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price you pay for the whole sapience and free will thing I guess
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Feb 15, 2023 19:10
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Lamuella posted:I think the point is that a Poppet is resistant to poison etc whereas the Construct trait suggests a poppet would be immune. Yeah, this was it. It's probably much healthier from a game design perspective to not just give outright immunities to things you could otherwise build encounters around. Speaking of--do they bleed? I'm guessing no: Constructed ancestry feature posted:Your spark of life means that you're a living creature, and you can be healed by positive energy and harmed by negative energy as normal. Bleed Damage posted:Another special type of physical damage is bleed damage. This is persistent damage that represents loss of blood. As such, it has no effect on nonliving creatures or living creatures that don't need blood to live. If my GM ends up deciding otherwise (whether or not undead PCs can bleed has been a large source of contention so far for some reason) I'll reflavor it as coming unraveled or something.
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Feb 16, 2023 01:27
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GetDunked posted:Yeah, this was it. It's probably much healthier from a game design perspective to not just give outright immunities to things you could otherwise build encounters around. Speaking of--do they bleed? I'm guessing no: Literally stuffing falling out.
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Feb 16, 2023 02:20
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It's beyond perfect that at high levels they get innate regenerate by stitching themselves back up
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Feb 16, 2023 04:46
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GetDunked posted:Yeah, this was it. It's probably much healthier from a game design perspective to not just give outright immunities to things you could otherwise build encounters around. Speaking of--do they bleed? I'm guessing no: Slimes can be tripped, skeletons can bleed. as long as they’re not expressly immune it happens. If you can’t think of a way for a skeleton to bleed then you’re playing the game wrong.
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Feb 16, 2023 04:47
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Skeletons get that weird boring disease from Lord of the rings
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Feb 16, 2023 04:52
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sugar free jazz posted:Slimes can be tripped, skeletons can bleed. as long as they’re not expressly immune it happens. If you can’t think of a way for a skeleton to bleed then you’re playing the game wrong. It's not blood, it's bone hurting juice.
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Feb 16, 2023 05:01
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They lose precious marrow
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Feb 16, 2023 05:03
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My argument is that they're still not alive, though, so that by the rules text of bleed damage they wouldn't take any. That being said, it seems they include a lot of explicit bleed immunity on constructs even though it should be redundant with the definition of bleed damage, and a lot of explicit death/disease/etc immunity even though it should be redundant with the Undead trait, so  this is why we can't seem to come to any consensus.
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Feb 16, 2023 05:07
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GetDunked posted:My argument is that they're still not alive, though, so that by the rules text of bleed damage they wouldn't take any. That being said, it seems they include a lot of explicit bleed immunity on constructs even though it should be redundant with the definition of bleed damage, and a lot of explicit death/disease/etc immunity even though it should be redundant with the Undead trait, so here is what basic undead benefits get you https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=1694\ bleed damage immunity isn't on that list. you don't gain the benefits of the trait as monsters do, this is an intentional design decision. PC skeletons follow different rules than monster skeletons as a design choice. you can choose to ignore this if you want to.
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Feb 16, 2023 07:03
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We can't come to a consensus, says only guy arguing about this.
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Feb 16, 2023 08:23
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sugar free jazz posted:here is what basic undead benefits get you Speaking of, reading this carefully a little while back is what made me realise that the Stitch Flesh feat for being able to use the Treat Wounds medicine action on undead is not necessary at all for PC undead like PC-Skeletons - Treat Wounds isn't positive healing, just regular healing, so it works on PC-Skeletons just fine. Similarly, a Healing Potion won't work (it has the Positive tag) but Elixir of Life works just fine - no need for Oil of Unlife.
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Feb 16, 2023 12:05
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That reminds me, if something is flying, can it still be tripped? The swashbuckler in my last game tried that on a tooth fairy and I allowed it because I reasoned you could disrupt its wings the same way you do someone 's legs, but I couldn't find a rule in the book to be sure.
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Feb 16, 2023 14:08
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marshmallow creep posted:That reminds me, if something is flying, can it still be tripped? The swashbuckler in my last game tried that on a tooth fairy and I allowed it because I reasoned you could disrupt its wings the same way you do someone 's legs, but I couldn't find a rule in the book to be sure. I think so and the fall damage can be absurd.
