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What is the most powerful flying bug?
This poll is closed.
🦋 15 3.71%
🦇 115 28.47%
🪰 12 2.97%
🐦 67 16.58%
dragonfly 94 23.27%
🦟 14 3.47%
🐝 87 21.53%
Total: 404 votes
[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

 
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mawarannahr
May 21, 2019

Majorian posted:

Yup, I'm looking at things through a materialist lens. Give it a shot, it's fun.:)

The German public should blame themselves for voting some way?

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speng31b
May 8, 2010

Majorian posted:

Yup, I'm looking at things through a materialist lens. Give it a shot, it's fun.:)

probe yourself for bloodlust

Majorian
Jul 1, 2009

mawarannahr posted:

The German public should blame themselves for voting some way?

I don't think there was ever a "vote" on denuclearization, although I could be wrong on that point. But "blame" probably wasn't the right word, I'll concede. My point is that Germany's denuclearization push arose mostly organically, often in opposition to US economic interests. Over the last couple of decades, no country has benefited more from Germany's anti-nuclear movement than Russia.

speng31b posted:

probe yourself for bloodlust

lol

paul_soccer12
Jan 5, 2020

by Fluffdaddy
https://twitter.com/mossrobeson__/status/1599091364309843970

Lostconfused
Oct 1, 2008

indigi posted:

I’m glad Canada is going to privatize their military, it will make it easier for us to just mush them into fertilizer when we need access to the newly arable land

Once again USA choosing to shoot themselves in the foot instead of just going with the easiest option where they get all they want anyway.

genericnick
Dec 26, 2012

Majorian posted:

I understand, but I think the U.S.' role in hobbling Europe's nuclear energy programs is smaller than you're assuming. Germany's anti-nuclear energy movement started in earnest in the 70s, back when the U.S. had a lot of money invested in building new plants. Denuclearization was against U.S. economic interests up until recently. Accidents like Three-Mile Island and Chernobyl really sent it into overdrive. Siemens, which built all of Germany's reactors, fully exited the nuclear sector after Fukushima. I agree with you that Germany should have been building reactors this whole time, and that the public response to these accidents was incredibly stupid. But I'm sorry to say that it was a largely organic response. The German public has no one to blame but themselves.

Eh, if I'm not completely off there was a marked shift in the US from pushing nuke exports to nonproliferation. The NPT is from 1968.

Danann
Aug 4, 2013

Putinger's Cat / Кот Путингера posted:


(Click thumbnail to open video)
In this video from 2018, Igor Strelkov talks about a prophesy tied to the seizure of the Kievo-Pechersk Lavra, which took place on Dec. 2, 2022.
(from t.me/putingers_cat/2724, via tgsa)

Strelkov with the prophesy of Ukraine's fall 6 months in 2023 from 2018.

supersnowman
Oct 3, 2012

Frosted Flake posted:

We’ve talked before about the state of Western Militaries, with the social contract being broken, erosion of benefits, stagnant pay, abuse and harassment and general low morale. The CAF is 10k pers short with no signs of that changing.

Well I want to point out that liberalism cannot offer solutions to the problems it creates. An article came out that I spent my entire day in meetings about with more to come: The Canadian Armed Forces are heading for a Titanic collapse

Now I want to preface that I agree with nearly all of the problems. The solutions, to turn the military into essentially a private sector corporate job with no tradition and esprit de corps, to me illustrate the alienating nature of liberalism. It’s not about inspiring belief or belonging or giving something soldiers to die for and instead trying to obfuscate that as much as possible and turn the military into a job - the implicit part is that no meaning can be expected from it, no duty or purpose, and in exchange the state will offer nothing more than a paycheque:

“Marching in lines, stamping feet on parade grounds and keeping with traditional uniforms – these should also be done away with. These rituals are simply not relevant to the citizens who must make up the force of the future; they reflect the reality that Canada’s military is stuck in the past.”

“Nobody wants to work in an old, tired organization that draws its culture and values from a museum; people want to be part of an agile organization that rewards modern values. The Canadian Armed Forces needs to abandon its sternward perspective on legacy force structure and missions – or it won’t be able to bail out the sinking ship.”

Without getting into the deep body of literature on the subject, close order drill, marching, uniforms, these all have a social purpose, and my theory here is that because liberalism doesn’t conceive of things socially but individually they see harebrained schemes like this as a solution to endemic problems instead of a further erosion of what soldiering means. Deep, felt, social, meaning is something disappearing from all areas of our society but again going back to the Egyptian Old Kingdom, militaries need these things to function.

