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field balm posted:I'm really hoping we get at least a couple different skill trees per class at some point. I was definitely hoping to play vet as more of an all rounder than a hang back and spam grenades type guy. Yeah, Ratling and Ad Mech are both classes I expect to see DLC for. I imagine we'll get some variants of the existing classes too, as Fatshark is on record as wanting to add one per quarter.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:14
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tehinternet posted:It bugs me that this is getting mixed reviews because any good or bad reviews are basically irrelevant right now the review score is getting hammered in China, wonder if something went wrong with that version 
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Nov 21, 2022 02:17
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God I can't imagine something worse than a sniper class for this game other than what already exists. Already have vets sitting way in the back and getting mobbed because they're trying to play sniper, an actual crosshairs sniper would be a nightmare. E. Just paid 1/4 of my gold for a sword that does less damage but whose rating is 70 points higher than my current sword. Stats when, I thought the damage bar wasn't absolute. CuddleCryptid fucked around with this message at 02:21 on Nov 21, 2022 |
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Nov 21, 2022 02:17
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CuddleCryptid posted:God I can't imagine something worse than a sniper class for this game other than what already exists. Already have vets sitting way in the back and getting mobbed because they're trying to play sniper, an actual crosshairs sniper would be a nightmare. Good news there's probably a long las in game that's currently hidden because for some reason they hid all the level 25+ weapons for classes.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:24
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field balm posted:This passes me off and I think is a valid reason for them not including the green circle screen in this game I like the green circle screen not being included because I think it ultimately just encouraged lovely competitive behavior in a cooperative game.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:27
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field balm posted:I'm really hoping we get at least a couple different skill trees per class at some point. I was definitely hoping to play vet as more of an all rounder than a hang back and spam grenades type guy. Vets definitely an all rounder class I'd say, a defensive one compared to Zealots offensive. When a swarm comes in you switch to melee just like anybody else, but when you're facing shooter swarms unlike the zealot who charges in to tie them all in melee you can stand there and trade with them and come out on top, especially if any specials are mixed in to trigger your toughness regeneration. Otherwise the differences in close combat are pretty minor, you lose access to some good two hander melee weapons but otherwise get all the same stuff, and a unique one in the power sword thats as good as the eviscerator I'd say. Zealot regenerated toughness faster and has slightly faster attack speed and crit chance. Grenades too I use more like a close range defensive tool, underarm throwing them after a backdash into the face of a swarm to support holding chokepoints, and chucking them at any mobs of armored elites or specials for the crowd control. Instead of staying back and grenade spamming or sniping, you should be focused on taking down elites quickly and counter shooting shooters to keep their heads down while your teammates close the distance, its still a pretty active class.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:27
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Khizan posted:I like the green circle screen not being included because I think it ultimately just encouraged lovely competitive behavior in a cooperative game. What was the green circle screen?
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Nov 21, 2022 02:28
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explosivo posted:What was the green circle screen? the scoreboard in vermintide 2, if you got the highest number in a category (i.e. elites killed) you got a green circle around your number
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Nov 21, 2022 02:30
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Sharkopath posted:Vets definitely an all rounder class I'd say, a defensive one compared to Zealots offensive. When a swarm comes in you switch to melee just like anybody else, but when you're facing shooter swarms unlike the zealot who charges in to tie them all in melee you can stand there and trade with them and come out on top, especially if any specials are mixed in to trigger your toughness regeneration. Otherwise the differences in close combat are pretty minor, you lose access to some good two hander melee weapons but otherwise get all the same stuff, and a unique one in the power sword thats as good as the eviscerator I'd say. Zealot regenerated toughness faster and has slightly faster attack speed and crit chance. Grenades too I use more like a close range defensive tool, underarm throwing them after a backdash into the face of a swarm to support holding chokepoints. Yeah, it's irksome *as* a vet that people will sit back and waste ammo on regular dregs/poxwalkers and then run around spamming "Need ammo!" right before we go to a boss fight. Best to take out any elites and then join the fry; occassionally if you hear the pox bomber switch back to snipe him before it jacks up the entire team.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:31