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Feb 16, 2023 14:24
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marshmallow creep posted:That reminds me, if something is flying, can it still be tripped? The swashbuckler in my last game tried that on a tooth fairy and I allowed it because I reasoned you could disrupt its wings the same way you do someone 's legs, but I couldn't find a rule in the book to be sure. Unless they're explicitly immune to trip/prone, they can be tripped. I can only remember seeing one creature actually immune to it, but I forget what it was now. It also knocks them out of the air as you fall when you're flying and knocked prone. https://2e.aonprd.com/Conditions.aspx?ID=31
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Feb 16, 2023 14:25
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Have been running miscellaneous Golarion-based adventures in Varisia and Nex for the last year or so for my group and we're finally going to be kicking of Kingmaker tonight and it's very exciting. I mentioned that I was thinking about it to my players a few weeks back and they've just constantly been mentioning it so I figured I can at least hack my way through the beginning of the book on Foundry until they put the actual module out.
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Feb 16, 2023 15:06
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appropriatemetaphor posted:Are you talking about "Twin Feint" and "Underhanded Assault"? Chevy Slyme posted:Bon Mot is a skill feat and those other two are Class Feats, so you shouldn’t have to choose between them in terms of feat selection. Yeah I was confusing some things I think. I'm gonna try out intimidating glare for the skill feature and quick draw for my class feature so I can put the fear of God into these little kobold shits before poking them in the face with my rapier.
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Feb 16, 2023 15:14
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So is there a maximum fall speed or is it like 5e DND where falling is basically "teleport to the ground and take damage"?
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Feb 16, 2023 15:20
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marshmallow creep posted:So is there a maximum fall speed or is it like 5e DND where falling is basically "teleport to the ground and take damage"? https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=402 You fall 500 feet in round 1 and then 1500 feet a round, in practice in a fight you teleport to the ground and take damage.
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Feb 16, 2023 15:21
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Thanks! I assume that falling counts as forced movement. marshmallow creep fucked around with this message at 15:33 on Feb 16, 2023 |
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Feb 16, 2023 15:30
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marshmallow creep posted:Thanks!
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Feb 16, 2023 15:36
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Boba Pearl posted:We can't come to a consensus, says only guy arguing about this. I mean me and my group, not me and this thread. My essential argument was that the rule listed in the core book under "Bleed Damage" precludes non-living creatures such as PC undead and living creatures that don't need blood to live such as PC constructs, regardless of whether or not they're given explicit immunity in their respective ancestry features. However, reading more of other people's arguments here and elsewhere, I'm starting to come around to the idea that if it was something they wanted to give those PC ancestries, they would have done so in those ancestry features, which are otherwise pretty comprehensive about what benefits they grant. I'll maintain that either those features or the bleed damage rules should have been more explicit about it, though.
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Feb 16, 2023 17:49
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GetDunked posted:I mean me and my group, not me and this thread. My essential argument was that the rule listed in the core book under "Bleed Damage" precludes non-living creatures such as PC undead and living creatures that don't need blood to live such as PC constructs, regardless of whether or not they're given explicit immunity in their respective ancestry features. However, reading more of other people's arguments here and elsewhere, I'm starting to come around to the idea that if it was something they wanted to give those PC ancestries, they would have done so in those ancestry features, which are otherwise pretty comprehensive about what benefits they grant. I'll maintain that either those features or the bleed damage rules should have been more explicit about it, though. There weren't any undead or construct ancestries when the bleed rules were written. https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=126 There are a lot of instances in the game where PCs and monsters are governed by different rules. Honestly if my players were going to be weird and try to give their ancestry immunities the system doesn't grant, I'd just disallow them since they're all uncommon and rare. No reason to be annoying about it, at best it falls under "too good to be true." https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=312
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Feb 16, 2023 18:11
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If you are the kind of player who's playing a sentient puppet and tries to argue that you should be immune to bleed damage even though there's nothing in the rules to support it, then you should probably not play as a sentient puppet
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Feb 16, 2023 18:52
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I plan to houserule stuff like that. If you don't have blood, don't worry about bleeding. I can see why they do it for game balance reasons, but it just bothers me and I'm willing to give out those immunities.
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Feb 16, 2023 18:55
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Also there's a question of "how many enemies who do persistent bleed are in this and how big a deal is it really? and if it is a really big deal, can they just do fire/acid/psychic?" So thematically it barely matters
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Feb 16, 2023 18:59
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The image of a poppet having stuffing falling out persistently because of a "bleeding" wound works fine for me.
