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Alright, Ive come to a conclusion. Sorry to those who are emotionally attached to this game, but this is an objectively bad game. Do not buy. If I could get a refund I would. Fortunately for paradox their games take about 40 hours to determine what you really think about them. Now that I know... I regret paying money for this. Genuinely. It's not a grand strategy game. It should not be classified as that. It's something else, and whatever it is may be enjoyable to people who enjoy clicking on menu screens but this is not in the same category as EU4, CK3, Victoria2, Hoi4 or even Imperator: Rome. Diplomacy does not matter. Geopolitics do not matter. The economy barely matters. You are 100 capable of supporting the greatest war economy on the planet with a farming industry. Seriously. Multiculturalism is absolutely the best choice you can make, multicultural societies apparently have never faced any problems whatsoever and its an absolute win, win. It's seriously crazy that this studio produced this game. lmao at the page snipe.
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Nov 14, 2022 02:31
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| # ? May 29, 2024 20:22 |
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game isn't good but the fundamental economic system is so strong and good it's possible it will be incredible soon. and it's fun enough if u like industrializing and reforming and roleplaying already  those games u listed are mostly worse though, so this is a weird post. strange.
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Nov 14, 2022 02:41
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Not saying those aren't actual issues but every one of them is the kind of thing that'll get fixed by a few balance passes rather than being anything fundamental about the game's systems. If there's anything that's worth giving some slack for, especially for a game of this level of complexity, it's that.
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Nov 14, 2022 02:44
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actually... the game... is good 
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Nov 14, 2022 02:45
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Koramei posted:Not saying those aren't actual issues but every one of them is the kind of thing that'll get fixed by a few balance passes rather than being anything fundamental about the game's systems. If there's anything that's worth giving some slack for, especially for a game of this level of complexity, it's that. nah i dunno if i have that faith in paradox. i dont think they've ever actually invested in making their AI good.
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Nov 14, 2022 02:45
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anyway besides late game slowdown my biggest complaint is lack of a music player, like, c'mon my dudes
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Nov 14, 2022 02:47
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If your definition of "grand strategy" only includes games that are good, you're not playing enough of them. I mean poo poo, Superpower 3 came out just last month. Or maybe you're playing just the right amount, I don't know. But show respect for the pits of the genre
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Nov 14, 2022 02:49
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"grand strategy" is one of those fake descriptors that people who can't actually articulate their thoughts use. It's like the ones who said "mobile game ui"
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Nov 14, 2022 02:51
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I wanted to *get* this game, I spent a few weeks trying to 'break through' whatever bias I probably have. But I honestly just found myself thinking repeatedly that the game is boring, like "I'm bored playing this lol wtf am I doing". Uninstall. I thoroughly enjoyed every pdx game I've ever played with hundreds or thousands of hours. I think they need to get the player things to do/think about other than the buildings theyre queuing. I just wish this was something it isnt at the end of the day.
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Nov 14, 2022 02:51
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Slim Jim Pickens posted:"grand strategy" is one of those fake descriptors that people who can't actually articulate their thoughts use. It's like the ones who said "mobile game ui" What the hell genre would you call them then? Just call them strategy games?
