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Judgy Fucker posted:Anecdotal and niche so I won’t overgeneralize but having been to Paris many times, often as part of a tour group my family led, how you dress definitely has an effect on how people interact with you. Many Parisians will not give the time of day to shlubbily-dressed tourists, and scam artists/pickpockets single such people out. It’s easy to avoid the thieves if you know what you’re doing but it’s better to just blend in in my experience. More than once a Parisian has mistaken my wife and I for locals and when they figure out we’re Americans they do the Looney Tunes thing where they run away so fast there’s a little wispy outline of themselves where they used to be. Like dressing in white trainers and a windbreaker won’t ruin your trip but also sticking out like a sore thumb does have consequences that can wear on you. I agree you will get treated differently if you dress much different to local norms, which is why noted as such and took care to mention jeans, button shirt and jacket (admittedly I forget to mention make it black or some other dour color so popular in Europe). After years of experiencing the free use of color in Africa, the only song I can think of playing through my head when stepping off a plane in Europe (especially Switzerland) is "Paint it black" by the strolling bones. webmeister posted:Yeah, sport jerseys and college/university sweaters make it super easy to spot Americans. Shorts as well I think, maybe not as much Europe but definitely in other parts of the world Not just yanks, if it is hot weather, I am going to be wearing shorts and the social impact as well as keep myself out of shrines/churches/mosques, government buildings as much as possible and too expensive bars unless I really need to (and then I will pull on some long pants).
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Jan 31, 2023 10:17
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Doll House Ghost posted:We travelled for 6 months with 40l backbags with my partner, with temperatures ranging from -1C and snowing to +35C. I managed to fit several outfits in my bag, most of it stuff I wear regularly anyway. Uniqlo is pretty good if you want comfortable, lightweight and easily packable clothing fit for many occasions that doesn't look extremely sporty/techy or break the bank. Yeah I've done multiple 6-month trips on just a 40L carry-on backpack as well. Most recently we did four months across South America from subzero temps in the highlands of Peru and Bolivia, all the way to the Amazon and the beaches of Rio. No daggy ~traveller~ gear like zipoff cargo pants with 30 pockets, just a pair of jeans, one pair of shorts, five x tshirts/underwear/socks, one nice polo shirt (Ben Sherman sort of thing), pyjama shorts, swimmers, rain jacket, thin woollen jumper, Uniqlo puffer jacket, thongs, toiletries, and a single pair of shoes (waterproof hiking shoes in an unremarkable colour, not chunky boots or blindingly white trainers). Though admittedly I also carry a very small messenger bag with a tablet computer and little tech bits (reading glasses, cords etc). Overall, I'm way happier with travelling super light. I used to be a chronic overpacker, before I realised that most stuff I either didn't need or could easily work around not having. For example I'm not the slightest bit concerned about not having extra space for souvenirs or shopping. I don't do much shopping at home, so I definitely don't do much shopping when travelling either. And I'm long past the souvenir collecting days, I'm happy with my photos and journals - I don't need a lame collection of fridge magnets or shot glasses or whatever. And as for the laundry thing, I don't have an issue with doing my own washing a couple of times a week. It's not like it takes that long and it's only a couple of times a week at most. In cheaper countries it's usually pretty easy to find a laundry that charges per kilogram rather than per item, so you can just drop off a load and pick it up 24 hours later, rather than sitting there watching your clothes go through a machine. I get why you wouldn't want to bother with washing on a two week holiday, but when you're travelling for months at a time it's honestly not a huge concern.
