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I love China
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Dec 8, 2022 15:08
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Shumagorath posted:Got anything to back up that ten year statistic three years after the outbreak? I don't have anything to back it up with, because I pulled it out of my rear end as a guess for what happens to a population where the average person gets ~1-2 serious viral infections per year for the rest of their life. If you think that sort of thing isn't so serious, that's fine. We'll see either way.
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Dec 8, 2022 15:11
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Atopian posted:because I pulled it out of my rear end The cspam covid thread is for making up bullshit, best to stick to something resembling facts in other threads.
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Dec 8, 2022 17:23
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I think the shocking thing about China's abrupt end of 0-covid is that it appears they never had any kind of transition plan and now when their hand has been forced it's to late to come up with one.
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Dec 8, 2022 17:24
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The junk collector posted:I think the shocking thing about China's abrupt end of 0-covid is that it appears they never had any kind of transition plan and now when their hand has been forced it's to late to come up with one. Honestly, that sounds like a lot of plans in China. Mandate from on high, then it's jazz.
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Dec 8, 2022 17:28
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The junk collector posted:I think the shocking thing about China's abrupt end of 0-covid is that it appears they never had any kind of transition plan and now when their hand has been forced it's to late to come up with one. This is only shocking if you haven't lived in China. I'd have been more surprised if they had a plan. E: I have no idea what the plan would be though. I don't see a good decision here. Maintaining zero covid forever isn't viable, just yoloing is a terrible idea. I guess at least they could've spent the last few years expanding their healthcare capacity to be able to deal with it instead of doing nothing. Dunno how you get the olds vaccinated short of rounding them up and forcing it. My most authoritarian opinion is everyone should be forced to be vaccinated though. Jack booted Biden thugs with needles full of MMR busting into places. Grand Fromage fucked around with this message at 17:58 on Dec 8, 2022 |
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Dec 8, 2022 17:30
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Hong Kong had a vaccination mandate on public places, including restaurants and coffeeshops, that was effective at persuading seniors to get the shot. China seems to be reactively executing a plan that made some sense in February, after Delta settled, when reopening chatter first emerged (before being reactively quashed during the Shanghai case explosion). The critical part is that it was pitched when the case count was low. Now, already knee-deep in a nationwide multi-city case surge, its priority should really be "flattening the curve" to defend emergency bed capacity and reorganizing the temporary hospitals to rapidly decant non-emergency cases. A dumber, broader lockdown with a definite exit timetable, rather than attempts at closed loops and micro-lockdowns that don't reduce case counts enough and yet also inflict enormous costs. That doesn't seem to be on the table though. https://twitter.com/LiuXininBeijing/status/1600816504064221186 ronya fucked around with this message at 18:57 on Dec 8, 2022 |
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Dec 8, 2022 18:48
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Grand Fromage posted:E: I have no idea what the plan would be though. I don't see a good decision here. Maintaining zero covid forever isn't viable, just yoloing is a terrible idea. I guess at least they could've spent the last few years expanding their healthcare capacity to be able to deal with it instead of doing nothing. I wish I could remember where but I read an analysis recently that China’s spending on increasing its healthcare capacity (already a tiny percentage of the literal hundreds of billions of dollars they’ve been pissing away on testing and quarantines) actually decreased slightly from 2020-2022. Which I guess if anyone is familiar with the Chinese government the fact that they chose the reactive path instead of the proactive one isn’t really surprising.
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Dec 8, 2022 19:02
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There was also a loving ton of money wasted on those slapdash quarantine facilities, which in a lot of places were built just because local governments have to build things constantly to keep the money flowing and they weren't able to do useless roads or whatever for a while. They could've built useful medical facilities instead.
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Dec 8, 2022 19:06
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maxwellhill posted:Do you think a virus can evolve to pass through an N95 mask? What physical properties would allow it to do this? Okay, I hope it's perfectly fitted at all times and that you never touch your face or mouth or indeed anything without washing your hands, especially now it's a billion times more infectious than a year ago. In selection pressure I'm going to stick with the mainstream reporting which I have not archived, and not do my own research based on what I think sounds logical. I can't overstress how totally unhinged the GBS Covid thread comes across as someone living an ordinary life in a large European city.