I’m curious what the feeling is here because people on the left have observed this cultural shift, with the officer corps becoming more like a corporate PMC and enlisted Operator Culture becoming more about individual advancement and a sort of professional athlete ethos. I get why the initial reaction from left leaning people is “who cares?” and “marching is dumb”, but my point is that if liberalisms alienating impulses and disconnection from social meaning have penetrated to something so essential as the functioning of the state - in preference to the basic social contract of improving material conditions: pay, benefits, housing, education, pensions, an end to workplace abuse - this line of thinking permeates all levels of decision making.

I think part of the problem is where do you find people who want to join the military for the "old" reasons instead of these "new" ones? Even if they were to renew the "social contract" of being in the military, who's going to join? For an outsider, the military current image is every single project blowing up in cost overrun and sex scandals. Sprinkle just a little bit of goodwill from the few home front operation in disaster relief and you pretty much have the full image people who aren't invested in the forces have of it. Where do you find 10k people to join what appear to be a dysfunctional mess who also offer less than a civilian job unless you have niche set of taste for your career only available in the forces?

Majorian
Jul 1, 2009

genericnick posted:

Eh, if I'm not completely off there was a marked shift in the US from pushing nuke exports to nonproliferation. The NPT is from 1968.

Nonproliferation and the NPT are about nuclear weapons, though, not peaceful nuclear energy. Throughout the Cold War the U.S. was still all about selling Westinghouse and GE tech to Europe; hell, Westinghouse is still building reactors in places like Poland. They're set to make a killing in the wake of this war.

paul_soccer12
Jan 5, 2020

by Fluffdaddy
Germany, no nuclear plants = 0 catastrophic meltdowns in 21st century

Japan, at least one nuclear plant = 1 catastrophic meltdown in 21st century

:thunk:

Majorian
Jul 1, 2009

paul_soccer12 posted:

Germany, no nuclear plants = 0 catastrophic meltdowns in 21st century

Japan, at least one nuclear plant = 1 catastrophic meltdown in 21st century

:thunk:

Breaking news: paul_soccer outs himself as Al Giordano

\/\/\/mistakes into miracles:angel:\/\/\/

Majorian has issued a correction as of 20:12 on Dec 3, 2022

Futanari Damacy
Oct 30, 2021

by sebmojo

speng31b
May 8, 2010


lol

lobster shirt
Jun 14, 2021

Majorian posted:

Breaking news: paul_soccer outs himself as Al Giordano

\/\/\/mistakes into miracles:angel:\/\/\/

havent thought about al giordano in many moons...

Hedenius
Aug 23, 2007
https://twitter.com/chiweethegod/status/1599088167441006592?s=46&t=WepSN41kRtWRxDnho7q99A

paul_soccer12
Jan 5, 2020

by Fluffdaddy

lol

Majorian
Jul 1, 2009

lobster shirt posted:

havent thought about al giordano in many moons...

Al DiGiorno?

That's a pizza I haven't had in a long time...

A loooooong tiiiiime...

dieselfruit
Feb 21, 2013

lol wait they're going ahead with the price cap??

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/dec/03/g7-countries-and-australia-to-cap-price-of-seaborne-russian-oil

Futanari Damacy
Oct 30, 2021

by sebmojo

quote:

But questions remain over whether the cap is radical enough to dent Russia’s budget or whether it will only work to lower the price of oil for developing countries.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Q-U2THOF00

BrutalistMcDonalds
Oct 4, 2012


Lipstick Apathy

Frosted Flake posted:

Without getting into the deep body of literature on the subject, close order drill, marching, uniforms, these all have a social purpose, and my theory here is that because liberalism doesn’t conceive of things socially but individually they see harebrained schemes like this as a solution to endemic problems instead of a further erosion of what soldiering means. Deep, felt, social, meaning is something disappearing from all areas of our society but again going back to the Egyptian Old Kingdom, militaries need these things to function.

I’m curious what the feeling is here because people on the left have observed this cultural shift, with the officer corps becoming more like a corporate PMC and enlisted Operator Culture becoming more about individual advancement and a sort of professional athlete ethos. I get why the initial reaction from left leaning people is “who cares?” and “marching is dumb”, but my point is that if liberalisms alienating impulses and disconnection from social meaning have penetrated to something so essential as the functioning of the state - in preference to the basic social contract of improving material conditions: pay, benefits, housing, education, pensions, an end to workplace abuse - this line of thinking permeates all levels of decision making.

