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fawning deference posted:Appreciate all the quick responses. No. It's going to be a relentless grind forever.
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Nov 30, 2022 16:48
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fawning deference posted:Appreciate all the quick responses. Quoting the entire post for the new page. I'm not trying to be a smartass here, but I fear he might not really comprehend what he's getting into. As for your actual question, sales is special. The usual rules don't apply. You either sell or you don't and that's all your boss cares about. If he has sales experience he'll probably get an interview, and an interview is a sales pitch.
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Nov 30, 2022 16:50
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This is the kind of stuff I appreciate the most. Thank you for being straight-forward about it. I'm wondering if there is another avenue he could take besides sales.
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Nov 30, 2022 17:01
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fawning deference posted:Appreciate all the quick responses. Everyone going in to the job is bright eyed, bushy tailed, fairly sharp, and convinced that they can move up in a reasonable amount of time and get themselves in to a better position. It's the avenue in to a business that many very smart people are convinced they want to work in. He will be competing directly with these people. I have a buddy working in MLB who started off unpaid wearing a Dasani water bottle mascot costume for a team. He then went in to the STH sales department. He has a pretty prestigious job now, but he was also willing to grind, he had a degree from a well-regarded school, and he had been a SABR panelist with published analytics work. That's the kind of guy your bro is going to have to outcompete.
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Nov 30, 2022 17:11
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fawning deference posted:This is the kind of stuff I appreciate the most. Thank you for being straight-forward about it. I'm wondering if there is another avenue he could take besides sales. Sales isn't the problem, sports is the problem. It's an extremely high pressure, low pay industry that squeezes its employees like a vise because people are lined up out the door desperate to get A Job In Sports. The other thing that comes into play with big-time sports, if he's dreaming of advancing into management, is that it's extremely insular. It is far more of a club than a business. You aren't advancing anywhere in that world without very strong connections that will take a very long time and licking boots until your tongue is sandpaper to create. Eric the Mauve fucked around with this message at 17:19 on Nov 30, 2022 |
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Nov 30, 2022 17:16
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Isn't there a goon-run resume/cover letter service that is well-received?
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Nov 30, 2022 18:07
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You’d probably be treated a lot better and have a better experience working a real sales job and buying season tickets than you would trying to work your way up through sales. Just a thought. I know I post this a lot around here but sales is a hard job with a specific and uncommon skill set. Everyone thinks they can do it but the people that are good at it can make bank. And they’re better off working a real b2b job. Dik Hz fucked around with this message at 20:17 on Nov 30, 2022 |
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Nov 30, 2022 20:14
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I started a new job 2 and a half weeks ago and I hate it enough that I want to leave asap. Should I bother listing this job on my resume while I search?
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Dec 1, 2022 03:37
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Neo_Crimson posted:I started a new job 2 and a half weeks ago and I hate it enough that I want to leave asap. Should I bother listing this job on my resume while I search? Probably not, no
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Dec 1, 2022 04:13
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How do recruiters tend to look at people who leave a job before finding a new one? How can you put a non-negative spin on it? E: Particularly if its a job they've been at a long time.
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Dec 1, 2022 18:16
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escapegoat posted:How do recruiters tend to look at people who leave a job before finding a new one? How can you put a non-negative spin on it? Like everything else, it requires a story. I don't think I necessarily look at that negatively but I'll ask about it. I think unless you get in front of it, it looks like you got fired on a resume.
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Dec 1, 2022 18:20
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It’s a negative unless there’s a story. Most commonly that story involves relationships and life outside of work. - My partner and I went on a tour of America - I was a stay at home parent/caretaker - I had a lifelong dream of doing ____ and I accomplished it …that sort of thing
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Dec 1, 2022 20:33
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Eric the Mauve posted:No. It's going to be a relentless grind forever. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yz246_Pjjkc
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Dec 2, 2022 00:10
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Lockback posted:Like everything else, it requires a story. I don't think I necessarily look at that negatively but I'll ask about it. I think unless you get in front of it, it looks like you got fired on a resume. 'My boss looked me in the eyes and told me that automating the tedious parts of my computer toucher job is a bad idea because "we're not a programming company" so I threw my hands up and bailed.'
