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This loving sucks.
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Jan 3, 2023 13:59
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drat Dirty Ape posted:This loving sucks.
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Jan 3, 2023 14:06
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Asproigerosis posted:Yeah as it stands there isn't anything about this the NFL could possibly have done to prevent short of mandatory cardiac mri for all players that get covid? Complete speculation on my part, but if he had covid 6 weeks ago and presumably myocarditis, I could see a high risk of blunt trauma causing a deadly rhythm disturbance cause the conduction chain is all hosed up from the inflammation. Lol why the hell is this a probe, he was talking about the real and dangerous disease itself, which the player just had Or are we not allowed to talk about how Covid is bad and has potentially harmful long term effects?
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Jan 3, 2023 14:43
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LeeMajors posted:But to be a complete realist out of hospital cardiac arrest generally has something like a 0.4% survival rate. maybe for unwitnessed events. It's like 10% surivval to hospital discharg for people who experience witnessed cardiac arrests and undergo CPR. Likely higher for this guy since he's young and doesnt have other comorbidities This was probably the best possible circumstqnces to suffer a cardiac arrest .. young healthy guy undergoes shockable malignant rhythm, gets Immediate medical attention/CPR/AED and swift transport to top tier hospital. It'll be a few days until they can prognosticate, all the sedation involved in the post-arrest cooling takes a while to clear out and you cant assess neuro effectively until then
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Jan 3, 2023 14:46
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A Buffer Gay Dude posted:Lol why the hell is this a probe, he was talking about the real and dangerous disease itself, which the player just had Yeah that's a bullshit probe
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Jan 3, 2023 14:49
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Was watching last night when it happened. Knew something was seriously wrong when the medical staff were frantic, knew it wasn't a typical injury. Reminds me of when Dale Earnhardt died in Daytona, had the same feel, medical staff was frantic and everyone else was in shock. Nobody knew what to do. I hope he pulls through ok this is horrible 
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Jan 3, 2023 14:50
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This guy made it: https://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/article/eriksen-plays-at-world-cup-after-cardiac-arrest-at-euro-2020/ "After Eriksen collapsed during Denmark’s opening Euro 2020 group game against Finland in June of last year, medics used a defibrillator to restart his heart as a horrified nation — and much of the soccer world — watched on as he lay lifeless on the field at Parken Stadium in Copenhagen."
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Jan 3, 2023 14:52
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BIG-DICK-BUTT-gently caress posted:maybe for unwitnessed events. It's like 10% surivval to hospital discharg for people who experience witnessed cardiac arrests and undergo CPR. Likely higher for this guy since he's young and doesnt have other comorbidities Yeah, it struck me this morning that if this is from some underlying medical issue (And not a result of what happened in the game), it's perversely lucky it happened during a game. Like, do teams have ambulances on stand-by for practices?
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Jan 3, 2023 14:53
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BIG-DICK-BUTT-gently caress posted:maybe for unwitnessed events. It's like 10% surivval to hospital discharg for people who experience witnessed cardiac arrests and undergo CPR. Likely higher for this guy since he's young and doesnt have other comorbidities You're right--looking back I quoted traumatic arrest survival from ITLS which doesn't really qualify here (although it is traumatic etiology, this is truly a medical event). I think I last saw 8% for Utstein inclusive medical OHCA events from the AHA, but I'll admit I haven't looked that hard for numbers in a few years. I agree with everything you said here--he has by far the best possible circumstances for survival all around. And yeah, he's on a wave of ketamine or propofol or benzos right now while they keep him nice and cool for another 12-24hrs. We can't really draw any conclusions from him being ventilated still. Like I said earlier though, it concerns me if they were having to perform compressions for up to 10min. VF with an AED nearby should be pretty quickly correctable in this case, as I wouldn't expect it to be particularly refractory. LeeMajors fucked around with this message at 14:56 on Jan 3, 2023 |
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Jan 3, 2023 14:53
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Applebees Appetizer posted:Was watching last night when it happened. Knew something was seriously wrong when the medical staff were frantic, knew it wasn't a typical injury. And like with Earnhardt, it initially looked routine (as routine as things like that go, anyway) like you've seen a thousand times before. I was watching the night Owen Hart died in 1999 and I have the same feeling now that I did then. Something about this tells me it's grim. I hope to gently caress I'm wrong.
