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njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.


Phones these days have really loving stupid aspect ratios because they want all the vertical space possible for doomscrolling through Twitter while also understanding that anything over 1080p is stupid for a small screen. The Razer resolution is 2400x1080.

Rolo posted:

That’s not even ultra wide what the gently caress lmao.

Bad product, looks like it’s up to the Pimax to take us all to retro heaven.
I wouldn't get excited over a handheld using an XR2, it's a Snapdragon 865 with support for more cameras to allow for VR tracking. It'll maybe be slightly more powerful than the Odin but probably not enough to noticably matter in actual game performance.

njsykora fucked around with this message at 00:04 on Jan 30, 2023

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Rolo
Nov 16, 2005

Hmm, what have we here?
Oh I’m joking, I don’t expect the Pimax to take me to retro heaven.

Assepoester
Jul 18, 2004
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!
Melman v2

MonkeyforaHead posted:

I got the bright idea of, "I know, I'll put Rhythm Tengoku on the 280v to test input latency." I don't know what sort of black loving magic is at play here, if it's to be credited more to the unit itself, something in Retroarch, or the choice/optimization of cores, but I know that every other time I've taken a swing at playing this I've had to deal with somewhere around 100ms of input lag, which is catastrophic to a game as sensitive to timing as the Rhythm Heaven series. You pretty much have to play these on genuine hardware for them to work as intended, which is why I actually went out of my way to order an import cart back in the day when this went un-localized.

And yet here I am for the first time able to play this emulated with seemingly zero input latency. Went ahead and slapped the fan-translation patch on it. Here we are, 17 years later, and I'm finally able to play this in English with proper goddamn input response.

Oh god it's been 17 loving years
There's probably an advantage to OpenDingux being so mature and optimized and slimmed down. It's a kernel optimized for running emulators and that's it.

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.


It's a good example of how the hype cycle is kinda masking how stagnant mobile SOCs and by extension the Android emulation handheld world is getting. It's no wonder the whole industry is descending on handheld PCs because there's way more room to grow there. Even a cheaper APU like the Mendocino AMD chips would be better solely for emulation since you then have access to the PC emulation world and aren't limited by what's available on Android. Like the Loki Mini Pro is $300 and will likely crush any of the Android handhelds.

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007

It really bugs me that the Razer isn’t all one device. There’s like no reason it shouldn’t be. It’s so dumb lol

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.


That takes time and money, why do that when we can make a cheap phone and ship it with this controller we already make.

coconono
Aug 11, 2004

KISS ME KRIS

njsykora posted:

It's a good example of how the hype cycle is kinda masking how stagnant mobile SOCs and by extension the Android emulation handheld world is getting. It's no wonder the whole industry is descending on handheld PCs because there's way more room to grow there. Even a cheaper APU like the Mendocino AMD chips would be better solely for emulation since you then have access to the PC emulation world and aren't limited by what's available on Android. Like the Loki Mini Pro is $300 and will likely crush any of the Android handhelds.

Android hardware not allowing easier OS customization/3rd party OS is really hampering DIY development, which in turn slows innovation. I have this stack of OEM phones and I'm learning they're useless for anything beyond being OEM phones. I was hoping to build companion hardware for my chromecast out of them. I guess I'll trade them for some delta10 carts or whatever.

Meanwhile windows mobile has some nice rooting tools that work regardless of hardware.

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.


Which is weird because greater customisation and freedom to gently caress with the device is supposed to be Android's thing. But when every hardware manufacturer needs to load all their ad service stuff into a device it makes sense why they don't want you just ripping all that out in favour of a clean install.

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007

I’m about over this Razer thing. It supposed to be fast but it doesn’t feel “fast”.

It’s definitely a hard pass device and hell I’m not sure I’d recommend it even at $200. The Odin pro is better simply because it has regular screen bezels.

Streaming via GeForce now worked ok because most PC games support the weird resolution the stupid device has.

stephenthinkpad
Jan 2, 2020

MarcusSA posted:

I’m about over this Razer thing. It supposed to be fast but it doesn’t feel “fast”.