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I feel like it was marketing genius to give out free copies of Vermintide 2 right before this game because it did end up getting me to pre-order, but man does Darktide feel worse than Vermintide 2 in every way I can think of. Horrendous framerate, constant crashing, boring characters, boring maps, bad-feeling weapons, obtuse and meaningless stats... it's basically my worst nightmare when it comes to L4D-alikes. I know folks keep saying cool weapons get unlocked later but after slogging through 10 hours with friends I haven't found a single one! I feel like if anyone is on the fence about the game, absolutely 100% wait until reviews come out and they patch the atrocious performance.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:31
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They've talked about adding in new subclasses but besides changing some skills around and adding some exclusive weapons here and there I'm not sure what that looks like, because the classes have pretty defined roles as is. Vermintide 2 got the 15 classes at launch because really there were 3 classes, and then sienna. Ranged, Melee, Tank, with a choice of one of four ults: knockdown, stealth, charge, instakill projectile. Sienna broke the mold a bit but its pretty easy to be reductive with the classes otherwise. If you picked any hero you could find a playstyle in their subclasses that fit you to the point its not quite but almost more of an aesthetic choice. That and the need to record ungodly amounts of dialog makes me wonder if they have smaller plans in mind.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:33
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Sharkopath posted:Vermintide 2 got the 15 classes at launch because really there were 3 classes, and then sienna. Ranged, Melee, Tank This is insanely reductive and not true at all imo. Even on release, saying that Handmaiden was the same class as Ironbreaker or Slayer was the same class as Shade is insane.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:44
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Sharkopath posted:Vets definitely an all rounder class I'd say, a defensive one compared to Zealots offensive. When a swarm comes in you switch to melee just like anybody else, but when you're facing shooter swarms unlike the zealot who charges in to tie them all in melee you can stand there and trade with them and come out on top, especially if any specials are mixed in to trigger your toughness regeneration. Otherwise the differences in close combat are pretty minor, you lose access to some good two hander melee weapons but otherwise get all the same stuff, and a unique one in the power sword thats as good as the eviscerator I'd say. Zealot regenerated toughness faster and has slightly faster attack speed and crit chance. Grenades too I use more like a close range defensive tool, underarm throwing them after a backdash into the face of a swarm to support holding chokepoints, and chucking them at any mobs of armored elites or specials for the crowd control. Yeah I was exaggerating, I played enough vt to know I should be hitting stuff with my axe 90% of the time. I guess I was expecting more variety in the talents, there's really no melee boosting talents in a game that is still mainly about cc. Off the top of my head it would have been cool to have a bonus to weapon switch speed or extra melee damage after shooting a special, or something like that. I realise I probably should have rolled zealot lol.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:44
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I really hope not being able to brain burst through railings is a bug that will be fixed because it's really annoying.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:46
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Kaddish posted:I really hope not being able to brain burst through railings is a bug that will be fixed because it's really annoying. It's janky LOS with railings in general. You can also see it with trying to mark enemies, or sometimes even just shooting or meleeing. It's not a simple bug to fix without making those things ignore all line of sight, it's geometry errors in the actual design of the level.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:48
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Yeah I'm noticing a trend where like, even grey versions of "technologically superior" weapons are just plain better than their more primitive counterparts. I mean like, the shovel you start with as Veteran is workable but a sword will beat it outright, which then gets beaten by a chainsword due to the special attack chewing through carapace armor, which is then beaten by a power sword since the special attack cleaves through both mobs and armored enemies much more quickly. Logically this makes sense but I'm now wondering about the balance, since I paid a pretty penny for this blue shovel with a good trait that just couldn't measure up to a grey power sword with a much lower power level. I suppose VT2 didn't have to worry about the Lore Implications but still...