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Nov 14, 2022 02:54
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the game is currently hamstrung by a number of glaringly obvious day one issues that were somehow not uncovered over however many months of ostensible alpha and beta testing but are nonetheless capable of completely ruining games 30 or 40 years in. the economic model is cool but it is currently chained to the service of a deeply flawed military and geopolitical model that will take a long, long time to fix, if it's even possible to do so. there's also virtually no flavor outside a handful of countries. in short, DAT'S PDOX BAY-BEE
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Nov 14, 2022 02:54
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Takanago posted:What the hell genre would you call them then? Just call them strategy games? Sure. It's about as specific
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Nov 14, 2022 02:55
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Takanago posted:What the hell genre would you call them then? Just call them strategy games? i call paradox games roleplaying games until they make them more strategic and harder >=)
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Nov 14, 2022 02:56
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as an aside, it's extremely wild/funny that we're coming up on three weeks post-release and they haven't fixed the turbo uber France thing
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Nov 14, 2022 03:07
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HannibalBarca posted:the game is currently hamstrung by a number of glaringly obvious day one issues that were somehow not uncovered over however many months of ostensible alpha and beta testing but are nonetheless capable of completely ruining games 30 or 40 years in. the economic model is cool but it is currently chained to the service of a deeply flawed military and geopolitical model that will take a long, long time to fix, if it's even possible to do so. there's also virtually no flavor outside a handful of countries. it's hard to imagine the magnitude of issues that must have been present throughout testing for some of this stuff to have slipped down to "we'll fix it after launch" priority. this speaks to the sheer complexity of the systems involved which i think is impressive as hell, but i do agree that the gameplay loop just kind of gets stale quickly compared to eu4. it's kind of similar to launch stellaris in that way but stellaris felt fundamentally unsound in a way this doesn't, and ultimately turned into an engaging game if you mod the hell out of it, so i don't think all hope is lost for v3 or anything - especially since stellaris showed a willingness on wiz's part to commit to radical redesigns if necessary HannibalBarca posted:as an aside, it's extremely wild/funny that we're coming up on three weeks post-release and they haven't fixed the turbo uber France thing what difficulty would exist in the game without turbo france for nations that start in the top half of global GDP? only britain and france can project power effectively in most areas of the world and britain gets so distracted with sticking their dicks into every little thing that it's easy to strike while they can't weigh in, plus their power is distributed between britane itself and the raj, which doesn't even participate in their wars unless britain is a primary participant themselves. france is basically at the level britain should be able to punch at, but can't because they aren't structured as a unitary nation like france, because turbo france is directly plugged into the british market through their indian treaty port. i don't think you would actually want them to fix turbo france before the AI in general is on less shaky ground. nerfing france leaves the player completely without a peer to jockey with by like 1860 unless the player started from a really really weak position. this post probably sounds mostly negative but my actual experience playing the game has been pretty uniformly positive barring certain bugs and the slowdown. and overall i think i've probably gotten a bit less value out of the game than people coming into v3 fresh instead of as a v2 veteran because certain parts of the game weren't really a puzzle to solve in the way they obviously are for a lot of the new players. i still make the same economic moves i always did in v2, max taxes, max wages, invade benin for more people, make more money than god with tariffs, etc. which took a bit of the mystery out of things for sure, even as there are a lot of new things to grapple with that don't have optimized solutions directly related to v2's optimized solutions. but i could have said the same about the eu3 -> eu4 transition and yet playing modern eu4 like it's eu3 divine wind would get you stomped by the AI. is it the game that will kill the grand strategy genre forever by being Too Good, like starcraft with RTS or civ 4 with TBS? no, but any expectations that it was going to be that at launch were always hyperbolic
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Nov 14, 2022 03:39
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Starcraft wasn't even the best RTS released that year.
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Nov 14, 2022 03:42
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I enjoy the game but I did decide to shelve it for some others while I wait for at least some bugfix patches to come in, it's more than a bit annoying that the lategame slowdown and overflow bugs are still in.HannibalBarca posted:as an aside, it's extremely wild/funny that we're coming up on three weeks post-release and they haven't fixed the turbo uber France thing Is this a thing that people are noticing? Like I've played three games to finish and they do somewhat better than most of the AI but not especially so. None of them really expand and conquer like they could, at least without the AI mod.
