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The Lord Bude posted:It’s not going to hurt or benefit gaming in any way. Gaming was just one of the things he said he did with his Mac. You don’t *need* a high refresh monitor to enjoy casual gaming (which is what you’re doing if you’re gaming on a Mac.) if you only play slower paced games it's fine (nothing wrong with that!) but if you play anything fast then a 4k 120 or even 1440p 240hz monitor is wildly nicer than any current 5k or 6k monitor at 60hz. the studio display (and ultrafine 5k) have an unusually high response time that manifests as blur when looking around in an FPS and also effectively adds a frame of input delay.
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Dec 13, 2022 13:46
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And there are several having monitors with great color accuracy.
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Dec 13, 2022 14:34
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BobHoward posted:Dude, stop gaslighting. You spammed angry troll posts here for months, while screaming about how not-mad you were. That wasn't you fighting the good fight to inform people, it was just you getting weird mad online because nobody went along with your seething hatred for the studio display. ArcticZombie posted:You recently had a very measured view about gaming on macOS in response to others taking a very “gaming lolno” view which makes it very difficult for me to understand your complete 180 into being one of those people (worse in fact since you won’t shut up about it) when it comes to this monitor. Ah yes, “gaslighting” and “spamming angry troll posts” about a $2000 monitor whose primary value, as voiced by its own fans in this thread, is as a status purchase and a decorative object. You guys belong on the MacRumors forums, you’re absolutely embarrassing yourselves. If you don’t like critical, negative, mocking takes on obviously bad purchasing decisions and hoity-toity Apple products that give fanboys boners and make literally everybody else laugh at them, then maybe SomethingAwful dot com is not your site. Maybe the trolling was a bit much (I think it was funny, especially when you had people ITT literally being like “well I have the money to afford it, maybe you’re too poor”  ) but when people ask “is this piece of Apple hardware worth buying” in the Apple hardware thread I’m going to give them my honest opinion and give them as full an assessment of the product as I can.“This monitor sucks and isn’t worth overspending on, in my opinion” is not an extreme or “unmeasured” position, no matter how badly you might want to spin it as such.
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Dec 13, 2022 14:42
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TwoDice posted:if you only play slower paced games it's fine (nothing wrong with that!) but if you play anything fast then a 4k 120 or even 1440p 240hz monitor is wildly nicer than any current 5k or 6k monitor at 60hz. maybe I’m just not sensitive to input delay, I’ve never noticed a difference on any monitor I’ve ever owned and I’m not convinced it’s perceptible to the average person ( some monitors have really bad blur/smearing like the new 14/16” MacBook pros but I don’t think the studio display falls into that camp, it may be worse on paper than a gaming monitor but I doubt most people could tell the difference. Personally I will always take resolution over framerate, but I know there are plenty of people who value frame rates and input latency, and it comes down to what you do with the monitor and personal preference. We were all very happily playing fast paced FPS games for years at 60fps before high referesh rates started becoming the new big thing. I don’t think it’s reasonable to flat out say you can’t buy a studio display if you play games as that other poster did. The Lord Bude fucked around with this message at 14:51 on Dec 13, 2022 |
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Dec 13, 2022 14:49
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The Lord Bude posted:maybe I’m just not sensitive to input delay, I’ve never noticed a difference on any monitor I’ve ever owned. I will always take resolution over framerate, but I know there are plenty of people who value frame rates and input latency, and it comes down to what you do with the monitor and personal preference. We were all very happily playing fast paced FPS games for years at 60fps before high referesh rates started becoming the new big thing. I don’t think it’s reasonable to flat out say you can’t buy a studio display if you play games as that other poster did. We were not. I was lamenting from day 1 not being able to play at at least 85hz like my old crt because I sure as hell noticed a difference in input response time and pixel response time. It took over 15 years to get something close enough that didn't remind me everyday about how crappy lcd screens are. They are still bad, but at least tolerable in most instances now.
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Dec 13, 2022 14:54
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Even right now, I clearly notice the refresh rate difference between my 4-year old high-refresh rate desktop monitor and the 60hz one for the M2A. It is a big enough difference to be a bit jarring to me every time I switch. And that is just with moving the mouse cursor and scrolling pages or really, anything with motion that updates with the screen refresh rate.