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Dec 8, 2022 19:08
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Dandywalken posted:I love China Ban this sick filth
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Dec 8, 2022 19:11
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In a mass infection wave, there is a real need to have somewhere for hospitals to move people who are infectious but not seriously ill out of ER beds. Potentially many still quite ill! Just not in immediate risk of death without continuous care. There would still need to be medical staff. This is the problem with the post-Shanghai explosion in isolation facilities: many of the beds are just literal beds, without the infrastructure that makes it a non-emergency hospital ward. They only make sense in the strategy of microtargeted lockdowns aimed at eliminating community transmission (which, as a strategy intended to be maintained for the 未来五年 long term, therefore rationalizes building a whole new facility to be reused over and over again for successive cohorts of close contacts, rather than just directing the current wave cohort to isolate at home). Many would need to be renovated or relocated to be useful as overflow wards.
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Dec 8, 2022 19:25
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Grand Fromage posted:There was also a loving ton of money wasted on those slapdash quarantine facilities, which in a lot of places were built just because local governments have to build things constantly to keep the money flowing and they weren't able to do useless roads or whatever for a while. They could've built useful medical facilities instead.
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Dec 8, 2022 19:29
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I have a personal hate-on for the push to traditional Chinese medicine as a cure for loving everything. It's one of the more blatantly obvious cynical attempts to harness science in the name of pointless nationalism in the 21st century and drat the costs. (That and climate change denial but yeah)
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Dec 8, 2022 19:46
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Tomn posted:I have a personal hate-on for the push to traditional Chinese medicine as a cure for loving everything. It's one of the more blatantly obvious cynical attempts to harness science in the name of pointless nationalism in the 21st century and drat the costs. Sounds like you’ve been eating too many hot foods and it has you all flustered. Eat some cold foods. It will cool you down and your skin and temperament will improve.
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Dec 8, 2022 19:48
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A vaccine mandate is extremely Chinese poo poo and you can’t persuade me otherwise. Asia doesn’t have the agitation of bodily autonomy that the US sees. They could easily have vaxxed the whole population by whip and wheedle. The problem is they boxed themselves out of this option by propagandizing against mRNA vaccine. They genuinely thought they could zero COVID their way out of this without Western vaccines. It was a big bad strategic bet.
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Dec 8, 2022 20:50
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Dick Fontaine posted:Sounds like you’ve been eating too many hot foods and it has you all flustered. Eat some cold foods. It will cool you down and your skin and temperament will improve.
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Dec 8, 2022 20:57
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Dick Fontaine posted:Sounds like you’ve been eating too many hot foods and it has you all flustered. Eat some cold foods. It will cool you down and your skin and temperament will improve. Can I drink some cold water?
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Dec 8, 2022 21:01
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McGavin posted:Can I drink some cold water? No, that’s unhealthy.
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Dec 8, 2022 21:03
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Don't drink cold water it's bad for you. Carry a flask of hot water with you instead and sip that, even when it's the middle of summer.
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Dec 8, 2022 21:07
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If you want to cool off just run a fan and take a nice nap
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Dec 8, 2022 21:10
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Strategic Tea posted:If you want to cool off just run a fan and take a nice nap I don't want to cool off to room temperature permanently.
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Dec 8, 2022 21:13
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Strategic Tea posted:If you want to cool off just run a fan and take a nice nap Also roll up your t-shirt and expose your belly
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Dec 8, 2022 21:17
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ili posted:Don't drink cold water it's bad for you. Carry a flask of hot water with you instead and sip that, even when it's the middle of summer. deep inside your belly are 《yang qi》， this is some fire inside your belly 。。。if you drink cold water，you will put out the fire。drinking hot water is good for healthy
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Dec 8, 2022 21:31
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sticksy posted:Also roll up your t-shirt and expose your belly This is good life advice whoever you are, wherever you are.
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Dec 8, 2022 21:41
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When the forest service brings in shipments of water and food for wildland firefighters the Aquafina and Dasani and Earth2O comes in warm. They say it prevents cramping but I say they're cheaping out on ice.
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Dec 8, 2022 21:44
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Trillhouse posted:have you guys seen this tik tok channel before? CGI Chinese workplace safety incident TikTok is grim.