V. Illych L. posted:

i appreciate that you're that rarest of things, a sincere and serious social conservative in the year of 2022

this making you, basically, a kind of communist is also not lost on me
well there's a reason why communist countries tended (and tend to) have orderly drills. one reason is that ideology matters. the united states used to have racial segregation in its society and military, and the british colonial army was also organized along the colonial pattern which was different from the soviet union, which marched 100,000 soldiers through red square in 1941 to fight the nazis. so by definition, the capitalist countries couldn't match that "spiritual quality" (for lack of a better term) without nazifying themselves so they're just proud of their race like nazi germany which was an extreme reaction to communism.

the state's role in the development of societes has also varied in different parts of the world and over time. for most of the early development of western countries such as the united states, the role of the state was relatively negative. the state's role has expanded since the 19th century, but the situation in countries that developed later is completely different as it led to "strong" states in command of the modernization process, with a unified and effective political will, and wary of (excessive) liberalization because of the potential negative consequences to their national power. that's due to structural reasons in the international system. "strong" states are necessary for weak states in the world system to check the power of the strong. the PRC here took from the soviet model but also adapted / iterated on it, and has imported western beliefs and has adapted some things from western political thought but the state has also tried to check / control it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxcE8a5X9aE

but i don't think that ^ kind of thing is possible in the western countries unless they either nazified themselves (had a tighter / small group of "aryans") or if there was a revolutionary change in the society. i think one reason (among others) why the U.S. military cannot do that is because there is still racism and racialized patterns in the U.S. military, the special forces are whiter and more "elite," and while there are black generals, there are a lot of black servicemembers who are lower down the military system and doing the equivalent of manual labor jobs and reinforced by racism in the military. so the kind of unity and discipline displayed in that PLA video would be difficult to replicate given that stratification because it would be too "threatening" to reactionary and conservative forces in the society. the military is kinda like a reflection of the society.







https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4HrefGcODk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9dHgAZPDOg

BrutalistMcDonalds has issued a correction as of 22:11 on Dec 3, 2022

Farg
Nov 19, 2013
https://twitter.com/xenasolo/status/1598995384042369024?t=r299389ykfkPs7a-YRG-ZQ&s=19

icantfindaname
Jul 1, 2008


Majorian posted:

Nonproliferation and the NPT are about nuclear weapons, though, not peaceful nuclear energy. Throughout the Cold War the U.S. was still all about selling Westinghouse and GE tech to Europe; hell, Westinghouse is still building reactors in places like Poland. They're set to make a killing in the wake of this war.

i guess if it takes near-nazi regimes to build nuclear power and ignore idiot bourgie greens that's one good thing to come out of it

Comrade Koba
Jul 2, 2007

someone get me a lavrov morale patch

Majorian
Jul 1, 2009

icantfindaname posted:

i guess if it takes near-nazi regimes to build nuclear power and ignore idiot bourgie greens that's one good thing to come out of it

Yeah well, we'll see if they can re-up any decommissioned plants quickly enough to make a difference, because building new ones from the ground up takes a whiiiiiiile.

Comrade Koba posted:

someone get me a lavrov morale patch



If his stern Mary Worth-esque glare isn't enough to motivate ya, I don't know what will!

Futanari Damacy
Oct 30, 2021

by sebmojo
De-industrialization will be good for Europe. Is there any moral reason they should enjoy a level of development above other regions in the world, particularly ones they had spent centuries subjugating and exploiting? They should pay a fair price for energy.

icantfindaname
Jul 1, 2008


Well, it's certainly going to be the first big test in practice of the apparent plan by the people in charge of the global north that that their own populations are just going to have to be a lot poorer going forwards. I don't think it will go down smoothly, but what do I know

Fat-Lip-Sum-41.mp3
Nov 15, 2003
What are the German business papers saying about all this? Are the Frankfurt bankers happy?

Majorian
Jul 1, 2009

Futanari Damacy posted:

De-industrialization will be good for Europe. Is there any moral reason they should enjoy a level of development above other regions in the world, particularly ones they had spent centuries subjugating and exploiting? They should pay a fair price for energy.

There isn't really a "moral" reason for anything that happens in geopolitics, regrettably. It's all a question of what action will lead to what reaction. It's probably wise to remember that deindustrialization in Europe will lead either to European countries becoming even more subjected to the American Empire, or else more war in the region. Or maybe both. But continued deindustrialization in Europe is pretty inevitable anyway, so...we'll see, won't we?