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Jan 31, 2023 11:43
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webmeister posted:I get why you wouldn't want to bother with washing on a two week holiday, but when you're travelling for months at a time it's honestly not a huge concern. Yeah I guess thinking about it, that's why my 35L is always full regardless of trip length. 10 day trip? New change of clothes every day. One month trip? Five to seven pairs of socks and underwear. A two week trip is probably the hardest to pack for, since it's just short enough that I don't want to find a place to do laundry, but long enough that packing something for every day-or-so means a lot of stuff. Electric Wrigglies posted:After years of experiencing the free use of color in Africa, the only song I can think of playing through my head when stepping off a plane in Europe (especially Switzerland) is "Paint it black" by the strolling bones. Yeah, everyone wearing black all winter is unreal. That said I don't wear black and I am never pegged as a tourist in big cities in Europe, so I don't think it's so much a tourist thing to do as a rare thing to do. Helios Grime posted:A Swiss tourist abroad is easily identifiable. Always wears ON brand sneakers, I don't even know what "ON brand" is. I guess I would be hosed for my citizenship application this summer, for the "cultural integration" part. Good thing my wife is Swiss.
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Jan 31, 2023 12:14
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I'll be going to Roskilde for a music festival in April so obviously I'll want to spend a few days checking out Copenhagen. What are some must-sees or must-dos there?
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Jan 31, 2023 13:40
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Saladman posted:I don't even know what "ON brand" is. I guess I would be hosed for my citizenship application this summer, for the "cultural integration" part. Good thing my wife is Swiss. Yikes, how could you not know of the shoe sponsored/owned by our one and true god of sport Roger Federer? 
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Jan 31, 2023 13:48
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I occasionally see European men wearing football (soccer) shirts while travelling. My guess is they want strangers to approach them and chat football, which is quite likely to happen if eg. you're wearing a Premier League shirt in a country where PL is popular. Maybe this is true of Americans as well (much less likelihood of it happening, but could be a conversation starter when meeting other Americans.)
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Jan 31, 2023 15:15
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Al2001 posted:I occasionally see European men wearing football (soccer) shirts while travelling. My guess is Americans are the only nationality that thinks people want to be approached by them. People don't want to be approached, anywhere, ever. Possible exception for the covid sceptics who've been abandoned by everyone they know for never shutting up about 5G vaccine sterilizations and so they just stand on street corners shouting and hoping someone will engage them.
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Jan 31, 2023 16:05
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they want strangers to approach them
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I was bored during a meeting so I just did a highly scientific analysis of people walking by: Out of 31 people:
                    So that's your central european winter camouflage if you want to blend in.
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Jan 31, 2023 16:38
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I'm assuming the censored picture had nudity in it. Noted, will give it a try.
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Jan 31, 2023 16:44
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Fruits of the sea posted:I'm assuming the censored picture had nudity in it. Noted, will give it a try. But yes.
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Jan 31, 2023 16:47
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Al2001 posted:I occasionally see European men wearing football (soccer) shirts while travelling. My guess is they want strangers to approach them and chat football, which is quite likely to happen if eg. you're wearing a Premier League shirt in a country where PL is popular. Maybe this is true of Americans as well (much less likelihood of it happening, but could be a conversation starter when meeting other Americans.) My SE Europe take is that only children wear their team/country jerseys in everyday occasions. Adults will wear them only if they're going to watch a game live, or if they are going to play with friends nearby. Rare exceptions for exotic or retro stuff, like a 1960's Brazil jersey or something in that vein. But more discrete markings, like hats or bags with team logos are common.
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Jan 31, 2023 18:54
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Honestly, just wear something weather appropriate that isn't bright as gently caress and horrific looking - even then in Scotland noone will judge you apart from internally thinking "This person dresses poorly". Maybe a "Nice jacket pal" and a rolleyes
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Jan 31, 2023 19:47
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I dress nice and don't wear jerseys. Once again the dumbest version of Americans need to stop traveling. I am loud though, that part is impossible to change
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Jan 31, 2023 20:23
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greazeball posted:Americans are the only nationality that thinks people want to be approached by them. People don't want to be approached, anywhere, ever. Possible exception for the covid sceptics who've been abandoned by everyone they know for never shutting up about 5G vaccine sterilizations and so they just stand on street corners shouting and hoping someone will engage them. Objection: Ireland In Ireland you can get into random street chats about nearly anything, as long as it's not nasty or mean. If you want mean racist chat, talk to 50% of taxi drivers. I have a dog, and I chat with strangers every single day about how cute and smart our dogs are. A few weeks ago, a mildly drunk man came up to me while I was waiting outside a supermarket to tell me musk ox weren't actually oxen, they are more closely related to goats. This was a thing I kind of already knew, so I had a nice little chat with mildly drunk guy about the evolution of the musk ox.
