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Admiral H. Curtiss posted:^ Might wanna spoiler that. So it's further proof of what Arist said, then.
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Jan 28, 2023 17:10
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Given that Azure's official release is like a month or so away, you might wanna spoiler that part. Anyway, a retcon is something that's usually thrown in five games later when they need something with ties to past games that doesn't completely fit without a bit of pushing and squeezing. (Cold Steel III/IV spoilers) Ash's status as a resident from Hamel who knew Joshua, Karin and Loewe feels a bit like a retcon since his existence was never brought up in the Sky games. Juna's existence feels a little bit like a retcon since she's literally living in the very appartment Cecile's family lived in in the Crossbell games and the inclusion of her siblings in the Kai versions doesn't completely rectify the issue. There's no way the devs included the scene you speak of without having already fully planned the plot of both games. There was always a plan. Delphisage posted:So it's further proof of what Arist said, then. No, what that poster complained about was the Cold Steel 1 opening, which felt like it was going for the same thing, but really was done purely to give first-time players some stakes to cling onto. That's not what the other opening was about. (Zero/Azure end-game spoilers) Unlike the Cold Steel I and III openings, which were flash-forwards included to present stakes and immediately give new players some trash mobs to pulverize but nothing more than that, Zero's opening was literally all about the narrative of the old timeline being cut short, rewound to position 0 and the new timeline starting at the very moment Lloyd wakes up on that train. CS1 and 3's first moments were flash-forwards, Zero first moment was a flashback. Big difference. Erpy fucked around with this message at 17:28 on Jan 28, 2023 |
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Jan 28, 2023 17:16
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I'll grant that Zero's opening makes a lot more sense than CS1's and 3's, but... I find it kinda hard to believe that they would intentionally do such a good job the first time and then completely flub their next two attempts. It also comes up, what, once in the scene before the final boss fight in Azure? And it's not like the story would be significantly altered if you removed that detail, either. But to be fair, it does end up working out pretty well in the Zero/Azure case, regardless of if it was planned that way or not. Admiral H. Curtiss fucked around with this message at 17:31 on Jan 28, 2023 |
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Jan 28, 2023 17:29
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Admiral H. Curtiss posted:I'll grant that Zero's opening makes a lot more sense than CS1's and 3's, but... I find it kinda hard to believe that they would intentionally do such a good job the first time and then completely flub their next two attempts. Zero/Azure spoilers: Why is it so hard to believe that when they inserted a "flash-forward" for narrative reasons it worked out but when they implemented flashforwards for commercial reasons, it fell a bit flat? Literally apples and oranges. Anyway, I disagree that omitting the timeline rewind elements wouldn't have made much of a difference. The revelation that KeA could rewind the timeline and actually already did so once gave Lloyd's decision in his conversation with Guy to reject the Sept-Terrion's powers a lot more impact.
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Jan 28, 2023 17:53
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Erpy posted:Given that Azure's official release is like a month or so away, you might wanna spoiler that part. I never had a problem with the first one, because at no point before CS 3 was it ever said that Joshua and Loewe were the only survivors. Additionally, they had neither the position nor the mindset at the time to confirm that. Additionally, war is chaotic, and it's not unreasonable to assume that even a well-planned ambush could have some people escape in the chaos and fog of war. For the second one, while Juna herself is an extremely obvious and awkardly-shoehorned retcon, it's not because of the apartment. I just assumed videogame compression and they're on different floors. You can clearly see in CS 3/4 that there are more stairs in the building than there were in Zero/Azure, you're just not allowed to use them. Anyway, by that standard of retcon, I think the real retcon is the incredibly loving stupid plot point of (MAJOR CS 4 spoiler - Act 3) Osborne being "the reincarnation of Dreichels" used as a pointless and unnecessary way to justify Arianrhod caring about Osborne/Rean and the Emperor bizarrely deferring to Osborne's every whim despite the Emperor supposedly being the one in charge.. You can tell how badly it was squeezed in because the game really, REALLY did not want to talk about that very bizarre thing it threw in ever again. Stabbey_the_Clown fucked around with this message at 18:17 on Jan 28, 2023 |
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Jan 28, 2023 18:11
