, in nightcrawlers words, to solve the real problem of depowered mutants just committing suicide and adding to the resurrection queue.
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Oct 28, 2022 00:37
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Oct 28, 2022 01:09
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Right, but the thing is that they say there's no more Crucible because of the Waiting Room, except that the WR doesn't solve the problem that Crucible was supposed to solve. People were forced to go through Crucible because there were already too many mutants for the Five to resurrect, so depowered or otherwise disfigured mutants had to go through a brutal deathmatch to "prove" that they "deserved" to go on top of the resurrection queue. It was cruel and barbaric by design to deter people from just killing themselves and clogging up the queue. The WR is an overall good thing because they can now rez people who weren't scanned by Cerebro, but all it does is add more people to the queue, so why would it replace the Crucible? Why is it an "alternative?" If anything, Crucible is even more necessary now! (That also brings up the question of why Xavier even needs to scan people anymore, like Kurt, if the WR can just bring back any mutant without a scan.)
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Oct 28, 2022 02:20
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Because nobody but a few people liked the idea of the Crucible and now instead of having to get murdered you can choose to use the Waiting Room. You also don't need a scan, but that's probably more of a guarantee that you retain memories than the Waiting Room.
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Oct 28, 2022 02:28
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BrianWilly posted:Right, but the thing is that they say there's no more Crucible because of the Waiting Room, except that the WR doesn't solve the problem that Crucible was supposed to solve. The Crucible didn't realistically solve a problem either, it just put a throttle on it by forcing people to go through uncomfortable extreme measures because Apocalypse designed it (and also he's gone now.) Presumably now you're making an appointment for when the Five can fit you in and going to the Waiting Room when it's just about time, so like, y'know. A waiting room. Cerebro also needs to scan people still; the souls in the Waiting Room were scanned when it was created, making backups for people it never had backups of before.
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Oct 28, 2022 02:38
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If you go into the Waiting Room, all you do is add to the Five's workload, which is already a decades-long endeavor, and it's very strange that this was presented as a big problem when they established the Crucible but now they just don't care anymore?Abroham Lincoln posted:The Crucible didn't realistically solve a problem either, it just put a throttle on it by forcing people to go through uncomfortable extreme measures because Apocalypse designed it (and also he's gone now.) Presumably now you're making an appointment for when the Five can fit you in and going to the Waiting Room when it's just about time, so like, y'know. A waiting room. Again, none of the problems that necessitated Crucible have been addressed at all but the books are just...acting as if they have been. As been said, the Crucible hasn't appeared at all since the WR. BrianWilly fucked around with this message at 02:46 on Oct 28, 2022 |
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Oct 28, 2022 02:40
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One possible advantage to the Waiting Room, though unstated, is that when someone or other drops a meteor on the Five or some kind of grim-jawed mutant atrocity occurs, you'll be in a subdimension managed by an Avenger rather than in a computer owned by a mutant political figure.  That might be a little bit genre savvy of course.
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Oct 28, 2022 02:55
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BrianWilly posted:If you go into the Waiting Room, all you do is add to the Five's workload, which is already a decades-long endeavor, and it's very strange that this was presented as a big problem when they established the Crucible but now they just don't care anymore? I've only just caught up on AXE but I don't recall anyone really suggesting that anything that's happened has improved the queue and workload. I do remember several moments of them navigating the limitations and noting how much more there is to do, though. But anyway you asked how it could replace the Crucible and it's pretty plainly there in the text. Replacing doesn't mean "solves every single problem and makes it perfect, forever." The selection process is still arbitrary and the people who get picked are realistically there for a story. The millions in queue are just a piece of background fluff until someone decides the Five have gotten to them all.
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Oct 28, 2022 03:24
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