It’s definitely a hard pass device and hell I’m not sure I’d recommend it even at $200. The Odin pro is better simply because it has regular screen bezels.

Streaming via GeForce now worked ok because most PC games support the weird resolution the stupid device has.

Can you use the controller on your own phone?

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007

stephenthinkpad posted:

Can you use the controller on your own phone?

I have a google pixel 7 I can try it on but I’ll guess that it works just fine on any USBC phone.

I have a kishi for my iPhone and I like it well enough.

Assepoester
Jul 18, 2004
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!
Melman v2
Honestly now that the Backbone exists for Android there really is no reason to get the Razer Kishi 2, to the point that it's basically just a slightly worse clone of the Backbone for the same price

MonkeyforaHead
Apr 7, 2006


God, you vindictive bitch, why can't I ever have any "me" time

It's been like 15 years since I dared try to dip my toes back into arcade emulation and how has this process only gotten so much more idiotic, convoluted, segmented, and broken in that span :psypop:

Froist
Jun 6, 2004

MonkeyforaHead posted:

It's been like 15 years since I dared try to dip my toes back into arcade emulation and how has this process only gotten so much more idiotic, convoluted, segmented, and broken in that span :psypop:

It's the one part of this whole scene I've never got my head around, and probably never will. Luckily I didn't grow up playing arcades so I've got no nostalgia for it, and I don't know of any "must play" games I'm really missing out on by just pretending arcades didn't exist. Seems like anything decent got a port to some console, and even if it's not the purist's definitive version ignorance is bliss.

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.


I think part of it is probably down to there being no one arcade format. Every machine was different, especially in the early days.

TVs Ian
Jun 1, 2000

Such graceful, delicate creatures.

MonkeyforaHead posted:

It's been like 15 years since I dared try to dip my toes back into arcade emulation and how has this process only gotten so much more idiotic, convoluted, segmented, and broken in that span :psypop:

The big problem is that you have to keep the ROMs in sync with the emulator. As previous bad dumps are replaced and undumpable chips are read, old rom sets drift away from what the emulator is looking for. Plus ROMs are typically split between a parent and clone ROMs for different regions etc - they tend to share most of the same files, so the zips get split up to save space. But if you copy just the clone rom, it won’t run without the parent and possibly bios or device ROMs.

The trick for that is to find a non-merged set (every clone zip also includes needed ROMs from the parent), plus a set of bios/device ROMs.

There are programs to scan and rebuild rom sets for specific versions of MAME (and other emulators), and let you know what you’re missing.

Another part of problem with arcade emulation is that the handhelds don’t typically have enough power to run MAME (which prioritizes accuracy over speed), so there are Retroarch cores based on old versions of MAME. The plus side is the ROMs for those old versions don’t change, and the sets are out there. The down side is that they have 20-year old bugs & missing featured in the emulation. And the Retroarch porting tends to be kind of half-assed.

Honestly, on handhelds and SBCs, you’re probably better off just using FBNeo, since that emulates most of the same games as the old MAME versions but prioritizes speed.

On a PC, you’re looking at:
Current MAME for everything up to early 3D
Model 2 emulator for Sega Model 2
Supermodel for Sega Model 3
Most Dreamcast emulators support Naomi/Naomi 2 and Atomiswave
Demul is currently the one emulator that supports Sega Hikaru if you really need to play Planet Harriers or something.

After that, pretty much everything is Windows-based hardware. And that’s where it gets complicated. Games were built for a specific set of hardware and Windows versions, and the “emulators” for those basically trick the exe into thinking that’s what it’s running on. With mixed success - some games that were designed around AMD graphics may not run right on nVidia and vice versa. Some games have patches for that, and to run at other resolutions, etc.

If you wanted to start digging into that, Teknoparrot supports most of them, there are also a couple of others that will support some platforms like Taito Type X, but that’s where you start running into intentional roadblocks from some of the authors.

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007

Who ever mentioned that the kishi would drain the battery over night seems to be correct.

I left the thing with like 70% battery last night and this morning it’s at 23%.

lol that you can’t leave your $400 gaming device on standby for a day.

I’m gonna check it again just to be sure but it seems like that is the case.

