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Sumerian Telecom posted:At any rate. There's no reason that you couldn't use AI to make capital A Art. ... But I'd wager it's probably harder to make Art with machine learning generators than to paint a piece of Art. yeah. the specific problem with using AI to make capital A art is, as you already pointed out, Sumerian Telecom posted:(This moment of Mystery confuses and frustrates people of the positivist scientific age who like everything to be clearly categorized and neat in an easily discernable box. Some get quite angry at it for daring the ultimate crime of being somewhat uncategorisable, lacking in clear definition. to get the AI to do poo poo you have to pin down and categorize pretty exactly what it is you want, even if you try to get at it in a roundabout way that the AI can understand. it seems nearly impossible to take that ineffable spark of creative genius and reduce it to some descriptive strings to plug into an iterative program
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Dec 22, 2022 16:12
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indigi posted:it seems nearly impossible to take that ineffable spark of creative genius and reduce it to some descriptive strings to plug into an iterative program maybe for you, but I'm an artist
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Dec 22, 2022 16:13
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drat. I forgot about that
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Dec 22, 2022 16:29
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSLd3Mb85BY A lot of words on the AI debate. Guess who shows up at about 8:45
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Dec 31, 2022 15:15
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Sumerian Telecom posted:
Fool! What is this non-materialist thinking?! There is no “Mystery” and there is no soul. We only have the material world and our beliefs. Marvel movies aren’t trash because they have no “mystery” and are therefore bad. No “mystery” step is needed; they are just bad. Bad cinematography, bad writing, bad values, bad politics. Art is simply the product of human creativity. There is no high Art, no capital-A Art™ versus base craftsmanship. It’s all art, both good and bad. Thinking science and categorization is removing magic or mystery from the world is childish superstition. The physical laws are sufficiently complicated to serve as an honorable medium for things like art and human values. They don’t debase it! - - - Playing around with it, AI art is really feels like it is trained on only the most easily accessible pop culture art. You can easily generate generic but highly technically competent ArtStation portfolio style images, but I can’t even really get it to generate anything in the style of Van Gogh. Like its only understanding of “Van Gogh” is Starry Night. So it only generates Starry Night clones. I can’t get it to generate Art Deco style posters, only a pop cultural understanding of Art Deco (cheesy diesel/steampunk trash. Like Bioshock turned up to eleven.) Also copyright sucks, especially since it basically doesn’t apply to small time artists. AI art would have been strangled in the crib if it was trained on more Disney and less what was easily scrapped from the web.
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Dec 31, 2022 20:38
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It really and truly doesn't understand style. Not just Art Deco, but Art Nouveau, Rococo, Baroque, Romanesque, you name it, it can't do it.
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Dec 31, 2022 21:07
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yeah it all pretty much sucks
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Dec 31, 2022 21:09
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it is trained on just "every image we could grab off the internet" you can do a fine-tune thing to get it to kinda understand what van gogh or art deco means if you have ~20 representative images, an hour, and $5 bucks or at least to make images more similar to the 20 from your training set
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Dec 31, 2022 23:44
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https://twitter.com/SecretSunBlog/status/1612868525206474776
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Jan 12, 2023 08:09
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Fat-Lip-Sum-41.mp3 posted:what? no. the advent of power looms exposed a problem of capitalism, not of industrialization or mechanization or automation. its the same fuckin thing as this, except it's artists out of work instead of hand weavers. the issue, as always, is who gets the benefit of these new machines, and who is forced to starve. You know what, I've not tried much with this stuff yet. I dropped out of art college years ago, was a proficient oil painter sometimes. I really like a lot of what I've seen so far. The rise of this stuff bolsters my decision to give up on representational art. I was among the very last generation that made a career of photo-ready art, so I've been through this getting replaced by a machine business once already. Once again, this new medium has unimagined creative potential and once again, the bulk of consumers viewing this product couldn't pass the Turing test any better than the computers, possibly would perform worse.
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Jan 13, 2023 07:11
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Pink Mist posted:AI is automating the most creative part of the artistic process instead of the least creative part, this makes little sense to me The introduction of photography didn't just eliminate work for painters as people feared, it made us question our use and understanding of painting, representation and art in general. If mankind were to survive much longer I think this is the direction we'd be going, where the art is focused on the artist and what's going on in their mind rather than getting the busy work just right in the artwork so you can sell it or whatever. Music appears to be heading in this direction as well. Ultimately it's deconstructing the whole model on which our appreciation of art is based on, that of commodification, or it has the potential to do that. The products of Midjourney or whichever one you use are not the real end goal, it is the moment you are telling the machine what to do, or working with the machine. It is the collection of moments at each attempt at perfecting the image. The artwork is collateral, just about. It's about the perfection of a body of knowledge, not of a simulated painting. Pardon my rambling, sorry
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Jan 13, 2023 07:48
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petit choux posted:The introduction of photography didn't just eliminate work for painters as people feared, it made us question our use and understanding of painting, representation and art in general. If mankind were to survive much longer I think this is the direction we'd be going, where the art is focused on the artist and what's going on in their mind rather than getting the busy work just right in the artwork so you can sell it or whatever. Music appears to be heading in this direction as well. Ultimately it's deconstructing the whole model on which our appreciation of art is based on, that of commodification, or it has the potential to do that. The products of Midjourney or whichever one you use are not the real end goal, it is the moment you are telling the machine what to do, or working with the machine. It is the collection of moments at each attempt at perfecting the image. The artwork is collateral, just about. It's about the perfection of a body of knowledge, not of a simulated painting. If I'm following you, I think I agree; and along the same lines, there's not really a possibility of AI producing art that's "better" than what humans can do, but the sheer volume of output means the communal aspect of art goes out the window--each individual gets exactly what they want. I get to watch Elsa and Spider-Man fight Susan B Anthony and they're all barefoot, etc.