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Dec 13, 2022 14:59
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Ok Comboomer posted:Ah yes, “gaslighting” and “spamming angry troll posts” about a $2000 monitor whose primary value, as voiced by its own fans in this thread, is as a status purchase and a decorative object. Except nobody is saying this except you. We’ve all been pretty clear that the primary value of the studio display (which isn’t $2000 incidentally, you’ve inflated its price by 25%) is the fact that it’s literally one of two monitors you can get that does 5k resolution at 27”. You seem completely unwilling or unable to grasp that that is very important to some people, for the reasons outlined, and that any other monitor is simply not up for consideration specifically because they don’t do the one thing we want, which is to be 5k. When your choice is between the LG ultrafine and the studio display personally I’m spending a little more for the studio display every time.
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Dec 13, 2022 14:59
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Kibner posted:Even right now, I clearly notice the refresh rate difference between my 4-year old high-refresh rate desktop monitor and the 60hz one for the M2A. It is a big enough difference to be a bit jarring to me every time I switch. And that is just with moving the mouse cursor and scrolling pages or really, anything with motion that updates with the screen refresh rate. ok most of us then. Actually I’d love to see a blind test done on say 1k random people to see how many of them can pick up a huge difference.
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Dec 13, 2022 15:01
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Ok Comboomer posted:Ah yes, “gaslighting” and “spamming angry troll posts” about a $2000 monitor whose primary value, as voiced by its own fans in this thread, is as a status purchase and a decorative object. The primary value is that you get perfect scaling of MacOS UI elements with zero artificating or aliasing. I'm not deep into the low level programming reasons why but I think it's something to do with the window server and how the Quartz Compositor translates a bitmap into an actual UI element, and how Apple chose to implement retina scaling. That's not going to matter to some (most?) people, but to the people it does matter to it's more important than high refresh rate or HDR or really any other feature. It drives a certain subset of Mac user absolutely insane. If it doesn't matter to you then you should not buy a Studio display, it's a terrible value. If it does matter to you then the Studio display is your only option (or you could buy a Pro Display XDR or a used Ultrafine but both of those are bad ideas). Penisaurus Sex fucked around with this message at 15:21 on Dec 13, 2022 |
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Dec 13, 2022 15:16
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The Lord Bude posted:Except nobody is saying this except you. We’ve all been pretty clear that the primary value of the studio display (which isn’t $2000 incidentally, you’ve inflated its price by 25%) is the fact that it’s literally one of two monitors you can get that does 5k resolution at 27”. You seem completely unwilling or unable to grasp that that is very important to some people, for the reasons outlined, and that any other monitor is simply not up for consideration specifically because they don’t do the one thing we want, which is to be 5k. Alright king. First of all:   pricing with basic glass, USD  pricing with nano-texture glass, USD Second: You’ve been putting words in my mouth a whole bunch and deliberately simplifying my takes to make them easier to refute. It’s lazy and dishonest and you should stop doing it because this thread is literally one big receipt. The very post that you’re dismissing notes that the display is 5K and visually very good, and also very pretty. I have never once shied away from those points. However, as you seem to keep missing constantly, 5K is not a baseline requirement for many (arguably most) Mac-using display buyers. You would do well to note that yesterday’s OP specifically said that they weren’t doing creative or color/resolution-specific work. They did not specifically ask for 5K, and when it was brought up to them by multiple posters aside from myself, they treated it as a minor consideration not worth the extra four-figure outlay over a third party one. trilobite terror fucked around with this message at 15:27 on Dec 13, 2022 |
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Dec 13, 2022 15:25
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Most people do not need nano textured glass; the monitor starts at 1599.