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Nov 21, 2022 02:49
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Vargs posted:This is insanely reductive and not true at all imo. Even on release, saying that Handmaiden was the same class as Ironbreaker or Slayer was the same class as Shade is insane. A few outliers, but can you expound upon the same differences when its say, Huntsman Kruber and Ranger Bardin.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:50
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Lol sniper specials are actually pretty dangerous when they spawn somewhere far away but with open los where you can't easily get at then
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Nov 21, 2022 02:51
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toasterwarrior posted:Yeah I'm noticing a trend where like, even grey versions of "technologically superior" weapons are just plain better than their more primitive counterparts. I mean like, the shovel you start with as Veteran is workable but a sword will beat it outright, which then gets beaten by a chainsword due to the special attack chewing through carapace armor, which is then beaten by a power sword since the special attack cleaves through both mobs and armored enemies much more quickly. Yeah it's in a wierd place where because of the setting of course a power sword does better than the one handed chainsword, like the chainsword still has a niche but in most combat scenarios youd rather have the power sword. I think chainsword versus say some of the faster hitting axes is where its a bit less clear, they have way better horde clearing potential than the chainsword does. I will say for some things that are still real fun the tradeoffs get real massive, like the bolter. The bolter is powerful and accurate in single shot, but slow, unwieldy with follow up shots, and has so little ammo that any missed shot hurts tremendously and your ability as say vet to suppress shooters is greatly reduced. I think theres still a strong case to be made for more utilitarian lasguns against it, and for braced autoguns if what you want is high damage midrange power. With a boltgun you can kill any elite you want in 1 or 2 shots pretty much, from almost any range, and disrupt swarms with massive knockdown and splash explosions, but you lose out on the ability to quickly snap from target to target in large areas I feel like if they're single shooters holed up in different places. Sharkopath fucked around with this message at 02:57 on Nov 21, 2022 |
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Nov 21, 2022 02:54
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Fishstick posted:What is it with pubbies and barrels Blow it up now so you don't have to worry about it later. IE mutant springs up and tosses you into it.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:57
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I assume the weapon progression is meant to be a bit of storytelling where as you become more trusted your options open up and your power increases. It’s just that then the progression is either too slow gameplay wise because the game feels kind of miserable at low power or too fast to support that narrative beat of becoming a trusted warband member. There’s a lot of decisions in the game that the more I play the more it feels like this game is both rushed and way way behind where they wanted to be and I suspect a major reworking at some point in its development.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:58
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A true veteran will select a highly efficient and effective infantry lasgun and worry little about fighting in close quarters often.
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Nov 21, 2022 02:59
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Orv posted:There’s a lot of decisions in the game that the more I play the more it feels like this game is both rushed and way way behind where they wanted to be and I suspect a major reworking at some point in its development. you can say all three of these things about literally every large-studio video game in the last 20 years, though
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Nov 21, 2022 03:00
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Cease to Hope posted:you can say all three of these things about literally every large-studio video game in the last 20 years, though No? Not every game is a massive development disaster by any means. Like yeah probably most of them would love to do more with the time they have but if that were true we’d have years and years of Cyberpunk 2077 and Anthem level mishaps. Orv fucked around with this message at 03:05 on Nov 21, 2022 |
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Nov 21, 2022 03:03
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I will say re snipers the Lucius and headhunter are close enough to the role and coincidentally are probably the weakest weapons in their category.