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Nov 14, 2022 03:42
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Gaius Marius posted:Starcraft wasn't even the best RTS released that year. i agree but good luck convincing the public that all of those korean broodwar esports guys should have been playing total annihilation the whole time instead
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Nov 14, 2022 03:45
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how has people's experience with that anbeeld's AI mod been, anyway? I tried it briefly on a belgium playthrough and it seemed like europe was consumed by turmoil and revolt at an even faster rate than usual, but maybe it was just bad rng. it would be well worth it if nations were developing late game industries at least
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Nov 14, 2022 03:46
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Fuligin posted:how has people's experience with that anbeeld's AI mod been, anyway? I tried it briefly on a belgium playthrough and it seemed like europe was consumed by turmoil and revolt at an even faster rate than usual, but maybe it was just bad rng. it would be well worth it if nations were developing late game industries at least as mexico i am somehow not #1 GDP by 1910 and not the #1 producer of anything besides automobiles. which to me was trivial to achieve by 1870 as the ottomans and before then as italy. so, i feel it's a genuine difference also importing all my opium from britain successfully
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Nov 14, 2022 03:51
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Waifu Radia posted:as mexico i am somehow not #1 GDP by 1910 and not the #1 producer of anything besides automobiles. which to me was trivial to achieve by 1870 as the ottomans and before then as italy. so, i feel it's a genuine difference tx im off to try it again. think i'll roll... persia this time
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Nov 14, 2022 03:55
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Fuligin posted:how has people's experience with that anbeeld's AI mod been, anyway? I tried it briefly on a belgium playthrough and it seemed like europe was consumed by turmoil and revolt at an even faster rate than usual, but maybe it was just bad rng. it would be well worth it if nations were developing late game industries at least i found that it helped a lot with keeping the AI competitive until the snowball point, not so much afterward, and that it doesn't help the AI with their late game industries (or even stuff like ammunition and opium) very much at all. but the dude's pulling a glavius and updating almost daily right now and i haven't started a new game in like a week and a half now so that could be a very outdated impression
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Nov 14, 2022 03:56
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It's definitely key to keeping the game engaging in sp lmao
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Nov 14, 2022 04:09
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I think there's a mix of bugs that can be easily fixed and should have been in beta, and systems with more serious design flaws. The AI is incredibly bad and stupid but apparently mods make it better so it could be fixable. Diplomacy seems busted but probably because of the AI, which in most games rarely seems to do much. I had Habsburgs unify Mega Germany sometime in the 1860s and they've been the runaway strongest nation in the game but didn't colonize or go to war or do anything with their 1000+ battalions. They haven't even bothered to annex a dozen or so remaining German duchies and kingdoms. Most of the things that actually happen in the game are due to internal revolts from often nebulous turmoil. So far I've had Portugal turn communist, Britian turn into an empire and then communist, the US have a fascist revolt and then released Louisiana as New Africa for some reason, Canada have a communist revolt that turned into a fascist revolt with the same leader (wtf?). The IG/party system seems mostly fine but I don't understand why IGs seemingly randomly leave and join parties, or why parties form and then disappear. Warfare seems broken with the random sizes of battles, but the front system itself seems like it should be workable assuming the bugs are unintentional. The trade route system... I don't know what they were thinking. Who was asking for manual trade routes for individual goods? I don't know if it's necessary for the rest of the economy to work but it is a terrible unfun mechanic. Juggling build orders can be fun if you're into making number go up (in principle, I mean; the queue UI is Not Great). The manual adjustment of production methods is awful and possibly more perplexing than manual trade routes (as in why they thought this would be a compelling gameplay loop, not how it works). Precambrian Video Games fucked around with this message at 04:36 on Nov 14, 2022 |
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Nov 14, 2022 04:32
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eXXon posted:
I like the production method stuff. seems pretty simple to manage?