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Dec 13, 2022 16:20
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The Lord Bude posted:Most people do not need nano textured glass; the monitor starts at 1599. or height adjustment  
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Dec 13, 2022 16:31
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Yeah like I'unno I'll poo poo on the Studio Display until kingdom come but it needn't be labelled a $2000 display for that to happen. I stand by my assessment; adding 700 poundollars to the price to gain a K and some PPI at the cost of 60 or more hertz, hundreds of ms of response time and broad port compatibility is an unsatisfactory value proposition for people who are here for broad buck-bang appeal. It is sensible to advise most people against it for these reasons. And if someone decides, rightly or wrongly, that they absolutely must have 5K, or if they really just loving love pixel density, or, gently caress, even if they just want that Apple Logo Swag, well, gently caress it, they were never going to be talked out of it on pragmatic grounds anyway so why bother. We are an Apple Thread. We think it don't be how it is, but it do. Unironically, in this case, let people enjoy things.
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Dec 13, 2022 16:37
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Fedule posted:Yeah like I'unno I'll poo poo on the Studio Display until kingdom come but it needn't be labelled a $2000 display for that to happen. I stand by my assessment; adding 700 poundollars to the price to gain a K and some PPI at the cost of 60 or more hertz, hundreds of ms of response time and broad port compatibility is an unsatisfactory value proposition for people who are here for broad buck-bang appeal. It is sensible to advise most people against it for these reasons. And if someone decides, rightly or wrongly, that they absolutely must have 5K, or if they really just loving love pixel density, or, gently caress, even if they just want that Apple Logo Swag, well, gently caress it, they were never going to be talked out of it on pragmatic grounds anyway so why bother. We are an Apple Thread. We think it don't be how it is, but it do. Unironically, in this case, let people enjoy things. I agree with this whole post. In the OP’s case, they specifically asked from a wide “broad buck-bang appeal” perspective (and they wanted to hook up a console), hence my “I don’t think it’s worth it”. For the record, it’s a visually appealing color-accurate 5K screen and the cheapest way to get the full Apple desktop look without settling for 24” iMac performance. That said, I do think that the height adjustable stand is arguably as important as anything else (at minimum it’s a core part of the design’s aesthetic appeal) and I don’t think it’s fair to just write it off.
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Dec 13, 2022 16:51
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We're about to see a wave of ultrawide OLEDs hitting the monitor market for less than the price of a Studio Display.
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Dec 13, 2022 17:34
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Guys the point of triggering ok combooner about the studio display is to not earnestly engage with him on the topic, for that is a fool's errand.
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Dec 13, 2022 17:42
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MrBond posted:Guys the point of triggering ok combooner about the studio display is to not earnestly engage with him on the topic, for that is a fool's errand. yeah but I’m right tho and you don’t look cool when you trigger me you look like a cargo cult loser with more money than sense you look like a tesla owner
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Dec 13, 2022 17:46
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Having more money than sense owns. I wish I had more money than sense.
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Dec 13, 2022 17:52
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Corb3t posted:We're about to see a wave of ultrawide OLEDs hitting the monitor market for less than the price of a Studio Display. yeah but ultrawide monitors look stupid
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Dec 13, 2022 18:08
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actionjackson posted:yeah but ultrawide monitors look stupid unironically this
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Dec 13, 2022 18:09
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for non-ultrawide, the OLED ones seem to be at least 3k, like the LG ultrafines
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Dec 13, 2022 18:13
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I like how the Studio Display looks, I would never buy one.
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Dec 13, 2022 18:38
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American McGay posted:Having more money than sense owns. I wish I had more money than sense. I don't know whether the phrase used to be "more dollars than sense" or if I just always wished it were.
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Dec 13, 2022 18:44
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American McGay posted:Having more money than sense owns. I wish I had more money than sense. there are two ways to accomplish this and one is much cheaper and easier, from experience.
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Dec 13, 2022 18:49
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Any guess when Apple/3rd party stop developing for x86? As in, here are some old versions of our apps you can still download that still work for x86 but from now on there won't be anymore x86 builds. 5yrs? 10yrs?
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Dec 13, 2022 18:50
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At some point in the future.