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Dec 8, 2022 22:08
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My Chinese coworker: Everybody has bought all the stock of xxxx Chinese medicine that will cure covid! Me: Oh yes? MCC: I didn't buy any, but I don't mind because I am always ready for death. Laughs.
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Dec 8, 2022 22:55
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Grand Fromage posted:The cspam covid thread is for making up bullshit, best to stick to something resembling facts in other threads. If I wanted to post in D&D, I would. But as far as I know, this is GBS.
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Dec 8, 2022 23:24
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Shumagorath posted:The Padme and Anakin meme with “China built a hospital in ten days!” - “And then staffed it with doctors and nurses?” Administrators, who are frightfully overworked.
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Dec 8, 2022 23:38
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ronya posted:In a mass infection wave, there is a real need to have somewhere for hospitals to move people who are infectious but not seriously ill out of ER beds. Same thing happened to the US with regard to the schools and hospitals they paid to build in Iraq and Afghanistan. Nice-looking buildings which sat empty because whoops anyone who could staff them fled the area Vegetable posted:The problem is they boxed themselves out of this option by propagandizing against mRNA vaccine. They genuinely thought they could zero COVID their way out of this without Western vaccines. It was a big bad strategic bet. China is fully willing to produce and administer mRNA vaccines. But Chinese companies have been unable to do so. And Moderna and co have been unwilling to enter a forced partnership/IP transfer as a condition for market access. And now millions will probably die because of a spat over who gets the profits.
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Dec 8, 2022 23:54
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je1 healthcare posted:
AFAIK China has had full access and the license to manufacture BioNTech's mRNA vaccine since early 2020 through Fosun Pharma who invested a whole bunch of money in BioNTech in exchange for shares and the exclusive rights to market the vaccine in China (vs. Pfizer getting everywhere else in the world). Hell I'm pretty sure it's been available in Hong Kong for a while it's just China has refused to approve it for use on the mainland for reasons . Mr Luxury Yacht fucked around with this message at 00:31 on Dec 9, 2022 |
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Dec 9, 2022 00:23
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je1 healthcare posted:China is fully willing to produce and administer mRNA vaccines. But Chinese companies have been unable to do so. And Moderna and co have been unwilling to enter a forced partnership/IP transfer as a condition for market access. And now millions will probably die because of a spat over who gets the profits.
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Dec 9, 2022 00:26
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My understanding is they refused to approve it in China for a long time at least in part because the EU refused to approve the Chinese vaccines. It was a tit for tat kind of thing, though I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s more to it.
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Dec 9, 2022 00:38
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je1 healthcare posted:China is fully willing to produce and administer mRNA vaccines. But Chinese companies have been unable to do so. And Moderna and co have been unwilling to enter a forced partnership/IP transfer as a condition for market access. And now millions will probably die because of a spat over who gets the profits. It's not just the production, which is difficult but quite possible for China to get done. RNA is fragile stuff, and keeping it stable for "vaccine distribution and administration" timescales needs some colder temperatures than normal for most other things. So it probably wouldn't be so difficult to make mRNA vaccines and get them to larger cities, but I doubt there'd be the sort of money and resources available to get them to the rest of the country.
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Dec 9, 2022 00:45
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China doesn't even have functional cold chains for transporting food, the vaccine would be a serious challenge. I agree you could probably manage it in the big cities at most (and even then I would not trust it was handled properly). Of course it's not like the government gives a poo poo about the rural population so why would they start now?
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Dec 9, 2022 00:51
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China operates the world's most extensive high speed rail network including into remote mountainous regions but they can't keep vaccines cold? The money and know how is there, they just spent their efforts elsewhere and thought their domestic vaccine was good enough.
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Dec 9, 2022 01:28
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Rabelais D posted:China operates the world's most extensive high speed rail network including into remote mountainous regions but they can't keep vaccines cold?
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Dec 9, 2022 02:21
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It's almost like national prestige projects don't always denote, or result in, a more broadly based level of capacity or advancement in other areas of society, particularly in extremely segregated and wealth-disparate authoritarian ones.
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Dec 9, 2022 02:55
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sticksy posted:Also roll up your t-shirt and expose your belly Is this a chinese thing? I used to see dudes doing this a ton in nicaragua but never asked what the story behind it was it's definitely a look
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Dec 9, 2022 03:03
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