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this is also why you see Youtube videos with names like Reworked Classic Jill High Heels & Skirt All Cutscenes Gameplay - RE3 Remake 4K UHDR or Marvel's Midnight Suns All Cutscenes Full Movie (2022) 4K ULTRA HD, or any number of porn clip titles, it's definitely not a problem exclusive to web serials youtube tweaks their algorithm pretty regularly, so the effectiveness of an overstuffed title comes and goes, but it's not hard to find a lot of lovely hustle tutorial videos with names like Get Paid +$28.18 EVERY 10 Minutes FROM Google Translate! $845.40/Day (Make Money Online 2022) that also suggest you overstuff your titles putting the year in the title is the one that really cracks me up, but it makes sense if you've done enough youtube searches that came back with videos from a decade ago; I have to put the year or the month+year in for a lot of Google searches, as well, for the same reason Lunatic Sledge fucked around with this message at 22:57 on Dec 18, 2022 |
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Dec 18, 2022 22:53
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Selkie Myth posted:Now, they USED to bonk people for incorrect titles. If you called your story "Harry Potter and the Apples and Bananas" but your cover had "Apples and Bananas" as the title, they got grumpy.
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Dec 18, 2022 22:56
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lmao, "i'm told" "should be" "don't have a clear timeline" "should be at least" feels like ee has no idea what's happening with his own story. is that all he's said? wonder who got shook enough to push back taking the original down, especially after telling everyone it was going away dec 31. Horizon Burning fucked around with this message at 14:27 on Dec 19, 2022 |
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Dec 19, 2022 14:17
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Horizon Burning posted:lmao, "i'm told" "should be" "don't have a clear timeline" "should be at least" feels like ee has no idea what's happening with his own story. is that all he's said? wonder who got shook enough to push back taking the original down, especially after telling everyone it was going away dec 31. He told everyone "at least december 31", not for sure december 31. naturally we planned for the worst and archived the poo poo out of the site and warned any new readers we knew. And yeah, that's all he said other than that he'd be back on the discord when the press release goes up.
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Dec 19, 2022 15:58
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Peachfart posted:Usually before I read a story, I wait for it to have a decent amount of chapters and I read the blurb to see if it sounds interesting. Then I go and read a few negative reviews to see if they make valid points (ie The story is bad/repetitive, etc) or if the negative reviews are stupid, which usually means the story is decent. This is objectively the best way to evaluate reviews for any sort of media - negative reviews always tell you much more, even (if not especially) when the reviews are dumb.
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Dec 20, 2022 01:14
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LLSix posted:Anyone know what's up with The Last Orellen? The last update was 4 months ago, so I'm tempted to think it's been dropped after 25 excellent chapters. Yo hold the loving phone I just noticed this is back
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Dec 20, 2022 16:15
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So I picked up volume 1 of Beneath the Dragon Eye Moons audio book as I had a spare audible credit and I’m maybe fifteen chapters in and at the risk of getting scortched… is Elaine supposed to be an idiot? Is her complete empty headedness intentional or is she just a “lol I’m an isekei protagonist how quirky and spacey I am isn’t that just zany?” It can’t all be just her being a kid, right? She still has an adults mind from how she sometimes talks but others it’s like a picture of the three cats and the third type of cat is a cat who has never thought anything in their life? Elaine just classed up if that tells you anything Edit: Lol her friend died because Elaine didn’t bother sterilizing the bandages or change them and Lira got an infection and died. Oops! Its Rinaldo fucked around with this message at 00:45 on Dec 22, 2022 |
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Dec 22, 2022 00:42
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Its Rinaldo posted:So I picked up volume 1 of Beneath the Dragon Eye Moons audio book as I had a spare audible credit and I’m maybe fifteen chapters in and at the risk of getting scortched… is Elaine supposed to be an idiot? Is her complete empty headedness intentional or is she just a “lol I’m an isekei protagonist how quirky and spacey I am isn’t that just zany?” It can’t all be just her being a kid, right? She still has an adults mind from how she sometimes talks but others it’s like a picture of the three cats and the third type of cat is a cat who has never thought anything in their life? yeah she's kind of a dip poo poo the entire way through. i don't think anyone else ever really calls her out on being a moron either despite an almost inhuman lack of self discipline the second she's alone which is really weird for a career military officer in any universe. honestly it's probably what got me to stop reading it eventually. has that like... falling forward energy.
