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WhiteHowler posted:Yeah, to each their own, but I think the Ioniq 6 looks fantastic. It has those vents open which do make it look weird, I think otherwise it would be fine. The rear end is kind of busy but maybe it looks different IRL  Nessus posted:I’d definitely buy a 100mile range car if it was reasonably crash safe and under 10k. I’d charge it at work for free! Then I’d get crushed like a bug by someone on Route 18 eager to get to a mall. mobby_6kl fucked around with this message at 19:38 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 19:23
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Kirios posted:Are y'all not realizing the MX-30 is 35k or something? Yes a smaller cheaper EV would be fantastic to have. There's nothing even in the sub 25k range, let alone sub 20k. You could easily justify 100 mile range in those brackets. I think what you're not realizing is people aren't necessarily talking about the mx-30. I am fine with a hypothetical car that's nice enough being 100 range, and 35k as there's more to a car than having a big battery.
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Jan 31, 2023 19:28
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Why would you want "nice enough, 100 miles" for 35K? If you're compromising on range, then that 35K either needs to go into luxury, or performance. Or it should cost less than 20K, because there's plenty of 230 mile cars that are "nice enough" and 35-40K.
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Jan 31, 2023 19:33
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“100 mile grocery getter” is $10k territory unless it literally does drive itself
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Jan 31, 2023 19:37
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The Ioniq 6 looks quite good but I can never unsee how much worse it looks compared to the concept car it was based on, the Prophecy.
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Jan 31, 2023 19:40
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Tiny Timbs posted:“100 mile grocery getter” is $10k territory unless it literally does drive itself I don't think any new cars are sub 10K anymore. But I agree with your point.
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Jan 31, 2023 19:44
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Tiny Timbs posted:“100 mile grocery getter” is $10k territory unless it literally does drive itself 1. It's 2023 so lol at 10k. 2. Some people live in places dense enough that they can get to many places besides a grocery store within 50 miles one way. Winter+ battery degradation let's say 25. 25 isn't great but not everywhere has cold winters.
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Jan 31, 2023 20:06
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Once you get to 25 you're basically in Bolt territory
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Jan 31, 2023 20:18
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Why stop at 10k, I think the MX-30 should be the same price as a Yugo in 1985: $3,990.
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Jan 31, 2023 20:19
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Ford Model T. 360 bucks.
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Jan 31, 2023 20:21
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Vegetable posted:Electric cars are a net negative on the environment in the developing world. Hybrids make far more sense there. quote:Even in the developed world hybrids would be a massive improvement over ICE cars and it’s pretty wild to be cutting them out of any climate mitigation strategy. The science pans out — a hybrid+EV world is only slightly worse for the environment than an EV-only worked, and it has massive upsides in affordability. Agreed on the first part. Can I learn more about the second part?
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Jan 31, 2023 20:23
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They should have never stopped making the Spark EV.
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Jan 31, 2023 20:29
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Duck and Cover posted:1. It's 2023 so lol at 10k. 2. Some people live in places dense enough that they can get to many places besides a grocery store within 50 miles one way. Winter+ battery degradation let's say 25. 25 isn't great but not everywhere has cold winters. You have to keep in mind how dependent so many major cities in the US are on cars infrastructure wise, even when people really don't drive long distances, to the point where most households have at least two cars, even if one car is used for basically nothing but getting one person to and from work and not even a far distance to and from work. My husband drives 9 miles to and from work. That accounts for 99% of the usage of his car, besides the occasional errand before or after work, a doctors appointment, etc, almost all other driving is done in my car. This is part of the reason married couples get such a big break on car insurance, they are going to share a car a big part of the time.
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Jan 31, 2023 21:13
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Three Olives posted:You have to keep in mind how dependent so many major cities in the US are on cars infrastructure wise, even when people really don't drive long distances, to the point where most households have at least two cars, even if one car is used for basically nothing but getting one person to and from work and not even a far distance to and from work. This is true, and it's why we're planning to buy the LEAF back from my dad when he gets his Bolt. I don't care that the battery is only 70% healthy, I only need to go 10 miles at the greatest. Absolute corner case, I need to get to the town 40 miles away, which is swimming in DCFC, so whatever.
