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DivineCoffeeBinge posted:Not so much "struggling to fold in the Avengers," though, considering it was a five-issue story and three of them were issues of the Avengers (well, two Avengers, one Avengers West Coast) Before 1993, I don't think there was much of a barrier between the X-Books and Everything else; the X-Men were a major part of pretty much every crossover/event that happened before 1993 (both Secret Wars, the Infinity Gauntlet/War/Crusade books, Acts of Vengeance) and the biggest X-Men event (Inferno) also spread out into other books. There were also plenty of smaller crossovers like Bloodties, with X-Men/X-Men characters appearing in other books, and other characters appearing in the X-Men books throughout the 1970s/1980s/early 1990s. So Bloodties was not the centerpiece of the the timeline of X-Men/Marvel crossovers, though not long after Bloodties, Tom DeFalco got fired as editor in chief and Marvel reorganized so there was no singular editor-in-chief but instead lines/fiefdoms of books run by Bob Harras, Mark Gruenwald, Bobbie Chase, etc. That lasted less than a year before Bob Harras (the X-Editor) became the full editor-in-chief. Almost immediately he started trying to bring in the Image guys and tried to farm out everything that wasn't X-Men or Spider-Man to other people. This all kicked off with Onslaught, an X-Men crossover that touched every corner of the Marvel Universe and ended with the Avengers and FF "dying" and going over into the Liefeld/Lee Heroes Reborn books. They eventually came back, but arguably the period of like 1996-2000 was the biggest "X-Men basically exist in their own corner of the universe" period of publication, and even then the last Big Marvel Event for several years was Maximum Security, a crossover that also involved the X-Men pretty heavily. One of the other "let's farm out everything besides X-Men and Spider-Man" efforts from Harras was Marvel Knights, which was ultimately Harras's undoing as the new management at Marvel liked Joe Quesada's MK work more than Harras's work on everything else, and replaced him as editor in chief. The early Jemas/Quesada era was really light on crossovers/events in general, which meant the X-Books were pretty separated, both from everything else and each other. This was also true for just about every comic for several years. When the Quesada/Jemas regime finally decided to do a Big Marvel Event 4-5 years in it was... "Astonishing X-Men/New Avengers: House of M" which as the full title suggests, involved the X-Men touching other books. It was another year before Marvel reacquired the rights to Iron Man. There is/was a decent argument to be made that all of the events from Civil War onwards "drag along the X-Men", but only in the sense that they were not the inciting incident/characters for the crossover; the X-Books still participated in Civil War, Secret Invasion, Fear Itself, etc. Avengers vs. X-Men was co-headlined, as was Inhumans vs. X-Men. Secret Wars was rumored to somehow write out the X-Men, but they ended up getting a dozen tie-in mini-series during the event. I know that the latter day Perlmutter era made some moves (both in comics and especially in licensing) to reduce the outsized influence of the X-Men, but I don't really see many (or really any) concerted efforts to separate them from the Marvel Universe. It's true that a bunch of 2000s/2010s crossovers didn't have the X-Men as a focal point, but that was true in the 1980s and 1990s as well, and other than the fact that there's usually a dozen X-Books at any point after 1995, I don't see how it's that different than Daredevil or Spider-Man or Thor or Hulk or the Fantastic Four or Punisher "getting dragged into" events that do not focus on them. That doesn't mean they aren't really part of the mainline Marvel Universe.
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Dec 30, 2022 04:08
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The “No More Mutants” really overshadows what a big deal just doing the event was. X-Men was riding the Whedon wave after Morrison, and Bendis had dragged the Avengers franchise into the 21st century. The two franchises were pretty much on equal footing for the first time.
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Dec 30, 2022 04:32
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Forge follows the Five Second Rule. I love it.