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Dec 22, 2022 00:47
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Yeah if she’s gonna be like that maybe I’ll finish out this book and leave it at that. Edit: Or maybe sooner! Jesus Christ she just tried to bill a rape victim literally mid breakdown. What the gently caress!
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Dec 22, 2022 01:09
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My impression was that while Elaine has memories from her past life she is very much running on the 'mental hardware' of a smart eight year old at the start of the series. Also she has ADHD.
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Dec 22, 2022 17:14
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I think a lot of characters need to / are written starting really, really dumb for ease of demonstrable character growth. Sometimes makes it hard to get into the first few though but IMO is eventually worth it, I'm current on it and really enjoy the series.
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Dec 22, 2022 18:07
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Its Rinaldo posted:So I picked up volume 1 of Beneath the Dragon Eye Moons audio book as I had a spare audible credit and I’m maybe fifteen chapters in and at the risk of getting scortched… is Elaine supposed to be an idiot? Is her complete empty headedness intentional or is she just a “lol I’m an isekei protagonist how quirky and spacey I am isn’t that just zany?” It can’t all be just her being a kid, right? She still has an adults mind from how she sometimes talks but others it’s like a picture of the three cats and the third type of cat is a cat who has never thought anything in their life? You're probably not going to be happier with the later books. Elaine's decision-making skills go up and down, but never reach much above adequate. Later books emphasize her poor decision making; poor impulse control; and dearth of social skills to the point that she's eventually assigned a minder to handle talking to other people for her. This discussion has got me thinking, are there any isekai stories where the protagonist makes objectively good decisions? If the narrative has to retroactively twist itself into knots to justify their decisions it doesn't count. I guess Beware of Chicken's protag consistently makes moral decisions, but he also has a tendency to get himself into a great deal of trouble in the process.
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Dec 22, 2022 19:38
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Ar'Kendrythist continues to be the answer. Erik messes up, but he generally makes good choices and he adjusts to new information while maintaining his moral compass.
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Dec 22, 2022 19:46
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There's this new story called THE LEVEL ZERO [HERO]: AMELIA that's at the top of the Rising Stars in RR. I checked out. It's like a slightly better spellchecked Azarinth Healer; just a cludge of generic litrpg tropes. And *of course* the Patreon is already at ~10K.
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Dec 22, 2022 20:18
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Wittgen posted:Ar'Kendrythist continues to be the answer. Erik messes up, but he generally makes good choices and he adjusts to new information while maintaining his moral compass. he's fuckin dumb as poo poo though
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Dec 22, 2022 20:21
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Megazver posted:There's this new story called THE LEVEL ZERO [HERO]: AMELIA that's at the top of the Rising Stars in RR. Not sure "already" is the right word for an author with multiple previous works.
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Dec 22, 2022 20:24
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yeah that’s the salvos author’s new thing. I didn’t read it because, well, it’s by the author of salvos, but it’s not exactly shocking that it’s being read by a lot of fans of their existing work
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Dec 22, 2022 20:29
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MadHat posted:Not sure "already" is the right word for an author with multiple previous works. Oh, true. Somehow didn't realize it. Still, don't read it.
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Dec 22, 2022 21:06
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LLSix posted:This discussion has got me thinking, are there any isekai stories where the protagonist makes objectively good decisions? Yes and also no. Yes in that there are plenty of trashy isekai on RR where the author thinks the MC is always making the correct decisions No in that basically all of those authors are morons and/or fuckwads so welp
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Dec 22, 2022 21:11
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LLSix posted:This discussion has got me thinking, are there any isekai stories where the protagonist makes objectively good decisions? If the narrative has to retroactively twist itself into knots to justify their decisions it doesn't count. Rational Fics, according to reddit / tvtropes edit: also just learned the phrase "competence porn," that's good
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Dec 22, 2022 22:23
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it's part of the genre trope to have isekai protagonists be dipshits. now in the case of Japanese light novels, this is because almost all of those are on some level a comedy and that's how you enable bumbling slapstick humor. this gets lost in translation to western equivalents though and instead we just get protagonists with questionable judgement and a learning disability that is typically not played for laughs. it's just annoying, imo.