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Jan 31, 2023 20:51
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Pookah posted:Objection: Ireland OK that's fair, I lived in Dublin for a few years and it does ring true now that you mention it. But the Irish approach is different from the Americans. Irish folks generally have something to tell you to start the conversation, Americans more often than not start with a question, which can range from really personal to insanely dumb, and then the onus is on the other person to make the conversation. White Lotus captured it perfectly, the way people would just ask questions to people at the next table. But the Irish will absolutely rip you to shreds if you dare step out in anything but the plainest of clothes (I love this thread): https://twitter.com/janky_jane/status/1426981976142123010
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Jan 31, 2023 21:11
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greazeball posted:OK that's fair, I lived in Dublin for a few years and it does ring true now that you mention it. But the Irish approach is different from the Americans. Irish folks generally have something to tell you to start the conversation, Americans more often than not start with a question, which can range from really personal to insanely dumb, and then the onus is on the other person to make the conversation. White Lotus captured it perfectly, the way people would just ask questions to people at the next table. Yeah, I get you on the distinction between sharing a thought compared to asking for an answer. Asking strangers personal or potentially controversial questions is just asking for trouble. I loved that clothing thread. It's like, you can wear whatever you want but you'd better be prepared for commentary if it is any way out of the ordinary. You'll get a lot of respect if you can punch back about your unorthodox clothing choices.
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Jan 31, 2023 21:22
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Helios Grime posted:A Swiss tourist abroad is easily identifiable. Always wears ON brand sneakers, hiking pants with leg pockets, a checkered short sleeve shirt, and when it's cold a Mammut brand down jacket. Minus the sneaker brand (never heard of it stateside, but I don't get out much) you described about 1/3 of men walking on the streets of SF or Seattle. Bonus points for a giant beard and/or manbun
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Jan 31, 2023 21:29
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https://twitter.com/evanoconnell/status/1427337803843739653 lmao
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Jan 31, 2023 21:51
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I remember the flying thread, some goon insisted everyone to dress properly on the plane. He always wears a shirt and jacket and thinks he’s upholding some social contract instead of comfortable but ugly sweats. That post was over 10 years ago but I bought the guy an avatar of a goony guy wearing a suit and fedora. Now in Europe we all try to blend in and trash talk sports jerseys :ohdea: I think it’s because we are all old, at least over 30 years old. Well guess what, I’m coming back full circle. I’m going to wear my 2023 limited edition zootopia Judy the rabbit sweater. She’s celebrating CNY and I consider it my lucky zodiac rabbit because I just won some small lucky draw prize. Oh and my orange outer shell is a thin layer of nissin cup noodles and Mickey Mouse collab. It’s bright orange with Mickey Mouse doing some CNY pose at the back. Yes it’s a little ridiculous to wear in Italy but so is Catholicism. Forum users alucard and I will have some tasty gelato and hopefully my BFF Dutch goon will join us as well. As I write this post I just got my tickets sorted out to japan for another weekend and I got to do fill in silly electronic visitjapan immigration forms. I rather pay 8 euros with some ETSA than deal with this bureaucratic poo poo
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Feb 1, 2023 03:33
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Wonton posted:I remember the flying thread, some goon insisted everyone to dress properly on the plane. He always wears a shirt and jacket and thinks he’s upholding some social contract instead of comfortable but ugly sweats. That post was over 10 years ago but I bought the guy an avatar of a goony guy wearing a suit and fedora. Well at least it'll be easy for me to find you in the crowd
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Feb 1, 2023 04:00
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Wonton posted:I’m going to wear my 2023 limited edition zootopia Judy the rabbit sweater. She’s celebrating CNY and I consider it my lucky zodiac rabbit because I just won some small lucky draw prize. Use this one weird trick to never have someone ask you for directions in Europe. Snobs HATE it. Local moms use it to make $14,413 online per day. Also please don't flay other T&T goons to wear their skin as a distinctive suit. We get so little traffic in this subforum as-is.
