|
NikkolasKing posted:I was reading about this old Toreador Bloodline called the Nephilim. They had Chimerstry and, looking it up, this is said to be the "trademark Discipline of the Ravnos." So why does a Toreador Bloodline have it? Looking up the page on their founder Michael, he had it, so maybe it's as simple as that? Michael may have learned it from somewhere. From an out of game standpoint, someone said 'wouldn't it be cool if a Toreador bloodline had Chimerstry?' You can't throw a rock two feet without hitting a vampire with some other clan's 'unique' Discipline. quote:I guess I've just read more about the Tremere and how they developed their own Discipline of blood magic. I thought Tzimisce did the same with Vicissitude. But maybe other Disciplines were there since the start or near the start and specific ones got filtered down into various clans? 'Unique' or 'trademark' Disciplines get spread around. Half the NPCs you see in the books have Thaumaturgy, or Obtenebration, or other things that are 'closely guarded secrets' without any explanation other than 'that's what they were given'. Don't look too deep into it, there generally isn't a huge amount of backstory or words spent on explaining that stuff.
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 00:55
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 20:11 |
|
|
Lots of non-Tremere NPCs have Path of Weather Control specifically for the ST to always have it be foggy/raining/etc. Like the Prince of Gary, Indiana.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 02:34
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:Lots of non-Tremere NPCs have Path of Weather Control specifically for the ST to always have it be foggy/raining/etc. Like the Prince of Gary, Indiana. In the face of mortal ineptitude in fighting climate change, the Council of Seven (Or whoever is in charge now) made the decision to teach the Path of Weather Control to select non-members in as many domains as possible. Clan secrets and the Masquerade are less important that stopping the wildfire burning down the entire city, sadly. It is true that unseasonably warm nights are so much creepy, though, plus it conflicts with the formalwear, leather, and trenchcoat dress code at Elysium.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 02:44
|
|
|
NikkolasKing posted:Also, this is more meta, but the only other TTRPG I've read about in depth is Pathfinder and reading their books makes me yearn for the Suggested Reading and Refrences included in pretty much every WoD book I've seen. It's just really helpful to lay out "this is the source of our inspiration. Go check it out yourself and learn like we did" Helps some of the books they cite are real works of history or philosophy which is always good to have. I wonder how much would be impossible to put reference guides in because they'd just point to other D&D books written decades ago under a different company. Like you could sort of backsolve inspirational work for Silver Mount and the Rain of Stars, but the real reason they exist is because 45 years ago Gary Gygax decided it would be fun to have a crashed spaceship in his convention game that year.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 05:45
|
|
|
Gatto Grigio posted:Then again, novel Dracula could walk around in daylight without exploding, so… You would be surprised how many things can be killed by a steak to the heart ~Buffy the Vampire Slayer
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 09:16
|
|
|
Steak goes in your stomach, Buffy, not your heart. Geez, frickin blondes, amirite?!?
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 15:18
|
|
|
Achilli is doing a W5 Q&A on the WoD Twitch channel right now. At work so not watching it.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 16:32
|
|
|
I grabbed a few screenshots of answers in the discord to some of the questions that have popped up in this thread but it's moving so fast it's hard to keep up with it at the moment.       
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 18:36
|
|
|
Just use the Google doc with the whole transcript. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1TI9FGZeku83c_rdJQl2cZzbaUg2MEMInYMG4pjUFfyw/edit?usp=sharing
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 18:56
|
|
|
drat, I'm actually interested in W5 now.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 19:16
|
|
|
Gatto Grigio posted:Steak goes in your stomach, Buffy, not your heart. Heart disease is the number 1 killer of supernatural creatures today. Tragic but true
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 19:45
|
|
|
Some people in the discord are big mad over that “Fianna is just a word” comment. I myself am somewhat shocked at the new treatment of Kinfolk. I knew they were going to deemphasize the breeding elements but I didn’t expect them to draw that hard of a line. Curious what the overall society is going to look like as a result.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 19:48
|
|
|
W5 looks decent thus far. While rolling to see if you gain/preserve/lose rage is way more appropriate to rolling to see if you lose blood, I hope they keep mechanics like that to broader "something injures or pisses you off"/"you spend a turn in crinos form" type situations rather than using them for each and every instance of power use or accelerated healing because it'd just be really annoying. I'm also hoping that Werewolf represents an impetus to think seriously about streamlining and standardizing the weird combat edge cases that currently require an enormous fan document to explain in disappointing ways. They can actually give us one roll combat if they try...!
