|
Xenomrph posted:So there’s no “pure” Alien because the Alien can’t exist without the host DNA, but there is baseline Alien genetic material which is then fused with host DNA to make recognizable capital A Aliens. You’re confusing yourself by beginning with the premise that such things as “baseline genes” and “capital A” creatures must exist. This sets you off on a wild goose chase, searching for the concrete “pure” identity of various creatures characterized by their boundary-crossing monstrosity. There is no need for your presumptions, and no basis for them in the text(s). There’s only one “Alien Queen” in the canonical films, followed by various failed attempts at replicating it.
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2022 22:51
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 13, 2024 22:46 |
|
|
Xenomrph posted:No I think they’re fine as xenomorph-adjacent (and like I said, that’s how the RPG treats them, as xenomorph-adjacent - the Black Goo can make all kinds of stuff, of which discrete capital A Aliens are one), but I prefer capital A Aliens, it’s kind of that simple. Nice, I didn't realize I'd basically done a called shot on a really-existing Aliens comic. Cloned bodies I'd let sneak by on the basis that those are people you're just generating and killing. Similarly, Resurrection is cool because it pays the Piper by, in the wake of generating a viable queen using pure, also generating a bunch of hosed up and perpetually-in-agony psuedoRipleys. Anyway, I actually think that Covenant is on your side when it comes to preferring, emphasizing, or otherwise placing a premium on what we might call the Xenomorph Classic. My takeaway from the movie was that David was effectively (and probably unknowingly) playing with a sort of point-buy system, making the actual reproduction process incredibly complicated and costly but in exchange producing an actual monster that's way stronger and smarter than most of the weird crap the black goo gives rise to spontaneously. So, the black, chitinous, humaniform manifestation of the generalized chaotic xeno-essence is in fact of special quality and importance.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2022 22:55
|
|
|
Ferrinus posted:Nice, I didn't realize I'd basically done a called shot on a really-existing Aliens comic.  For what it’s worth I just picked the brain of another Aliens nerd and he identified the comic with the cloned bodies (Aliens: Rogue) but he thinks it might have been a mix of actual genuine cloned bodies that worked and then “faked” genuine human torsos that the scientist was gathering from people he murdered, to cover up his murders. One of the characters figures out what’s happening when he sees that one of the torsos has a tattoo from a Marine that had conveniently “disappeared” earlier in the story. There might be more to it than that, I’d have to check the comic and its novelization. Like I said, the expanded universe isn’t all just rote “humans find Aliens, they breed, humans die”, they do some neat stuff with the creature, its symbolism and themes, sometimes using the creature as window dressing for other topics like androids’ rights, or the creation of art, or ethics in science, or the nature of folklore, or spirituality, or the concept of existence and legacy after death, etc. The quality is all over the map, but that’s part of the charm. And for people who just want “Aliens breed, people die”, there’s plenty of that too.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2022 23:06
|
|
|
I wish we would have gotten that last movie I want more stupid android trying to destroy the human species.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 01:35
|
|
|
Same. It’s why I’m mad at annoying alien fans for complaining and depriving me of something I love!
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 01:39
|
|
|
CelticPredator posted:Same. It’s why I’m mad at annoying alien fans for complaining and depriving me of something I love! Yeah I'll always be annoyed that the third movie didn't happen. A flick about engineers and "we should figured out what happened" humans and "gently caress this poo poo David Must Die" humans all converging on David's xenomorph hell colony? God dammit Like if I won power ball or something I'd definitely dump $100 million of it into getting this movie made.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 03:05
|
|
|
CelticPredator posted:Same. It’s why I’m mad at annoying alien fans for complaining and depriving me of something I love! Same here. David was the best thing to come out of the entire Alien franchise. Depriving us of the last David movie makes me dislike supposed Alien fans (who aren't really film fans and are just trying to replicate their childhood when they first saw Aliens).
