|
Shifty Pony posted:And on what planet is a 2" diameter trunk considered a "mature" fruit tree? If it produces fruit, it's mature. My ultra dwarf meyer lemon is ten years old, 8' high, two inches at the most, and has set fruit for 8+ years.
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2023 22:03
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 14:53 |
|
|
Motronic posted:This is what inspections should be for. Damages or defects that cost 5 figures like roofs and foundations, house full or knob and tube with rodent damage, bad septic, bad well, etc.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2023 23:18
|
|
|
Arsenic Lupin posted:Note to past me, and to the rest of you in the present: Do not accept an inspection in which the inspector says "Did not go up on roof." Hire somebody who owns a drone. Correction: hire someone who will go on the roof, even if that's a separate roofer doing an inspection. Drones can't tell if the decking is bouncy because they're not walking on it. That's an incredibly basic and important way to evaluate a whole host of conditions that bear further investigation. Many of which will easily hit that 5 figure mark.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2023 23:29
|
|
|
Arsenic Lupin posted:Note to past me, and to the rest of you in the present: Do not accept an inspection in which the inspector says "Did not go up on roof." Hire somebody who owns a drone. what's your roof story
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2023 23:37
|
|
|
pmchem posted:what's your roof story I don't know yet. There's definitely moss that needs cleaning off, and some damaged shingles. Watch this space.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2023 00:09
|
|
|
I was up on my roof last weekend cleaning the leaves off for the final time this fall. Definitely noticed a bouncy spot or two. It's a new roof so I'm guessing some unreplaced rotten decking. Of course it's *not* in an easily accessible spot. YAY.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2023 00:15
|
|
|
Oh poo poo our offer won.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2023 01:01
|
|
|
Shifty Pony posted:Oh poo poo our offer won. Goondolences and congrats.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2023 02:09
|
|
|
Shifty Pony posted:Oh poo poo our offer won. sorry for your loss
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2023 02:19
|
|
|
Shifty Pony posted:Oh poo poo our offer won. Congratulations! It will be scary up to the point you sign, and afterward it is still some scary. That's normal.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2023 02:22
|
|
|
It's all downhill from here.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2023 03:39
|
|
|
carticket posted:It's all downhill from here. Not in a “things will get easier” sense, but a “this place has really gone downhill” sense .
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2023 03:56
|
|
|
therobit posted:Not in a “things will get easier” sense, but a “this place has really gone downhill” sense .
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2023 05:04
|
|
|
and also "water flows downhill," into your house
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2023 05:08
|
|
|
Leperflesh posted:and also "water flows downhill," into your house That's the one I thought of.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2023 05:14
|
|
|
I've gotten my down payment/closing cost/extra fund now, I got my pre-approval, and I met with my realtor yesterday. I am prepared to become completely stupid. 
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 14:24
|
|
|
I'm starting to think about buying a house. I had a question, is there a reason you wouldn't throw much more than 20% for the down-payment on the house? Let's say you could afford 40-60% of a house why wouldn't you do it? I live in a high cost of living area and I'm scared to buy a house because while I could afford the mortgage price now I don't know if I can in 15-20 years, but if i could lower the total mortgage payment down then it doesn't seem so scary. The only way I can picture that happening is buy saving money and slamming it all into a house and making the largest initial dent possible. Am I thinking about it correctly?
