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I do not need a world with more Nils Amans in it
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Mar 7, 2023 04:08
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Darude - Adam Sandstorm posted:haha it was a joke. At some point in time Nate Silver lashed out at expansion teams in the USA and said that the optimal places to put a new NHL team was like 3 of them in the GTA, one each in the martimes and Quebec and one in Thunder Bay. It was such a real bad article that I think also said Vegas was a terrible place for a franchise, and well Nate Silver is a moron and just went with it and got roasted a lot. was it also nate silver that said they should put a team in the thriving metropolis of wood buffalo, alberta?
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Mar 7, 2023 04:08
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Thought the Sabres outplayed the Oilers tonight everywhere but in goal. Stuart Skinner was a brick wall, while Mr. Anderson let in a softie. Greenway needs a longer stick by like 6 inches. Dude is constantly hunched over with the puck essentially in his skates due to the tiny stick.
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Mar 7, 2023 04:13
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Was catching up on this thread and saw that Blackhawks roster, immediately checked the score and that roster won 5-0 over Ottawa?? Hockey is loving strange.
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Mar 7, 2023 06:01
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Dr Zaius posted:Was catching up on this thread and saw that Blackhawks roster, immediately checked the score and that roster won 5-0 over Ottawa?? Hockey is loving strange. The moment people started making fun of that roster I knew they’d pick up some wins this week because hockey is a terrible, random game where nothing matters
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Mar 7, 2023 06:05
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there's still time for ottawa, but getting blown out by 31st place chicago feels pretty devastating
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Mar 7, 2023 12:20
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Hockey rules
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Mar 7, 2023 12:42
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The Canucks continue to suck at sucking. Just the worst franchise. corn on the cop posted:there's still time for ottawa, but getting blown out by 31st place chicago feels pretty devastating Didn't you hear the fans chanting "we want the playoffs?" the other day? They're gearing up baby! ThinkTank fucked around with this message at 12:58 on Mar 7, 2023 |
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Mar 7, 2023 12:53
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Caps lose and Ovi scores. Sounds like a win to me.
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Mar 7, 2023 13:02
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What if the Caps hit on a Bedard lottery ticket? I almost don't even want to contemplate it because it would jinx it.
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Mar 7, 2023 13:07
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Chad Sexington posted:What if the Caps hit on a Bedard lottery ticket? They’re barely holding on to the final spot.  Need the cats to get hot. Looks like the Cats don’t even get that pick either, more incentive for them to start winning games.
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Mar 7, 2023 13:15
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th3t00t posted:Just Pizza and LaNova are 4 minutes apart fyi Yeah LaNova is four minutes further away from downtown. I was trying to give him options closer to downtown. Anyway I’m not a big fan of Buffalo-style pizza anyway so I dunno if it would be worth going there for wings. Edit: Ottawa getting crushed by Chicago was the silver lining to last night, tough loss for the Sabres but at least it was to a western team. But if they lose tonight they’re pretty much done.
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Mar 7, 2023 13:43
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Cartoon Man posted:They’re barely holding on to the final spot. I can't understand the condition as it's written on capfriendly but surely it's protected in some way? Nobody was willing to risk it this year, not even teams that were comfortably expected to be playoff teams.
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Mar 7, 2023 13:44
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fisting by many posted:I can't understand the condition as it's written on capfriendly but surely it's protected in some way? Nobody was willing to risk it this year, not even teams that were comfortably expected to be playoff teams. Ain't no conditions when you want Ben Chiarot baby
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Mar 7, 2023 13:58
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The Caps getting Bedard would rule.
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Mar 7, 2023 14:44
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Bloody Stars giving up a breakaway with 5 seconds left... I'm trying to watch my team tank here.
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Mar 7, 2023 15:47
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https://twitter.com/Aochokoa/status/1633104939764285445 How does McDavid score 12 goals a game and is still only a +10 lol
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Mar 7, 2023 15:50
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The Oilers other than McDavid and Draisaitl are very bad OP
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Mar 7, 2023 15:51
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Eric the Mauve posted:The Oilers other than McDavid and Draisaitl are very bad OP I mean, sure but this implies that when he's on the ice, the other team is almost as good as having Connor McDavid on the ice lol
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Mar 7, 2023 15:54
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58 of his 124 points are on the powerplay. Probably doesn't help. That said +/- is one of the most meaningless stats there is. One of the best +/- totals of this century is this dude in 2009-10 https://www.hockey-reference.com/players/s/schulje02.html Absolutely nobody should have considered him for the Hart or even the Norris ( he got some votes for the latter) El Gallinero Gros fucked around with this message at 16:58 on Mar 7, 2023 |
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Mar 7, 2023 15:56
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It's not that uncommon. Lemieux was only +10 in 95/96 for similar reasons. Plus/Minus is a really bad stat in general.