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 03:32
|
|
|
Darko posted:Same here. David was the best thing to come out of the entire Alien franchise. Depriving us of the last David movie makes me dislike supposed Alien fans (who aren't really film fans and are just trying to replicate their childhood when they first saw Aliens). That sure is a hell of a spicy hot take right there. I like David, he just deserves to be in something not Alien where he can run wild and not have Alien baggage holding him back. I was totally onboard with the proposed Prometheus sequel where it’s about Shaw and David going on a scary adventure and there isn’t a single Alien in sight. Sign me the hell up. Or hell, take Covenant and pull the Alien creature from the last act out of it, it’s easily the weakest part of the movie. Neomorphs and spores and backbursters and David’s menagerie and David being a gothic horror villain, I’m completely onboard. The bit where David communes with one of the Neomorphs is the best scene in the movie. Xenomrph fucked around with this message at 04:22 on Nov 2, 2022 |
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 04:16
|
|
|
I want an alien movie that’s weird as hell and fucks up the whole canon but it gets to be a little bit higher budget because it’s an IP I say weird as hell and I love blomkamp but his alien movie didn’t sound weird as hell. It sounded like the old school aliens novels and I don’t want those. I want to weird stuff. Bring Jenuet back honestly
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 04:26
|
|
|
CelticPredator posted:I want an alien movie that’s weird as hell and fucks up the whole canon but it gets to be a little bit higher budget because it’s an IP I want to see a Blomkamp directed adaptation of ‘Aliens: Labyrinth’, that kind of body horror and weird poo poo coupled with very technical sci-fi designs is extremely in his wheelhouse.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 04:30
|
|
|
That one is fine because it IS really weird. Still don’t know what was up with some of the hive stuff. It got very abstract and it was great.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 04:31
|
|
|
CelticPredator posted:That one is fine because it IS really weird. Still don’t know what was up with some of the hive stuff. It got very abstract and it was great. Easily my favorite Aliens expanded universe story by a country mile. It took the “boring” played-out Alien and made it weird and scary and unpredictable again while still keeping it somewhat recognizable, and it had easily one of the best and most interesting villains the franchise has ever seen (and the ending is loving perfect, the end of Alien Covenant wishes it was that good) I would pay good money to get a copy of the comic in Blomkamp’s hands just so he could read it. Nothing could come of it, I don’t care, just the knowledge that he read (and hopefully liked) it. I remember when I scrounged up like 20 copies of the comic and distributed it to any goons who were interested, that’s one of my fondest forum memories. Xenomrph fucked around with this message at 04:39 on Nov 2, 2022 |
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 04:36
|
|
|
I think having the black goo as a kind of alien Building Block kind of was dumb. I prefer it being this wild genetic firestorm. Making it seem to point towards Making Aliens was kind of meh. I like to think that ancient Engineers built Eden and watched it just fail to live up to their expectations. Then some of them come across a Xeno and it's like this amazing dark revelation/mindfuck that turns their society in its head. But the best they can do is mutagen goo they were using to seed planets, perverted, in search of something they don't really understand. As for sequels, I figured David would end up like the Elden synth from AvP: Fire and Stone. Maybe infecting himself/splicing himself to commune with the hive or something.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 06:16
|
|
|
FilthyImp posted:I think having the black goo as a kind of alien Building Block kind of was dumb. I prefer it being this wild genetic firestorm. Making it seem to point towards Making Aliens was kind of meh. David hasn't received any maintenance for some time and is already full of himself so I took it to be that he was a real deal "mad" scientist, how much of his talk about the xenomorph being the endgame of the black goo ultimate life form was just his android logic (like Ash) looking at it in terms of "finally a focused humanoid-ish thing with no pity or remose....like me!) Like even the first movie being called Prometheus and the way it opens up, I don't think they were quite as in control of the black goo as David thinks and it really was just this wild just genetically gently caress everything up atomic bomb to them. I know the third movie probably wouldn't have gone in this direction but when we learn that even the engineers had to have been created/come from somewhere, I liked the idea that the elephantine space jockey was still a thing and that the engineer helmets/etc. were made in homage/worship of that form. It would never have happened since IIRC even as far bas as the 2003 Legacy DVD commentary set Scott talked about how the idea of it was to evoke a pilot's mask/etc. but still
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 14:30
|
|
|
For what it’s worth, Giger always said it was just the thing’s face. Like, the one in ‘Alien’ had teeth.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 15:33
|
|
|
For what it's worth I don't view Prometheus as an attempt to provide me, the viewer, with a definitive answer as to where all aliens come from, and therefore what all further alien movies must now acknowledge in order to maintain credibility with Aliens Fans, or something. However, it does have interesting possible explanations for why aliens appear somewhat biomechanical, why they don't appear to eat or need sustenance, and why they are unrelentingly hostile, for examples of three ways in which they seem utterly unnatural to our understanding of life.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2022 23:31
|
|
|
One of my favorite details from Covenant is that they just obliterate fauna but leave flora standing.
