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What is the most powerful flying bug? This poll is closed. |
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|---|---|---|---|
| 🦋 |
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15 | 3.71% |
| 🦇 |
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115 | 28.47% |
| 🪰 |
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12 | 2.97% |
| 🐦 |
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67 | 16.58% |
| dragonfly |
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94 | 23.27% |
| 🦟 |
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14 | 3.47% |
| 🐝 |
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87 | 21.53% |
| Total: | 404 votes | ||
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Desiderata posted:One of my favourite genres of denial is that mil-nerd-oneupmanship and hyper-specificity. The classic "This so called 'journalist' says that the execution was carried out by a soldier's an M16 but actually that squad are all equipped with M4A1 SOPMODs - therefore this massacre did not happen". Which has the advantage of appealing to war worshipping grognards in terms of hyper accurate nomenclature, but is also fractal in that no matter how right you get it, someone can always come in and correct it with more details (actually it is an m4a1mod2-C-rev:4-mkII, and that is not a true SOPMOD if it has that model of Trijicon sight, and marines aren't soldiers etc) so there is no way to ever be accurate, so the massacre never happened. Journalists themselves are certainly guilty of dropping in technical details as they understand them to give more crunch to their stories, when unneeded or not truly understood. But the important point is that those who want to ignore the story, can find a detail to let them ignore the story, kinda dosn't matter what it is. war crime denial by way of fishmeching
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Feb 16, 2023 14:08
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BMs first big scoop was finding that  Croatian weapons were showing up with Syrian rebels, likely US supplied.
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Feb 16, 2023 14:09
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fishmech wouldn't be so sloppy though. they were tedious but they did care about whether or not something was actually true
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Feb 16, 2023 14:11
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Cuttlefush posted:moral of the story is that america must be destroyed
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Feb 16, 2023 14:15
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Desiderata posted:I remember these forums being terrible with it in the early years or Iraq/Afghanistan. Arguments about exactly what shape dent is put on the back of a spent casing from a glock, and ignoring that the iraqi police were executing people. I remember one guy insisting no prisoners could ever have been shipped by the US Navy in a cargo hold without him personally knowing about it, because of the exact definition of what counts as cargohold and the lack of prisoner shipping cages existing in a manual / stores somewhere - distracting that the US was definitely shipping prisoners to blacksites around the world, nor that getting unusual things shipped regardless is what half the US navy do for a living. quote:The Military presence of the People's Liberation Army in the West Philippine Sea is not the largest contingent nor does it pose the largest threat in Filipino fishermen, that would be from the China Coast Guard and Chinese Maritime Militia-- part of the People's Republic of China's Cabbage Tactics utilizing the Gray Zone-- which is what makes a conventional response to an escalation harder in the first place. quote:They specifically said "Chinese Military Assets" as you have pointed out in your comment on what the article said, yes? So that refers to the PLAN, not the CGC nor the CMM, officially the "People's Armed Forces Maritime Militia", a Paramilitary organization that acts as an equivalent to the US Merchant Marine. Their assets will not and will never be considered "Military assets" the same way the Philippine Coast Guard is not the same as the Philippine Navy as the PCG's role is a civilian one, not a military one and has not been that way for 26 or so years. quote:No one in their right mind would make the argument that the People's Liberation Army Navy is the same as the China Coast Guard to international bodies, regardless of their intentions to follow through Chinese national interest, and we would look absolutely laughable if we make that claim, since the globally acceptable standards of the difference of roles between Maritime Law Enforcement Agencies and Navies are defined, even with the 2021 Coast Guard Law in China that allows CGC ships to carry armaments, which is why the PLAN transfers some of their corvettes to the CGC, and why OPVs of the CGC have 76mm naval guns nowadays (Which they aimed at the BRP Teresa Magbanua), and the Chinese can easily (and distinctly) classify their white ships to their gray ships.
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Feb 16, 2023 14:31
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Libyan rebels were getting brand new FN F2000s, a gun pretty much nobody uses. I seem to remember a something awful mod was involved. Anyways, the problem with all of these stories is that Moderate Rebels are sacrosanct, so where they get guns from, if it must be acknowledged, is dismissed as irrelevant. That the movements themselves suit US interests, might be directed by the US and so on will not get any play in the media. The same is even more true for Colour Revolutions, which if I remember, are still considered coincidences among liberals.
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Feb 16, 2023 14:32
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Cuttlefush posted:fishmech wouldn't be so sloppy though. they were tedious but they did care about whether or not something was actually true 
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Feb 16, 2023 14:34
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Cuttlefush posted:fishmech wouldn't be so sloppy though. they were tedious but they did care about whether or not something was actually true dont try to rehabilitate fishmech
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Feb 16, 2023 14:36
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it's preposterous to suggest that Norway was involved in the sabotage of Nordstream 2!  
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Feb 16, 2023 14:36
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didn't the norwegians open a new pipeline literally days after the nordstream bombing?