MonkeyforaHead
Apr 7, 2006


God, you vindictive bitch, why can't I ever have any "me" time

TVs Ian posted:

The big problem is that you have to keep the ROMs in sync with the emulator.

Yeah I well recall the practice of trying to hunt down MAME dumps while avoiding FBA, identifying parent dumps from the clones, learning the difference between merged, nonmerged, and split sets, and then cobbling it all together and only half of it working (and even then only half of those not being destroyed by performance issues or graphical corruption). I've only just now familiarized myself with the process of hunting down DATs for specific emulator revisions and rebuilding sets, and it took following 3 different tutorials for one of them to actually work. Then there's the issue that I'm having to build for FBA on the 280v, and apparently most "complete" FBA sets are some wack-rear end trash featuring an entirely arbitrary assortment of games while pretending half the specific library I'm looking for doesn't exist. Took about six hours just to get Joust and Rampage working, and even then I ended up having to shunt them into the MAME folder despite specifically building them for FBA. Whatever, it works now!

Then I spent another few hours trying to figure out what could possibly be wrong with the Neo Geo BIOS before discovering that it apparently goes in the roms folder, not the BIOS folder. Silly me.

sethsez
Jul 14, 2006

He's soooo dreamy...

MarcusSA posted:

Who ever mentioned that the kishi would drain the battery over night seems to be correct.

I left the thing with like 70% battery last night and this morning it’s at 23%.

lol that you can’t leave your $400 gaming device on standby for a day.

I’m gonna check it again just to be sure but it seems like that is the case.

A Razer engineer over on Reddit confirmed it.

This thing is such a disaster lmao

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007

sethsez posted:

A Razer engineer over on Reddit confirmed it.

This thing is such a disaster lmao

Lmao

If they gave it to me free I’d probably maybe use it but it’s just a sub par experience all around.

stephenthinkpad
Jan 2, 2020
Question about all these 6“ window based consoles. If I pick one of the low end $300 variants (there are so many from Ayn, Aya and GDP win whatever), are they all powerful enough to emulate every PS2 games? What about the Switch version of Devil May Cry?

And the next question is how well can they (the $300 consoles, not the $600 ones) play kinda old driving games from Steam? My go to arcade driving game is The Crew 2. Since it isn't support on the Deck and more importantly, I don't like the size of the Deck. There is almost no reason for me to keep one in the house.

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007

stephenthinkpad posted:

Question about all these 6“ window based consoles. If I pick one of the low end $300 variants (there are so many from Any, Ana and GDP win whatever), are they all powerful enough to emulate every PS2 games? What about the Switch version of Devil May Cry?

And the next question is how well can they (the $300 consoles, not the $600 ones) play kinda old driving games from Steam? My go to arcade driving game is The Crew 2. Since it isn't support on the Deck and more importantly, I don't like the size of the Deck. There is almost no reason for me to keep one in the house.

I think so. You might not get 2x on them but you should be able to native it.

https://youtu.be/Ve6lpLqUOEc

MarcusSA fucked around with this message at 22:46 on Jan 30, 2023

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.


stephenthinkpad posted:

Question about all these 6“ window based consoles. If I pick one of the low end $300 variants (there are so many from Ayn, Aya and GDP win whatever), are they all powerful enough to emulate every PS2 games? What about the Switch version of Devil May Cry?

And the next question is how well can they (the $300 consoles, not the $600 ones) play kinda old driving games from Steam? My go to arcade driving game is The Crew 2. Since it isn't support on the Deck and more importantly, I don't like the size of the Deck. There is almost no reason for me to keep one in the house.

Basically any decent power handheld PC will run older PC games absolutely no problem and easily emulate PS2. The $300 Ayn Loki Mini Pro will more than do what you're asking for. Switch stuff I wouldn't bet on though, Switch emulation is spotty at best on the Deck so it's unlikely a lower powered device will do any better. You'd be better off just grabbing the DMC games on Steam when they go on sale.

Rinkles
Oct 24, 2010

What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?
I'd like to see how they handle the Ratchet games, because my Skylake i5 had trouble with them.

stephenthinkpad
Jan 2, 2020
Okay but how about The Crew 2? Say the cpu is not the bottleneck then how big of a harddrive to you need to run these windows games comfortably?