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Dec 22, 2022 22:48
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LLSix posted:This discussion has got me thinking, are there any isekai stories where the protagonist makes objectively good decisions? If the narrative has to retroactively twist itself into knots to justify their decisions it doesn't count. Jackal Among Snakes' thing is kind of the MC doing mental laps around everyone, though it's been leaning towards his cheat becoming less reliable lately. It's really the closest I can think of, though.
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Dec 22, 2022 23:08
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LLSix posted:You're probably not going to be happier with the later books. Elaine's decision-making skills go up and down, but never reach much above adequate. Later books emphasize her poor decision making; poor impulse control; and dearth of social skills to the point that she's eventually assigned a minder to handle talking to other people for her. Here's the issue, and it's fundamental to the question "Why is every [Isekai] protagonist an idiot?" There's a few different factors: 1) The differing perspective factor. Everyone interprets the world differently. One man's brilliant decision is another's "What is this idiot thinking?" I like to use "keeping secrets" as a classic one. "I should keep the secret." Person A: "That's dumb! Why wouldn't you tell anyone?" Person B" "That's right! Don't tell anyone!" Alright... Author writes the MC telling the secret. Person A: "Excellent! Confiding in a trusted mentor will help you use the secret well!" Person B: "YOU IDIOT!!!" That's the first hurdle. You're never going to agree with all the moves the author thinks is smart for the MC to make, just due to life n poo poo. 2) The "Author is only human" factor. I'm one person. I've got a deadline. I can only imagine so many things, I can only come up with so many plans. I literally can't think of everything, and I can't tell you how many times I've had people say "Why didn't Elaine do X?" in the comments, only for me to go "Ah, derp. Yes. That would've been a good idea." I think about stuff. I plan stuff. But I also need to think about and plan out THE ENTIRE WORLD, and handle ALL the characters, people, animals, governments, systems, impacts, magic... there's a lot of stuff. I'm human, I can't hit it all. 3) Down with the Mary Sue! A character that's perfectly rational and always makes the correct decision no matter what, and has every solution to every problem is a gigantic pain in the rear end to read. They flawlessly solve all problems to a cheering audience, and... just no. I get that some people want to read this sort of thing, but it's not the sort of story I enjoy writing or reading. To this end, characters need flaws. They need things they're bad at - but at the same token, they need things they're good at. Nobody wants to read the story of how McFumble stumbles his way into every answer. Characters need strong points, and they need weak points. It's one thing if the weak point is cripplingly bad, but it's another if the character acknowledges it's a weak point, and finds ways around it. BTDEM Example: Elaine isn't good at bartering. She makes up for this weakness by making enough money that it doesn't matter as much that she's being fleeced a little by the local merchants, she's got the spare coin. Hand in hand with this, characters do need growth. I'd like to think Elaine's worked on and grown out of a few dozen of her flaws, and I can even point some of them out. By the same token, there are some where she'll always be papering them over. And yes, early BTDEM Elaine IS annoying. She's too cocky and sure of herself without anything to back it up... sound like any other teenagers you know?
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Dec 22, 2022 23:43
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jesus christ
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Dec 23, 2022 00:20
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Bremen posted:Jackal Among Snakes' thing is kind of the MC doing mental laps around everyone, though it's been leaning towards his cheat becoming less reliable lately. Probably unrealistic but I enjoyed it.
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Dec 23, 2022 00:30
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you can just say you copied the trend dude.
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Dec 23, 2022 00:32
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Larry Parrish posted:you can just say you copied the trend dude. You seem like a cool guy.