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Feb 16, 2023 14:37
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speng31b posted:dont try to rehabilitate fishmech i want to rehabilitate fishmech and make them my champion and fight all the tedious posters with an even more tedious poster. i want to make it sting.
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Feb 16, 2023 14:37
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Cerebral Bore posted:didn't the norwegians open a new pipeline literally days after the nordstream bombing? people were literally joking about how it was possibly norway but now it's some outlandish claim
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Feb 16, 2023 14:40
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Cerebral Bore posted:didn't the norwegians open a new pipeline literally days after the nordstream bombing? FACT-CHECK: it was a day before the Nordstream bombing https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelshellenberger/2022/09/27/nato-says-sabotage-behind-destruction-of-natural-gas-pipelines/ 
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Feb 16, 2023 14:40
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gradenko_2000 posted:FACT-CHECK: it was a day before the Nordstream bombing Couldn't they have waited a week to make it look less obvious? Actually nevermind, it's pretty obvious why bombed the pipeline and there's no consequences anyway.
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Feb 16, 2023 14:50
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I have Jane's, Brassey's, Conway's, and who the hell knows what's in the Navy section of the library here. What is substantively different between classes of minesweeper that would in any way effect the operation? IMO nothing. A ship was needed for a dive team, it was a minesweeping exercise, minesweepers were the more expedient choice, and if observed, had a plausible reason for conducting diving operations. As far as covert use of maritime assets, is that any different than the use of trawlers for surveillance? They have a reason to be out at sea, so for over half a century trawlers bob around behind US carrier groups in international waters. You use the ship that is reasonably capable for the job at hand. I don't actually know much about the use of "weather research", "technical research", "submarine rescue" ships, but I would imagine that would be more suspicious to use on BALTOPS than a regular minesweeper, and the added capabilities weren't needed. It would have been more of a smoking gun to deploy one, I would think. Minesweepers routinely use clearance divers. Clearance divers, salvage divers and sabotage divers differ in method but not really in means. It would be one thing if they needed a diving bell or decompression chamber - therefore one of the specialized ships - but my understanding is that it wasn't the case here. The other thing, and this is not my department, is I'm positive that that once an area is closed for exercise the air and sea transponders that provide data to the ship and flight tracking websites can be turned off. They're not based on radar returns or anything but information that is by definition publicly available. It stands to reason that during a covert operation there might be some misdirection at play. Luckily I am not a naval or air operations guy, but probably they had to juggle if it was more suspicious for ships to disappear from the maritime tracking systems entirely - completely concealing their movements but possibly raising suspicion - or to manoeuvre with them broadcasting in a way that still accomplished their goals. My point regardless is that it takes a certain level of credulity to point to the transponder records as exonerating evidence (and even then it's clearly not) because everyone in question was operating with the transponders in mind. I understand this is pedantry popping smoke for what seems to be a pretty open and shut case, but it's pretty annoying to claim SME while also affecting this level of naivety. Bottom line, from what I've read, any ship would do, it may as well have been a Round Table Class minesweeper like Sir Galahad  I guess you could thumb through Warship 2022 and 2023 but my inclination is that the minesweeper was not the critical element here, let alone a specific hull number jfc. ee: Unrelated, but naval gunnery is the only part I generally have to follow. Someone mentioned 5 inch guns, in the context of the UK press or whatever. It just reminded me that General Dynamics has developed new 5 inch projectiles that they were showing off to the RCN, and will probably present again this year. If the Royal Navy was also considering moving back to 5 inch guns, I wonder what the motivation is. Littoral and coastal bombardment missions in the South China Sea? A backup to missiles in an EW environment? Defence contractors trying to take a bite out of OTO Melara? Just interesting that I've seen that twice now. Frosted Flake has issued a correction as of 15:08 on Feb 16, 2023 |
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Feb 16, 2023 14:59
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Admittedly, it seemed like those two classes of Norwegian minesweepers were probably better equipped than most for an operation considering their loadout and the fact that at least one was near target areas I think is useful evidence. In addition, it doesn't seem like it would need to be paused to conduct an operation if it was truly necessary. Again, it is another piece of the puzzle beyond a "single unnamed source" that adds credibility to recent claims.
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Feb 16, 2023 15:06
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How can a case be both open and shut? I rate FF 8 Pinocchio's. Btw, what was CATO wife's response to the Hersh?
