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Nobody Interesting
Mar 29, 2013

One way, dead end... Street signs are such fitting metaphors for the human condition.


It doesn't fix every problem, and certainly introduces more of its own, but there is a mod that just replaces all the CK3 music with CK2, going so far as to just straight up pirate the DLCs (including the vocal Pagan Fury stuff) and put it in there.

It's easy enough to remove DLC music you don't like by modifying the mod's main config file. I strip out House Lords because who the gently caress wants dubsteb in CK.

On the other hand, I'm hearing Pagan Fury everywhere I go. Everywhere.

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Theotus
Nov 8, 2014

Do you guys have any particular favorite count starts? Start date doesn't matter that much to me, I just like the whole palace intrigue aspect of this game so starting small is my preference.

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

The count of Anjou in either start is good, so is Freidrich Barbarossa's dad or grandad in 1066 Swabia.

Communist Thoughts posted:


i think the focus has shifted from primarily a simulation or representation, secondarily a game to the other way around. theres now primarily a focus on making game systems which means you get a game that is immediately easier to play. And... if im being mean, i sort of think from Stellaris onwards paradox isn't amazing at making these game systems either, they're often half baked. though game design is hard as gently caress and making playable games is a huge achievement itself

Yea this is my big issue with the direction Paradox has been taking with the historical GSGs. I don't know if that's just me getting older as a game player or being better read in history, but it bothers me that CK3 mostly doesn't even attempt to represent different states functioning in very different ways, in favor of making everything a Norman feudal hierarchy with some modifiers slapped on top.

I see the appeal from a gameplay perspective but man it's not the game I want to play.

And the addition of poo poo like crazy op Viking Varangian Veterans running around in 867 doesn't help. Varangians that even the loving Romans don't get access to a stack of lol.

Tippis
Mar 21, 2008

It's yet another day in the wasteland.

Theotus posted:

Do you guys have any particular favorite count starts? Start date doesn't matter that much to me, I just like the whole palace intrigue aspect of this game so starting small is my preference.

Don't remember which one, but one of the Corsican counts in the 9th century. There's a wide selection of nearby duchies or even kingdoms to either try to stick with or sear fealty to… and also at the very start be wary of since they're your relatives and have an interest in getting rid of you so you must manoeuvre around them. Also, there's the bigger issue that you have to secure yourself against: you are a canibal and anyone out to get you is bound to find out.

Good luck. :devil:

Anno
May 10, 2017

I'm going to drown! For no reason at all!

I only played like 10 hours of CK2 - to what degree was it actually more of a simulation? The only thing I can recall offhand from my limited time was your had a % chance every however often to fabricate a claim rather than "your dude will do it in X days". And Victoria 3 seems like at least as much of a simulation as V2?

I agree that both games lack friction and are maybe too exploitable, but that's arguably more of a balance thing or unintentional design rather than being purposefully driven that way.

Stellaris, sure, that was meant to be more of a board-game style game. Although that's pulled more towards a simulation over the years than when it launched.

Anno fucked around with this message at 03:13 on Nov 30, 2022

Theotus
Nov 8, 2014

How about in Iberia? I haven't checked the whole struggle thing out yet.

Buschmaki
Dec 26, 2012

‿︵‿︵‿︵‿Lean Addict︵‿︵‿︵‿
The Count of Vermandois in 1066 is the last remaining Karling. You can easily get some "Be the only landed Karling" achievement from him as well as there being a unique Karling only decision if youre emperor of Francia

FreudianSlippers
Apr 12, 2010

Shooting and Fucking
are the same thing!

Theotus posted:

How about in Iberia? I haven't checked the whole struggle thing out yet.

Which Iberia?

Hellioning
Jun 27, 2008

On one hand CK3 does have a lot less flavor for individual government types, but basically every government in CK2 either played mostly like feudal or had massive problems and needed reworking.

Honestly as long as they come up with a government for the Byzantines that makes them more unstable I'll be fine with CK3's offerings.

binge crotching
Apr 2, 2010

Theotus posted:

Do you guys have any particular favorite count starts? Start date doesn't matter that much to me, I just like the whole palace intrigue aspect of this game so starting small is my preference.

Countess Hedwig of Göttingen in 1066. She has a wealthy province, but she's in her 30s with no kids, and has two brothers with claims on her. One of them is a fellow vassal, the other is her liege, who is also a mega duke that owns 1/3rd of Germany.

If you can survive the first decade you're in a great position to break free and become a duchess yourself, but you can also just stay small and compact with your rich land.