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Feb 1, 2023 09:47
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greazeball posted:Americans are the only nationality that thinks people want to be approached by them. https://imgur.com/SRFHvvq
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Feb 2, 2023 04:05
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webmeister posted:Yeah, sport jerseys and college/university sweaters make it super easy to spot Americans. Shorts as well I think, maybe not as much Europe but definitely in other parts of the world In the UK you will see at least one guy walking down the street wearing shorts in any town or village, no matter the time of day/night, the season, weather or temperature.
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Feb 3, 2023 13:11
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Wonton posted:You should be angry that America has poo poo public transit and infrastructure, not using metric, and that every other country’s economy is basically subsidizing America. USA is the only country in the world that can print as much as it want and raise the debt ceiling whenever it wants without worrying about their currency becoming useless. I think you're making a big assumption that the average European isn't similarly terrible.
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Feb 4, 2023 00:06
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Residency Evil posted:I think you're making a big assumption that the average European isn't similarly terrible. We use sugar, op.
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Feb 4, 2023 13:21
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Road tripping in a rented EV! I've almost talked myself out of renting one for my garda-dolomite supertrip, given these articles: https://blog.ricksteves.com/cameron/2022/11/ev-europe-road-trip/ https://www.pcmag.com/how-to/renting-an-electric-vehicle-in-europe-everything-you-need-to-know and the fact that I'd need to: download several apps for each country the apps might not like American credit cards and I can't download the apps here at home in order to look into that credit card thing or check out the charger supply in places I plan to go a day might be ruined by not being able to charge up when I park for the night--especially ruinous if it happens the days where I drive from one home base to the next BUT for the same price as a Ford Kuba or whatever I could get a Polestar 2 and also save a shitload on fuel Please confirm that I am right to prefer the convenience and flexibility of liquid dinosaurs over the vanity and decadence of a swedish luxury car.
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Feb 10, 2023 04:01
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The people we know here (Switzerland) with EVs say it's still a clusterfuck and it sounds like one half of the couple has to be a full time logistics coordinator for charging. Way too much hassle for a holiday, IMO. Sucks that there aren't as many hybrid options from rental places but maybe you can get lucky there.