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Jan 31, 2023 21:25
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Duck and Cover posted:1. It's 2023 so lol at 10k Don’t care, for a car that incapable that’s what I’d pay for what it actually does
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Jan 31, 2023 21:29
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Tiny Timbs posted:Don’t care, for a car that incapable that’s what I’d pay for what it actually does Well no product can survive being unappealing to Timy Timbs.
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Jan 31, 2023 21:58
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Kia Soul Enthusias posted:How so? A 100% BEV world would be prohibitively expensive and environmentally worse for those countries. They would do great with hybrids and I totally empathize with Toyota’s befuddlement that those cars are being demonized.
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Jan 31, 2023 22:00
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Vegetable posted:BEVs are more polluting than hybrids if the charging is powered by coal. Driving a Bolt in West Virginia is worse for the environment than driving a Prius. Most of the developing world is still hugely reliant on coal. That is not true, actually. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RhtiPefVzM https://twitter.com/AukeHoekstra/status/1083705013917097986 And many more sources I'm sure are available, but this is just a discussion board on the internet. You're being Astroturfed by the oil industry!
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Jan 31, 2023 22:18
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Wayne Knight posted:They should have never stopped making the Spark EV. I wish the latest Kia Soul EV was sold in the U.S.! It's the perfect size for me.
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Jan 31, 2023 22:22
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Tiny Timbs posted:“100 mile grocery getter” is $10k territory unless it literally does drive itself I'm pretty sure like 100% of demand for cheap 100mi grocery getters is filled by used Leafs, if anyone wants one you can have my Leaf for $10k. If I'm paying $30k for a new car I'm getting a Bolt that can do 200+ real world miles, the slightly larger battery is an extremely marginal added material/environmental cost, and the added utility is huge. Vegetable posted:BEVs are more polluting than hybrids if the charging is powered by coal. Driving a Bolt in West Virginia is worse for the environment than driving a Prius. Most of the developing world is still hugely reliant on coal. Do you have any kind of source for that? Because "West Virginia" is not one of the interconnected regions of the US power grid. and I've seen numbers for post-denuclearized Germany, which has a massive amount of coal, and BEVs still come out on top. I don't think anyone is "demonizing" hybrids or PHEVs, even in this thread about how cool pure EVs are E: you can make a lotta batteries for the material and energy cost of building an ICE. Elviscat fucked around with this message at 22:40 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 22:29
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Valicious posted:I’ve been watching news about the ID.BUZZ for a while now because I want an EV I can throw a mattress in for road trips and camping. I also need to fit an electric wheelchair (Whill CI) that breaks into three pieces as well. VW is going to be introducing the ID.CALIFURNIA (looks like a BUZZ but with pop-up roof, awning, camper stuff) in 2025, but that’s a heckuva long time to wait. Hopefully VW receives enough negative feedback about the capacitive controls that they change them. The crazy thing is the new eSprinter, the 2023 one that did a 295mile test in Germany, may not be much more expensive than the ID BUZZ (one report says $50k in USA, the ID BUZZ IS $45K?). The Ford eTransit is less expensive, abet with only 125 mile range. But wow, these are FAR larger vans. eSprinter article: https://cleantechnica.com/2022/12/04/new-mercedes-esprinter-goes-295-miles-in-real-world-driving/
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Jan 31, 2023 22:31
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Finding a free fast charge station four miles from my house feels like a cheat code. Not like charging my vehicle at home costs that much in the PNW, but this still feels incredible. I wonder how long this kind of thing will last.
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Jan 31, 2023 22:35
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Kirios posted:Finding a free fast charge station four miles from my house feels like a cheat code. Not like charging my vehicle at home costs that much in the PNW, but this still feels incredible.
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Jan 31, 2023 22:38
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Aino Minako posted:https://twitter.com/verge/status/1618405312569933829 FORD could triple the F150 production and sell every single one. They should do a promo where you get your CyberTruck deposit refunded if you switch.
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Jan 31, 2023 22:39
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Kia Soul Enthusias posted:That is not true, actually. as far as I can tell he doesn't actually disprove it, he just says you can't buy coal power in the Netherlands and calculates using the actual Dutch grid (which is wind/gas mostly). Let's say the grid is about as bad as Poland's (mostly coal with some wind). They're now around 800g/kWh (https://app.electricitymaps.com/zone/PL) 0.2kWh/km * 800 = 160g CO2
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Jan 31, 2023 22:47
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My understanding was that at this point an EV is lifetime better even with a coal grid now, but it takes longer to break even so to speak. This may have been less true a few years ago. Even if it’s a complete push you would still have the advantage of all the non CO2 pollution happening in one scrubbable place.