Buschmaki
Dec 26, 2012

‿︵‿︵‿︵‿Lean Addict︵‿︵‿︵‿
Been thinking about the war system in CK3 and how to incentivize troop diversity. Maybe if there was some sort of modifier for having units that dont cover some stats? Like remove any screen ability from heavy infantry and make light inf and archers do more damage or divide the toughness of opponents they face without any screen to represent such a force not being able to skirmish effectively or something. That way you'd have to bring a bunch of units with different strengths to not lose because your army is too lopsided or something.

DJ_Mindboggler
Nov 21, 2013

Buschmaki posted:

Been thinking about the war system in CK3 and how to incentivize troop diversity. Maybe if there was some sort of modifier for having units that dont cover some stats? Like remove any screen ability from heavy infantry and make light inf and archers do more damage or divide the toughness of opponents they face without any screen to represent such a force not being able to skirmish effectively or something. That way you'd have to bring a bunch of units with different strengths to not lose because your army is too lopsided or something.

I think synergistic bonuses from combined arms is the way to go here, infantry taking disproportionate damage if the other side fields archers and you don't, etc. Armies should also retreat if they're being massacred by heavy infantry, and without some cavalry you can't capitalize on the rout. 95% casualties in the melee phase should be reserved for battles with huge force disparities, not a common occurrence.

megane
Jun 20, 2008



Reworking how counters function would help a lot. Particularly the way the AI uses them (or rather, doesn't use them). Units only counter twice their number, being countered doesn't matter a whole lot, and the AI always and only builds homogenous mixes of units so there's no advantage (or disadvantage) to be had from what counters what. If you could reliably expect, say, the French to build tons of heavy cav, you could build pikes to counter them, but they build mixed junk like everyone. Conversely, if the AI noticed that you as the player are building tons of heavy cav and invested in pikes to beat you, it might matter, but they don't (as far as I can tell). And since realm-wide buffs exist, there's little reason not to just stack one unit type.

Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021

Theotus posted:

Do you guys have any particular favorite count starts? Start date doesn't matter that much to me, I just like the whole palace intrigue aspect of this game so starting small is my preference.

that funny viking dude in france who you can regularly do indo-norse stuff with.

scaterry
Sep 12, 2012
New patch dropped. Patch notes here: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/ck3-robe-1-8-0-release-changelog.1560180/

Notably, a small "frick you" to speedrunners/achievement hunters (you can no longer custom design other rulers)

FreudianSlippers
Apr 12, 2010

Shooting and Fucking
are the same thing!

scaterry posted:



Notably, a small "frick you" to speedrunners/achievement hunters (you can no longer custom design other rulers)

Populating the world with random freaks was fun while it lasted

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

Theotus posted:

How about in Iberia? I haven't checked the whole struggle thing out yet.

It's alright, it lets you do stuff you should be able to do all the time like make friends with people, interfaith marriages are good too.

But the conflict CB lets you conquer all of Iberia in like 20 years if you want to, it does a terrible job of modelling the decline of the Caliphates there, no North African interventions, the Christian kingdoms can't run their protection racquets (sometimes people buy truces, but you can't actively seek tribute which was like, the whole thing), and the conditions to end the struggle are real silly.

Bit of a mixed bag, it's got a real Civilization-esque "here is a board game with history as the window dressing" feel.

Nobody Interesting
Mar 29, 2013

One way, dead end... Street signs are such fitting metaphors for the human condition.


As a loving Nerd I am unreasonably excited to try out the Vulkan renderer.

Elias_Maluco
Aug 23, 2007
I need to sleep

Nobody Interesting posted:

As a loving Nerd I am unreasonably excited to try out the Vulkan renderer.

I figure it will make the game run better in linux but to be true it already runs pretty smooth here

Trevor Hale
Dec 8, 2008

What have I become, my Swedish friend?

Elias_Maluco posted:

I figure it will make the game run better in linux but to be true it already runs pretty smooth here

Seems to be running smoother on my M1 MacBook Air

winterwerefox
Apr 23, 2010

The next movie better not make me shave anything :(

Got this recently. Been doing a 867 start as a custom count in Norway, count of Varnhold/Vikin. Been able to claw my way to empire pretty regularly in one lifetime, Men at Arms are frikkin powerful once you get a pile of holdings build up. Conquer up to my holding cap, raid to build up cash, get the Jarldom. Raid more to build up holdings, watch the Kingdom of Sweden or Denmark to see if they get weak, Subjugate one when they do. Work up to getting the Holy sites, reform Asatru. Holy war Wessex. hope the other vikings in England like me enough to vassalize, like Haestian of Nantes did after i helped him take out Mercia for himself. Form England. Denmark is still warring jarls, but its some kids in charge of like Skane and Sjaeland, so they agree to vassalize after some cash stolen from the Muslims in Iberia. Conquer and kick out all the Christians in Frisia and give it to the Fylkir. Get Typhoid. Beat Typhoid. Get Cancer. linger with cancer for 30 years, form the Empire of the Northsea. Form Norman Culture on a whim. Learned 12 languages.