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Feb 10, 2023 08:04
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greazeball posted:The people we know here (Switzerland) with EVs say it's still a clusterfuck and it sounds like one half of the couple has to be a full time logistics coordinator for charging. Way too much hassle for a holiday, IMO. Sucks that there aren't as many hybrid options from rental places but maybe you can get lucky there. It's fine, even many Tesla superchargers in Switzerland and Italy are open to all other EVs now ( https://www.tesla.com/en_eu/findus?...8&filters=party ). For people living in or frequently travelling to Switzerland then they just add it to your Swisspass and then use that everywhere. I think your friends might just be bad at logistics, because there's an evpass charging station in like every village in Switzerland and most shopping malls have them too. @Greg if you really want to be sure, then you could book hotels that have on-site chargers, although these tend to be nicer and more expensive hotels. If you're driving > 350 km/day then it might be a little bit of a hassle, but if you're doing under that then you can just charge up when you eat dinner or whatever, as even the ~50 kW chargers that are everywhere will get you a full charge from zero in about an hour and a half. https://www.plugshare.com/ has been reliable for me. I can't direct link to a map location but there are approximately ten billion public chargers in the Dolomites. Tesla's network is by far the most reliable, but the other networks are getting a lot better and a lot of highway gas stations have them now too, although waiting at a gas station for an hour sucks so I prefer to go to a charger near a lunch or dinner location. Most of them you can pay for by just tapping your credit card on the charge terminal. Note that if you do charge while eating dinner, most chargers do have significant idle fees so you won't want to park at a charger for dinner when your car is at like 80% charge, since then you'll have to go and unplug it and repark in the middle of dinner. I've had an EV for almost 3 years now, done 50 k km all over Europe, never had any problem charging even on long drives. Now that I'm doing it I rather prefer stopping for half an hour every 4 hours of driving, rather than 5 minutes every 4 hours of driving. I can't believe I spent years doing 9 hour drives without taking a break. There's a reason that those breaks are legally mandated for professional drivers, which coincidentally are about the time and frequency it takes to charge an EV. E: On the plugshare map, green chargers are slow (overnight to full), orange ones are fast (~1-3 hours to full). Plug type will not be an issue for newer EVs, as CHAdeMO is dead. You will need to have internet and it will require very basic planning effort to scope out an EV charger, but honestly when I had a gas vehicle and I was driving in the mountains, I also made sure to Google for gas stations when I was getting low on a tank rather than hoping to find them. Saladman fucked around with this message at 11:37 on Feb 10, 2023 |
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Feb 10, 2023 11:30
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I'm US-based, and will be meeting my dad and brother in Paris in mid-September. We're going to do 2 nights in Paris, 4 nights in Normandy, then back to Paris at which point I'll either fly home, or meet my wife and travel somewhere else in Europe for about a week. But with no particular objective, we're a little overwhelmed by options about where to go and what to do. I was hoping to get some recommendations. We're in our early/mid 40s and enjoy travel but haven't been overseas since our honeymoon (15 years ago) in Paris and Vienna. We especially enjoyed the latter. We've both been to London (early/mid 2000s) and liked it a lot. I spent a month in/around Copenhagen as a teenager ('90s) and it was great. In the US, we like to visit cities like NYC, Chicago, Philadelphia, and New Orleans. Options that we've kicked around include Amsterdam, [northern?] Italy, or [coastal?] Spain. Switzerland holds a lot of appeal but may be expensive? In metropolitan areas we're mostly interested in museums, walking exploration, and especially food (we lean more casual than fine dining) and we'll keep our travel to that one urban center. We're also open to less-populated areas and maybe we could rent a car or ride a train and stay in 2-3 places? We don't give a poo poo about nightlife or shopping. Neither of us speaks a foreign language. I know this is overly broad, but any suggestions on a location/region for options we can look into? I need to finalize plans in the next couple of weeks. Much thanks.
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Feb 14, 2023 13:55
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If it was me, catch a train to Rome and spend a week there. Food, museums, plenty of good walking and is certainly more economical than Switzerland (which is best experienced by getting to the different corners of it).
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Feb 14, 2023 14:08
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FYI there's nothing to do in Normandy
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Feb 14, 2023 16:47
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Electric Wrigglies posted:If it was me, catch a train to Rome and spend a week there. Food, museums, plenty of good walking and is certainly more economical than Switzerland (which is best experienced by getting to the different corners of it). kiimo posted:FYI there's nothing to do in Normandy
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Feb 14, 2023 18:10
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I love trains so I didn't hesitate to do that exact trip (Paris-Rome), maybe a flight if you don't want to lose so much time. We connected in Milan and almost missed the connection because it was at a different train station. I had the same fear about being too touristy but I thoroughly enjoyed it. There's a reason so many tourists go there! I do like the idea of avoiding peak season and is what I generally did. Rome doesn't need lots of people around you to be fun and a lot of the attractions are independent of weather.
