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BadOptics
Sep 11, 2012


Well that explains this being reported on atm


mlmp08 posted:

Breaking my own soft-rule of “No ATACMS chat” but this is actually new reporting.

https://twitter.com/ralee85/status/1599786769490198529?s=46&t=63GLLKkUbAEE87xWuQ2glg

Though I'm pretty sure even the ATACMS doesn't have the range to hit Engels.

BadOptics fucked around with this message at 17:39 on Dec 5, 2022

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Loezi
Dec 18, 2012

Never buy the cheap stuff

I don't know what it is about "a completely defenseless airfield" that I find so hilarious, but it sure is funny

shame on an IGA
Apr 8, 2005


oh no the poor defenseless smol bean nuclear bombers :ohdear:

Nuclear Tourist
Apr 7, 2005

Xakura posted:

Quadcopters don't make a noise like this

They sure don't, hadn't seen that clip yet. Wonder what it was.

Jasper Tin Neck
Nov 14, 2008


"Scientifically proven, rich and creamy."

Loezi posted:

I don't know what it is about "a completely defenseless airfield" that I find so hilarious, but it sure is funny

Indeed, poor widdle airbase, bristling with innocent strategic bombers that were just minding their own business of lobbing a few hundred cruise missiles. How dare they!?!

:arghfist::qq:

Alan Smithee
Jan 4, 2005


A man becomes preeminent, he's expected to have enthusiasms.

Enthusiasms, enthusiasms...

I need to watch Doctor Sleep

The X-man cometh
Nov 1, 2009

Jasper Tin Neck posted:

Indeed, poor widdle airbase, bristling with innocent strategic bombers that were just minding their own business of lobbing a few hundred cruise missiles. How dare they!?!

:arghfist::qq:

Camping the bombers spawn location.

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012

http 418

The X-man cometh posted:

Camping the bombers spawn location.

This future war is kinda annoying

psydude
Apr 1, 2008

In my Tom Clancy fantasy, the Ukrainians have disguised a HIMARS as a box truck and snuck it across Russian lines to target the Russian strategic bomber fleet.

ASAPI
Apr 20, 2007
I invented the line.

psydude posted:

In my Tom Clancy fantasy, the Ukrainians have disguised a HIMARS as a box truck and snuck it across Russian lines to target the Russian strategic bomber fleet.

At this point, that seems plausible to me.

Loezi
Dec 18, 2012

Never buy the cheap stuff

psydude posted:

In my Tom Clancy fantasy, the Ukrainians have disguised a HIMARS as a box truck and snuck it across Russian lines to target the Russian strategic bomber fleet.

In my Dahir Insaat fantasy, Russians are on a lookout for two males on motorbikes, last seen driving a bright red "FRESH FRUITS" truck.

ded
Oct 27, 2005

Kooler than Jesus

Loezi posted:

In my Dahir Insaat fantasy, Russians are on a lookout for two males on motorbikes, last seen driving a bright red "FRESH FRUITS" truck.

fresh fruit in russia? obvious terrorism

Rust Martialis
May 8, 2007

At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

ded posted:

fresh fruit in russia? obvious terrorism

No, that's Scotland

Herstory Begins Now
Aug 5, 2003
SOME REALLY TEDIOUS DUMB SHIT THAT SUCKS ASS TO READ ->>
I have to say I'm really not too bothered by the idea that your long range bomber fleet that you've been blowing up infrastructure with starts suffering unexplained explosions up to 2 months later due to some kind of long range weapon system. Like what did Russia expect, there are a bunch of countries in Europe with missiles that can do that who likely have feelings about Russia trying to freeze millions of civilians and have weapon systems that could accomplish this.

Crab Dad
Dec 28, 2002

behold i have tempered and refined thee, but not as silver; as CRAB


Herstory Begins Now posted:

Like what did Russia expect, there are a bunch of countries in Europe with missiles that can do that who likely have feelings about Russia trying to freeze millions of civilians and have weapon systems that could accomplish this.

They expected everyone to be afraid of their supposed nukes.

