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Konomex posted:Did they bother future proofing that cap? Or is it just a hard cap, lazy government sort of deal? What do you mean by future proofing?
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Feb 28, 2023 11:29
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JBP posted:Maybe the cops have changed change from within
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Feb 28, 2023 11:49
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Senor Tron posted:What do you mean by future proofing? Presumably indexing the cap with inflation. Chalmers said the $3m limit won't be indexed
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Feb 28, 2023 14:45
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PalaNIN posted:Presumably indexing the cap with inflation. Chalmers said the $3m limit won't be indexed Yeah this. 3 million is a lot these days, but when I was a kid 1 million was insane. When my old boss first started working he made $1000 a year. When my Nan left school she worked for half a pound a day. The current medicare rebate is poo poo, but when it was introduced it was a reasonable amount. Now many GP's can't afford to bulk bill unless they ran factory style practices. It's lazy government to set a monetary cap on anything, all costs or limits should be indexed to something.
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Feb 28, 2023 14:55
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Breakfast Burrito posted:yes that's the bit of your post that is funny Even if "no police at pride" were a unanimous 100% view within the queer community I would still think it lovely of a non-queer politician to put themselves centre stage like this. I don't think Thorpe would be (or should be) copping anywhere near as much flak if she weren't straight.
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Feb 28, 2023 19:50
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freebooter posted:Even if "no police at pride" were a unanimous 100% view within the queer community I would still think it lovely of a non-queer politician to put themselves centre stage like this. I don't think Thorpe would be (or should be) copping anywhere near as much flak if she weren't straight. You really are moving goalposts here but I honestly think it's good ol' fashioned racism and the intersection between Lidia being on the "left" while also ruffling the feathers of some progressives by swinging out against the Voice. She ate poo poo from conservative media about the protest at pride and it seemingly has latched a bit in more progressive circles maybe because there's some hurt feelings and this is an easy target.
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Feb 28, 2023 22:23
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I don't like the way she goes about things/feels about the voice but you at least have to respect her guts
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Feb 28, 2023 22:33
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freebooter posted:I don't think Thorpe would be (or should be) copping anywhere near as much flak if she weren't straight. she still would cop a lot of flak over it it's just a fair bit messier than it could have been
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Feb 28, 2023 22:51
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Recoome posted:You really are moving goalposts here but I honestly think it's good ol' fashioned racism and the intersection between Lidia being on the "left" while also ruffling the feathers of some progressives by swinging out against the Voice. She ate poo poo from conservative media about the protest at pride and it seemingly has latched a bit in more progressive circles maybe because there's some hurt feelings and this is an easy target. lefties out there that were unhappy with the greens shenanigans, but felt uncomfortable raising it, finally have an outlet
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Feb 28, 2023 22:56
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"decorum!" shouts the man chained to a tree.
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Feb 28, 2023 23:02
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I am offended Albo didn't wear any glitter to pride
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Feb 28, 2023 23:11
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hambeet posted:"decorum!" shouts the man chained to a tree.
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Feb 28, 2023 23:42
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Pleasant Friend posted:I am offended Albo didn't wear any glitter to pride He was munted though
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Mar 1, 2023 00:01
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Generally speaking, queer politics is in a twilight right now where there exists a tension between LGBTQ people who place their struggle in a wider context of social equity and those who view queer rights as an underserved part of a liberal project. The former are going to be far more hostile towards a police presence than the latter, but the latter are more affluent and in greater positions of power within queer institutions, and as such get to dictate how these events are run. If they decide that cops get to be at Pride, they have the institutional power to push it through and shrug off whatever discomfort everyone else shares. The problem is that I think, for as much as people don't want cops at Pride, there's an understanding that queer rights are under threat: the right are getting more rabid and radicalised over the increasing normalisation of queer people, and when the worst of them are elected, as we see in America, their rights are significantly curtailed. In these circumstances, I can't help but see the courting of liberal institutions, corporations and law enforcement as a strategy to find patrons that will protect queer people from harm. Now, it would be foolish to assume that's uniform protection - it would mostly be for the benefit of affluent, white queer people - but at a time when the steady advancement of queer rights is under threat by a rabid reactionary force that thinks they're rapists and monsters in disguise, I think it's going to be an uphill battle to say that institutions like Pride should dismantle the police floats and tell the big sponsors to go away. The fear is that we are simply too weak to alienate... not allies, exactly, but partners of convenience whose co-opting of our struggle allows them to launder their own crimes, but also gives us mainstream legitimacy and protection from the horrors that would drive us into the grave. That's not a good position to be in, and it's an indication that we need to build institutional power of our own separate from cops and suits, but I'm not sure if we're doing that well enough. To be honest, I'm somewhat glad we're talking about this rather than kink at Pride.