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Feb 14, 2023 18:24
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Easychair Bootson posted:I'm US-based, and will be meeting my dad and brother in Paris in mid-September. We're going to do 2 nights in Paris, 4 nights in Normandy, then back to Paris at which point I'll either fly home, or meet my wife and travel somewhere else in Europe for about a week. But with no particular objective, we're a little overwhelmed by options about where to go and what to do. I was hoping to get some recommendations. Any of the destinations you mentioned sound nice. Mid-September the weather is still amazing everywhere and 90% of the tourists are gone. For Rome or Spain I would 100% fly, but to anywhere in Franec or Amsterdam or Switzerland then train is better. Switzerland the lodging is a little expensive but not that bad; you can get an okay place for like $130/night anywhere, even in the city of Zurich. What is absurdly expensive in Switzerland is eating out, so just go to grocery stores if you need to budget so you avoid spending literally $30 per person on a fast food burger and soda. Normandy has some cool stuff besides cold beaches that have bullets hidden in them. The Bayeux Tapestry museum is neat, Etretat is super neat, Honfleur is neat. Mont-Saint-Michel is super neat but not especially near the WW2 parts of Normandy (not far either though!). Make sure you have a car, getting around Normandy by public transport is lol, lmao. Naples would also be a good place to hit up if you feel Rome is too touristy. I mean, it is too touristy but it's also absolutely unique and incredible. Naples is also pretty amazing for history, and has much, much better scenery (well - Rome has none), and a lot more variety in terms of small towns vs. big city stuff than Rome. Coastal Spain
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Feb 14, 2023 18:32
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Cherbourg en Contentin is where you want to go when you get bored of WW2 stuff in Normandy
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Feb 14, 2023 23:21
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The castle at Caen is also nice. It also has an art museum and historical museum inside it, iirc
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Feb 15, 2023 00:12
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Okay, itinerary is set: I'll spend a week in France with my dad and brother. At the end of that week, my wife will fly to meet me and we'll spend three nights in Lucerne and then on to Amsterdam for three nights. Here's what we've got lined up: Wed Sept 13 - arrive in Paris, spend 2 nights Fri 15 - train to Caen, car to Normandy, spend 4 nights Tue 19 - car back to Caen, train back to Paris, spend one night Wed 20 - fly to Zurich to meet wife arriving from US, train to Lucerne, spend 3 nights Sat 23 - train back to Zurich, fly to Amsterdam, spend 3 nights Tue 26 - depart Amsterdam I wish we had one more full day in Amsterdam but we both liked the idea of seeing Switzerland. Italy would have been a good bit more expensive in terms of airfare. Now we need to zero in on some accommodations and attractions. Thanks for all the help thus far. I'm sure I'll have more specific questions.
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Feb 19, 2023 01:02
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Take the direct train from Paris to Zürich instead of flying. It’ll be cheaper after you factor in getting to/from the airport, faster if you consider getting to/from the airport, and much more comfortable. There’s nothing to see on the route but I would never in a million years fly that route unless it was to do a connecting flight. And I have done that route probably twenty times, of which I drove twice and took the train the rest. The rest sounds nice and I would fly from ZH to Amsterdam. There is a direct train from Basel to Amsterdam but ehh, it’s long (9-10 hours) and way more expensive than flying. Vvv: yeah, that’s always good to point out. Absolutely never take a train passing through Germany unless it’s direct or unless you have no better option, like hiring a horse. Their on time percentage is awful, probably the worst in Europe for high-speed services. For directs a 15 minute delay doesn’t really matter but if you have to connect in Germany, you have like a 50/50 chance of actually making it. Saladman fucked around with this message at 09:48 on Feb 19, 2023 |
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Feb 19, 2023 02:11
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It's also delayed quite often.
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Feb 19, 2023 07:57
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It’s a night train though so you’re not gonna notice the delay, as you’ll be asleep.
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Feb 19, 2023 10:56
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