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Nov 21, 2022 03:13
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Orv posted:I assume the weapon progression is meant to be a bit of storytelling where as you become more trusted your options open up and your power increases. It’s just that then the progression is either too slow gameplay wise because the game feels kind of miserable at low power or too fast to support that narrative beat of becoming a trusted warband member. This has nothing to do with "low power", some weapons just do absolute dumpster-tier garbage. For example, any cleaving melee weapon is absolute trash compared to single-target melee weapons, even at killing hordes - the only benefit they give you against hordes is letting you stand still while swinging instead of strafing/dodging in circles, their damage is so much worse than single-target weapons that at higher difficulties they take longer to kill a horde. (this might not apply to the big two-handers, I haven't got any of those yet) I think that as you grow in power the stats on those weapons start to compensate for that and make them passable, but you can use the powerful weapons right away. I jumped into difficulty 3 at level 4 and did just fine - a single-target melee weapon (literally a dagger at the time) one-shots horde zombies and 1-2 shots guardsmen and other non-zombie mooks. A Braced Autogun I bought at level 4 has been capable of chumping all but the tankiest specials in about half a mag on Difficulty 3 and obliterates hordes, but level 17 purple Infantry Autoguns struggle to down anything. Right now I'm using a gray low-power Chainsword just because it's a chainsword and it easily one-shots things. So far my experience (as Zealot) is ignore ranged weapons that demand precision (this includes pretty much any gun with ADS which all do complete trash for damage, or non-explosive guns with small mags like revolvers or pistols because they do not have enough throughput to be useful) and ignore melee weapons that cleave (their damage is pathetically fractional of non-cleaving weapons) and you'll be fine. E: Also some guns with low damage (like the Shotgun) can still be useful because they have very high Stopping Power and can stumble even big tanky things while your team deals with them, but at least playing in public matches I don't want any weapon that relies on my teammates being good. deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Nov 21, 2022 |
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Nov 21, 2022 03:19
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deep dish peat moss posted:This has nothing to do with "low power", some weapons just do absolute dumpster-tier garbage. For example, any cleaving melee weapon is absolute trash compared to single-target melee weapons, even at killing hordes - the only benefit they give you against hordes is letting you stand still while swinging instead of strafing/dodging in circles, their damage is so much worse than single-target weapons that at higher difficulties they take longer to kill a horde. Don’t entirely agree with this, two of the best melee weapons in the game right now are great cleave weapons; the zealot 2h chainsword whose name suddenly escapes me and power sword. I do agree that some weapons are just monumentally bad for no particular reason. Catachan swords are great if you heavy attack necks like VT but the moment a scab stumbles or moves out of line at all suddenly it’s five or six hits to kill them with one.
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Nov 21, 2022 03:32
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Yeah the power sword just has really good fast cleaving light attacks that have high damage and then also an charged mode with a near 180 degree arc that can piece armor and one shots flak enemies by cutting them in half, it rules.
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Nov 21, 2022 03:35
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Orv posted:Don’t entirely agree with this, two of the best melee weapons in the game right now are great cleave weapons; the zealot 2h chainsword whose name suddenly escapes me and power sword. I do agree that some weapons are just monumentally bad for no particular reason. Catachan swords are great if you heavy attack necks like VT but the moment a scab stumbles or moves out of line at all suddenly it’s five or six hits to kill them with one. I haven't got to try the 2h chainsword yet, but the 1h chainsword's special attack literally pops shields from Sanctum Redactum bosses in 2-3 hits and it owns. Also worth noting is that you do not need to wait for the 'revving up' animation at all, just tap MB5 or whatever does the special attack then press LMB right after. e: I guess a lot of it may be down to playstyle - I almost never use heavy attacks, preferring weapons that one-shot things with light attacks. Because if you are spamming light attacks and dodging you literally cannot be hit in melee unless you gently caress up your positioning, and then you don't have to worry about timing swings. So my idea of "bad damage on a melee weapon" is anything that isn't capable of killing non-Specials in a single light attack. deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 04:00 on Nov 21, 2022 |
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Nov 21, 2022 03:54
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deep dish peat moss posted:So far my experience (as Zealot) is ignore ranged weapons that demand precision (this includes pretty much any gun with ADS which all do complete trash for damage, or non-explosive guns with small mags like revolvers or pistols because they do not have enough throughput to be useful) and ignore melee weapons that cleave (their damage is pathetically fractional of non-cleaving weapons) and you'll be fine.
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Nov 21, 2022 03:59
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deep dish peat moss posted:I haven't got to try the 2h chainsword yet, but the 1h chainsword's special attack literally pops shields from Sanctum Redactum bosses in 2-3 hits and it owns. I prefer the same but yeah the list of weapons that fit that criteria is pretty small. Which I guess is probably an attempt at balance but mostly just feels bad.