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I think there is a way to square the inconsistencies in the in media res openings Cold Steel 1 and 3 have but it's the kind of thing that only makes retroactive, headcanon sense by thinking about it after playing future games in the series, it's never really something mentioned in the game like in Zero/Azure's case. (More major spoilers for Reverie and the Kuro games below, the above was just for Zero and Azure.) Trails is a setting where not only can the future be calculated by what is essentially a giant super computer, but also has alternate bad ending timelines branching off which are completely independent of KeA messing with causality. CS4's bad ending wasn't just a neat extra, it actively comes back into play in Reverie and C. Epstein managed to create artifacts so powerful it can rewind time to set points to observe different aspects of the world; including humanities capacity for sin. So you can definitely fit the openings of CS1 and 3 in with what's been presented, it just isn't really commented on ever again in the games. Selenephos fucked around with this message at 18:38 on Jan 28, 2023 |
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Jan 28, 2023 18:35
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Stabbey_the_Clown posted:Anyway, by that standard of retcon, I think the real retcon is the incredibly loving stupid plot point of (MAJOR CS 4 spoiler - Act 3) Osborne being "the reincarnation of Dreichels" used as a pointless and unnecessary way to justify Arianrhod caring about Osborne/Rean and the Emperor bizarrely deferring to Osborne's every whim despite the Emperor supposedly being the one in charge.. You can tell how badly it was squeezed in because the game really, REALLY did not want to talk about that very bizarre thing it threw in ever again. Dreichels was mentioned as early as SC, was consistently and constantly called back to, and his school motto is the defining tagline of the CS series. It's absurd to think of that as a retcon. Admiral H. Curtiss posted:I'll grant that Zero's opening makes a lot more sense than CS1's and 3's, but... I find it kinda hard to believe that they would intentionally do such a good job the first time and then completely flub their next two attempts. Likewise, (Azure) it is absurd to think they hadn't planned that out from the start of Crossbell, as is the claim that it isn't important. At the very end of the opening section it fades to KeA saying "find me". Whenever that happens, it's the KeA from the future, as the Sept-Terrion, calling for help. It was the core of Azure's announcement trailer, and it was foreshadowed by Lloyd's nightmare at Mishelam.
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Jan 28, 2023 18:50
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Zero/Azure spoilers: It seems clear to me that Zero's opening being an alternate timeline that KeA prevented was intended from the start, because (among other reasons) I think that Zero shows you the specific thing KeA changed to create the timeline where the SSS members survive. They never explicitly tell you what it is, and it's something so small and insignificant that you'd probably never think twice about it if you saw the scene without knowing about the timeline change. Specifically: It's the butterfly (as in "butterfly effect") that Colin's chasing after when he wanders away from the delivery truck, causing him to be attacked by monsters, and Renne having to jump in to save him. If the butterfly wasn't there, then when Lloyd called the truck driver, Colin would've still been there with him. Knowing that Colin was safe, I think Renne would've probably said, "my work here is done," and left the SSS to go get him on their own. She'd never get to hear the Hayworth's side of the story, and the SSS probably wouldn't either, since they only told that story after Colin mentioned the girl with purple hair who saved him. Without all that happening, you don't get Estelle and Joshua pledging to help out the SSS whenever they need it, so they don't come along for the final dungeon (as seen in the opening), and thus Renne doesn't show up to rescue them when things start to go bad. CS1/CS3: I can't find it now, but I swear I've seen an interview with Kondo where he said that a future game might explain the CS1 and CS3 openings like Azure did for Zero. It is worth remembering that, just like in Zero, the versions of events you see in the openings of CS1 and CS3 are different from the versions you eventually see when you catch up to that part of the game. Furthermore, they're all different in exactly the same way: there are two people missing from the opening version that are present in the later version. In Zero, it's Estelle and Joshua; in CS1, it's Crow and Millium; and in CS3, it's Angelica and Aurelia. I think that there's definitely room to speculate on how things might've gone differently in each of those situations if those extra people weren't present. In general, I've also heard a theory that they've been foreshadowing alternate timelines since the first Sky game in the form of the book "31 Cypress Trees" that you have to find in one of the overdue library book quests, which is a poem describing a farmer who tries multiple times to grow a cypress tree and only succeeds after 31 of the trees he plants die or are discarded for being too frail. The idea would be that someone (the Grandmaster?) is searching for a successful timeline, and the dead trees represent failed ones that were abandoned.