Atrocious Joe
Sep 2, 2011

Kindest Forums User posted:

I saw this on Reddits front page
https://www.reuters.com/world/ukraine-war-shows-europe-too-reliant-us-finland-pm-says-2022-12-02/


After just reading the headline, I initially thought it was a sensible dose of reality with someone actually pushing back on the United States influence and control over the EU. But no, lol, it's just the fresh new progressive Scandinavian superstar politician requesting that EU nations grow their domestic MIC.

quote:

HELSINKI, Dec 2 (Reuters) - Russia's invasion of Ukraine has shown that Europe is too reliant on the United States for its own security, Finnish Prime Minister Sanna Marin said on Friday.

Speaking at a think tank in Sydney, Australia, Marin advocated boosting Europe's defence capabilities, including arms production.

"I must be brutally honest with you, Europe isn't strong enough right now. We would be in trouble without the United States," Marin told an audience at the Lowy Institute.

She added she had spoken with many U.S. politicians who had said they think Europe should be stronger.

"The United States has given a lot of weapons, a lot of financial aid, a lot of humanitarian aid to Ukraine and Europe isn't strong enough yet," Marin said.

"We have to make sure that we are building those capabilities when it comes to European defence, European defence industry."

In a recent speech in Helsinki, Marin said Europe was currently too reliant on China for technology and should invest more in fields such as artificial intelligence and quantum computing.

is she dumb. the US politicians want Europe to buy more US weapons, not make their own

mlmp08
Jul 11, 2004

Prepare for my priapic projectile's exalted penetration
Nap Ghost
There has never existed a military force that was particularly "effective" or "skilled" or "good at things."

They just try to suck at it all somewhat less than their opponents.

icantfindaname
Jul 1, 2008


Fat-Lip-Sum-41.mp3 posted:

What are the German business papers saying about all this? Are the Frankfurt bankers happy?

They’re not happy, but they understand that their bread is buttered ultimately by the United States, and they’re going to do as they’re told

speng31b
May 8, 2010

icantfindaname posted:

They’re not happy, but they understand that their bread is buttered ultimately by the United States, and they’re going to do as they’re told

thats right

AnimeIsTrash
Jun 30, 2018

mlmp08 posted:

There has never existed a military force that was particularly "effective" or "skilled" or "good at things."

They just try to suck at it all somewhat less than their opponents.

the mongols seemed like they were pretty skilled

indigi
Jul 20, 2004

how can we not talk about family
when family's all that we got?

this definitely happened

Starsfan
Sep 29, 2007

This is what happens when you disrespect Cam Neely

indigi posted:

this definitely happened

what they won't tell you is that they crashed the car into a crowd of Ukrainian soldiers, killing dozens.

Lostconfused
Oct 1, 2008

She doesn't seem very grateful that they saved her life by disposing of her death trap.

ModernMajorGeneral
Jun 25, 2010
https://www.skynews.com.au/world-ne...e771b0a76bb?amp


quote:

Russian President Vladimir Putin has reportedly slipped down five stairs and soiled himself at his official residence in Moscow, as speculation mounts about the 70-year-old's declining health.  

The Telegraph Channel claims Mr Putin landed on his coccyx or tailbone during the fall on Wednesday evening, which caused him to "involuntarily defecate"  due to the "cancer affecting his stomach and bowels".

The anti-Kremlin channel which claims to monitor Mr Putin's health said his three bodyguards and team of medics rushed to his aide.



Putin’s pamps are extra poopy today

Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique

BrutalistMcDonalds posted:

i think one reason (among others) why the U.S. military cannot do that is because there is still racism and racialized patterns in the U.S. military, the special forces are whiter and more "elite," and while there are black generals, there are a lot of black servicemembers who are lower down the military system and doing the equivalent of manual labor jobs. so the kind of unity and discipline displayed in that PLA video would be difficult to replicate in a multi-racial army in a given that stratification because it would be too "threatening" if you know what i mean. the military is kinda like a reflection of the society.

Some of the most striking things I ever read in GiP were in a thread years ago about basic training where people recounted black soldiers on their course marvelling at owning multiple pairs of shoes for the first time. One USAF guy remembered that when, what I suppose were rural, southern and poor, black members of his unit were painting a fence or something similar, they started singing work songs. That’s so uncomfortable, I mean, it’s really hard to
imagine that, but as you said it’s a reflection of society.