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Mar 7, 2023 16:16
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It seems vaguely useful for knowing when a player/their team sucks defensively but not really good for showing when a player is singularly good offensively.
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Mar 7, 2023 16:23
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Rasmus Sandin was a nice pick-up by the Caps, 23 years old and has 5 points in his first 2 games in Washington, and for Boston’s 1st, which is probably going to be late Timothy Liljegren could be another buy-low candidate too if Keefe keeps playing him below Justin Holl
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Mar 7, 2023 16:48
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El Gallinero Gros posted:58 of his 124 points are on the powerplay. Probably doesn't help. for most of his career McDavid has been pretty notably a poor player without the puck (but not nearly as bad as Draisaitl is) but he's largely turned that around this year and has been solid without the puck in addition to being the best player in the league with it.
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Mar 7, 2023 17:25
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Oh hey it's the literal thing I wrote a bunch of bullshit about in the off-season about why Mathews is the vastly more valuable player. This year at 5v5 Conor McDavid's Edmonton Oilers have 58 goals for and 53 goals against. A spread of +5 sandwiched between Robert Thomas and Sam Bennett ranked 169th amongst forwards with 200 minutes or more of 5v5 ice time. Unlike years past though, McDavid is having an extremely strong xG season so it's kind of funny... previously when McDavid has had coin flip 5v5 outcomes he's been in line with his expecteds. Mathews, by contrast, was on the ice for 56 goals for and 28 against. If you want to break it down by rates it's even more stark. Matthew's is 6th in league with 3.95 goals for his team per 60 minutes of ice time. That is good for 6th in the league. Conor is 52nd best with 3.32 goals for 60. Of course where McDavid has always struggled in the goals for split is the defensive side. At a rate of 1.98 goals against per 60 Mathew's isn't in the elite preventative category, but he's 77th in the league which still ranks as extremely good. With 3.03 goals against per 60 McDavid drops in at 339th of 433 players. Point being McDavid is the most offensively talented player in the league *especially* when on the powerplay, but his 5v5 (actual) numbers remain sub-standard IMO and saying he's the most valuable player in the league when he only excels at 1 side of a two sided coin seems to diminish what it actually takes to be valuable and win games/be successful.
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Mar 7, 2023 17:32
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Eric the Mauve posted:The Oilers other than McDavid and Draisaitl are very bad OP The Oilers depth players have in general been above 50% at 5x5. Most of the issues have been Leon and Cody Ceci being real bad at 5x5.
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Mar 7, 2023 17:32
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Starsfan posted:for most of his career McDavid has been pretty notably a poor player without the puck (but not nearly as bad as Draisaitl is) but he's largely turned that around this year and has been solid without the puck in addition to being the best player in the league with it. This is flat out wrong. At 3.03 goals against per 60 it is McDavid's 4th best 'actual' preventative season. 16/17 was his best with 2.14 goals against per 60 followed by 2.26 in 21/22. 2.72 GA/60 is 3rd best in 2017/18 then we reach this year which is roughly in line with 20/21s 3.07 GA/60. Finally 15/16, 18/19, and 19/20 seasons Conor had a truly bad 3.3 goals against per 60. In terms of his expected outcomes it ranks as his 5th worse on a per 60 basis, but I'll spare the yearly split.
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Mar 7, 2023 17:40
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rex rabidorum vires posted:Oh hey it's the literal thing I wrote a bunch of bullshit about in the off-season about why Mathews is the vastly more valuable player. Yet Matthews is so obscure that many people still don't know there are two t's in his name. ffs when are they going to get him out of Toronto and into a major media market
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Mar 7, 2023 17:40
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Does McDavid play on the penalty kill? Matthews doesn’t, so that would account for some of the differences.
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Mar 7, 2023 17:48
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pretty hard to not call the dude pacing for 160 points the best player in the league this is bringing me back to the days when people would try to say Datsyuk was better than Crosby because he was better defensively. i scoffed then and i scoff now
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Mar 7, 2023 17:48
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You guys ever heard of Sisyphus?Arivia posted:Does McDavid play on the penalty kill? Matthews doesn’t, so that would account for some of the differences. Sometimes he camps out instead of skating back to play defense effectively giving his team a PK. That kind of counts.