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Jan 28, 2023 19:23
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Spoilers up through CS4:Terper posted:Dreichels was mentioned as early as SC, was consistently and constantly called back to, and his school motto is the defining tagline of the CS series. It's absurd to think of that as a retcon.
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Jan 28, 2023 20:05
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Cold Steel 4 spoilers. Osborne being a reincarnation of Dreichels isn't a retcon, it's just unbelievably loving stupid and one of the many things 4 does to torpedo that character into the dirt.
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Jan 28, 2023 20:20
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CS4 Chat The Reincarnation part was the only thing that broke me out of the game in regards to Osborne. I would have been fine if Osborne was just very charismatic and capable, like his son, such that he was like Dreichels and that was what drew Ishmelga to force him to become its Awakener.
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Jan 28, 2023 22:20
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The bad thing about Osborne in CS4 was just kinda everything imo. The reincarnation aspect is the goofiest but even without he'd still be exactly as boring. Alas, Trails has only had like 2.5 good main antagonists so once Osborne finally took that spot it was all over for him.
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Jan 28, 2023 23:18
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He never should have been fought. He was intimidating when he was clever and resourceful, and physical powerful people willingly served him because of his intellect. He became less interesting when became yet another boss to fight. Same issue with Vayne Solidor being fought at the end of FFXII. Peter Beckman's voice really carried the character too.
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Jan 28, 2023 23:24
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I adore everything about Osbourne's plot and only lament the lack of screen time for him and best anguis to really make it hit lol.
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Jan 29, 2023 02:48
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 at this pic https://twitter.com/noisypixelnews/status/1626619779703242758?s=46&t=UhqXRU2XU7_d7JgCS1Riqw
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Feb 17, 2023 22:53
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https://twitter.com/sonicmega/status/1626696885410082816 https://twitter.com/ItsXanthor/status/1626716218249060352 Chiplock and Huynh won't be returning as Rean or Altina it seems for the anime. Unknown if it's just for the anime, or if there's going to be a delay as they get recast for Reverie. Chiplock did say he recorded all of his lines as Rean for Reverie but I mean, it's NISA. I wouldn't put it past them to delay the game further and do a complete recast.
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Feb 18, 2023 00:37
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Something weird went on with the dub production and now Rean and Altinas game VA's had to pull out (was amicable they announced it themselves) edit: beaten Maybe it was because of the freeze in Dallas messing with dub scheduling?
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Feb 18, 2023 00:38
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It's probably just the anime because they're handled by different companies, there's no need to go conspiracy theory on NISA about it
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Feb 18, 2023 03:34
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They should have delayed the dub.
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Feb 18, 2023 05:01
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Wouldn’t be surprised if it was a union thing and CR not wanting to pay an updated Union rate
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Feb 18, 2023 05:08
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Kashuno posted:Wouldn’t be surprised if it was a union thing and CR not wanting to pay an updated Union rate Oh yeah, considering how little they try and pay people that's pretty likely
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Feb 18, 2023 06:12
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i dont think NISA would have any involvement on the anime's dub so theres no reason why itd affect the games/be indicative of anything about them
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Feb 18, 2023 08:22
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On the flip side I have a cork board and a punch of pins already in my hand, I'm ready to tie it all together
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Feb 18, 2023 08:24
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Ishmelga strikes again
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Feb 18, 2023 12:28
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Kashuno posted:Wouldn’t be surprised if it was a union thing and CR not wanting to pay an updated Union rate They’d already announced them as the VAs so I imagine contracts had already been signed on that front
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Feb 19, 2023 10:31
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they also both said there were no hard feelings also theres been nothing about any of the other returning characters not getting their old VAs back it was seriously just a logistical issue. sometimes its as simple as that. chill out, people
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Feb 19, 2023 10:32
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Sean's gotten stupid popular after all.