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Jan 13, 2023 08:15
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When everyone can be sold their own bespoke culture, culture will cease to exist as a shared reality. lol, maybe the haters are right and gatekeeping really is important to society and not something to be casually tossed aside. okay, i'm convinced, gently caress generative ai and the algorithm, one station one communist message for all.
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Jan 13, 2023 08:27
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AI events continue happening in the art and creative world People are starting to experiment with having AI write their scripts. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5lLco_-QA60 Grifters are churning out AI art tutorials. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGp3lejXEoc An especially terrible reddit mod on /r/art banned someone because their drawing looked like AI art and doubled down when the artist offered to provide proof they drew it themself. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC4choxssoc
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Jan 13, 2023 11:44
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i wonder what AI art fizz buzz tests will look like to weed out the FAKERS edit: oh wait! 
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Jan 13, 2023 11:47
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super sweet best pal posted:An especially terrible reddit mod on /r/art banned someone because their drawing looked like AI art and doubled down when the artist offered to provide proof they drew it themself. this last one was very funny because the nature of the models inherently lead to an "ai art style" that human pattern recognition easily picks up on, and then of course this happens. it's basically autotune for images.
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Jan 13, 2023 11:49
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Zodium posted:this last one was very funny because the nature of the models inherently lead to an "ai art style" that human pattern recognition easily picks up on, and then of course this happens. it's basically autotune for images. can't wait to see what kind of wacky terf-like "real art has X" poo poo we get
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Jan 13, 2023 11:53
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human pattern recognition easily recognizes when jesus appears in bread finally the art world will recognize the value of my unmistakably human ms paint doodles
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Jan 13, 2023 12:07
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smarxist posted:can't wait to see what kind of wacky terf-like "real art has X" poo poo we get real art diverges, algorithmic art converges. simple as.
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Jan 13, 2023 12:14
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Tungsten posted:an ai could totally innovate on visual art, in an infinity of ways that hold no meaning or interest to a human being Absolutely.
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Jan 13, 2023 14:13
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this is a good rear end point that I can't believe you're all just ignoring
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Jan 13, 2023 14:15
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Gareth Gobulcoque posted:one of the things I like about art is exploring the human experience. but what if that human experience was mediated through a billion fragments of stolen human experience, homogenized through a machine, and then spat back out at me in a process on nonconsensual collaboration In Neuromancer the space Rastafarians had a computer that generated "the dub" and it apparently worked with all recorded music. I really wish there were one for music as well RN.
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Jan 13, 2023 14:18
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Your Brain on Hugs posted:I guess I never felt that I could personally tell the difference between what is and isn't art, so it never mattered at all to me, and so I don't really understand when other people talk about it, what they're actually seeing. I'd like to know more about machine-made music also. Although I've made some noise about it, I haven't looked into that very much.
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Jan 13, 2023 14:26
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Paradoxish posted:My hot take as someone who occasionally needs to subcontract real artists is that AI art is currently too, uh, "creative" to perform a lot of paid meat and potatoes design/art. It might threaten some concept work, but many commercial projects rely on consistency and detail that these systems can't pull off. A big part of what working artists do is translate project requirements into actual deliverables, and none of these systems are within a light year of being able to do that. Working artists don't get to go hog wild from a sentence-long prompt, and the very nature of the underlying tech makes it poorly suited for real design work. Fact.
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Jan 13, 2023 14:36
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barge posted:It seems like it is nearly good enough to replace some entry level illustration work already just by being dirt cheap. I got my start taking commissions for random video game assets, book covers, little editorial illustrations, the kind of stuff where someone just needs some image to fill a space. It's not that this work is super important but it's how a lot of illustrators start off and it's not hard to imagine it being replaced or transforming into "here's an AI image, we'll give you 20 bucks to fix the hosed up hands/eyes and cover up the remnants of the artist signature" or whatever. I'm glad to see a working artist's take on it. It's reminding me of how Heinlein had a working artist in one of his novels whose job was to do just that, mostly with porn.
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Jan 13, 2023 14:40
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Cabbages and Kings posted:some favorites, this is just midjourney, I have also been messing with stablediffusion on a local machine. this is what I came to this thread for, really, somebody who had some results to show off. I didn't come here to listen to naysayers for 20 pages.