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Dec 2, 2022 13:15
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Car Hater posted:'My boss looked me in the eyes and told me that automating the tedious parts of my computer toucher job is a bad idea because "we're not a programming company" so I threw my hands up and bailed.' *clicks delete on a CI/CD Azure Devops pipeline* It's a real shame, but we need to do the tedious parts ourselves. Can't turn it over to the computers, dey tekken ar jerbs.
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Dec 2, 2022 13:25
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Just frantically touching two wires together and tearing them apart over and over to generate bits.
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Dec 2, 2022 14:50
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When I see specific numbers for things in resumes, how often are those being made up/guesstimated? I ask because even in managerial positions, many people don't have access to the inside numbers of a company, and many companies are run by incompetent lunatics who don't even care to look at them, let alone share them regularly with employees. What's the rate of "these numbers are based in absolute fact" to "yeah kinda making them up"?
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Dec 3, 2022 20:33
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fawning deference posted:When I see specific numbers for things in resumes, how often are those being made up/guesstimated? I ask because even in managerial positions, many people don't have access to the inside numbers of a company, and many companies are run by incompetent lunatics who don't even care to look at them, let alone share them regularly with employees. What's the rate of "these numbers are based in absolute fact" to "yeah kinda making them up"?
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Dec 3, 2022 21:14
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I appreciate all of the responses here. I am trying to help with his resume but we are both a bit low on time right now and I think I want to get him a resume / cover letter service as a holiday gift to get him going. What are generally recommended services here? I thought I recalled an SA-run service with good results, but I'm not sure if that is still going. I am also leaning towards a service because it's a tricky thing to tailor a background like his into an account manager / sales position. EDIT: I'm looking at some of the services and the example resumes they have look super wordy. Crammed with information. Not sure I have seen a resume service where the after compared to the before is obviously better... fawning deference fucked around with this message at 22:03 on Dec 4, 2022 |
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Dec 4, 2022 18:58
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you're looking for danny's thread
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Dec 4, 2022 22:41
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2nding. Danny is great. He’s not really fire-and-forget so your friend will have to do some work communicating back and forth with him to get his final product.
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Dec 5, 2022 02:02
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help me, please. i need a gig that pays better than the lovely ones i'm working now.
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Dec 5, 2022 21:53
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I think the retail paragraphs are too long. I like a lot of texting stories on a résumé but at a glance, too long. What are you looking to do?
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Dec 5, 2022 21:58
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w4ddl3d33 posted:help me, please. i need a gig that pays better than the lovely ones i'm working now. Well, first off reverse the ordering of your experience. Where do you live?
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Dec 5, 2022 21:59
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Lockback posted:Well, first off reverse the ordering of your experience. london - my address is censored but it's on there
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Dec 5, 2022 22:17
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w4ddl3d33 posted:help me, please. i need a gig that pays better than the lovely ones i'm working now. I am not a hiring manager, just a guy who has read a fair number of resumes and helped some coworkers write them. Listen to other goons before me. I say something like this every time, but: Add bullets to your action words, and use a common tense between them. You have "Worked" and "Working" in the same document, which just doesn't scan very well. Action words are punchy, and help things stand out. Make them single sentences (not paragraphs) starting with the verb. If you can, don't repeat a word, but that's okay if you can't think of the right action word. The OP says to focus on accomplishments instead of duties where possible, but it's okay if you can't think of anything concrete. I don't think you should use "I" on a resume. It's essentially implied. So something like this:
Also, I don't know what the GCSES is. I'm a yank and it's some sort of UK thing? Is this some sort of Primary Education thing? I don't think anyone cares about anything except secondary education, but a UK goon can probably answer that better.