CommieGIR
Aug 22, 2006

The blue glow is a feature, not a bug


Pillbug

Herstory Begins Now posted:

I have to say I'm really not too bothered by the idea that your long range bomber fleet that you've been blowing up infrastructure with starts suffering unexplained explosions up to 2 months later due to some kind of long range weapon system. Like what did Russia expect, there are a bunch of countries in Europe with missiles that can do that who likely have feelings about Russia trying to freeze millions of civilians and have weapon systems that could accomplish this.

Yup. Who cares, maybe Russia shouldn't start a war and lose it.

Jasper Tin Neck
Nov 14, 2008


"Scientifically proven, rich and creamy."

The strongest hypothesis at the moment is that Ukrainians have cobbled together poor man's cruise missiles by giving 1980s vintage Tu-141 recon drones a guidance upgrade and an explosive payload.

I doubt these things exist in vast quantities though, and their payload is probably pretty puny, so for the time being the Crimean and Donbas rear areas remain relatively safe staging areas for the Russian war logistics.

BIG HEADLINE
Jun 13, 2006

"Stand back, Ottawan ruffian, or face my lumens!"
I can't read a Wikipedia history about old Soviet equipment without hearing it narrated by Peter Ustinov's voice.

Tiny Timbs
Sep 6, 2008

It’s immoral for Ukraine to strike back against these pathetic conscripts, and also to strike into the country doing a fascist genocide against them

A.o.D.
Jan 15, 2006

Jasper Tin Neck posted:

The strongest hypothesis at the moment is that Ukrainians have cobbled together poor man's cruise missiles by giving 1980s vintage Tu-141 recon drones a guidance upgrade and an explosive payload.

I doubt these things exist in vast quantities though, and their payload is probably pretty puny, so for the time being the Crimean and Donbas rear areas remain relatively safe staging areas for the Russian war logistics.

How difficult are these things to manufacture? Like, what level of jet technology do they represent? It seems like in some ways they are on the same level as early 60s eras jet fighters.

Comrade Blyatlov
Aug 4, 2007


should have picked four fingers





Why doesn't Ukraine just hire me to stand near Russian military bases :thunk:

CainFortea
Oct 15, 2004


How do we know you haven't been?

Tiny Timbs
Sep 6, 2008

He's still chained to the last open McDonalds

shame on an IGA
Apr 8, 2005

Jasper Tin Neck posted:

The strongest hypothesis at the moment is that Ukrainians have cobbled together poor man's cruise missiles by giving 1980s vintage Tu-141 recon drones a guidance upgrade and an explosive payload.

I doubt these things exist in vast quantities though, and their payload is probably pretty puny, so for the time being the Crimean and Donbas rear areas remain relatively safe staging areas for the Russian war logistics.

Big ups to the Croatian, Romanian and Hungarian governments for all pretending they didn't see poo poo when one went 180 degrees the wrong way and crashed into a dorm parking lot in Zagreb a few months ago though. No snitches in osteurop.

Herstory Begins Now
Aug 5, 2003
SOME REALLY TEDIOUS DUMB SHIT THAT SUCKS ASS TO READ ->>
i wonder if someone hammered the compass sensor on upside down

Crab Dad
Dec 28, 2002

behold i have tempered and refined thee, but not as silver; as CRAB


shame on an IGA posted:

Big ups to the Croatian, Romanian and Hungarian governments for all pretending they didn't see poo poo when one went 180 degrees the wrong way and crashed into a dorm parking lot in Zagreb a few months ago though. No snitches in osteurop.

Holy moly Zagreb?
Pretty town. Glad only a parking lot got hit.

Hyrax Attack!
Jan 13, 2009

We demand to be taken seriously

Any excuse to bring up one of the top raids on an airbase of all time, courtesy of platoon of Stuart tanks in North Africa in 1942. Excerpt from Rick Atkinson’s excellent An Army At Dawn.

quote:

Suffused with cavalry panache, Barlow pressed ahead. His tanks rumbled northeast for seven miles along the left bank of the Medjerda, sheltered by olive groves, to the village of Djedeďda. Behind a ridge a few hundred yards ahead, a German plane lifted into the air, followed by another. Barlow sent forward a platoon under Lieutenant Wilbor H. Hooker while the rest of the company remained secluded in the olive trees.