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Feb 16, 2023 19:01
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Serf posted:I plan to houserule stuff like that. If you don't have blood, don't worry about bleeding. I can see why they do it for game balance reasons, but it just bothers me and I'm willing to give out those immunities. A poppet bleeding stuffing or straw is hilarious and rules as does a skeleton getting stabbed then green gooey ectoplasm or tiny spooky ghosts who act like blood or some poo poo starts leaking out oooh I’m a mummy and I’m losin my precious sand
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Feb 16, 2023 19:02
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sugar free jazz posted:A poppet bleeding stuffing or straw is hilarious and rules as does a skeleton getting stabbed then green gooey ectoplasm or tiny spooky ghosts who act like blood or some poo poo starts leaking out The skeleton brings to mind an old horror short I read as a kid about an alien that looked like a human skeleton, but turned out to be like a reverse human, with the blood and meat inside the bones. Pretty freaky stuff back then. And that does sound funny but it's not to my taste. Undead should just have a whole slew of immunities to bleeding, poison, disease all that stuff. Might as well have some upside for being dead.
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Feb 16, 2023 19:05
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It's not a big deal, I'm a skeleton in my current campaign and another person is a poppet and I'm not sure the bleed thing has ever come up and we're about to hit level 8. Skeletons apparently eat bones though(or use them to mend themselves somehow?), which is way weirder than being affected by bleed damage. Am I constantly swapping my bones out for new ones? Does that make me look different? Are my legs different length. Much more important questions. It's easier to just re-flavor what the monster is doing to you (your bones are crumbling and parts are flaking off, your stuffing is leaking out, whatever..) so that the GM can continue to enjoy the easy encounter balancing inherent to the system without a bunch of extra work changing the monsters around.
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Feb 16, 2023 19:06
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Serf posted:Might as well have some upside for being dead. But skeletons and the undead archetypes are already cool and have lots of upsides. If they have blanket immunity they will be better than living characters.
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Feb 16, 2023 19:29
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Serf posted:The skeleton brings to mind an old horror short I read as a kid about an alien that looked like a human skeleton, but turned out to be like a reverse human, with the blood and meat inside the bones. Pretty freaky stuff back then. They already do have upsides it's in the rest of the text.
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Feb 16, 2023 20:08
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M. Night Skymall posted:It's not a big deal, I'm a skeleton in my current campaign and another person is a poppet and I'm not sure the bleed thing has ever come up and we're about to hit level 8. Skeletons apparently eat bones though(or use them to mend themselves somehow?), which is way weirder than being affected by bleed damage. Am I constantly swapping my bones out for new ones? Does that make me look different? Are my legs different length. Much more important questions. quote:Bone Missile Seems like you magically retain your 'real' form even if you lose bits. Maybe the bones you eat are just for delicious bonemarrow jelly.
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Feb 16, 2023 20:23
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KPC_Mammon posted:But skeletons and the undead archetypes are already cool and have lots of upsides. If they have blanket immunity they will be better than living characters. Turns out being dead but still mobile is pretty good. Kind of like being a construct but the smell (and noises) are worse.
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Feb 16, 2023 20:24
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Skellingtons shooting people with their ribs is absolutely fantastic.
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Feb 16, 2023 20:29
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Facebook Aunt posted:Seems like you magically retain your 'real' form even if you lose bits. Maybe the bones you eat are just for delicious bonemarrow jelly. It's your only source of calcium, clearly
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Feb 16, 2023 20:30
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Skeleton drinking a big glass of milk and it just pours through.
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Feb 16, 2023 20:31
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Feb 16, 2023 20:40
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Obviously when you wound a dusty old skeleton, green dust comes out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-suhRCpfME
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Feb 16, 2023 20:48
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| # ? May 29, 2024 10:12 |
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Jumping into pathfinder and trying to learn everything still before I run a game for my players. I plan on using the beginner box for the first go but afterwards I want to let my players make their own characters. I know Pathbuilder is recommended for new players to make their characters however the PDFs that it seems to export seems very basic with class features / spells and items just listed instead of like how the pregen pdfs have everything listed out. Is there a character builder that makes sheets that have the spell text blocks in them or something. We are coming from 5e where we had smart sheets that had everything listed out similar to the pregen Iconics sheets looked like.
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Feb 16, 2023 21:08
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