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Nov 21, 2022 04:00
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Exodee posted:Eh, once you level up on the Zealot you'll already have good melee weapons/feats to deal with pretty much any mob at close range, so your main weakness is going to be stuff at range which an accurate gun can cover for. I quite like the eviscerator / bolter combo myself, though I think the shotgun or headhunter might be objectively better picks since you can pull them out faster in clutch situations. The Braced Autogun is nearly pinpoint-accurate at long range as long as you fire one shot at a time and it has far less recoil than the other autoguns while also doing like 3x as much damage per shot and having a larger magazine and higher max ammo capacity. Just fire in bursts and it's a better precision weapon than the actual precision weapons. Bonus: It doesn't obscure half your vertical FoV with iron sights while you aim. deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 04:03 on Nov 21, 2022 |
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Nov 21, 2022 04:01
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I think it's why the power sword is so good: light swings will let you dance with mobs, but powering up for a heavy is a guaranteed sweep clear on even flak-armored mobs. Well worth the fuss of activating special and charging up a heavy. The chainsword getting stuck on a revved heavy kinda fucks with it, it should instead be sweeping through chaff zombies too.
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Nov 21, 2022 04:03
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Orv posted:I prefer the same but yeah the list of weapons that fit that criteria is pretty small. Which I guess is probably an attempt at balance but mostly just feels bad. I don't feel like it is. As a Zealot, my options for one-shot single-target light attack melee weapons right now at level 17 (this is just stuff I have in my inventory) includes the dagger, two axes, and the chainsword. The only melee weapons I have that don't fit those criteria are Devils Claw swords and Heavy Swords. Gun-wise though yeah, the Braced Autogun is the only ranged weapon I've tried that feels even remotely passable. Holding out hope for the bolter though
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Nov 21, 2022 04:05
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deep dish peat moss posted:The Braced Autogun is nearly pinpoint-accurate at long range as long as you fire one shot at a time and it has far less recoil than the other autoguns while also doing like 3x as much damage per shot and having a larger magazine and higher max ammo capacity. Just fire in bursts and it's a better precision weapon than the actual precision weapons. Bonus: It doesn't obscure half your vertical FoV with iron sights while you aim. edit: and this is on the Veteran with his ultimate active too, though I forgot if that boosted accuracy or not. Something like the headhunter or even the shotgun will kill that skab gunner much much faster at range. Exodee fucked around with this message at 04:08 on Nov 21, 2022 |
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Nov 21, 2022 04:06
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So this does actually run on the steam deck although I had to use the track pad as a mouse due to some weird issues in the options menu. It runs pretty poorly though, 25-35 fps on low settings although I guess it depends on the person as to whether that's bearable. The controller settings feel fine at least, the prompts change appropriately.
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Nov 21, 2022 04:06
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Exodee posted:It's really not that accurate; try hitting the skab gunner or mauler from the other side of the Psychkanium room and like 90% of your shots will miss. Yeah i mentioned it earlier but genuinely if you're veteran or psyker try the accatran, its incredible how fast the firerate is and how pinpoint accurate it remains the entire time. It doesn't do quite the full dps of the braced autogun at close range but its nsuper consistent in doing taht damage at every range. The second variant that has even faster firerate is hardly less accurate for it and just sounds like a buzzsaw, it rules.
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Nov 21, 2022 04:09
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Tagichatn posted:So this does actually run on the steam deck although I had to use the track pad as a mouse due to some weird issues in the options menu. It runs pretty poorly though, 25-35 fps on low settings although I guess it depends on the person as to whether that's bearable. The controller settings feel fine at least, the prompts change appropriately. this explains a lot of my teammates tbqh
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Nov 21, 2022 04:10
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deep dish peat moss posted:I don't feel like it is. As a Zealot, my options for one-shot single-target light attack melee weapons right now at level 17 (this is just stuff I have in my inventory) includes the dagger, two axes, and the chainsword. The only melee weapons I have that don't fit those criteria are Devils Claw swords and Heavy Swords. I feel like we might be operating on different definitions of single-target here? The chain sword and dagger light attacks definitely aren’t in my book. Not to be pedantic about it, just thinking it through.
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Nov 21, 2022 04:10
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Something I noticed while doing some testing with it is that despite not being as explodey as the bolter lasgun wounds are pretty gnarly up close. A headshot will crack open the skull and expose brain, torso and gut shots will leave ribs and organs exposed etc, its pretty gnarly. Perhaps grim, maybe dark. You just don't usually notice because of the pace of the game.
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Nov 21, 2022 04:11
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