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Jan 31, 2023 22:51
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Elviscat posted:I'm pretty sure like 100% of demand for cheap 100mi grocery getters is filled by used Leafs, if anyone wants one you can have my Leaf for $10k. The Bolt looks and feels like a cheap econobox, which is fine, people have always bought cheap econoboxes, but there is certainly a market for an elevated city car that puts battery cost into build quality instead of battery. The BMW i3, while clearly priced too high new and really needed 100+ miles range across the line has held it's second/third hand value remarkably well for this exact reason. Bring the Honda e to the US. If you never drive more than 50 miles a day and you buy a 200 mile range car, you are just paying to drive an expensive, depreciating battery around that serves you no useful purpose, it's equally valid, honestly, much more so, to buy a car that has a nicer experience for the driver for what you actually use it for, sitting in traffic on your daily commute to work 20 miles each way. Three Olives fucked around with this message at 23:02 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 22:55
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Here's a map that assigns an mpg figure that would result in the same the emissions of the average EV if driven on that region's energy mix. Full report and executive summary here: https://www.ucsusa.org/resources/driving-cleaner
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Jan 31, 2023 22:57
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Three Olives posted:Bring the Honda e to the US. 
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Jan 31, 2023 22:59
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According to https://afdc.energy.gov/vehicles/electric_emissions.html WV is 92.38% coal powered, an EV would have 6228 lbs of CO2 vs a Hybrid at 6898 lbs, so barely an improvement, at 100% it might indeed be worse. (Specific vehicle model efficiency may vary, as well) Also I think the main goal in developing nations should be to get people to switch to electric scooter/moped (whatever they're called), since those small displacement engines are awful polluters.
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Jan 31, 2023 23:03
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Elviscat posted:Do you have any kind of source for that? Because "West Virginia" is not one of the interconnected regions of the US power grid. and I've seen numbers for post-denuclearized Germany, which has a massive amount of coal, and BEVs still come out on top.
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Jan 31, 2023 23:03
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Elviscat posted:I'm pretty sure like 100% of demand for cheap 100mi grocery getters is filled by used Leafs, if anyone wants one you can have my Leaf for $10k. Yes exactly. I don’t know why anyone would argue on Mazda’s behalf for this, even they knew this thing was unmarketable.
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Jan 31, 2023 23:05
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Elviscat posted:E: it's not a hive mind, it's a collection of the worst possible EV opinions in the world. I had to think for a bit to work out the best way to make it the thread title
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Jan 31, 2023 23:10
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borkencode posted:According to https://afdc.energy.gov/vehicles/electric_emissions.html We really need to nationalize all power in the US but nope gotta have capitalism
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Jan 31, 2023 23:12
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Mazda spending all this energy with the MX-30 when they could be instead making an electric Miata. ...oh no, they're going to make a crossover Miata aren't they
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Jan 31, 2023 23:16
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New Volvo has a giant fuckoff lidar sensor (at 4:50) as well as 5 radar sensors, 8 exterior cameras and 16 ultrasonic sensors  https://youtu.be/mzhoterdJcI e: also features “backlit wood” at 14:40. Big lols Vegetable fucked around with this message at 23:24 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 23:16
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Thr problem is they didn't spend any real energy - that's why the result sucks
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Jan 31, 2023 23:18
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dissss posted:Thr problem is they didn't spend any real energy - that's why the result sucks
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Jan 31, 2023 23:20
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bird with big dick posted:Like, a bicycle? Nah, those are 12k now
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Jan 31, 2023 23:30
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Vegetable posted:New Volvo has a giant fuckoff lidar sensor (at 4:50) as well as 5 radar sensors, 8 exterior cameras and 16 ultrasonic sensors 5 radar sensors are pretty standard and 16 ultra sonic sensors is barely above standard (4 corner radars plus front facing radar for ACC, emergency braking and cross traffic, 4 front, 4 rear, 4 side for parking assist).
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Jan 31, 2023 23:33
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