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Nov 14, 2022 04:45
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eXXon posted:The trade route system... I don't know what they were thinking. Who was asking for manual trade routes for individual goods? I don't know if it's necessary for the rest of the economy to work but it is a terrible unfun mechanic. i think it needs tuning but im not sure what you mean by it being unfun to directly engage in market prices and have to consider what boosting rival economies can mean
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Nov 14, 2022 04:47
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Fuligin posted:I like the production method stuff. seems pretty simple to manage? I like the principle of it, and it's not too bad to manage in a small country without too many states. When you get to the stage of fiddling with production types in individual states because you can't afford to do it across the country (especially with construction sectors), that's where I wish it would just automagically adjust to resource availability and leave me alone. (also if you conquer a new, backwards state you might have to change all the production types in every building. blah) Waifu Radia posted:i think it needs tuning but im not sure what you mean by it being unfun to directly engage in market prices and have to consider what boosting rival economies can mean The trade route selection UI is reasonably helpful but 90% of the time I do not care which particular market I am importing from/exporting to. Precambrian Video Games fucked around with this message at 05:03 on Nov 14, 2022 |
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Nov 14, 2022 05:01
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You probably don't want to import the lead for your ammunition from countries you expect to go to war with...
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Nov 14, 2022 05:50
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OddObserver posted:You probably don't want to import the lead for your ammunition from countries you expect to go to war with... Why pay money to import when they'll give it to you via rifle for free.
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Nov 14, 2022 06:01
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Fat-Lip-Sum-41.mp3 posted:I feel like there are too many radical pops being generated by the way the AI bounces them from job to job. I think it also has something to do with trade routes. Any time a trade route gets canceled or downsized, it lowers the trade center's size, and each level lost means 1000 shopkeepers get fired. At least I think that's how it works.
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Nov 14, 2022 07:07
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I feel there are a great many flaws to this game but I don't think 'isn't a grand strategy game' is one of them. Anyway horribly failed my first attempt at un sick manning the Ottomans. There was one annoying bug (some of my armies got stuck at 0 morale and I basically couldn't use that general anymore because he would throw the 0 morale armies into fights. He was advancing on a unmanned front and still lost.) but most of my failures were my own fault. Good!
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Nov 14, 2022 07:16
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I think I found a similar bug with some navies, they were stuck at terribly low morale and aren't gaining it back very fast at all. As in I couldn't make naval landings in my war so I peaced out, teched to ironclads, expanded my shipyards, redid my naval PMs and when the truce timer had expired their morale was only up from 35 to like 60ish. All the while saying it was ~25 days to full morale. Meanwhile the new bases I built in the adjacent state to add to the same admiral were all full morale. I tried sacking and replacing the admiral, and saved and reloaded several times. No input good shortage, and plenty of people in that state to work at the naval bases (they were full employment anyway) No apparent debuffs to the admiral or the navies themselves for losing battles etc. So I just don't know other than destroying and rebuilding the bases themselves.
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Nov 14, 2022 08:00
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Yeah, I knew there was an issue with navies, but I didn't know there was an issue with armies.
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Nov 14, 2022 08:04
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Might be a bug, but when my generals have low morale troops I usually just flip them to standby and replace them with another general and that tends to get their morale and numbers back up to be usable again.
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Nov 14, 2022 09:00
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OddObserver posted:You probably don't want to import the lead for your ammunition from countries you expect to go to war with... That sounds efficient and poetic, actually. "Let them eat lead" - some French lady.
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Nov 14, 2022 09:01
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She was Australian actually
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Nov 14, 2022 09:03
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GreyjoyBastard posted:yeah there's something off with handling unemployment and/or temporary small SOL reductions its applying way, way too fast and easily. it should be after being unemployed for 3-9mo & or increased radicalization tied to a % SOL drop over a few months it's insanely dumb how economic hiccups lasting less than 2 loving days can result in 115,000 people being pissed at you for years
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Nov 14, 2022 10:01
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New patch dropped https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/patch-notes-for-1-0-6.1557300/quote:Balance
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Nov 14, 2022 10:06
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Actually having navies not regaining moral for like 2 weeks is pretty funny. Hopefully this will make USA and England a lot better in wars now. Does anyone know if you need to start a new save for the performance thing to kick in?
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Nov 14, 2022 10:35
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My main issues were the weird numbers in army engagements, the extra treaty ports, and rulers living way too long, so I am a bit disappointed in these notes
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Nov 14, 2022 10:56
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