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Jan 3, 2023 14:53
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So wait, did the dude have covid six weeks ago or what? I've heard it mentioned twice but couldn't find anything saying it on google or twitter or anything, because, well, searching "Hamlin covid" gets you exactly what you'd think it would right now.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:00
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BigBallChunkyTime posted:And like with Earnhardt, it initially looked routine (as routine as things like that go, anyway) like you've seen a thousand times before. Yeah, the crash was pretty normal and didn't look bad at all really. But I remember Kenny Schrader crashing with him, then getting out of his car to check on Dale and freaking out at what he saw. Then the medical staff were all frantic trying to get him out of the car and into the ambulance, it had a really eerie feel to it just like last night.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:03
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A Buffer Gay Dude posted:Lol why the hell is this a probe, he was talking about the real and dangerous disease itself, which the player just had Demonstrable long term effects even... quote:The cardiovascular complications of acute coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) are well described, but the post-acute cardiovascular manifestations of COVID-19 have not yet been comprehensively characterized. Here we used national healthcare databases from the US Department of Veterans Affairs to build a cohort of 153,760 individuals with COVID-19, as well as two sets of control cohorts with 5,637,647 (contemporary controls) and 5,859,411 (historical controls) individuals, to estimate risks and 1-year burdens of a set of pre-specified incident cardiovascular outcomes. We show that, beyond the first 30 d after infection, individuals with COVID-19 are at increased risk of incident cardiovascular disease spanning several categories, including cerebrovascular disorders, dysrhythmias, ischemic and non-ischemic heart disease, pericarditis, myocarditis, heart failure and thromboembolic disease. These risks and burdens were evident even among individuals who were not hospitalized during the acute phase of the infection and increased in a graded fashion according to the care setting during the acute phase (non-hospitalized, hospitalized and admitted to intensive care). Our results provide evidence that the risk and 1-year burden of cardiovascular disease in survivors of acute COVID-19 are substantial. Care pathways of those surviving the acute episode of COVID-19 should include attention to cardiovascular health and disease. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-022-01689-3
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Jan 3, 2023 15:04
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MJeff posted:So wait, did the dude have covid six weeks ago or what? I've heard it mentioned twice but couldn't find anything saying it on google or twitter or anything, because, well, searching "Hamlin covid" gets you exactly what you'd think it would right now. I cannot find anything either, so I’m guessing no. A Buffer Gay Dude posted:Lol why the hell is this a probe, he was talking about the real and dangerous disease itself, which the player just had Because op and you don’t know poo poo and need to get to sucking my dick from the back
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Jan 3, 2023 15:07
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*athlete has heart attack* *people give reasonable explanation of how that could occur in these circumstances* “IT MUSTA BEEN DA COVID EYYYYY” For real, get to sucking (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jan 3, 2023 15:10
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idk about you but I think post-covid symptoms would also count as a "reasonable explanation" at least as much as anything can be, given what we know (very little)
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Jan 3, 2023 15:14
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Soup du Jour posted:https://twitter.com/doulbedoink/status/1610108853089099778?s=46&t=WTVhB5ytphQPUvPLHx0byg Just gonna quote this post for no particular reason.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:17
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I think there’s probably some room for medical professionals handling Hamlin’s care to explore if covid had some effect on what happened, I do not think there is a single way that letting this discussion happen in this thread ends with anyone happy with the outcome.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:18
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Chief McHeath posted:*athlete has heart attack* Uche Nwaneri, a dude who played 6 or 7 years for the jags and went to Purdue died Friday of a heart attack. He was very active on social media and downright rabid against anti-vaxers. He was an overweight, middle-aged man, checked a lot of boxes for cardiac risk factors, but the nuts have picked up on his death and done the same.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:18
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Chief McHeath posted:*athlete has heart attack*
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Jan 3, 2023 15:19
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Chief McHeath posted:
Probed goon is in the medical field.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:25
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Chief McHeath posted:*athlete has heart attack* What is wrong with you man?
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Jan 3, 2023 15:25
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this thread needs cpr
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Jan 3, 2023 15:27
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Anime Store Adventure posted:I think there’s probably some room for medical professionals handling Hamlin’s care to explore if covid had some effect on what happened, "It might have been caused by covid" "Yeah, maybe, and here's another thing thats unrelated and could also explain it" seems like a normal conversation to me that people should be capable of having
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Jan 3, 2023 15:28
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blue squares posted:"It might have been caused by covid" You’re correct, it should be, but it won’t be, and it currently isn’t!