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 19:49
|
|
|
Fianna thing is still kinda weird, but the rest is neat.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2022 22:26
|
|
|
I dig it
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 00:55
|
|
|
A Cool And Good Answer posted:"W5 and the Garou don't place any setting stigma on gender, sex, disability, or other identity elements. Trans werewolf? Rock the gently caress on." Hell yeah.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 01:17
|
|
|
Was looking back through some of the Q&A responses and caught that Justin says Vanir’s Wrath from Heart of the Forest is considered a legacy concept. Wild that we got two Werewolf videos games within the past two years that are both already out of date from the edition they were supposed to be tied to.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 01:36
|
|
|
Free Gratis posted:Was looking back through some of the Q&A responses and caught that Justin says Vanir’s Wrath from Heart of the Forest is considered a legacy concept. Wild that we got two Werewolf videos games within the past two years that are both already out of date from the edition they were supposed to be tied to. Still love to know what caused Paradox to yoink the writing duties back from Hunters Entertainment.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 04:07
|
|
|
Dawgstar posted:Still love to know what caused Paradox to yoink the writing duties back from Hunters Entertainment. Me too. A friend of mine from back in the day was on the writing team, and I don't dare ask her anything about it (#NDAs) but am dying to know what happened. The initial team looked very good. At a guess, the Hunters team were working off Paradox's original pitch, i.e. the one Swedracula shat out, and the change of direction since Achilli came in prompted such a reboot of planning that they pulled the project from Hunters entirely while they worked out what they actually wanted out of W5.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 04:58
|
|
|
Someone on RPGnet wrote a summary of the Twitch Q&A stream, which has more a little more information beyond the Discord Q&A, which is hopefully accurate: https://forum.rpg.net/index.php?threads/any-news-about-werewolf-the-apocalypse-5th-edition.900876/post-24562901 I can't say I didn't get what I wanted: W5 is a straight up hard reboot in so many ways. No wonder why they still don't quite know what Loresheets in the game are going to look like; those were made to plug characters into greater setting details, few of which remain in this edition. Also, it's kind of funny that Swedracula's vision of "return to the 1st edition" still lives on under Achilli's management. Fuzz posted:Just use the Google doc with the whole transcript. If I'm reading this right, Project Twilight went full Cowboy Delta Green, and I'm here for it! Also I should give Walk Among Us a read some time, come to think of it.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 05:21
|
|
|
Free Cog posted:Also, it's kind of funny that Swedracula's vision of "return to the 1st edition" still lives on under Achilli's management. Nah, that neither surprises nor is a particularly bad goal in and of itself. The big difference is which aspects of first edition they're talking about returning to.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 11:18
|
|
|
quote:Outstar comment: Unlike previous editions, this one is in the age of apocalypse and the fifth edition is going back to the roots in what the original game-splats were about What does this mean? I've heard and read a bit myself about how much the tone of Mage changed from edition to edition, but never heard Werewolf "lost its way" or seriously shifted its ideas. What was WtA originally about and how did it change over time? (note: Seems the first editiosn of the Big Three of the oWoDare a happily forgotten relic to everyone. Old timey fans seem to look back at 2nd edition and on for VTM, WTA, and oMage)
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 11:47
|
|
|
NikkolasKing posted:What does this mean? I've heard and read a bit myself about how much the tone of Mage changed from edition to edition, but never heard Werewolf "lost its way" or seriously shifted its ideas. My best guess as to what they’re referring to is how inseparable the meta-plot became, and just how much stuff got added. The second editions, in particular, went full gonzo and bloated their respective games pretty hard with supplement after supplement and added all kinds of sub factions and further crystallized the WoD setting. This was around the time I got into WoD and I still have fond memories of just devouring all the material I could, and most WoD nerds love flexing how much they know. The revised editions tried to pull back a little bit on the wackiness, but doubled down on pushing the metaplot to the direct front of the line. They also did this weird thing where they tried to subvert the game lines? It was around this time when I really started seeing the debates of who “the real villains” are. I.e. The Sabbat are fighting the antediluvians, and the Technocracy just want to help humanity. Werewolf was arguably the least affected in this regard, but it still happened. No one was acting like a Pentex apologist but we did get “The WEAVER is the true enemy!”