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Jan 13, 2023 14:42
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Wheany posted:There is an AI art thread in GBS, it's probably a better place for this: https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=4000251 Yeah maybe that's a better thread for me because all the naysaying is pretty dull.
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Jan 13, 2023 14:50
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saying ai art is bad because you dont like it/feel threatened by it is one thing. inventing completely new and unprecedented ways to apply intellectual property rights and then advocating for it in the socialist subforum is something else
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Jan 13, 2023 15:20
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All flavors of the losers and the haters are welcome in c-spam
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Jan 13, 2023 15:32
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Did DALLE get much worse since a few months ago? It looks like DALLE mini now, particularly since Midjourney got good.petit choux posted:this is what I came to this thread for, really, somebody who had some results to show off. I didn't come here to listen to naysayers for 20 pages.         https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfgs9FRD25M      Some of these require knowing who Al-Saqr is I suppose. Frosted Flake has issued a correction as of 15:41 on Jan 13, 2023 |
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Jan 13, 2023 15:33
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Ovenmaster posted:What AI 'art' exposes (and what I suspect has so many people in uproar, besides the capitalism aspect) is that the human creative brain - while still more complex - is every bit as crude and chaotic as an algorithm of 1s and 0s. We still have our conscious self attempting to curate all the output, but it's not odd that people lose their poo poo at machine learning making a mockery of 'divine inspiration', muses and all these lofty terms for our creative process - it strikes at the heart of our sense of self importance, because surely we are unique and beautiful soulful beings, and not primitive monkeys trying to make sense of a crazy world. Everybody should watch Annihilation maybe. How much can you change a thing before it becomes something else? In the 80s I was led to believe by my college instruction that the world of art (and music) experienced a transformation, partly rendering all traditional techniques and media moot. We experienced in the 20th C this big thing called modern art, it reassigned values to things and it challenged the very idea of there being a central object of adoration as a work of art whatsoever. It also challenged the very idea of the role of the artist. This was the major thing going on in the world of art at the end of the 20th C, once all the different "art movements" got out of the way. Those things really happened, years ago. While the rest of the world went on reading their comic books and watching comic book movies, the changes that transformed our conception of art and what it is for have already taken place (and we're still watching the comic book movies because we are just apes.) And as far as I was concerned it was the end of my painting career. This happened many years ago, long before any of this. But it was, coincidentally, happening as the trade and business then known as illustration were being totally restructured. I'm just trying to get an idea of the scope of this problem, if problem is a good word for it. If there is any kind of discourse or dialogue going on here, I just wanted to try to bring in the context of modernity because most people are still stuck in a 19th Century conception of art and its purpose. I swear to God you would think the whole 20th C never happened as far as most people are concerned.
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Jan 13, 2023 15:54
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Slavvy posted:I think it's more that it shows that 99% of art is derivative reproduction and rote skill and actually original art in the true sense is just as rare as everything else made by humans that isn't crap. Yeah, what this person said
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Jan 13, 2023 15:56
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speng31b posted:the test of whether this can produce good art will just be continuing to see what good artists can do with it. if any of y'all know any good artists using it that would be interesting content. LOL big takes from the "might as well be" world I have no doubt you're right, LOL Those capitalist hells are not the creation of Dall-E, they were inside you all along
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Jan 13, 2023 16:00
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Paradoxish posted:This is also not a great take because a lot of this tech doesn't exist on a straight line from "bad" to "good." It's incorrect to assume that anything like this will just keep steadily marching toward some line that's finally acceptable instead of dead-ending with goopy eyes and wonky hands. Yeah, you don't just assume future success unless you're Elon Musk apparently. You make those assumptions based on past performances, like these "AI" art computers are sure "learning" fast.
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Jan 13, 2023 16:05
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Homeless Friend posted:suffice to say theres going to be a huge boom in comic books/manga/etc because AI is just tailor made for passable enough to tell a story with that any yahoo can use. Finger Family on acid
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Jan 13, 2023 16:07
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Frosted Flake posted:Did DALLE get much worse since a few months ago? It looks like DALLE mini now, particularly since Midjourney got good. 
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Jan 13, 2023 16:11
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turn off the TV posted:to train a neural network that knows what things like cows are then you need to have a selection of pictures of cows that are all annotated to let the AI know that it is looking at cows because it's a dumb computer program that only understands pixels. then you need to have another set of pictures of cows, separate from the pictures of cows it's learning about, so that it can be graded on how well it's doing at making cows in comparison to cows that it has never seen before. O poo poo
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Jan 13, 2023 16:12
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Slavvy posted:Doesn't that leave us at the prompt is the art, the bot is the tool, the sweaty goon at the keyboard is the artiste? Is this a problem?
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Jan 13, 2023 16:15
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bitmap posted:oh cool  don't do it! You can still paint your WoW figurines or whatever!
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Jan 13, 2023 16:28
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people who get mad when other people aren't clapping their hands like trained seals at "artificial intelligence" have the same energy as people who get mad other people aren't excited about nfts
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Jan 13, 2023 16:34
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