Hooker and his tankers soon came galloping back. A new airfield “packed with planes” lay on the other side of the rise, Hooker reported. No sentries had been posted and the Luftwaffe seemed oblivious of the approaching Americans. Barlow ordered the tanks into a forage line, with two platoons abreast and a third trailing slightly behind. He radioed Waters and relayed Hooker’s report in a voice pitched to the occasion:

“Right in front of me is an airport full of German airplanes, sitting there, the men all sitting out on the gasoline barrels, shooting the breeze in the sunlight. What should I do?”

Waters had spent much of the day hiding in the cactus from these very aircraft. Now he nearly leaped in the air with incredulity. “For God’s sake, attack them! Go after them!”

Seventeen Stuarts surged up and over the crest of the hill, tracks churning the wheat stubble as they barreled down the front slope from the northwest. Tank commanders craned for a better view from the open turret hatches and spurred their drivers forward. Several dozen Messerschmitts, Stukas, and Junkerses crowded around the dirt airstrip, reminding one American officer of “fat geese on a small pond.” Some were taking gas at a makeshift fuel dump; others were being rearmed with bombs and belts of machine-gun bullets. Late-afternoon shadows stretched before the charging Stuarts as if racing the tanks to the bottom of the slope. A few Luftwaffe crewmen turned and waved, evidently believing the tanks were Italian.

Then the first bursts of machine-gun fire struck the parked planes and the męlée began. Fuel drums exploded, spreading sheets of fire across the runway and engulfing German soldiers and planes alike. The boom of seventeen tank guns reverberated in the hills, as Barlow’s gunners hit their fire buttons as fast as loaders could shove rounds into the breech. Gunfire from the tanks created its own hot wind, flattening the brush and blowing a dark cloud of debris before the hulls.

The squirrel guns proved lethal to aircraft sheet metal. Planes blew up, planes disintegrated, planes collided with other planes making for the end of the runway. A Messerschmitt gained enough speed to lift off, only to be raked by machine-gun bullets and cartwheel, burning, to earth. Mud slowed the taxiing Junkerses long enough for American gunners to take languid aim and machine-gun the fuselages from propeller to vertical stabilizer. As for those still able to build speed, a tank commander at the far end of the runway raked departing planes with fire until a nearby grainfield was full of burning cruciforms.

Tanks lunged onto the runway. Terrified pilots in their leather headgear fled zigzag across the field, only to be shot down or crushed beneath the tracks. Several Stuarts rolled behind a row of parked aircraft, methodically shearing off their tails. Desultory German rifle fire, one tank crewman later recalled, hit the turrets and “bounced off like peas.” A few defenders tried to turn their 20mm anti-aircraft weapons into tank killers, but the Stuarts were too agile and the gunners died at their guns.

Tanks tacked back and forth across the airfield looking for things to kill. Spent brass rained down on the Stuart drivers and bow gunners, who wrapped towels around their necks and kept their collars buttoned tight to avoid burns from the hot casings. A few fighters had managed to get airborne when the attack began, and now they circled back for low strafing runs that ignited bedrolls and clothing bags lashed to the American hulls. Crewmen climbed from their hatches to beat at the flames, then pressed forward to kill some more.

In half an hour the fight was over. Barlow pulled his whooping tankers back up the hill. The raid had cost him one tank destroyed, several damaged, and two men killed by strafing, including a platoon leader.

He paused for a final look at the carnage below. Wreckage from more than twenty German planes lay scattered in a burning swath longer than a mile. Spikes of flame from detonating fuel and ammunition flared the length of the runway, illuminating scattered propellers, wheels, and fuselages. Bodies lay sprawled across the field.

citybeatnik
Mar 1, 2013

You Are All
WEIRDOS




What on earth do they mean by squirrel guns?

Hyrax Attack!
Jan 13, 2009

We demand to be taken seriously

citybeatnik posted:

What on earth do they mean by squirrel guns?

The Stuart tanks used by the US in 1942 was a light tank with a 37mm gun, insufficient firepower against medium or heavy tanks but useful in a scouting or infantry support role, or in this case, shredding densely packed aircraft.