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Mar 1, 2023 02:10
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I mean I think you bring a very interesting perspective but I’d disagree with the idea that the queer community is courting cops as an institution. Police are still very overtly hostile to queer people and the rationale is we shouldn’t be inclusive to institutions which are very exclusive or outright dangerous to the queer community. You don’t see the cops marching as part of Invasion Day or May Day (unless they do? I don’t think they do but could be wrong!) not because they wouldn’t be important partners/stakeholders to these respective groups but because they are usually the shits who cause issues/break up protests.
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Mar 1, 2023 03:05
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I wonder if Lidia Thorpe is going to end up following a bit of a Tulsi Gabbard trajectory. I admit I haven't followed too closely so hopefully am way off the mark.
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Mar 1, 2023 04:01
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Recoome posted:I mean I think you bring a very interesting perspective but I’d disagree with the idea that the queer community is courting cops as an institution. Police are still very overtly hostile to queer people and the rationale is we shouldn’t be inclusive to institutions which are very exclusive or outright dangerous to the queer community. I should clarify again that I'm making a distinction between the queer community and queer institutions, the latter of whom I propose are the well-to-do ones leading efforts at rapprochement with cops and business. I don't disagree that cops are dangerous to the wider queer community, or that their presence at Pride is an unwelcome one - but I think the institutions that run events like Pride work with them to secure a certain degree of safety, according to the fears that I mentioned before. It also helps(?) that the goals and motives behind a Pride rally are different than those at an Invasion Day or May Day rally. Pride is inherently an event meant to present a community to the mainstream and say 'we are not a threat, we are just like you, we belong in society and do not deserve the indignities we are subject to by being forced outside of society.' They're not a direct challenge to the way that society works when compared to Invasion Day (which inherently challenges the legitimacy of the current government; sovereignty, after all, was never officially ceded) or May Day (which challenges the ideological underpinning of that society), so they can court the existing institutions of power much easier. Hence, cops break out the floats for one rally and the truncheons for the others. Having said that, I would be remiss if I didn't point out that for as much as the wider queer community doesn't want cops at Pride, that cops can be there in the first place suggests that there are institutional forces in this society willing to publicly support us - albeit rhetorically and conditionally, and in a way which can seperate us from that wider struggle I mentioned earlier. I think if there was a grassroots push to get rid of the Raytheon sponsorship and throw out the police floats, we would risk losing that institutional patronage and be forced to contend directly with the elements of society that despise us and wish us dead - and my fear, that I may be projecting on the wider community and certainly believe exists in our institutions, is that we are not ready to survive that lack of protection.
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Mar 1, 2023 04:24
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Bucky Fullminster posted:I wonder if Lidia Thorpe is going to end up following a bit of a Tulsi Gabbard trajectory. I may be misremembering but I think Gabbard is an amoral, power hungry, political opportunist Modi worshipper that grew up in and may still be involved in some kind of cult. I think Lidia Thorpe would struggle to get on that level. She probably has beliefs but is a born poo poo stirrer unsuited to party politics
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Mar 1, 2023 05:04
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Cartoon posted:It's generally a woman, but OK. problematic
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Mar 1, 2023 05:06
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Bucky Fullminster posted:I wonder if Lidia Thorpe is going to end up following a bit of a Tulsi Gabbard trajectory. don't see anything to suggest that's particularly likely thorpe is a radical who wants indigenous sovereignty and self-determination. she can be a volatile personality and her radicalism made her a difficult fit for party politics where some level of compromise and negotiation is necessary, but she cares about causes outside her own and the right has nothing to offer her except money so it's hard to see her taking any sort of reactionary turn. gabbard is a political opportunist who was raised in a right-wing hindu cult and had a long history of being a social conservative before she pivoted a decade ago, and has obviously since pivoted back. her commitment to progressive positions was always fairly hollow - she claimed to be anti-war while still being pro-war-on-terror and regularly went on fox to denounce obama for being soft on islamic terrorism etc., and you could see her more firmly reactionary shift coming a mile away.
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Mar 1, 2023 06:23
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EoinCannon posted:I may be misremembering but I think Gabbard is an amoral, power hungry, political opportunist Modi worshipper that grew up in and may still be involved in some kind of cult. I think Lidia Thorpe would struggle to get on that level. She probably has beliefs but is a born poo poo stirrer unsuited to party politics That kind of personality type has its own problems but yeah, Gabbard had a lot else going on which was pretty obvious once you took a closer look.