|
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2022 02:34
|
|
|
Ferrinus posted:One of my favorite details from Covenant is that they just obliterate fauna but leave flora standing. David: History's Greatest Eco-Warrior
|
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2022 02:47
|
|
|
Xenomrph posted:Yeah but one of those I prefer over the other, and that’s okay. I get what you're going for, but I don't think the prequels ever really show the Alien being only a few decades old. The Space Jockey base they go to in Prometheus is presumably thousands of years old, and they have artistic depictions of the Alien in there, so it is still 'ancient'. Michael Fassbender is not the first guy to create an alien. The space jockeys were decorating their walls with images of them, and they clearly got killed by them already before Fassbender ever showed up. Also maybe it makes me bad but I actually like the scene in Alien where Ripley finds her crewmates getting mutated into eggs. Unpredictable hosed up body horror creating Aliens in a variety of different painful ways is much cooler to me than Insect Colony. Mr. Grapes! fucked around with this message at 12:11 on Nov 3, 2022 |
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2022 12:03
|
|
|
Yeah I never got the impression that Michael Fassbender invented the Alien as we know it now, he's clearly following in the footsteps for what the engineers did. He's a mad scientist, of course he think it's all him but that's clearly not the case.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2022 01:35
|
|
|
Neo Rasa posted:Yeah I never got the impression that Michael Fassbender invented the Alien as we know it now, he's clearly following in the footsteps for what the engineers did. He's a mad scientist, of course he think it's all him but that's clearly not the case. That’s been my argument from the moment the movie came out, and the movie’s novelization even outright textually supports it, not to mention its subtextually supported within the movie that he misattributes creators of things whether he realizes it or not. Ridley Scott has said in interviews in no uncertain terms that David invented the xenomorph, but there’s a reason there’s a well-worn adage in the AvP community: “Ridley Scott says a lot of things.” Fox almost immediately tried to downplay Scott’s claims and walk it back, and I don’t even know what Disney’s stance is on the matter; the upcoming Alien TV series might shed some light on it - if it’s set pre-‘Covenant’ and has Aliens in it, it stands to reason that Aliens exist independently of David. I know the Alien RPG is deliberately noncommittal on the topic, pretty much letting GMs and players decide for themselves, although the author personally doesn’t think David created them.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2022 02:18
|
|
|
Xenomrph posted:Fox almost immediately tried to downplay Scott’s claims and walk it back, and I don’t even know what Disney’s stance is on the matter Whoa, I didn't even think The Company had much of a stake in the matter, but I guess The Company has stakes in a lot of things.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2022 02:26
|
|
|
I got drunk and then my nerf pulse rifle came in the mail and I have the biggest grin on my face. I am blown the gently caress away that this exists and I am holding one in my hands. This thing was worth every penny.
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2022 22:39
|
|
|
It’s so good
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2022 23:08
|
|
|
I wish the stock extended a bit. Otherwise hell yes, it's awesome. I'm pretty sure I giggled when I loaded the mag and the round counter popped up.
|
|
#
?
Nov 7, 2022 15:06
|
|
|
I don't think Prometheus provides any definitive answers about anything. Covenant does to some degree, but the only thing Prometheus did was provide us with the name, Engineers, and the idea that they are incredibly fond of genetic engineering. It doesn't say anything about the age or origin of the Xenomorphs from the original film - the "engineer" in Alien is fossilized and so must be thousands of years old. Potentially it could even not be an engineer, but a precursor species that the engineers based their tech on. It could be a bio-modified engineer with an elephantine face that lets it interface with its technology in a superior way, etc. All Prometheus does is provide some context as well as thematic and visual ties, it doesn't actually give any answers to anything other than the origin of humanity. In fact I believe the original Prometheus script was way more explicit about its ties to Alien, and they then deliberately made an effort to make it way more ambiguous and vague. To me it does largely the same thing that a lot of the better EU material does, which is add flavour to the universe. And then tells a largely original story with David. I wish Covenant was a better movie, because there are parts of it I really like, but it also falls into the trap of partially just being an Alien remake that's much less compelling than the original. Alas, I have high hopes for the television show simply because it's Noah Hawley, though who knows if it'll actually happen.
|
|
#
?
Nov 7, 2022 15:21
|
|
|
Man I wish I could play around with the NERF Pulse Rifle for a bit, I don't really want it but I want to fire it and poo poo. What was the MSRP on it? Also, someone modded it to look really loving good: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EnKz_Godrwc
|
|
#
?