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Dec 5, 2022 22:52
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for the ability to post here
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w4ddl3d33 posted:help me, please. i need a gig that pays better than the lovely ones i'm working now.
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Dec 5, 2022 23:00
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I have had two jobs for a few years now, and on paper it looks like I'm "overemployed", aka working two full-time jobs at once. While this is technically true, both jobs know about the other one and it's not some secret. Basically when covid started I was in the process of transitioning out of one role and into the other, but then old job asked me to just stay on to take care of odds and ends until the hiring freeze lifted. Well the hiring freeze ended long ago and I'm still there. My title stayed the same but the output they expect from me went way down. It was just cheaper and easier than finding someone new. Since then I've had a couple new jobs, and just tell them I'm still on at company A in a consulting role and it won't interfere with the new gig they're offering. That was almost 2.5 years ago now and scanning my resume it looks like I'm juggling two concurrent FT jobs. They're both at big, more traditionally structured organizations, one is "senior manager" and the current one is "director", so I don't think they really look like things you could manage at the same time without double-dipping. Like I mentioned, I have gotten hired in this situation but I was grilled by some recruiters, HR reps, and interviewers along the way. Ideally I'd like to keep both on there without it looking suspicious. It's easy enough to explain once I have my foot in the door but I don't want it to be a blocker before then. What is a good way to present it on my resume? - A bullet point in old job's list, explaining the above (more succinctly of course) - Making up a new downgraded title that starts when I got that initial new job? Even though this never happened, I could list it as a new position in the same company as like "[subject matter] consultant March 2020–Present" - Same as the last point, but creating a new section called "consulting" under the main experience section with the post-2020 - Just putting the end date as March 2020 and considering it a necessary loss. This would be easiest, but in the time since then I actually did end up working on some notable projects with results I want to show off and talk about. Sorry if this is all over the place, I haven't really thought about it too much but I'm getting the itch to start looking for a new job. I didn't really care if the overemployed suspiciousness lost me a few opportunities before as they were basically lateral moves, but I really want to go all-in on some dream jobs and wouldn't want this to hinder my search. The idea is to lock in something really good and finally call it quits with that first job and just have the one. Edit: navyjack posted:2nding. Danny is great. He’s not really fire-and-forget so your friend will have to do some work communicating back and forth with him to get his final product. gamer roomie is 41 fucked around with this message at 23:55 on Dec 5, 2022 |
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Dec 5, 2022 23:51
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Magnetic North posted:Also, I don't know what the GCSES is. I'm a yank and it's some sort of UK thing? Is this some sort of Primary Education thing? I don't think anyone cares about anything except secondary education, but a UK goon can probably answer that better. gcses are your final secondary school exams, so i'm all in the clear. moana posted:French tutoring for private high school students? What other kinds of jobs are you qualified for? i have a SIGNIFICANT amount of social media management/seo experience, but i'm a stupid stupid fool bozo the clown of a man and i never chased my higher-ups on changing my official job title, so it looks like i have none and i've just been a sales assistant for my entire working life. tutoring is something i've considered, but most tutoring companies here in the uk require a completed degree, and rn i'm saving up to transfer universities so my studies are on hold
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Dec 6, 2022 01:08
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w4ddl3d33 posted:i have a SIGNIFICANT amount of social media management/seo experience, but i'm a stupid stupid fool bozo the clown of a man and i never chased my higher-ups on changing my official job title,
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Dec 6, 2022 01:50
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w4ddl3d33 posted:gcses are your final secondary school exams, so i'm all in the clear. No one else is writing your resume. Use this opportunity to tell the story YOU want to tell. You don't need permission, just don't lie. I'd also put together a resume to see if you can get into B2B service/support, you'd need to gear it much more towards customer service, customer success and maybe some technical know-how. The social media stuff will help too. Multi-lingual can be a huge boon for that. The job quality is... varied in those roles, but they are typically a good step up from shop floor assistant. gamer roomie is 41 posted:I have had two jobs for a few years now, and on paper it looks like I'm "overemployed", aka working two full-time jobs at once. I'd try to make that first role look a lot more like a long-term consulting gig. That isn't super unusual.
