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(Thread IKs: fart simpson)
 
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Ardennes
May 12, 2002

Cerebral Bore posted:

it's p funny that neoliberalism is such a garbo economic system that the ostensibly richest part of the world can't even match the production capabilities of russia

really makes all that boasting about beating the chinese over taiwan even funnier

The Western press really really wants Taiwanese people to die in street fighting with the PLA.

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i say swears online
Mar 4, 2005

oh please. they would die on beaches

Ardennes
May 12, 2002

i say swears online posted:

oh please. they would die on beaches

Even the Western press is not that optimistic

KomradeX
Oct 29, 2011

Danann posted:



yeah let's go to war with basically nothing in the tank that'll work out

One swift kick will bring the whole rotten strcture down. Just like our German friends taught us

Ardennes
May 12, 2002

KomradeX posted:

One swift kick will bring the whole rotten strcture down. Just like our German friends taught us

I would say the PRC is the sleeping giant in this case.

KomradeX
Oct 29, 2011

Ardennes posted:

I would say the PRC is the sleeping giant in this case.

Yeah but are r worded leadership doesn't think so. Remember when Biden said America is still the workshop of the world

Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021

Hedenius posted:

Whenever westerners pretend to give a poo poo about Chinese oppression of Uyghurs they should ask themselves why the oppression of Tibetans is not more important. 90's kids remember how Tibet was important and how Tibetans fled China to find freedom in India. As a Swede it struck me how little you read about Tibet in major Swedish papers anymore. You'll see endless stuff about Xinjiang but nothing about Tibet.

Now why is that?

When China annexed Tibet it had a population of about a million people. 70 or so years later the population of The Tibetan autonomous region is more than 3,6 million (90% ethnic Tibetans).



The Tibetan economy is developing at such an astonishing rate that even on Wikipedia the only thing "critics"* can come up with is to imagine an alternative reality where this is not happening. And looking at an rate of economic expansion going from 14.7 percent to 7.4 percent in 2008 and trying to blame it on the "Lhasa riots" is hilarious. Sure, there was a global economic crisis happening at the same time but that probably had nothing to do with it.

I was actually shocked to find out that His Holiness the 14th Dalai Lama is no longer advocating for Tibetan independence. Turns out that's the reason I never hear anything about him in the mainstream press these days.

And it turns out that the rate of Tibetans fleeing China has decreased as the economy has developed.

Just check this LA Times article from 2009

Tibetans in India usually can't become citizens and face a bunch of discrimination. And how do the freedom-lovers talk about that?



Whenever someone talks about Chinese imperialism it is a good idea to look at how the regions subjected to this "Chinese imperialism" do economically compared to the regions subjected to Western imperialism.



*Definitely not associated with the CIA or State Department.

wait so your complaint is that tibetians becoming indian citizens now is bad?

Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021
Also don't think the PRC is asleep that much given that they are doing poo poo like this:

https://foreignpolicy.com/2023/01/22/china-xi-xiongan-future-city/

Jazerus
May 24, 2011


it's gonna be funny when xiongan is delivering on the "city of the future" poo poo while NEOM THE LINE sinks into the sea

Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021
yeah, its like NEOM but the PRC has already given everyone who was displaced housing in this future tech city that is actually being built.

i say swears online
Mar 4, 2005

Stairmaster
Jun 8, 2012


why didnt you put photographs of the respective cities in

Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021
Neom like like 6 shacks in the desert.

Weka
May 5, 2019

That child totally had it coming. Nobody should be able to be out at dusk except cars.

Cerebral Bore posted:

it's p funny that neoliberalism is such a garbo economic system that the ostensibly richest part of the world can't even match the production capabilities of russia

really makes all that boasting about beating the chinese over taiwan even funnier

Eh, one of the main goals for America in this proxy war is to force Russia to switch their economy on to more of a war time footing while they don't change theirs. This has met with limited success.

i say swears online
Mar 4, 2005

Stairmaster posted:

why didnt you put photographs of the respective cities in


Tankbuster posted:

Neom like like 6 shacks in the desert.

yeah beyond phoneposting, NEOM is [file not found dot jay peg]

Stairmaster
Jun 8, 2012

either use the concept art or use the shacks

Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021

Weka posted:

Eh, one of the main goals for America in this proxy war is to force Russia to switch their economy on to more of a war time footing while they don't change theirs. This has met with limited success.

If only russia bordered a country that basically makes all the consumer goods in the world.

Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021

Stairmaster posted:

either use the concept art or use the shacks

yeah but one side is actually building things while the other side has concept art.

Real hurthling!
Sep 11, 2001




they bulldozed a little bit of the line i think thats it.

neom is just cover for persecuting the nomads that live in that area iirc. like the plan is just ruin a huge slice of desert those people depend on so they go away

Lord of Pie
Mar 2, 2007


Pretty sure there's still a couple old historic buildings in Mecca for them to bulldoze before worrying themselves with NEOM

Spergin Morlock
Aug 8, 2009
Probation
Can't post for 3 hours!

Tankbuster posted:

Also don't think the PRC is asleep that much given that they are doing poo poo like this:

https://foreignpolicy.com/2023/01/22/china-xi-xiongan-future-city/

the whole digital twin "city in the cloud" thing is interesting. like a fully integrated CAD drawing of the entire city, and then some

ModernMajorGeneral
Jun 25, 2010
https://twitter.com/CarlZha/status/1618138823652962304?s=20&t=1nEA9_uTxwPEL_AJ9rF78Q

Hedenius
Aug 23, 2007

Tankbuster posted:

wait so your complaint is that tibetians becoming indian citizens now is bad?

I think you misunderstand me. My point is that Tibetans in China have seen huge improvements in their economic situation while Tibetans in India are impoverished and second class citizens deemed unfit for anything but anti-China propaganda.

Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021
they are impoverished because they generally live in a less economically developed country and if they live in dharamsala they basically have to do do lovely service jobs in a bloated tourist trap.

stephenthinkpad
Jan 2, 2020
I have said this before, US's switch from supporting Tibetan minority to Uyghurs Muslims (as well as other Muslim minorities in Myanmar and other countries, maybe Pakistan too) was likely part of CIA's strategic pivot. Probably to divert attention to the awful things the West has been doing to the Muslims. It has nothing to do with the actual life quality improvement of the minorities.

Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021
Also Indians are racist to each other about as much as they are to tibetians. We just call them all chinese and then get real mad when the PRC claims Arunachal pradesh and like half of ladakh.

Orange Devil
Oct 1, 2010

Wullie's reign cannae smother the flames o' equality!

Tankbuster posted:

Also Indians are racist to each other about as much as they are to tibetians. We just call them all chinese and then get real mad when the PRC claims Arunachal pradesh and like half of ladakh.

Have you considered letting the PRC claim all of India?

Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021
no, we are too racist for that.

Palladium
May 8, 2012

Very Good
✔️✔️✔️✔️

Danann posted:

yeah let's go to war with basically nothing in the tank that'll work out

remember US ran out of 5.56mm ammo and had to buy them from israel and china, where their troops were fighting in ultra-high intensity global warfare by playing xboxes in air conditioned bases

AnimeIsTrash
Jun 30, 2018

Orange Devil posted:

Have you considered letting the PRC claim all of India?

no only i can unify the subcontinent

comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

pretty sure it's more militarily effective to cripple and maim your target than lethally kill them

Mantis42
Jul 26, 2010

no? that gives them a chance to get extra kills while in last stand mode.

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.

Tankbuster posted:

no, we are too racist for that.

Ran out of sick days, called in racist

atelier morgan
Mar 11, 2003

super-scientific, ultra-gay

Lipstick Apathy

Orange Devil posted:

Have you considered letting the PRC claim all of India?

i mean obviously i would prefer if we just let PRC claim the whole planet over status quo but nooooooooo

Weka
May 5, 2019

That child totally had it coming. Nobody should be able to be out at dusk except cars.

AnimeIsTrash posted:

no only i can unify the subcontinent

Not even you can make a whole subcontinent unite in hatred.

Hedenius
Aug 23, 2007

Tankbuster posted:

they are impoverished because they generally live in a less economically developed country and if they live in dharamsala they basically have to do do lovely service jobs in a bloated tourist trap.

Back in the 90's when Tibet was still poor and undeveloped western media was full of stories about Tibet. Films like Seven Years in Tibet and Kudun were playing in cinemas and the Dalai Lama was constantly doing world tours. Tibetan Freedom Concerts had the some of the biggest bands at the time playing for audiences of over a hundred thousand people.

Today you don't hear anything about Tibet. Precisely because it's hard to ignore how Tibetans in Tibet have seen huge economic growth while Tibetans in exile have no choice but to "do lovely service jobs".

The Dalai Lama in 2016 posted:

“Politically we are not looking for independence. For economic and other reasons, we want to stay within China. But the Tibet issue is not just a political matter, it is the preservation of one of the world’s ancient cultures which is relevant to today’s world. So it is worthwhile to preserve it. The Chinese government has the responsibility to preserve rather than destroy it.”

I'd bet everything I own that the vast majority of westerners still think that The Dalai Lama is fighting for Tibetan independence.

My point is that it's a good idea to keep all this in mind whenever you read about Xinjiang.

Jel Shaker
Apr 19, 2003

if tibet comes up in conversation now a clever so-and-so will mention how tibet is a main water source for china, and it’s in their national interest to never let it go, but that it’s also india’s main water source … and might drag them both into a war

Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021

Hedenius posted:

Back in the 90's when Tibet was still poor and undeveloped western media was full of stories about Tibet. Films like Seven Years in Tibet and Kudun were playing in cinemas and the Dalai Lama was constantly doing world tours. Tibetan Freedom Concerts had the some of the biggest bands at the time playing for audiences of over a hundred thousand people.

Today you don't hear anything about Tibet. Precisely because it's hard to ignore how Tibetans in Tibet have seen huge economic growth while Tibetans in exile have no choice but to "do lovely service jobs".

I'd bet everything I own that the vast majority of westerners still think that The Dalai Lama is fighting for Tibetan independence.

My point is that it's a good idea to keep all this in mind whenever you read about Xinjiang.

Tibet was a fun retirement hobby for certain libs at the end of history. Once someone jumpstarted History(tm) by crashing planes with no survivors, tibet was quickly jettisoned for the initial Crusade against the Islamic world and post the 2012 pivot to Asia(tm) a Crusade FOR the islamic minorities both done by bombing poor farmers with overly expensive equipment. The focus has now returned to fighting the Ruskies but now with feral eastern europeans whose countries worship people that were political in the 1940s.

The west keeps baying about weegers even though the PRC is making marked improvements in their material lives.

Telluric Whistler
Sep 14, 2008


Tankbuster posted:

Also don't think the PRC is asleep that much given that they are doing poo poo like this:

https://foreignpolicy.com/2023/01/22/china-xi-xiongan-future-city/

It's not really the thrust of the article but I always wonder about better ways to translate phrases like "千年大計“ ("thousand year great plan / project") or "__萬歲” ("<blank> <blank> for ten thousand years")

They are technically correct but always seem to come along with some connotations in Western circles of the CCP's mystical authoritarian language that reprograms the Chinese brain.

Or maybe it is I who is the Orientalist

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Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021
think its a poetic way of saying long term project.

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