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 14:16
|
|
|
NikkolasKing posted:What does this mean? I've heard and read a bit myself about how much the tone of Mage changed from edition to edition, but never heard Werewolf "lost its way" or seriously shifted its ideas. Whoops http://worldofdorkness.com/2022/08/10/world-of-dorkness-3-werewolf-the-apocalypse-1st-edition/ 1e was pretty straight forward in "You are Garou, fight for Gaia because it's the end times" From what I've read about W5 it's "You are Garou and the war is over, shits hosed. Deal with it"
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 14:29
|
|
|
I also think it could be how the intergenerational conflict the garou have is returning to the forefront. Which might also be why they're dialing back a bit on important NPCs. It's part of the punk theme. Anyone in a position of authority isn't to be trusted, with the real focus is on the pack and the small victories theu can carve out. Looking both over again my one concern is what they're doing with the Bone Gnawers. I'm not sure I'm for them being the werewolf equivalent of Nosferatu obsessed with secrets any more than I'm for a Disney-fied take on the homeless. Part of the draw of the tribe to me was both the weird Americana aspects (the General Lee totem, the Hootenanny gift, the Rite of Superbowl Sunday and Rite of Pizza) coupled with their subversion of and reverence for traditions. Both how their leaders were more like ancient rulers constantly handing out gifts to their thanes (only it's spare clothes or food vouchers instead of looted jewelery or feasts) and how they made do with beer ("well the slogan says "taste the Rockies" and this rite says we should use mountain water...") for the Rite of Cleansing. Maybe that's been taken over by one of the other tribes? *edit* Most of my experience with large scale werewolf games is from Digichats, where there was far more "this is how Garou society is and how dare you try to not accept the revanchist oppression inherit in my PC forcing their will on you because they have a few more dots in Renown" OOCly. Basically any questioning of the IC power structure being seen as you "not getting the game" and playing it wrong. Hopefully that's gone out the window along with giving a poo poo about who is sleeping with whom. citybeatnik fucked around with this message at 14:46 on Oct 28, 2022 |
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 14:41
|
|
|
Free Gratis posted:The revised editions tried to pull back a little bit on the wackiness, but doubled down on pushing the metaplot to the direct front of the line. They also did this weird thing where they tried to subvert the game lines? It was around this time when I really started seeing the debates of who “the real villains” are. I.e. The Sabbat are fighting the antediluvians, and the Technocracy just want to help humanity. Werewolf was arguably the least affected in this regard, but it still happened. No one was acting like a Pentex apologist but we did get “The WEAVER is the true enemy!” If you wanted a really dialed-in campaign about making impact against climate disaster you'd be dismantling every jet engine in the US military and reducing every defense contractor's factory into atoms (and even then, the snapshot of late 90s neoliberal centrism the games were first conceived under means such a campaign would inevitably turn out to be Because The Wyrm Made It Bad War, Or The Weaver Wanted More Tools For War, Instead of Only Fighting For A Good War, See).
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 14:42
|
|
|
One thing that does legit bother me about Woof 5 is I'm not sure I agree with the notion Justin put forward that the 'saving the world' mentality blocks personal stories. Honestly that the Garou having a really clear goal of what they need to be doing was a strength the other games didn't particularly have. You can still do it while dealing with living in a gig economy or whatever.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 15:16
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:Looking both over again my one concern is what they're doing with the Bone Gnawers. I'm not sure I'm for them being the werewolf equivalent of Nosferatu obsessed with secrets any more than I'm for a Disney-fied take on the homeless. Part of the draw of the tribe to me was both the weird Americana aspects (the General Lee totem, the Hootenanny gift, the Rite of Superbowl Sunday and Rite of Pizza) coupled with their subversion of and reverence for traditions. Both how their leaders were more like ancient rulers constantly handing out gifts to their thanes (only it's spare clothes or food vouchers instead of looted jewelery or feasts) and how they made do with beer ("well the slogan says "taste the Rockies" and this rite says we should use mountain water...") for the Rite of Cleansing. I doubt they’d shunt it off to another tribe if they decide to keep the magic hobo stuff. I have a feeling they’ll still have some ties to the impoverished, but more emphasize their ability to blend in and stay close to humanity, which naturally lends to their listed Verbs relating to infiltration and what not. Based on the Q&A yesterday, a character’s choice of tribe seems more tied to personal philosophy than any kind of social circumstances, so I just don’t know how fleshed out or generically written they’ll be. I, myself, always tried to emphasize their capacity for survival and well as their rejection of decorum. They live where no one else wants to