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Dec 6, 2022 03:48
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So, I:
 )I'm worried that a graduation date of <current year> might get my application immediately filtered out by someone gauging experience by quickly skimming to education dates (or by their ATS). One option I've considered is listing the degree without specifying a date, but that probably looks like I'm trying to hide something. Which I suppose I am. The best I've come up with so far is writing "(Studied P/T alongside AcmeCorp role)" where the grad date would normally go. Any thoughts appreciated. I might be worried about nothing for all I know.
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Dec 6, 2022 07:28
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I've seen people list things like that as "Continued Education". I think generally if your experience if your strongest point list it first and it'll be pretty clear.
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Dec 6, 2022 14:59
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Have my fifth(!) interview for a job on Thursday, this time with one of the big bosses (as in his name is in the company name). The HR recruiter who did my first phone screen warned that their interview process is in-depth, and I appreciate the honesty, but I really hope this is it. My impression was that this was a very mid-level job in a company of about 150-200 so this all feels very intense. Previous interviews/meets have been with: Internal recruiter (video call) VP of HR Hiring manager Person who has been piecemealing together the job to this point (it's a new position) Any tips for these high-level interviews? If he asks if I have any questions, what do I say? Culture questions seem like they're not going to elicit anything useful and I'm guessing his work isn't going to overlap a whole lot with mine (it would be rights/licensing/database management). Like I said, I'm mid-career and to this point have mainly worked in very small companies (currently part of a staff of 8) so I don't have a ton of experience in interfacing with executives. JaneError fucked around with this message at 00:42 on Dec 7, 2022 |
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Dec 7, 2022 00:24
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When you talk to the C-Suite, use smaller words and try to paint bigger pictures. Don't try to wow them with the in-depth specific knowledge, but try to talk about industry trends, where he sees the company going and what new worlds alexander would like to conquer. He's probably going to ask you to review your professional story so give some thought to turning that into a good elevator pitch. And if you can get him talking, even better. People like that usually like to talk. Definitely have some questions prepped, and if the interview seems to be running out of steam I wouldn't be afraid to say "Well, I don't want to take up more of your time", he may appreciate 15 minutes back from his schedule.
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Dec 7, 2022 02:52
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Thanks, that's helpful. Company/industry trends make sense--previous interviews have alluded to them being in a growth period and it's an entertainment-adjacent field so getting him talking about the reasons behind that, how things have changed since the plague times, etc., might be a good direction to go if I have an in.
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Dec 7, 2022 03:29
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If they were affected by the plague times then asking how they've planned to future proof for the next big disruptive event might be an interesting avenue.
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Dec 7, 2022 04:48
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Lockback posted:I'd try to make that first role look a lot more like a long-term consulting gig. That isn't super unusual. Thanks, I'll do this - I'm just going to lean all the way in on the consulting thing. That's not the formal, HR designation I have but that doesn't really matter when applying. I created a quick first draft like that and it's already resolving things I was worried about. Appreciate the feedback!
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Dec 8, 2022 02:02
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For your average professional career, how many references are reasonable to provide? I was surprised to receive feedback (after being hired) that one of my references wasn't as glowing as I would have expected. They aren't going to tell me who it was (of my 4) so I was going to just cut the one I think is the most likely and replace it with a new reference who I am very confident is a solid addition. I touched base with every reference before applying and they all came across as very positive about me so I guess I'm just learning that people in management roles can be a little deceitful! Who would have thought?! Or maybe they were hoping I'd be stuck forever in my previous position working for them.
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Dec 8, 2022 02:12
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VelociBacon posted:Or maybe they were hoping I'd be stuck forever in my previous position working for them. It's this.
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Dec 8, 2022 02:18
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