BadOptics
Sep 11, 2012

citybeatnik posted:

What on earth do they mean by squirrel guns?

Probably the .50 machine guns versus the bigger 37mm main gun. MG's would be enough to pierce the aluminum skin of some Messerschmitts. The line after even talks about them machine gunning aircraft taking off.

joat mon
Oct 15, 2009

I am the master of my lamp;
I am the captain of my tub.

citybeatnik posted:

What on earth do they mean by squirrel guns?

It's a pejorative term for the Stuart's inadequate 37mm main gun.

aphid_licker
Jan 7, 2009


The PzIII (Ausf E) started out with a 37 as well, it wasn't a terribly unheard of armament for the early war. Ofc not really what you'd prefer to be armed with in 1942.

Crab Dad
Dec 28, 2002

behold i have tempered and refined thee, but not as silver; as CRAB


It’s fine for the role a light tank was supposed to do at the start of the war. Go forward, make contact, withdraw and then send in the Sherman’s. Technology really caught up with the next light tank rocking the 75mm, the M24 Chaffee, but it didn’t hit the battlefield until 1944.

A.o.D.
Jan 15, 2006
I can't think of a better gun for shredding parked aircraft than a fast firing tank cannon with canister shot. .50 bmg will do in a pinch as well.

Did those Stuarts even have canister?

Crab Dad
Dec 28, 2002

behold i have tempered and refined thee, but not as silver; as CRAB


A.o.D. posted:

I can't think of a better gun for shredding parked aircraft than a fast firing tank cannon with canister shot. .50 bmg will do in a pinch as well.

Did those Stuarts even have canister?

Like many other light anti-tank guns, the M3 was widely used in the infantry support role and as an anti-personnel weapon, firing high-explosive and canister rounds.

The M5 and M6 tank mounted variants were used in several models of armored vehicles most notably in the Stuart Light Tank M3/M5, the Lee Medium Tank M3, and Greyhound Light Armored Car M8. In addition, the M3 in its original version was mated to a number of other self-propelled carriages.”




So yup it would appear they could. However HE would work just fine for aircraft on the ground.

A.o.D.
Jan 15, 2006

Crab Dad posted:


Like many other light anti-tank guns, the M3 was widely used in the infantry support role and as an anti-personnel weapon, firing high-explosive and canister rounds.

The M5 and M6 tank mounted variants were used in several models of armored vehicles most notably in the Stuart Light Tank M3/M5, the Lee Medium Tank M3, and Greyhound Light Armored Car M8. In addition, the M3 in its original version was mated to a number of other self-propelled carriages.”




So yup it would appear they could. However HE would work just fine for aircraft on the ground.

Yeah, but canister lets you turn the aircraft into confetti AND the ground crews into hamburger in a single shot.

Xakura
Jan 10, 2019

A safety-conscious little mouse!

A.o.D. posted:

I can't think of a better gun for shredding parked aircraft than a fast firing tank cannon with canister shot. .50 bmg will do in a pinch as well.

Did those Stuarts even have canister?

Somebody never played Company of Heroes

Stuarts with canister was the funniest thing

Madurai
Jun 26, 2012

Crab Dad posted:


Like many other light anti-tank guns, the M3 was widely used in the infantry support role and as an anti-personnel weapon, firing high-explosive and canister rounds.

The M5 and M6 tank mounted variants were used in several models of armored vehicles most notably in the Stuart Light Tank M3/M5, the Lee Medium Tank M3, and Greyhound Light Armored Car M8. In addition, the M3 in its original version was mated to a number of other self-propelled carriages.”




So yup it would appear they could. However HE would work just fine for aircraft on the ground.

It's practically the only thing the 37mm HE would be good for.

My Spirit Otter
Jun 15, 2006


CANADA DOESN'T GET PENS LIKE THIS

SKILCRAFT KREW Reppin' Quality Blind Made American Products. Bitch.

Madurai posted:

It's practically the only thing the 37mm HE would be good for.

Hey now, they make a good replacement for those lil noisemakers you throw at the ground and they pop

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Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Xakura posted:

Somebody never played Company of Heroes

Stuarts with canister was the funniest thing

Close Combat was my first exposure to such

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