Nov 7, 2022 18:48
|
|
|
Thats looks really cool except for all the dumb modern tactical poo poo plastered to it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 7, 2022 20:49
|
|
|
100 bucks for the nerf gun. It’s worth it. Wonderful piece
|
|
#
?
Nov 7, 2022 20:52
|
|
|
Just got the new Alien RPG module Heart of Darkness. It's really cool and immediately takes its own liberties with the franchise to make a gigeriffic horror story. Who here likes alien microphages turning space stations into living ships and mutating prisoners into biomechanical superbeings who look like they belong on the cover of Necronomicon? Also you can play as the ship's cat, whose special personal item is their "crusty butthole"
|
|
#
?
Nov 7, 2022 21:24
|
|
|
My nerf pulse just came in the mail today and it rules. I havent owned a nerf gun since I was 10 and this was worth the 99 bux eassssssssssssssy. I definitely want to repaint it eventually, maybe a summer project when my family is off visiting relatives and I have the garage to myself
|
|
#
?
Nov 7, 2022 21:27
|
|
|
banned from Starbucks posted:Thats looks really cool except for all the dumb modern tactical poo poo plastered to it. ChickenHeart posted:Just got the new Alien RPG module Heart of Darkness. It's really cool and immediately takes its own liberties with the franchise to make a gigeriffic horror story.
|
|
#
?
Nov 7, 2022 23:56
|
|
|
Payndz posted:First things I noticed were the laser and red dot sights that don't belong there. I have mixed feelings about the laser module but the red dot sight is neat. The M41a would absolutely have a 20mm rail on top of it IRL. The gun mods and different pulse rifle variants in Fireteam give me the same mixed feelings; they're useful as hell but I just want my pulse rifle to look like the one in the movie. The weathering on that paintjob is excellent, but drat is he using a Sharpie for it? I don't have any experience painting up NERF guns but I figured the process would be more like edge drybrushing for Warhammer models. Mister Speaker fucked around with this message at 01:11 on Nov 8, 2022 |
|
#
?
Nov 8, 2022 01:08
|
|
|
It’s the same thing as that but with a sharpie. You’re hitting the edges but it gives it a more solid chipping effect as opposed to the lighter effect use with dry brushing. I used it when I made some props for a short film  I want to try it with a chrome gundam marker though. Shiner finish. Dunno if it’s more realistic but it could be interesting to try
|
|
#
?
Nov 8, 2022 01:25
|
|
|
Mister Speaker posted:I have mixed feelings about the laser module but the red dot sight is neat. The M41a would absolutely have a 20mm rail on top of it IRL. The gun mods and different pulse rifle variants in Fireteam give me the same mixed feelings; they're useful as hell but I just want my pulse rifle to look like the one in the movie. There are def better ways of doing it than a sharpie
|
|
#
?
Nov 8, 2022 01:26
|
|
|
ChickenHeart posted:Just got the new Alien RPG module Heart of Darkness. It's really cool and immediately takes its own liberties with the franchise to make a gigeriffic horror story. It isn’t just any cat, it is literally the author’s IRL cat. Same name, and the artwork is based on a real life picture of his cat.
|
|
#
?
Nov 8, 2022 01:28
|
|
|
Playing as the ship's cat in an Alien story sounds OP as hell.
|
|
#
?
Nov 15, 2022 12:45
|
|
|
Slashrat posted:Playing as the ship's cat in an Alien story sounds OP as hell. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wb_lkp58Jd0
|
|
#
?
Nov 15, 2022 14:32
|
|
|
Scorn came out, the Giger/Beksinski game that's basically set on EngineerWorld. It's probably a better Prometheus sequel than Covenant (sorry David you were great). I was worried the art style would just be a superficial skin on a traditional adventure game, but it really does engage headfirst with the Giger theme of nightmarish mechanized reproduction. It even has some very Prometheus beats, like a species of superhuman hominids with a mysterious reproductive fetish, and a parasite produced from an accidental and bizarre combination of events which becomes a major plot driver. I don't know if anyone here will actually like it, but I loved it, especially the ending.
|
|
#
?
Nov 15, 2022 15:33
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 13, 2024 22:46 |
|
|
Yeah, I liked Scorn a lot and definitely captures the existential dread of Giger beyond just looking like his art. Initially I was all where are all the psychosexual themes but then the last chapter sure showed me! I understand why a lot of people really hate the gameplay, but it's worth watching a playthrough or something if you don't think you'd like it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 16, 2022 09:13
|
|