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 18:04
|
|
|
gay for gacha posted:I'm starting to think about buying a house. I had a question, is there a reason you wouldn't throw much more than 20% for the down-payment on the house? Let's say you could afford 40-60% of a house why wouldn't you do it? It depends entirely on your mortgage rate. You don't lock money into an illiquid asset when you could be making the spread between 3% mortgage interest and 7% average returns on broad market index funds. I wouldn't even make that trade at 7% mortgage interest because liquidity is more important.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 18:07
|
|
|
gay for gacha posted:I'm starting to think about buying a house. I had a question, is there a reason you wouldn't throw much more than 20% for the down-payment on the house? Let's say you could afford 40-60% of a house why wouldn't you do it? I live in a high cost of living area and I'm scared to buy a house because while I could afford the mortgage price now I don't know if I can in 15-20 years, but if i could lower the total mortgage payment down then it doesn't seem so scary. The only way I can picture that happening is buy saving money and slamming it all into a house and making the largest initial dent possible. Am I thinking about it correctly? I think you are thinking about it correctly because you are considering what it actually means to you over some time horizon; however, I think not being able to afford in 15-20 years is a bit too undefined though, a lot can happen over that time span. Your payments would presumable stay fixed while your income grows due to inflation and your gaining experience, so I’m not sure specifically why you are thinking that way. In that sense, it probably is better to stay liquid/invest as long as your near-term debt-to-income ratio is comfortable to you. I’m also interested in this because I’m in a similar boat - I have a ~3-yr window where I’m looking to upgrade to my family home. I currently earn quite a bit, but if I get laid off in a less-than-ideal market (I.e. we enter a recession), I could easily see my next job paying ~1/3 less and being stuck there for a couple of years. Therefore, I’m saving up for a down payment that would be in line with the “next job’s” salary, since I want to still maintain healthy cash flow and not stress myself out on mortgage payments. I’m also fairy risk adverse and the housing market here is super slow rn, so I’m not too worried about missing out and staying flexible if something comes up.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 18:31
|
|
|
IME it comes down to how confident someone is about their long-term employment plans i.e. are their job prospects going to collapse or contract anytime in the next 30 years. Which will inevitably happen, just that no one knows when.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 18:43
|
|
|
Dropping a large down payment and going for a 15yr loan is also a valid strategy. Having no housing payment other than property tax and insurance would be drat sweet.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 18:53
|
|
|
The amount of your down payment is roughly equivalent to the amount of equity you have in the home, the day you move in. This presumes you could sell the home for exactly what you bought it, but actually you pay the agent costs etc. so realistically you should reduce your equity by some amount to get a "cash back after sold" amount of equity. The more equity you have, the safer you are in the event that you have to sell during a downturn in the market. I bought my house in december 2009, and house prices went down another 10% in 2010, putting me underwater on my house because we'd put a minimal amount down (3.5%). If we'd suddenly had to sell, we'd have had to bring cash to the table just to get out... or do a short sale, or get foreclosed on. If your worry is "what if I can't afford my payments 10 years later", your equity is the safety valve that would let you sell in that case. A 20% down payment provides a pretty solid buffer from day 1, and of course you make payments on your mortgage - review an amortization schedule to see the amount of accumulated equity your payments have created after a given number of years. Because of how interest works, on a 30 year loan the equity portion of your payments are usually far smaller than the interest portion in the early years, and then as you gradually reduce the size of the outstanding debt but make payments of the same size, more and more of each payment goes to equity. In this way, long loans are "back loaded" and a large down payment mitigates that significantly. The less you borrow in total, and the lower your interest rate, the less you pay in interest. You can make larger than minimum payments to build equity faster. You can buy down your interest rate with cash up front for "points" off your rate, which also helps you to build equity faster (the up front cash is a cost that gets paid back over time by the lower interest, so you can calculate how many years of payments it will take to "break even" on your points cost). In the end, nobody can really tell you exactly how much is "good" for your down payment. But this is math you can do. How much equity will you have day one? How long can you feel very confident you'll be able to make payments? What has your local home market done historically during downturns - by exactly how much did homes in your market and price segment decline, between say 2007 and 2010? Would you consider that a "worst case scenario"? Create the conditions where you'll have, or quickly achieve, enough equity to feel comfortable with the risks.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 18:58
|
|
|
Leperflesh posted:....The more equity you have, the safer you are in the event that you have to sell during a downturn in the market..... These statements assume that someone who could put down more literally can't stop themselves from lighting that additional money on fire if its' not locked up in the house. That's not the case for everyone and while some of you emotionally may rather have more equity than liquid investments the liquid investments are historically going to greatly outperform you home and allow you the flexibility to do things like: - Sell even if you're under water. - Not have to sell immediately if you can't cashflow your payments from regular income anymore - Solve other problems that money can fix whether house or not house related Poor people can't get credit. Wealthy people know how to use it as a tool.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 19:05