live and hunt where no one else wants to hunt, and don’t care about your fancy titles. citybeatnik posted:Most of my experience with large scale werewolf games is from Digichats, where there was far more "this is how Garou society is and how dare you try to not accept the revanchist oppression inherit in my PC forcing their will on you because they have a few more dots in Renown" OOCly. Basically any questioning of the IC power structure being seen as you "not getting the game" and playing it wrong. In the Q&A, someone asked about the Litany, and Justin responded that there were 11 tenets, and they had cast out the ones related to who you gently caress (Garou shall not mate with garou) or described how to treat the disabled (do not suffer thy people to tend to thy weakness.) That would mean submission to those higher in station is still at play if they keep the same of the remaining 11 tenets. Something tells me they’ll dial back a little on the outright oppressive nature though.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 15:24
|
|
|
Dawgstar posted:One thing that does legit bother me about Woof 5 is I'm not sure I agree with the notion Justin put forward that the 'saving the world' mentality blocks personal stories. Honestly that the Garou having a really clear goal of what they need to be doing was a strength the other games didn't particularly have. You can still do it while dealing with living in a gig economy or whatever. Yeah I didn’t really get that either. I’m personally not a fan of the more pessimistic vibes that Justin’s been giving off. I know poo poo is hosed but I really hope reading the book doesn’t just feel like I’m doomscrolling twitter.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 15:27
|
|
|
Interview with Justin Achilli on the new edition. The comments currently are about 95% upset Get of Fenris fans.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 16:24
|
|
|
Skios posted:Interview with Justin Achilli on the new edition. The comments currently are about 95% upset Get of Fenris fans. quote:achilli man you turning werewolves into wereterriers u Get of Fenrir Hater Too long for a new thread title? That's amazing.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 16:28
|
|
|
They just randomly dropped a Daughters of Cacophony Loresheet on the main WoD site this morning. It's pretty good but the level 4's wording is so vague that it's sorta brokenly strong. The level 5 is rad though.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 16:34
|
|
|
Fuzz posted:They just randomly dropped a Daughters of Cacophony Loresheet on the main WoD site this morning. It's pretty good but the level 4's wording is so vague that it's sorta brokenly strong. The level 5 is rad though. Ah, classic world of darkness.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 16:45
|
|
|
Where is this loresheet? I can't find it on the main site.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 16:59
|
|
|
Skios posted:Where is this loresheet? I can't find it on the main site. Month of Darkness calendar and you need to be signed into your Paradox account, it'll be in the downloads with all the other MoD goodies they've given away that way. https://www.worldofdarkness.com/month-of-darkness
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 17:06
|
|
|
Free Gratis posted:
Yeah, that was always my take as well. The part in the revised tribebook where you have competing stories around a trashcan fire to decide who the new leader was going to be always stuck with me. Fancy titles don't mean poo poo, it's about who can rally folks and hand out grub. That and the old hoboking dying peacefully because everyone's now in the hands of a furious metis who'll stomp anyone that fucks with them into a fine paste was bittersweet in the best way. Free Gratis posted:In the Q&A, someone asked about the Litany, and Justin responded that there were 11 tenets, and they had cast out the ones related to who you gently caress (Garou shall not mate with garou) or described how to treat the disabled (do not suffer thy people to tend to thy weakness.) Even the Shadow Lords called that out as bullshit in their revised tribebook, particularly the reasoning of 'this is how wolves act!' "gently caress no it's not how wolves act, wolves act like a family. This is all because we throw a bunch of unrelated folks together and a pecking order needs to be set our because we're all idiots. Ceterum censeo Silver Fangs esse delendam." It's when the IC tension of "out of touch Elder won't listen" is used OOCly by players to force others to do as they say that my knuckles itch.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 17:11
|
|
|
There was a big 'the alpha may not be challenged during wartime' plot point in the Werewolf comic, but like the games that was probably based off an earlier draft. Although it did mention the Ghost Council so maybe they were always around. It is a mystery.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 17:18
|
|
|
I am absolutely about to pay for defending V5 with W5 just being Forsaken reskinned with Apocalypse nouns, aren't I?
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 19:10
|
|
|
Dawgstar posted:Too long for a new thread title? That's amazing. Voting for title change lol also: 
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 19:24
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 20:11 |
|
|
you turning werewolves into wereterriers is a great title
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2022 19:44
|
|