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Feb 16, 2023 15:09
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Ardennes posted:Admittedly, it seemed like those two classes of Norwegian minesweepers were probably better equipped than most for an operation considering their loadout and the fact that at least one was near target areas I think is useful evidence. In addition, it doesn't seem like it would need to be paused to conduct an operation if it was truly necessary. As someone mentioned, if the ships are designed to deploy zodiacs, it seems like it wouldn't need to pause much at all. Off the top of my head (at least in the professional edition) the first surface ship tutorial of CMO is deploying a zodiac from a Dutch minesweeper to inspect small craft, continuing on course, and just making sure to set a speed where it can reasonably catch up after completing the inspections. Orange Devil posted:tw, what was CATO wife's response to the Hersh? She's tightlipped about it, but that's true for anything that might touch on her work, and annoyed when I bring it up, but that's true for anything that touches on geopolitics. I can infer based on the apparent lack of Canadian involvement at the operational level that she probably didn't do it or know about it. Other than that, with Five Eyes and everything else, I don't know what's going on in government surrounding the issue now. The implications for anyone working in natural gas are significant, Canada's involvement in the whole Ukraine thing are significant, so it was in Canada's strategic interest even if Canada wasn't involved. I would guess official denial, tacit support, more policies about LNG trade with Europe. Personally, you know, "blogger Seymour Hersh", "tired of hearing about it", all of the usual things. It's been posted about endlessly ITT but the ability of liberals, and I don't mean on a personal level but generally, to seamlessly go from "never happened" to "old news" is incredible and seems to be a big part of the consent manufacturing process. Frosted Flake has issued a correction as of 15:20 on Feb 16, 2023 |
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Feb 16, 2023 15:11
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Frosted Flake posted:Libyan rebels were getting brand new FN F2000s, a gun pretty much nobody uses. I seem to remember a something awful mod was involved. 
January 6 Survivor has issued a correction as of 15:16 on Feb 16, 2023 |
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Feb 16, 2023 15:12
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https://twitter.com/OAlexanderDK/status/1626176420648026113
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Feb 16, 2023 15:19
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why does a rando internet user think they have access to that information lmfao
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Feb 16, 2023 15:22
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 Oh well, case closed.
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Feb 16, 2023 15:23
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the coordinates only got as close a 0.04 seconds, therefore they did not overlap
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Feb 16, 2023 15:25
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shut da gently caress up bargain bin pissflaps
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Feb 16, 2023 15:25
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It was Russia. Case closed!
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Feb 16, 2023 15:26
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Actually, lol I don't think this guy is making the argument he thinks he is   "immediate vicinity" 
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Feb 16, 2023 15:26
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he's really sad even for an osint guy
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Feb 16, 2023 15:27
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 The Japanese were never in the immediate vicinity of Pearl Harbour. Have we considered that the United States likely blew up their own Pacific Fleet to show they could? They were 230 miles away people!
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Feb 16, 2023 15:29
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they hired the dumbest possible osint guy to debunk hersh incredible couldn't wikipedia his way out of a wet paper bag
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Feb 16, 2023 15:29
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it's insulting
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Feb 16, 2023 15:30
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Luckily Zodiac craft can't go small distances away from a ship with a diving team and payload.
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Feb 16, 2023 15:30
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how did the last OSINT vs hersh battle go? i forget what the final conclusion was
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Feb 16, 2023 15:31
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shut da gently caress up bargain bin brown moses
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Feb 16, 2023 15:33
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Cerebral Bore posted:shut da gently caress up bargain bin brown moses Its just a bit, he is posting normally in the Eurasia thread. mila kunis posted:how did the last OSINT vs hersh battle go? i forget what the final conclusion was The Sec-Gen of NATO at very least was political as a teenager.
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Feb 16, 2023 15:36
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gradenko_2000 posted:FACT-CHECK: it was a day before the Nordstream bombing yeah, that's why i guessed poland! crepeface posted:lol so now russian gas into germany has to go through yamal or soyouz? so poland and ukraine have a tonne of leverage? i really should have considered norway considering stoltenberg
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Feb 16, 2023 15:37
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Frosted Flake posted:
So eyeballing the KNM Hinnøy it's something like 5km between the blast site and the course?  Yet nowhere in the article is the claim that they dived down in a straight line from the ship, only that they operated from one. I guess they technically might have operated from a rubber boat that operated from a mine hunter? 9/10 pinochios in that case
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Feb 16, 2023 15:38
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Ardennes posted:Its just a bit, he is posting normally in the Eurasia thread. nah i mean over syria
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Feb 16, 2023 15:44
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https://euobserver.com/world/156725 A report on the renewal and adding to of the EUs trade ban. "Another part of the EU trade ban is meant to strike at Russia's industrial capacity more broadly speaking. This miscellaneous list includes "bidets, lavatory pans, flushing cisterns and similar sanitary ware", as well as LEDs, hemp yarn, fork-lift trucks, mail-sorting machines, chimney pots, bricks, tyres, and even "pen nibs and nib points". The toilets were among items first banned last October — and now feature in the renewed list designed to enter into force by 24 February, the first anniversary of the war."
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Feb 16, 2023 15:46
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Donkeybrains
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Feb 16, 2023 15:47
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| # ? Jun 3, 2024 07:22 |
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The ban doesn't seem to include banyas. Understandable, given the fine products previously showcased ITT.
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Feb 16, 2023 15:49
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