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Feb 19, 2023 17:30
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I wanted to go  but it's been a busy week so I'll let it go
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Feb 19, 2023 17:36
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While we're on the topic how is the anime? I watched the first couple episodes and it felt really slow and boring, did it pick up since then?
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Feb 19, 2023 18:03
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Kashuno posted:While we're on the topic how is the anime? I watched the first couple episodes and it felt really slow and boring, did it pick up since then? It's... alright The animation isn't anything special, but there's glimpses of interesting writing in the main squad. It's definitely picked up in recent episodes as they get closer to the war actually starting. Like a previous episode had the squad arrive in Celdic at night when Lecter, Millium, and Altina stop them and Lecter reveals one of the members was a Northern Jaeger involved in Celdic's burning in CS2, and he ends up getting captured in a convenient cover for Erebonia to start demanding reparations from North Ambria
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Feb 19, 2023 18:39
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Episode 3 was absolutely the worst and it's been up from there. The second half of episode 3 was just weird.
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Feb 19, 2023 23:28
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It's a very Cold Steel anime. For good and ill. In that one episode you get stupid goofy filler, the next you'll get some intrigue. The thing is though, you kinda know how it's all going to end if you play Cold Steel 3.
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Feb 20, 2023 22:12
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https://twitter.com/NISAmerica/status/1631082911310172160?s=20
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Mar 2, 2023 07:00
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This means NISA has the rights to localize Kuro. So they're probably going to do something similar like they did with Nayuta, where the Japanese PC port will be patched with English language support later on. You'll probably hear about it after Reverie releases. Edit: https://twitter.com/nihonfalcom/status/1631086556391051264?t=_ZEuupLiwaBkJjNHrcF0IA&s=19 Falcom straight up confirms that the game is being localized officially into English in this tweet, probably to NISA's annoyance. So yeah. Kuro is officially confirmed as coming over, the question is when. Selenephos fucked around with this message at 08:24 on Mar 2, 2023 |
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Mar 2, 2023 08:18
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Cool, now I can play Kuro. Was thinking the jp version would only release once NISA got to localising but very happy its coming earlier than that.
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Mar 2, 2023 10:34
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SyntheticPolygon posted:Cool, now I can play Kuro. Was thinking the jp version would only release once NISA got to localising but very happy its coming earlier than that. https://store.steampowered.com/app/2138610/The_Legend_of_Heroes_Kuro_no_Kiseki/ It's already out. Japanese only but it'll be patched later in English. It also works with the existing fan translation patch apparently, so you can play it in English now, it just won't be official.
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Mar 2, 2023 13:42
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Durande also posted a blog where he explains what they did for the port. That's a whole lot more than, "runs on PC". https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/2138610/view/3675538191993632884 They introduced asset compression so the whole game shrinks down to 9 GB. The game uses as much memory as available to almost eliminate loading times. This can be configured or turned off completely, as it should be. The more common stuff like 360FPS max, widescreen and full mouse support, etc. They continue the trend of having some of the best console ports in the industry. Apparently the game is called "Trails in the Dark" in some of the files. That's a cheeky WiP name.
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Mar 2, 2023 14:47
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Pretty sure Durante's company could hire translators and VAs and perform that part of the job much better, if Falcom would just cut a certain middleman from the equation.
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Mar 2, 2023 14:51
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lagidnam posted:Durande also posted a blog where he explains what they did for the port. That's a whole lot more than, "runs on PC". I mean the CLE port was only like 12 GB anyway. It's not that huge of a difference, not like CLE's port of Reverie which was 50 GB. Trails in the Dark is also apparently just a placeholder name because the actual localized name wasn't confirmed yet, according to Durante on a Reddit thread. I still think it'll end up being Trails Before Dawn, it's thematically appropriate for what happens in the games.
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Mar 2, 2023 14:57
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Mr. Fortitude posted:https://store.steampowered.com/app/2138610/The_Legend_of_Heroes_Kuro_no_Kiseki/ Think I know what I'll be researching this weekend
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