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Jan 3, 2023 15:29
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wernox posted:Uche Nwaneri, a dude who played 6 or 7 years for the jags and went to Purdue died Friday of a heart attack. He was very active on social media and downright rabid against anti-vaxers. He was an overweight, middle-aged man, checked a lot of boxes for cardiac risk factors, but the nuts have picked up on his death and done the same. covid vaccination being a cause and covid being a cause are two very different scenarios btw, only one of which warrants serious consideration e: maybe the best way to head all this stuff off is to say 'no further medical speculation in this thread' because I doubt there's much new to say anyway Vando fucked around with this message at 15:35 on Jan 3, 2023 |
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Jan 3, 2023 15:31
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I think it’s an ok question to ask if myocarditis increases cardiac irritability (I’m sure it does) but also commotio cord is is well-known and there’s a clear mechanism and overall it seems weird to do the Joe Rogan Just Asking Questions nonsense over this.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:34
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Welp I guess no news is good news at this point. Hope he gets some sort of meaningful recovery.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:34
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While this is obviously terrible, Local sports radio actually made a good point in stating that had this happened in his back yard, he'd probably have died immediately, but they had team and independent medical pros within 15 yards on hand. I guess the question is; should they need to😔
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Jan 3, 2023 15:35
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Vando posted:idk about you but I think post-covid symptoms would also count as a "reasonable explanation" at least as much as anything can be, given what we know (very little) I had covid pretty bad in 2020 and I still have heart (and lung) complications, so if he had covid it’s entirely reasonable to speculate it being a factor just as anything else we’ve speculated about. It’s not like they were saying the vaccine caused it. That response was weirdly aggressive and dumb as hell.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:35
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Elephanthead posted:Welp I guess no news is good news at this point. Hope he gets some sort of meaningful recovery. Unfortunately this isn’t true We’re in a period of no news either way but the less news we end up getting the worse it probably is
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Jan 3, 2023 15:36
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at this point it's all just speculation, and there's no way we're gonna know until the family/team is willing to release more info, but that buffalo bills tweet from 2am sounded sorta promising.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:38
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LeeMajors posted:
Medical stuff I’m wondering what the protocol is for acls in the nfl in that situation? How quick can they get his pads off to do compressions? How long before it actually started? How long before someone realized what was actually happening? His heart was stopped when he dropped. It wasn’t stopped when they finally realized he was unresponsive, checked his pulse, rolled him over, realized what was happening, got his pads and jersey on, did a pulse check, started compressions, got the AED on, got a 12 lead hooked up etc
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Jan 3, 2023 15:43
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Apples McGrind posted:at this point it's all just speculation, and there's no way we're gonna know until the family/team is willing to release more info, but that buffalo bills tweet from 2am sounded sorta promising. Yeah that’s my point. Nobody knows anything except people close to the situation and they’re not saying anything yet. Getting pissed at people (especially those in medical field) for offering up ideas* on what could have been the problem isn’t helpful. If speculation is the problem then we should just close the thread until something substantial comes out. *except those assholes on Twitter saying it was the vaccine, those people should rightfully be poo poo on.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:44
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Elephanthead posted:Welp I guess no news is good news at this point. Absolutely not. We don't know how his brain was affected.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:47
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Every hospital ICU is chock full of geriatric ROSC patients with no Avenue to good neuro outcomes. We absolutely know nothing other than his heart is still beating.FizFashizzle posted:Medical stuff Honest question, are you required any sort of large body trauma life support credentialing as a PA? ITLS/PHTLS all goes into this but athletic trainers (or any medical specialist near specialized clothing or equipment think fire dept, bomb squad etc) have explicit training to quickly remove pads/helmets etc for resus. I’ve got some training on it but pads are designed to remove quickly or with few tools and training staff would know how to knock it out immediately. Typically I think you can cut ties over the chest and immediately have full access iirc
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Jan 3, 2023 15:48
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Since commotio cordis is the topic, one of the best hockey players ever nearly died after taking a slap shot right by his heart. https://twitter.com/chrispronger/status/1610282040544432130?s=20&t=zMENEhy7EB-5xNH5MMXJhg
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Jan 3, 2023 15:48
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FizFashizzle posted:Medical stuff Maybe I'm cynical, but I suspect the only long-term thing that will come out of this (for the NFL) will be better training and making sure the right equipment is available in every stadium.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:51
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Hey guys I'd and I'm sure most others would appreciate it if we kept it civil here. This isn't the time nor the place for shitposting. Lee and Fiz, I appreciate your perspective from the health side of things. I had a horrible night sleep; I couldn't stop thinking about this situation. A feeling of hopelessness definitely creeps in, so I understand why people may lash out here. But... Please don't. You can do it anywhere else in TFF and no one is going to give a poo poo, but not here.
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Jan 3, 2023 15:52
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Impossibly Perfect Sphere posted:Maybe I'm cynical, but I suspect the only long-term thing that will come out of this (for the NFL) will be better training and making sure the right equipment is available in every stadium. I guess their is always room for improvement, but you have a full MD on each sideline, a professional training staff, and an EMT/ambulance crew right outside the tunnel. What else could you have?
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