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Mar 1, 2023 06:28
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Aight cool then
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Mar 1, 2023 06:48
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Sierra Madre posted:I should clarify again that I'm making a distinction between the queer community and queer institutions, the latter of whom I propose are the well-to-do ones leading efforts at rapprochement with cops and business. "My wealth will surely protect me!" from any kind of minority is always bleakly funny. Some people never learn from history and are surprised as hell when they find the jackboot on their neck. "But I thought we were friends?" I'm an old gay man with many run-ins with the cops growing up and my position is simple: if the cops want a spot in Pride they can _start_ with a formal apology over their historic (and continuing) abuses. And they would need to implement serious reform for how they treat minorities. And that's an absolute minimum for most LGBTQIA+ people I know to even begin to be willing to consider starting a dialogue on their inclusion. Well, for anyone besides the Australian versions of Three Olives that is. Cops want in? They can loving earn it. Megillah Gorilla fucked around with this message at 10:50 on Mar 1, 2023 |
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Mar 1, 2023 10:48
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https://qnews.com.au/brisbane-pride-decides-on-uniformed-police-in-pride-march/ a few years ago the brisbane pride march did actually ban uniformed police from marching, but have decided to allow them back in after successfully getting an apology for 'historic mistreatment'. that was at least something but certainly not enough, not when it's still an active problem
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Mar 1, 2023 11:48
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I can definitely understand the desire to align yourself with institutional power as some form of protection against a very real threat, but imo a float at pride won’t make cops so much as blink before joining their mates in the far right to stomp on some minorities the second they get the chance. imo progressives tend to massively overestimate how much their enemies give a poo poo about being seen as hypocrites or inconsistent
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Mar 1, 2023 11:48
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i never really see the debate framed in those terms from people in favour of cops marching for pride, just 'what about the gay cops?' 'the cops have changed they're good now' 'not all cops are bastards' etc.
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Mar 1, 2023 12:02
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It boils down to not understanding what acab means. All cops, under capitalism, are bad. Their role is to violently enforce the dictatorship of the bourgeoisie. Hence even the cute gay cop that directs traffic to the tune of abba is bad despite never having directly touched an aboriginal person. So it's simply supporters and attempted reformers of capitalism vs. revolutionaries. Thorpe is not a revolutionary.
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Mar 1, 2023 12:10
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Megillah Gorilla posted:"My wealth will surely protect me!" from any kind of minority is always bleakly funny. I agree and it needs to come from the Police Union itself, not the management. The political leadership can say how much they want the cops they manage to be as part of the community they are policing all it wants but I wont believe they are successful for a second until a majority of beat members vote a resolution to the effect you describe.
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Mar 1, 2023 12:28
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Sierra Madre posted:Pride is inherently an event meant to present a community to the mainstream and say 'we are not a threat, we are just like you, we belong in society and do not deserve the indignities we are subject to by being forced outside of society.' I mean that's one interpretation of Pride but it's neither inherent nor foundational. The foundational Pride parades were a statement of "we are different and we will not be forced to disappear nor hide that difference, we will parade through your public spaces with joy and without fear".
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Mar 1, 2023 14:06
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Yeah, Pride is Pride because it's the opposite of shame.
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Mar 1, 2023 17:18
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Sierra Madre posted:Pride is inherently an event meant to present a community to the mainstream and say 'we are not a threat, we are just like you, we belong in society Yeah so why are cops allowed to participate again?
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Mar 1, 2023 22:48
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Ranter posted:It boils down to not understanding what acab means. but thorpe is against cops at pride? i wouldn't really call her a revolutionary but a radical, certainly
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Mar 1, 2023 23:03
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She isn't even radical. Thorpe thinks capitalism is ok (but needs to be nicer). So there will always be cops, even in her version of capitalism. Her position is nonsense.
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Mar 1, 2023 23:21
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i don't get the impression that thorpe has much attachment to capitalism, but it's true that her focus is certainly more on indigenous sovereignty than any question of capitalism vs. communism 'protesting cops is nonsensical unless you are a committed revolutionary' though is an extremely stupid position lol but have fun with that
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Mar 1, 2023 23:54
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Speaking of Copsquote:Queensland hoping to attract 500 foreign police officers a year to boost recruitment https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-02-23/queensland-recruits-foreign-police-officers-police-recruits/102013476
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Mar 2, 2023 01:26
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similar 'legislation'
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Mar 2, 2023 01:54
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Hire 👏 more 👏 diverse 👏 police 👏 officers
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Mar 2, 2023 01:57
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Queensland really going all in on "tough on youth crime" this election cycle
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Mar 2, 2023 02:03
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Mar 2, 2023 02:18
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starkebn posted:Queensland really going all in on "tough on youth crime" this election cycle its wild how the courier mail front page immediately pivoted from nonstop bashing them for high youth crime to the health system being hosed since they started implementing dutton level crime policy
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Mar 2, 2023 02:27
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