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Dec 23, 2022 00:35
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congratulations to isekai writers for having invented main characters who make bad decisions, I don’t know what fiction would have done without you
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Dec 23, 2022 00:37
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Selkie Myth posted:A character that's perfectly rational and always makes the correct decision no matter what, and has every solution to every problem is a gigantic pain in the rear end to read. They flawlessly solve all problems to a cheering audience, and... just no. I get that some people want to read this sort of thing, but it's not the sort of story I enjoy writing or reading. I mean, I don't really agree with this. I love competent, logical protagonists, but it doesn't mean they're never challenged. And if I'm mentally shouting at a MC "You idiot! Don't do that!" odds are I'm going to drop the story in short order. Take, oh, to be thread topical Zorian from Mother of Learning. He's generally pretty rational and thinks things through; he isn't always right, but that comes down to problems in the information he has rather than his ability to process it. But he probably suffers a lot more adversity than, say, Erin from TWI (first two books, as far as I got), who never seems to actually spend time considering things but has them always work out. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed BtDEM the last time I caught up on it (and Elaine always felt more ADHD than actual bad decision making - which is good because the MC acting like an idiot is what made me drop TWI), but I disagree with you on this point specifically. Bremen fucked around with this message at 01:02 on Dec 23, 2022 |
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Dec 23, 2022 00:50
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Horizon Burning posted:jesus christ Maybe let's not meet actual effort with sneering at people.
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Dec 23, 2022 00:56
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*is looking for where Selkie said they or Isekai invented flawed protagonists and can't find it* I see them explaining the use of a generally accepted writing principle in their own work. Personally I do enjoy the rare story where a MC makes all good decisions and is appropriately challenged nonetheless, but that's a rare and fantastical story indeed. I think it is much easier to write flawed decision making but do it in a character consistent way. Tom Clancy is Dead fucked around with this message at 01:24 on Dec 23, 2022 |
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Dec 23, 2022 01:21
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Cicero posted:What's the point of this post? If you write something like that in response to mild criticism and you're making 200,000 on patreon with one of the industry's best agents then get some perspective maybe?? Horizon Burning fucked around with this message at 01:38 on Dec 23, 2022 |
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Dec 23, 2022 01:35
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i kinda hate when authors talking about their books tbh. doesn't really matter why or where.
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Dec 23, 2022 01:38
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Horizon Burning posted:If you write something like that in response to mild criticism and you're making 200,000 on patreon with one of the industry's best agents then get some perspective maybe?? It’s fascinating when people post “Ignore me, please”. Weird flex, but ok.
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Dec 23, 2022 01:39
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I think PracGuide does a good job of handling the protagonist making "reasonable bad decisions." Almost everything Catherine does, even when it's stupid, can at least be understood (and her bad decision-making largely coincides with either the point in the story where she's young/inexperienced or the point when she's heavily under the influence of Winter).Wittgen posted:Ar'Kendrythist continues to be the answer. Erik messes up, but he generally makes good choices and he adjusts to new information while maintaining his moral compass. Erick fits into a same category as Catherine IMO (though with him having a very different personality and set of flaws). He does dumb poo poo, but in a way that is usually believable.
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Dec 23, 2022 01:57
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I never really liked Elaine in BtDEM, and eventually dropped it, but the story is well written and I think the author deserves every dollar she has gotten from it
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Dec 23, 2022 02:01
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Bremen posted:Jackal Among Snakes' thing is kind of the MC doing mental laps around everyone, though it's been leaning towards his cheat becoming less reliable lately. Jakal Among Snakes really showcases the problem with Smart Protagonists. Because often the author isn't smart enough to have the MC run mental laps around actual people, so you just get an average dude out thinking the dumbest people alive.
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Dec 23, 2022 02:03
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Dumb protagonists are fine but they shouldn't be world-beaters because that means the world is dumb.
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Dec 23, 2022 02:43
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Selkie Myth posted:And yes, early BTDEM Elaine IS annoying. She's too cocky and sure of herself without anything to back it up... sound like any other teenagers you know? Yeah tbh dense protagonists are really only annoying when they keep making the same mistake over and over without changing or addressing it. Dumb but gets better is interesting. I think people get wary of it though in webnovel stuff? Cause you can't really tell early on if a character is improving, or if it's just going to be a frustrating story. Also in an isekai the MC is stuck in a literal out of context problem. They are working off of very incomplete information, and even if they were perfectly rational mentats they would be making tons of bad calls just from not knowing any better.
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Dec 23, 2022 03:01
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Horizon Burning posted:If you write something like that They were explaining from their perspective why characters tend to up a certain way in the genre, they weren't combative or hostile at all. So what's the problem? Meanwhile your "jesus christ" in response to effort just brings people down for no reason. Why use a one liner to dunk on someone who's actually trying? Cicero fucked around with this message at 03:05 on Dec 23, 2022 |
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Dec 23, 2022 03:02
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