|
|
|
It would be sweet if you could just get a place to live, and not have to be a wealth manager.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 20:46
|
|
|
Epitope posted:It would be sweet if you could just get a place to live, and not have to be a wealth manager. Cheap housing exists, just not within 20 minutes of employment centers
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 20:57
|
|
|
Motronic posted:These statements assume that someone who could put down more literally can't stop themselves from lighting that additional money on fire if its' not locked up in the house. Yeah those are good points. gay for gacha was talking about I guess waiting till they could save more cash and then putting that into the house; your suggested alternative is to save that money and not put it into the house, which is fine too, as long as it gets saved. More broadly, you're getting at another point which is that you need to not take on such a high cost of housing that you're unable to save. If you're able to save, you can bring cash to the table if you had to sell while underwater on your house, and/or keep making payments while unemployed, etc.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 21:06
|
|
|
gay for gacha posted:I'm starting to think about buying a house. I had a question, is there a reason you wouldn't throw much more than 20% for the down-payment on the house? Let's say you could afford 40-60% of a house why wouldn't you do it? I live in a high cost of living area and I'm scared to buy a house because while I could afford the mortgage price now I don't know if I can in 15-20 years, but if i could lower the total mortgage payment down then it doesn't seem so scary. The only way I can picture that happening is buy saving money and slamming it all into a house and making the largest initial dent possible. Am I thinking about it correctly? I wouldn't do that, hell I put 0 dollars down on my current house*, but different people handle the stress of debt differently. I don't give a poo poo about debt, because if my life takes a bad turn that debt is the banks problem not mine. But for real though my personal risk of defaulting on my home loan is low enough I don't worry about it at all. Everyone has their own personal risk tolerance. You also never truly own your own home. There's always property taxes, upkeep costs, and other expenses that come with living in a house. Even if I paid my house off I'd still be on the hook for about 10K a year in expenses minimum. If you want to buy a house though and the only way you feel comfortable doing it is slamming 40% down and tying that money up in the house, go ahead. I don't know if it's because we all grew up playing video games or whatever but we don't have to min/max high score every single decision in our life. Buy a house when it's the right time for you and you feel comfortable doing so. If you need to put 50% down on the home to sleep well at night, go ahead. *My wife worked at a bank that offered an employee loan purchase program with 0 down and no PMI If I had the means I would put the least amount of money down to get me the most favorable terms, and put the rest in investments. I'm not debt averse at all though.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 21:16
|
|
|
Arsenic Lupin posted:Congratulations! It will be scary up to the point you sign, and afterward it is still some scary. That's normal. I'm glad to know it's not just me (we sign in a month).
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 21:34
|
|
|
Arsenic Lupin posted:Note to past me, and to the rest of you in the present: Do not accept an inspection in which the inspector says "Did not go up on roof." Hire somebody who owns a drone. Or, more simply, don't accept an inspection if critical items aren't inspected. I once regrettably put an offer in on a flip; home on slab, everything important in the attic and walls. The inspector said he tried to get into the attic but there was too much insulation and couldn't see anything. Plausible, but unlikely he couldn't access with a little effort, but all the important things were up there and we already knew the roof was at end of life. He wouldn't go up so I walked away from the deal. More recently, my inspector looked at 1/8 of the crawlspace (an addition), said he couldn't find access to the rest of the crawl, and called it good. I gave him and my agent hell and threatened to walk if we couldn't access all the critical parts in the crawl (HVAC, sewer, water/gas plumbing, bodies, etc). Both went down again and "couldn't find access" again. Knowing the home just had the seasonal floor furnaces serviced in the "inaccessible" area, I suggested contacting the guy who serviced them. Surprise, surprise, they found the access. I own the home now, and I went down there last week and found the 3'x3' square access not 20 feet from the crawl access, plain as day. You couldn't miss it unless you only went 10 feet into a very comfortable crawl. I was pissed. The real estate industry is teeming with idiots and grifters, and if you think otherwise, you're the idiot.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 21:38
|
|
|
The first house we bought, my husband had to stop the car on the way to the closing to barf.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 21:40
|
|
|
Arsenic Lupin posted:The first house we bought, my husband had to stop the car on the way to the closing to barf. I did buy a condo years ago right out of college, but I was too oblivious to feel worried about it. (It was also a few months before the big housing market collapse and seven years later when I left the mortgage was still underwater by a huge chunk.) This is my first house purchase and the worrying comes in waves now.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 22:03
|
|
|