Which isn’t to say that somewhat similar dynamics don’t play out here with rural Quebec, New Brunswick and Newfoundland soldiers, that you can see differences in Canadian society that are basically invisible from Toronto or whatever. The class, regional, linguistic and other stratifications in Canadian society are there too, there are imbalances in officers and other ranks, indigenous people have separate enlistment programs etc. but it’s hard to wrap my head around how large race looms in America.

One thing worth pointing out is that motivations for enlistment, or at least type of enlistment, vary across language, gender, class and race. The working class and minorities, which as you said can often be the same thing, approach service in a way that has a distinct pattern.

They often go into combat support and (more-so) combat service support roles, the labour jobs, for short period enlistments. Learn to cook, become a mechanic, plumber, electrician, carpenter, whatever - and then get out. Here, that’s 3-4 years, after which they go into public life with skills and something to put on their resume. I’m not great at explaining it, but it’s a very pragmatic use of the military that fits with the economic draft, since they’re returning to civie street with job skills.

In Canada that pattern is shared with women and Francophones but I’m not confident in how these things are interconnected. Just that I’ve seen the pie charts over and over again. Quite a few of the women who serve for short periods get married and leave or become military wives and that’s a whole thing I don’t feel qualified to touch on or try to explain. People still joke about “the 3 reasons why women join the army”.

For one example, combat support and combat service support units in Western Canada were losing enlisted men to the oil patch as soon as they got their red seals, journeymen tickets, AZ etc. To the point where units started deliberately withholding them and the idea was floated of the military deliberately cutting part of the skills training so they wouldn’t be properly certified. This goes back to the “solutions” to retention problems being misguided to malicious.

They have also recently done the same to paid training and education for Doctors, Nurses, Physiotherapists, Lawyers and Dentists to the point where you need to be trained and qualified before joining the military - and they’re marvelling why none are. I can’t wrap my head around this, so if anyone can shine a light I’d appreciate it. Why the hell would someone who is already a doctor become a Medical Officer? They want Chaplains to already have a Masters of Divinity Studies.

Other than people who feel a sense of duty, and are willing to sacrifice civilian employment, who are they hoping to attract to these high skilled and sought after positions? They’re so clearly sabotaging themselves I don’t understand it other than idk they want to means test the positions? But that doesn’t really make sense either.

On the other hand, officers and combat arms enlisted men skew male, middle class, white, English, two or more generations Canadian. Traditionally the Long Service Professional enlists or takes his commission for life - 18-25 years. There’s way more than I can get into here but this probably touches on something Max Weber observed in the Protestant Work Ethic about a “vocation” or “calling”. This was more consciously expressed in the Late Victorian and Edwardian Army, but you can take upper middle class Anglos out of the Anglican Church but you can’t take the Anglican Church out of the upper middle class Anglos. So, these are people who make a life out of the military. Some jumped ship for the tar sands, but not at the same rate. You can argue that’s because they didn’t have transferable job skills, but that’s the point - they don’t go into it for the job skills.

Where this gets complicated is questions of the ability of the other groups to have this career if they wanted. The “fit in or gently caress off” culture and everything else might mean an indigenous person from the territories couldn’t be a moustachioed Regimental Sergeant Major if they wanted to, or a woman hang tough in Battalion as a company commander before getting an ADC billet. The military up to the 70’s and 80’s stalled out Francophone officers’ careers at the Regimental level, beyond which they’d be in command of English troops and formations, so as you said about black generals, this is not all about preference.

I just want to cap this by saying there’s an old book about the RCMP, which is facing identical problems, written for a foreign audience, and when describing the personnel system they say: “Competition for the RCMP is intense, and the Force is able to pick and choose from among the best of those seeking a law enforcement career”

and it’s that they act as if that’s still true without earning it - failing the nation, public, members, Sam Steele and Vimy Ridge - that galls me. They’re acting as if they have the “pick of Canada’s men” without understanding why people believed only the best earned the Red Serge and pushed themselves to be worthy of it. Cunningham said during the evacuation of Crete, when army generals feared the Royal Navy would lose too many ships (the RN lost 12 fleet and 7 auxiliary ships and saved over 18k soldiers) “It takes the Navy three years to build a ship. It will take three hundred years to build a new tradition.” Well, what the gently caress do they want here?

I have often caught poo poo on CSPAM for my belief in this, and deservedly so, but these institutions rely on people acting as they have meaning, not assuming it.

Gripweed
Nov 8, 2018

I haven’t been paying attention, how’s the war been going for the past few weeks? Last I heard, the Russians were falling back and had lost control of a couple major cities.

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Majorian
Jul 1, 2009

A true warrior's death, the way I want to go.

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