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Dec 13, 2022 18:53
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I would guess when the last Intel Macs either hit their respective vintage or obsolete statuses. vintage = five to seven years after they stopped selling them. obsolete = seven years after. So somewhere in between 2025 and 2027 seems like a good rough deadline to get off x86 completely
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Dec 13, 2022 18:58
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Last Chance posted:I would guess when the last Intel Macs either hit their respective vintage or obsolete statuses. vintage = five to seven years after they stopped selling them. obsolete = seven years after. yeah I'm guessing 5-7 years after the last Intel Mac gets dropped, maybe a bit longer since it'll (probably) be the Mac Pro and there's arguably an expectation of longterm support there didn't apple do a buyback for certain PPC Macs? I know they did it for the liquid cooled G5s because they leaked, right? But did they ever do it for late-bought pro Macs more broadly?
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Dec 13, 2022 19:01
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Last Chance posted:I would guess when the last Intel Macs either hit their respective vintage or obsolete statuses. vintage = five to seven years after they stopped selling them. obsolete = seven years after. Apple is still selling an Intel Mac Mini and Mac Pro so probably even further out than that.
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Dec 13, 2022 19:08
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Ok Comboomer posted:expectation of longterm support there I mean 'we will support this older version for a bit' counts 'but newer versions of our app will not be x86'.
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Dec 13, 2022 19:09
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FCKGW posted:Apple is still selling an Intel Mac Mini and Mac Pro so probably even further out than that. bah i forgot about the mini! why?? Mac Pro I get but that mini sucks.
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Dec 13, 2022 19:10
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Maybe there's institutional users who need replacement stock of x86 minis for some reason. But that's not on brand for Apple to heed that need case.
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Dec 13, 2022 19:31
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Shaocaholica posted:Maybe there's institutional users who need replacement stock of x86 minis for some reason. But that's not on brand for Apple to heed that need case. https://youtu.be/Vhh_GeBPOhs
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Dec 13, 2022 19:34
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Last Chance posted:bah i forgot about the mini! why?? Mac Pro I get but that mini sucks. It’s the cheapest, smallest Mac and they sell a metric fuckton of them to business and industry.
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Dec 13, 2022 19:36
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FCKGW posted:It’s the cheapest, smallest Mac and they sell a metric fuckton of them to business and industry. If you make an app that's on Windows and Mac or on Android and iOS and you need x86 it's a useful/the cheapest tool if you're not going to commit to something like a Macbook Pro as your primary and you don't want multiple laptops. It lives on a desk or on top of a PC tower taking up virtually no space and stays out of the way TLDR: a fuckton of the global iOS devspace uses them and I guess Apple didn't think they had a fully workable replacement between the M1 Mini and M1M Studio (maybe yield issues with M1P? They didn't want to divert supply from the Macbook Pro which was selling faster than they could satisfy orders for for a good while?  )
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Dec 13, 2022 19:43
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FCKGW posted:It’s the cheapest, smallest Mac and they sell a metric fuckton of them to business and industry. The Intel Mac Mini starts at $1100 and the M1 Mac Mini starts at $700 
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Dec 13, 2022 19:45
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Ok Comboomer posted:TLDR: a fuckton of the global iOS devspace uses them Apple can just make them upgrade to AS mini why cater to that crowd 'as Apple'? Are they just waiting for old stock to sell out? That's still not the Apple way tho. Wouldn't Apple just 'discontinue' it but put all the old stock on the refurb store or sell the old stock to distributers instead of having it in their official store.
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Dec 13, 2022 19:45
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Shaocaholica posted:Apple can just make them upgrade to AS mini why cater to that crowd 'as Apple'? I amended my post as you were writing this, but my best guess is that Apple didn't think they could make enough M1P chips to satisfy both the Macbook Pro and Mac Mini demand last year? Maybe the rumors of a chassis redesign (with redesigned cooling system) are true, despite recent purported leaks claiming that no such chassis change is coming?
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Dec 13, 2022 19:50
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So the AS GPU, are 3rd party or Apple apps actually using those GPU cores for general purpose work like image processing? Not just synthetic performance but are real apps actually utilizing them? I don't even want to game on AS but are games even using them?
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Dec 13, 2022 20:03
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my neighbor's iphone was $200 less than my m2 air lol i bought a new second gen SE from ebay for 150. still in original packaging, maybe it was stolen by a store employee
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Dec 13, 2022 20:06
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