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Mar 7, 2023 17:51
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Arivia posted:Does McDavid play on the penalty kill? Matthews doesn’t, so that would account for some of the differences. Yah recently hes been getting time on the 2nd pk unit. But mostly its because he sucks rear end at defense. Maybe he doesnt due to the different analytical numbers but when I watch the game he just kind of cruises around
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Mar 7, 2023 17:59
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I don't think it's some big secret that no one pays less attention to defence in the NHL than Connor McDavid, and with good reason. His job is to cherry pick and do sick dangles and he's about as engaged as Ovechkin when the puck isn't on his stick or about to be. He's never going to be Pavel Datsyuk or Patrice Bergeron, that's not his game. He's as one dimensional a player as you will find, but holy hell that's quite the dimension.
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Mar 7, 2023 18:00
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Ginette Reno posted:pretty hard to not call the dude pacing for 160 points the best player in the league But then Crosby became an elite defensive forward and people say he was better than Ovechkin because he was better defensively, and in fact, that is true. Defense does matter. McDavid doesn't play it. He's still probably on balance the best player in the league, but it's not as giant a gap as the points totals make it look.
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Mar 7, 2023 18:01
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rex rabidorum vires posted:This is flat out wrong. At 3.03 goals against per 60 it is McDavid's 4th best 'actual' preventative season. 16/17 was his best with 2.14 goals against per 60 followed by 2.26 in 21/22. 2.72 GA/60 is 3rd best in 2017/18 then we reach this year which is roughly in line with 20/21s 3.07 GA/60. Finally 15/16, 18/19, and 19/20 seasons Conor had a truly bad 3.3 goals against per 60. It's his best season ever by xG +/- at 5v5 play, his 5v5GA/60 over his career is almost entirely lined up with his on ice save percentage as well as the quality of the team and is effectively meaningless, I don't know why you're quoting it. Connor McDavid didn't have Jack Campbell playing alot of minutes behind him in 2016-17, the Oilers had an actual competent goaltender that year for once. I also think comparing player performance on different years is problematic if you don't account for context based influences like linemates, the overall strength of the team, and what system the team is playing. The Oilers players this year under Jay Woodcroft might in general have higher xGA/60's than previous versions of the team under Dave Tippet or Todd McLellan because those coaches are known to prioritize limiting shot quality against whereas Woodcroft has (at times at least) seemed to lean more to a system that sacrifices structure to generate more offense, and the Oilers are now the 3rd best team in the league at generating xGF at 5v5 play whereas a few years ago they were middling or below average.. I don't think any of that stuff reflects on the effort level or the focus of the players, I was relaying what has been conveyed by people who follow the Oilers and have watched McDavid progress over his career into being a better overall player.
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Mar 7, 2023 18:02
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The best thing in the world would be if the Oilers flame out early in the playoffs and people start talking about Yzerman and having to learn defence to win championships and then McDavid's starts trying to stick lift and back check and his offence craters and his defence still sucks.
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Mar 7, 2023 18:03
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Eric the Mauve posted:But then Crosby became an elite defensive forward and people say he was better than Ovechkin because he was better defensively, and in fact, that is true. I don't recall Crosby ever becoming elite defensively. He wasn't a no-defense guy, but he wasn't elite. McDavid is pretty all offense but he's also better offensively than anyone since Lemieux so it's probably worth whatever tradeoffs he's making defensively Starsfan posted:I also think comparing player performance on different years is problematic if you don't account for context based influences like linemates, the overall strength of the team, and what system the team is playing. This is very relevant. As much as Jfresh's cards try to take out all the noise things like linemates and systems can have a profound effect on these numbers that people throw around.
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Mar 7, 2023 18:05
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McDavid is about league average defensively and that's exactly where Crosby was in his peak years
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Mar 7, 2023 18:17
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Arivia posted:Does McDavid play on the penalty kill? Matthews doesn’t, so that would account for some of the differences. I only pulled numbers for 5v5 specifically to avoid special teams numbers. I could include powerplay/pk/all situations...and I specifically *always* use Matthews when trying to compare/contrast with Conor 'cause uh well that should be obvious shouldn't it? I'm still on mobile so if the discussion is still going during nap time I'll take another swing at addressing some of the other points (haha jokes on us even if discussion moves on I'll drag it back up).
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Mar 7, 2023 18:20
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Penguins fans universally have a very weird thing about making GBS threads on McDavids play. I work with two of them and it’s hilarious hearing about how McDavid is overrated and doesn’t play defense. Yeah he’s at 2ppg, but how many of those points are at 5v5!? It’s ok that another superstar is in the league now, Crosby is still “elite defensively” apparently lol
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Mar 7, 2023 18:20
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