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Dec 30, 2022 15:11
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Connor from cerebro probably had to go and dig a grave so he could spin in it after that splash page of jean slapping maddie
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Dec 31, 2022 03:56
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So at y’all’s recommendation I made my way through Dawn of X and then X of Swords. I liked them! Couple questions. If I’m invested in this realm of books, what are they called? X-books? Like I haven’t touched any of the avengers/fantastic 4/whatever else and I’m okay with that. I was going with the reading lists that Unlimited provides for Dawn/Swords and noticed a stray Empyre issue in there. Now I’m just going by release date until I get to the hellfire gala event and there’s an issue of SWORD (#2) that looks like it’s dealing with King in Black stuff. It wasn’t labeled that on the cover, but the earth’s atmosphere is covered in a layer of symbiote goop? If I don’t really care about non-x related stuff, am I missing out by skipping empyre and king in black? If these are monumental pieces of story telling I can check them out, but if there are just some tangentially related issues scattered in to the broader x books, I can probably skip. Also, in a sea of good art, the X-Force issues are standing out as very not that. The story is kind of interesting but David Baldeon just draws people unpleasantly. E: I’m sorry if this has all been addressed earlier in the thread. I’m trying to avoid spoiling these stories as I read through them so I’ve skipped a lot of posts. zelah fucked around with this message at 00:21 on Jan 2, 2023 |
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Jan 2, 2023 00:18
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Empyre is an okay story but doesn't matter much to the X-Men outside of SWORD and X-Men Red. So you'll be able to pick up on what happens in them well enough without finding the storyline. Same with King in Black, except the story is pretty bad.
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Jan 2, 2023 01:01
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zelah posted:If I don’t really care about non-x related stuff, am I missing out by skipping empyre and king in black? If these are monumental pieces of story telling I can check them out, but if there are just some tangentially related issues scattered in to the broader x books, I can probably skip. Most big "crossover stories" in modern comics are written in such a way that - at least in theory - if you're not following the whole crossover but are instead just reading a book or two, you should be able to keep doing that. So for the King in Black tie-in specifically, for example - there's a bunch of Symbiote Things happening and it's all very scare and if all you're reading is SWORD, you don't really have to give a poo poo about it. Anything you desperately need to know, you'll find in those SWORD issues. Where did the symbiotes come from? What's going on? Who beats the bad guy in the end? Don't worry about that stuff, you don't have to care. So, in general, that's the guideline. Don't worry about it. If an event or a crossover is spinning out of the X-books, well, that might be a whole other thing - but Empyre is effectively an Avengers story and King in Black is essentially a Venom story, so, yeah, basically just don't sweat it.
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Jan 2, 2023 01:07
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honestly i think the only thing that really followed up on empyre was Last Annihilation
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Jan 2, 2023 01:11
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Yeah you don't need to read Empyre or King of Black. Are you reading all the X series at that time? I'd suggest that's not necessary. Sword, Marauders, X-Men are probably the best of that bunch.
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Jan 2, 2023 01:19
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Thanks! The highlight of X of Swords, for me, was the goose Captain Britain. Big fan of that goose. Hope so see more of it.
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Jan 2, 2023 01:38
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so you're a natural excalibur fan, then. read the original run!
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Jan 2, 2023 02:13
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I grew up on a vastly different comic reading experience, just whatever looked cool and was available on the newsstand. Drop in during the middle of a 6 part story? Who're all these people? What are all the *'s referring to? You'll never know little kid, at least not til you wake up in the middle of the night decades later wondering what that was all about and asking the internet 'hey remember the time captain america got dunked into a vatful of estrogen? what was up with that?'
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Jan 2, 2023 02:21
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danbanana posted:Yeah you don't need to read Empyre or King of Black. Don't sleep on Hellions. It's up there.
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Jan 2, 2023 02:51
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Currently reading by release date on Unlimited: X-Men X-Force X-Factor Marauders Hellions SWORD Excalibur Wolverine New Mutants I think that’s all of them. Once I’m all caught up with that I guess I’ll go back and check out some older stuff. zelah fucked around with this message at 03:50 on Jan 2, 2023 |
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Jan 2, 2023 03:43
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zelah posted:Currently reading by release date on Unlimited: Recommend Immortal X-Men too.
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Jan 2, 2023 10:34
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Immortal X-Men isnt til much later in the timeline.
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Jan 2, 2023 11:20
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Dawgstar posted:Don't sleep on Hellions. It's up there. I was thinking Hellions and typed "Marauders" for the most obvious reason.
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Jan 2, 2023 17:49
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Hey, I just saw some recent, I think, panels of Nightcrawler. Glad he's got the facial hair back, but what's up with the horns and the spikes and stuff? More stupid hell poo poo, selling his soul consequences, something hilariously unrelated?