Spent the 30 years with cancer learning other realms dirty laundry and telling everyone as soon as i found a secret.

winterwerefox fucked around with this message at 12:21 on Dec 3, 2022

SlothBear
Jan 25, 2009

Last Dev Diary of the year is out.

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/developer-diary/dev-diary-112-year-in-review.1561106/

Not much but there is a nickname system coming, so that's cool.

Bird in a Blender
Nov 17, 2005

It's amazing what they can do with computers these days.

I did a Duchess Matilda start in Tuscany. I worked my way up to emperor of the HRE. I’d love to destroy the election law, but I have to build up enough prestige to do that. Question though, if my heir doesn’t win the HRE election, I just drop down to vassal and keep my other titles correct?

I keep getting a warning that my heir isn’t of my dynasty until I successfully manipulate enough people to vote for my son. Just worried I’m going to croak before I can make that happen and don’t want this game to end on me just because of the election law. Running the HRE is definitely a pain in the rear end.

FreudianSlippers
Apr 12, 2010

Shooting and Fucking
are the same thing!

SlothBear posted:

Last Dev Diary of the year is out.

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/developer-diary/dev-diary-112-year-in-review.1561106/

Not much but there is a nickname system coming, so that's cool.

God bless the minimum of 30 vacation days per year (plus all religious holidays) Swedes get.

Buschmaki
Dec 26, 2012

‿︵‿︵‿︵‿Lean Addict︵‿︵‿︵‿

Bird in a Blender posted:

I did a Duchess Matilda start in Tuscany. I worked my way up to emperor of the HRE. I’d love to destroy the election law, but I have to build up enough prestige to do that. Question though, if my heir doesn’t win the HRE election, I just drop down to vassal and keep my other titles correct?

I keep getting a warning that my heir isn’t of my dynasty until I successfully manipulate enough people to vote for my son. Just worried I’m going to croak before I can make that happen and don’t want this game to end on me just because of the election law. Running the HRE is definitely a pain in the rear end.

Yeah you keep all your other titles that you personally hold, including kingdoms I'm p. sure so you can go hogwild and create a bunch and inherit them all and be a super vassal if you want

The Cheshire Cat
Jun 10, 2008

Fun Shoe

SlothBear posted:

Last Dev Diary of the year is out.

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/developer-diary/dev-diary-112-year-in-review.1561106/

Not much but there is a nickname system coming, so that's cool.

One thing I am hoping is that nicknames don't get too common because of this. It was always a bit weird in CK2 how rare it was to see regnal numbers even if you named every kid after their parent, because you were so likely to pick up a nickname that every single generation was like "the great" or "the just" or just one of the many lifestyle nicknames.

Bird in a Blender
Nov 17, 2005

It's amazing what they can do with computers these days.

Buschmaki posted:

Yeah you keep all your other titles that you personally hold, including kingdoms I'm p. sure so you can go hogwild and create a bunch and inherit them all and be a super vassal if you want

That’s what I figured so thanks for confirming. I have added a few kingdom titles, but I should add some more.

Trevor Hale
Dec 8, 2008

What have I become, my Swedish friend?

Playing an Elevate Mann run with a customer count, so I have no extended family. I have 3 daughters and they are all *jacked* with stats, so I am pretty happy about where I am.

And then the serial killer tree kicks off. I lose one daughter, and then my heir's only child, and then my wife. And then I get the "all gone, bye now" letter.

Angry enough that I enter debug mode to figure out what happened, and there were loving *two* killers. And that's just rude! A genius courtier of a different culture offed my daughter and grand-daughter, and then my youngest daughter killed her mom. What a terrible little island I am on.

Midnight Voyager
Jul 2, 2008

Lipstick Apathy

Trevor Hale posted:

Playing an Elevate Mann run with a customer count, so I have no extended family. I have 3 daughters and they are all *jacked* with stats, so I am pretty happy about where I am.

And then the serial killer tree kicks off. I lose one daughter, and then my heir's only child, and then my wife. And then I get the "all gone, bye now" letter.

Angry enough that I enter debug mode to figure out what happened, and there were loving *two* killers. And that's just rude! A genius courtier of a different culture offed my daughter and grand-daughter, and then my youngest daughter killed her mom. What a terrible little island I am on.

Welcome to murder island!

Freudian
Mar 23, 2011

Mann's inhumanity to man.

winterwerefox
Apr 23, 2010

The next movie better not make me shave anything :(

My spymaster found out my oldest daughter is boning my 3rd oldest son, and they got kids together. i tell my spymaster I want this kept on the down low.