Maybe this doesn't help with the nerves, but when you're buying a house, realize everyone at closing is getting paid *by you*. No matter what the closing cost negotiations were, it's all actually coming out of your wallet. Your realtor, their realtor, the mortgage broker, any lawyers.... No reason to be deferential to anyone, they all need you to sign to get paid. So they need to be answering any and all questions, and if anything doesn't feel right, no reason not to balk a bit. The dynamics are definitely a bit weird, but I think the buyer holds a lot of power at closing.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 22:44
|
|
|
jjack229 posted:I did buy a condo years ago right out of college, but I was too oblivious to feel worried about it. (It was also a few months before the big housing market collapse and seven years later when I left the mortgage was still underwater by a huge chunk.) That’s a good point. If worse comes to worse and the economy takes a dump or you lose your job prospects, you could just sell your house and get part of your money back and it’s no longer your problem. Just fuckin hit da bricks.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 22:48
|
|
|
Pollyanna posted:That’s a good point. If worse comes to worse and the economy takes a dump or you lose your job prospects, you could just sell your house and get part of your money back and it’s no longer your problem. Just fuckin hit da bricks. You do have to have sufficient equity in the place for this to work, which is one reason everyone's interest only poo poo went horribly wrong in the financial crisis.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2023 23:24
|
|
|
Okay I realize I know even less about this than I thought. I've had this other question that I have been trying to think about for a year or so but after reading this thread I realize that I maybe you goons have experience and advice. I live in a place where the median house price is 800k, it's a job center, it's really awesome here, in previous recessions the house prices seem like they stagnated but didn't drop. The source of the first question is me trying to figure out if it makes financial sense to buy a house here, or move to a place my friends have moved recently where the median house price is about 350k. I really want a house, ideally single family or duplex, with a yard that has grass in it. I currently rent that right now in this city, I pay about 25% under value for rent, and the total rent is about 25% of my wife and I's income. Until this thread I thought I needed 20% minimum to buy a house so I don't have to pay the insurance on the loan, 20% of between 600-800k, is like 40%+ of a house in the city my friends have moved to. It also feels lame to have that much debt, but maybe that's just in my head. My wife and I work remotely, I have always worked remotely, but she works for a company that is remote but in a field of mostly non-remote work. She does some hyper specialized medicine research thing where there is a lot of employers in and around where I am now, and not 15 hours away where my friends have moved. Regarding the not making the same amount of money in 15-20 years, I want to work in non-profits doing something unrelated to what I do for employment but related to a skill that I do have and regularly volunteer for nonprofits -- I just want to do it full time. So anyways my thinking was that if you make a massive down payment, like if I saved money for the next few years and was able to crush a 50% down payment on a house in this city the monthly mortgage would maybe be low enough that in an extreme unemployment scenario I could get a job at a grocery store and still pay the mortgage. Or if I moved to the city far away, I could have a mortgage low enough that if my wife needed to find a job that was remote and it took six months we wouldn't be hurting if I was also unemployed. I'm also worried that if I moved far away from a place with lots of employment, like the city where my friends moved, I may have to stay in undesirable employment situations for longer than if I continue to live in a place with lots of jobs. I don't know how much of this is rational.
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2023 00:07
|
|
|
gay for gacha posted:Okay I realize I know even less about this than I thought. I mean it's all rational in the sense that you're doing the appropriate weighing of pros and cons. As I've gotten older... and moved away from my friends to a more expensive jobbier area... I regret being away from friends. Are your friends also your wife's friends? And how in love with your jobs are y'all - more specifically she? As reductive as this sounds, find out where you two are going to be the happiest (it sounds like its around friends) then figure out how to make that work.
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2023 00:12
|
|
|
I'm embarking on the process of leaving the world of renting and into the world of ownership and god help me, I think I'm in over my head and might be trying to rush this too much. I worry that I could potentially move in the next few years due to work or something and I'd basically eat the loss in trying to offload it and not deal with renting it out. I also worry about if this is the right time to buy what with interest rates and other things I'm too dumb too fully comprehend. Some of this is also desperation in trying to find a new place in general and wanting a bit more control over getting certain issues solved rather than depending on maintenance to handle it.
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2023 00:32
|
|
|
Epitope posted:It would be sweet if you could just get a place to live, and not have to be a wealth manager. It’s stuck with me; if you want to have money you have to learn how to manage it. There’s no real way around that.
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2023 00:59
|
|
|
I don't want money though. Of course you can't participate in our society without it. So, ya, need to learn to manage it. Still, gotta make sure the priorities don't get inverted. Like, I dig this, vs what will get max net worth high scoreBonoMan posted:find out where you two are going to be the happiest (it sounds like its around friends) then figure out how to make that work.
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2023 01:54
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 14:53 |
|
|
My only semi relevant quip is "sometimes money is the cheapest way to pay." It is very applicable to DIY house repairs.
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2023 01:59
|
|