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Jan 3, 2023 01:02
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Agaragon posted:Hey, I just saw some recent, I think, panels of Nightcrawler. Glad he's got the facial hair back, but what's up with the horns and the spikes and stuff? More stupid hell poo poo, selling his soul consequences, something hilariously unrelated? No one knows. It's a mystery currently being explored in the current story arc
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Jan 3, 2023 01:11
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https://twitter.com/Marvel/status/1609957711029977093
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Jan 3, 2023 01:17
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Voting beast
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Jan 3, 2023 01:34
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kurt's been regularly clashing with sinister for a while now in multiple books, and also promo art for sins of sinister shows his physical mutation becomes much worse over time. the cause seems pretty obvious to me.
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Jan 3, 2023 02:26
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site posted:Voting beast
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Jan 3, 2023 02:35
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site posted:Voting beast Vote blue no matter who!
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Jan 3, 2023 02:38
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Rochallor posted:Vote blue no matter who! Raven
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Jan 3, 2023 17:07
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site posted:Voting beast They have seen the results of too many internet polls to even let him be a candidate but I would totally vote for him just to see how it all plays out
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Jan 3, 2023 18:09
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Yeah I would love Beast to be on the X-Men again just so he would be around people that would call him on his bullshit.
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Jan 3, 2023 19:30
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I think the "resolution" to X-Force Beast is to have him be elected onto the X-Men and then just write him as Hank circa 1992, like the last 10+ years just didn't happen.
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Jan 3, 2023 21:05
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danbanana posted:I think the "resolution" to X-Force Beast is to have him be There we go.
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Jan 3, 2023 21:40
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rantmo posted:There we go. This is the only rehabilitation arc I would accept, but it would also require current Wonder Man to stop being such a loving sad sack
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Jan 3, 2023 22:36
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Soonmot posted:This is the only rehabilitation arc I would accept, but it would also require current Wonder Man to stop being such a loving sad sack Two birds, one stone(r)!
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Jan 3, 2023 22:48
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Coming this Summer, only on MOJO-TV: X-TREME CELEBRITY REHAB! Join host ADAM-X, THE X-TREME as he puts Marvel's most shiftless superheroes through a strenuous course of image rehab and recreational pharmaceuticals! This season is a two-for-one - Krakoa's Biggest Supervillain, BEAST, and his old pal from the Avengers when we all liked them because they hadn't hit middle age, WONDER MAN! MOJOPLUS Subscribers get access to the 24/7 Hotbox Room feed! Call your cable provider TODAY! (gently caress now I'm a little sad this doesn't exist)
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Jan 4, 2023 01:24
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as far as reactions to a life of super heroism go, wonder man's pacifism is way better than committing genocide.
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Jan 4, 2023 03:34
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X-Men Red finishes another arc on yet another high note. And I love that ending reveal, which I'll spoil in a single emoji. ♠️
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Jan 4, 2023 20:13
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glitchwraith posted:X-Men Red finishes another arc on yet another high note. And I love that ending reveal, which I'll spoil in a single emoji. ♠️ So far all the theories on the different clones of Sinister have been correct. All that's left is Mother Righteous as the heart.
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Jan 4, 2023 20:30
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NGL, I was disappointed that Orbis Stellaris wasn't Stryfe after Cable said they'd talk "quite literally face to face!"
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Jan 4, 2023 20:58
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Endless Mike posted:NGL, I was disappointed that Orbis Stellaris wasn't Stryfe after Cable said they'd talk "quite literally face to face!" Cue Cerebrocast's "Surprise Bitch, I'm YOU!" audio. Fake Edit: Actually, I'm just posting the animatic, because it's that good. https://twitter.com/CerebroCast/status/1401330515635060736?s=20&t=DRaN9c7rAFfQe-v31u06Ng
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Jan 4, 2023 21:22
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i think villain beast is good because he's fun to hate and i have no particular fondness for earlier incarnations of the character. but this here is some real bullshit. if he's going to keep getting away with poo poo, there has to be an actual reason for why that is. every other current member of x-force has been in an experimental torture prison at some point! what the heck is up with this lackluster reaction?
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Jan 4, 2023 21:43
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Endless Mike posted:NGL, I was disappointed that Orbis Stellaris wasn't Stryfe after Cable said they'd talk "quite literally face to face!" That sequence (and the dialogue) is borrowed wholesale from X-Cutioner's Song where he was quite literally talking about Stryfe (who was in cahoots with Mr. Sinister) so who knows, maybe we've got some Stryfe in our future. The X-Books sure are doing a lot with clones of late. 
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Jan 4, 2023 22:33
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One of the greatest panels in comic book history. You thought you knew what an action hero from the 90's is? You were wrong!
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Jan 4, 2023 22:35
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