Someone else found out told everyone and I had to disown them both, otherwise their rule was going to be a nightmare of disgusted vassals.

The Cheshire Cat
Jun 10, 2008

Fun Shoe
"My kids are too horny" is one of the most common issues in CK. I feel like ultimogeniture is the best inheritance law because it makes you more likely to inherent as someone really young, possibly even a child, before they've had time to turn into too much of a fuckup (especially since CK3 doesn't have the downsides of being a child king like CK2 regencies).

Servetus
Apr 1, 2010

The Cheshire Cat posted:

"My kids are too horny" is one of the most common issues in CK. I feel like ultimogeniture is the best inheritance law because it makes you more likely to inherent as someone really young, possibly even a child, before they've had time to turn into too much of a fuckup (especially since CK3 doesn't have the downsides of being a child king like CK2 regencies).

I think Ultimogeniture was one of the better options in CKII as well, but in CKIII there is no comparison. Making sure your ruler hasn't ruined their own life is just too much of an advantage, and the lifestyle focus system just makes it incredible.

The annoying thing is that Ultimogenitive partition/Borough English Succession, where the youngest inherits the family seat while other property is divided between siblings, isn't a ting in the game. Even though there are multiple cultures in the game who practiced it. Including some of the Anglo-Saxons and the Mongols.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultimogeniture

Vichan
Oct 1, 2014

I'LL PUNISH YOU ACCORDING TO YOUR CRIME

The Cheshire Cat posted:

"My kids are too horny" is one of the most common issues in CK. I feel like ultimogeniture is the best inheritance law because it makes you more likely to inherent as someone really young, possibly even a child, before they've had time to turn into too much of a fuckup (especially since CK3 doesn't have the downsides of being a child king like CK2 regencies).

binge crotching
Apr 2, 2010

Servetus posted:

I think Ultimogeniture was one of the better options in CKII as well, but in CKIII there is no comparison. Making sure your ruler hasn't ruined their own life is just too much of an advantage, and the lifestyle focus system just makes it incredible.

The annoying thing is that Ultimogenitive partition/Borough English Succession, where the youngest inherits the family seat while other property is divided between siblings, isn't a ting in the game. Even though there are multiple cultures in the game who practiced it. Including some of the Anglo-Saxons and the Mongols.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultimogeniture

Ultimogeniture is probably the best single heir type, and a tribal era partition with it would be crazy good.

Samadhi
May 13, 2001

Just started a new game as a Norse Jarl in Sjaelland. Where should I varangian adventure my capital to in order to bring the good word to its peope?

PizzaProwler
Nov 4, 2009

Or you can see me at The Riviera. Tuesday nights.
Pillowfights with Dominican mothers.
Personally, I'm a big fan of Galicia, Gascogne, or Bohemia. Sardinia's a popular choice I've had fun with as well.

Though in my experience with Varangian Adventures I often find it most fun to start up a Norse game with no particular target in mind. Then once I become strong, I scan the map looking for weakness and make my decision based on that. If you can catch an otherwise strong power (like France or Andalusia) on the back foot you can insert yourself into their capital and gradually take over from there (after they're permanently crippled from losing their best holdings).

Trevor Hale
Dec 8, 2008

What have I become, my Swedish friend?

PizzaProwler posted:

Personally, I'm a big fan of Galicia, Gascogne, or Bohemia. Sardinia's a popular choice I've had fun with as well.

Though in my experience with Varangian Adventures I often find it most fun to start up a Norse game with no particular target in mind. Then once I become strong, I scan the map looking for weakness and make my decision based on that. If you can catch an otherwise strong power (like France or Andalusia) on the back foot you can insert yourself into their capital and gradually take over from there (after they're permanently crippled from losing their best holdings).

Also very fun to raid as to gauge strength. Sometimes it’s just fun to collapse a kingdom because you’ve stackwiped them in a raid and their weakness brings all the vultures in to feast.

binge crotching
Apr 2, 2010

As mentioned, Galicia is great if you want to convert to Mozarabic. There are 3 unique buildings there, two of which already exist, and the third one costs 1000 gold, 400 of which you get automatically for doing an adventure against a feudal king, and the rest you'll either have already from raiding, or gain quickly by raiding Iberia before you convert to Mozarab. If I'm adventuring down into Iberia, I'll usually hybridize with Aragonese for Visigothic Codes, because Equal inheritance is the best, and early access to High Partition is so much better than Confederate Partition.

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Buschmaki
Dec 26, 2012

‿︵‿︵‿︵‿Lean Addict︵‿︵‿︵‿
Yeah but if you're starting as Norse you also get Scandinavian succession, which imo is one of the most tun succession types

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