I forgot DMC3 is on Steam, okay then there is zero need for me to emulate Switch.

Assepoester
Jul 18, 2004
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!
Melman v2

stephenthinkpad posted:

Question about all these 6“ window based consoles. If I pick one of the low end $300 variants (there are so many from Ayn, Aya and GDP win whatever), are they all powerful enough to emulate every PS2 games? What about the Switch version of Devil May Cry?

And the next question is how well can they (the $300 consoles, not the $600 ones) play kinda old driving games from Steam? My go to arcade driving game is The Crew 2. Since it isn't support on the Deck and more importantly, I don't like the size of the Deck. There is almost no reason for me to keep one in the house.
The Ayn Loki isn't out yet so the only actual* $300 console you can buy right now is the Anbernic Win 600 3020e (lowest end) model, and it appears to play PC ports of PS360 era racing games just fine:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-EGi7kdBNc&t=582s

But the PS2 and Switch emulation isn't that good, it's definitely not powerful enough to play every PS2 game

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-W8WFn2gZBg&t=675s

*does not include shipping

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007

LMAO

I'm trying to do a return on this stupid thing and its trying to charge me $15 to return it.

Bogart
Apr 12, 2010

by VideoGames
I think you can raise enough of a stink after their inaccurate website description that they'll return it for free.

stephenthinkpad
Jan 2, 2020
Write some bad reviews on BBB and google and YouTube comments.

sethsez
Jul 14, 2006

He's soooo dreamy...

MarcusSA posted:

LMAO

I'm trying to do a return on this stupid thing and its trying to charge me $15 to return it.

ahahahaha buying from AliExpress is less scummy

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007

I had to talk to CS to get it free but its pretty lame they auto charge you for a return.

So yeah don't waste your time with Razer lol

The Ayn Loki should be the next device I get. The Odin is fantastic so I'm not worried about it being crap.

kirbysuperstar
Nov 11, 2012

Let the fools who stand before us be destroyed by the power you and I possess.
Thanks for being the canary in the coal mine, Marcus

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007

Ranking the Devices right now for me

Myoo Mini
Odin Pro / Lite
Steam deck

I really love the mini because it's not that expensive and the screen looks great. The Odin has solid build quality and is decently fast.

The Steam deck is my favorite for obvious reasons and its the best price to performance out of any hand held right now.

I really like my GPD Win Max 2 but its not super ergonomic. The screen is fantastic and large though.

Rolo
Nov 16, 2005

Hmm, what have we here?
Marcus do you even own a Chicken Boi yet

Cory Parsnipson
Nov 15, 2015
Mother, when may I have a Miyoo Mini?

When the market supply catches up to demand, dear.

:negative:

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007

Rolo posted:

Marcus do you even own a Chicken Boi yet

Lol no but I am getting ready to move and I'm finally getting my office back so I might order one as a lark if I can get it cheap.

Rolo
Nov 16, 2005

Hmm, what have we here?
Chicken Boi is basically “we have Miyoo Mini at home.”

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007

I really want to get some stands for my retro stuff and display them all nicely. I'll have to check like Aliexpress for some decently looking plastic stands.

Bourricot
Aug 7, 2016



Cory Parsnipson posted:

Mother, when may I have a Miyoo Mini?

When the market supply catches up to demand, dear.

:negative:

Apparently, the Mini uses an old BlackBerry screen which is only getting harder to source. The soon to be released Mini+ uses a slightly bigger screen and should not suffer the same issue.

Edit: Reddit has a size comparison

RG35XX, Mini+, Mini

Bourricot fucked around with this message at 09:09 on Jan 31, 2023

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Cory Parsnipson
Nov 15, 2015

Bourricot posted:

Apparently, the Mini uses an old BlackBerry screen which is only getting harder to source. The soon to be released Mini+ uses a slightly bigger screen and should not suffer the same issue.

Edit: Reddit has a size comparison

RG35XX, Mini+, Mini

Oh a slightly bigger mini is actually super perfect. Cant wait!

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