Ukraine War: Berth El Buk

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(Thread IKs: weg, Toxic Mental)

zone: Dec 6, 2016

https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1634573725193449472
Latest entry in department of strange Russian fires:

https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1634574134918230019
Cigarette mismanagement occurred in occupied Mariupol airport

# ? Mar 11, 2023 17:42

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# ? May 28, 2024 03:55

the holy poopacy: May 16, 2009; hey! check this out; Fun Shoe

zone posted:

https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1634573725193449472
Latest entry in department of strange Russian fires:

https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1634574134918230019
Cigarette mismanagement occurred in occupied Mariupol airport

It's hard to tell how many fires are sabotage as opposed to run of the mill industrial accidents, but TV offices are not normally known for spontaneous fires AFAIK

# ? Mar 11, 2023 17:46

zone: Dec 6, 2016

the holy poopacy posted:

It's hard to tell how many fires are sabotage as opposed to run of the mill industrial accidents, but TV offices are not normally known for spontaneous fires AFAIK

A number of the fires got figured as being insurance scams this year.

# ? Mar 11, 2023 17:48

Arc Hammer: Mar 4, 2013; Got any deathsticks?

How successful are those insurance scams anyways? People jumping onto car hoods and claiming they were hit by mad drivers were so frequent that it spawned the Russian dashcam genre. Does it ever work that these scammers get a payout? Is Russian insurance that robust to handle the claims?

# ? Mar 11, 2023 18:13

Pablo Bluth: Sep 7, 2007; I've made a huge mistake.

Where will 1A5s sit on the tank ranking scale of all the tank types seeing action in Ukraine?
https://twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1634579177746894851

# ? Mar 11, 2023 18:14

HonorableTB: Dec 22, 2006

Arc Hammer posted:

How successful are those insurance scams anyways? People jumping onto car hoods and claiming they were hit by mad drivers were so frequent that it spawned the Russian dashcam genre. Does it ever work that these scammers get a payout? Is Russian insurance that robust to handle the claims?

It works so well that's why pretty much everyone has a dash cam now as you noted.

Now it works mostly when you give the car owner a cut of the money and they "forget to turn the camera on that day"

# ? Mar 11, 2023 18:19

Icochet: Mar 18, 2008; I have a very small TV. Don't make fun of it! Please don't shame it like that~; Grimey Drawer

the holy poopacy posted:

It's hard to tell how many fires are sabotage as opposed to run of the mill industrial accidents, but TV offices are not normally known for spontaneous fires AFAIK

tbf the takes are pretty drat hot

# ? Mar 11, 2023 18:29

Coquito Ergo Sum: Feb 9, 2021

Pablo Bluth posted:

Where will 1A5s sit on the tank ranking scale of all the tank types seeing action in Ukraine?
https://twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1634579177746894851

Probably as training devices or with TDF/Guard forces. Maybe as armored cavalry?

The main known feature about the Leopard 1 is that it has really thin armor. This is by design, as AT rounds (especially HEAT) at the time were massively overmatching what we could accomplish with basic steel armor. So some nations opted for smaller, faster tanks with lighter armor. And if you think that T-72s can throw turrets, get ready because the L1 has its main ammo storage sitting in the front chassis behind like 50mm of sloped armor.

Then, tanks with composite armor like the T-64 started coming out, enabling tanks to have good frontal protection again.

There are armor kits made by different countries that have given the Leopard 1 more effective protection, but I can't speak to their effectiveness against the more powerful or modern ATGMs or kinetic rounds. The Danish Leopard 1s are technically A3s that have been upgraded to A5 level, minus some unavoidable differences like not having the A5's cast turret. They have fairly modern optics and FCS.

Sorry if I got anything wrong. I'm running off of what I remember from reading a book years ago. That said, L1s are robust and fast and the guns are still viable in the conflict. They performed well in the former Yugoslavia conflicts. I wouldn't say no to receiving them.

# ? Mar 11, 2023 18:49

Victis: Mar 26, 2008

1A5DK are okay. Fast, 105mm NATO rounds and good optics and FCS (actually better than 2A4). They are uparmored and should shrug off any autocannons but probably not anything that�s actually anti-tank

Also all 1A5 are upgrades, they are the base standard for any countries that field them

# ? Mar 11, 2023 19:14

PC LOAD LETTER: May 23, 2005; WTF?!

My guess (I'm not a tanker) is they'd use them in the same sort've roles the Russians are using their older tanks in.

That is not for head to head tank battles but recon, ersatz artillery SPG's, and troop support.

The 105mm cannon might not be up to modern requirements for penetrating the frontal armor on a T72 but it'll do just fine for side or rear shots and can still blow up plenty of other things quite well. Sights are supposed to be decent, around about as good as the earlier Leopard2's. Speed and mobility are OK but not great.

The biggest issue is probably every ATGM will be lethal against it due to the thin armor and both sides have tons of those lying around on the battlefield.

Most of the commentary by the experts seems to be that they'll be good and a improvement for the Ukrainians forces in a defensive role but also that there'll be lots of them blown up in any assault.

edit: I'm not aware of official or exact numbers of the amount of ATGM's either side has in the field but plenty of people comment that ATGM's are everywhere on both sides. Same thing for MANPADS too. \/\/\/\/\/

PC LOAD LETTER fucked around with this message at 19:50 on Mar 11, 2023

# ? Mar 11, 2023 19:44

Tai: Mar 8, 2006

Do russians have a lot of ATGM's kicking around at platoon level?

# ? Mar 11, 2023 19:47

HonorableTB: Dec 22, 2006

Lmao Zelensky's trolling to get the Russian Federation renamed to Moskovia/Muscovy got the Russians really loving mad haha

https://en.socportal.info/en/news/zelenskii-otvetil-na-petitciiu-o-pereimenovanii-rossii-v-moskoviiu-v-rf-otreagirovali/

SocPortal posted:

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has asked Prime Minister Denys Shmyhal, together with scientific institutions, to clarify whether it is possible to return Russia to its historical name - Moskoviya.

Before doing so, Zelensky considered an electronic petition whose author suggested that the name "Russia" be officially changed to "Moscovia" and that the terms "Russian" be changed to "Moscovia" and "Russian Federation" be changed to "Moscow Federation".

Zelenskiy pointed out that "the issue raised in the petition requires thorough elaboration both from the perspective of the historical and cultural context and taking into account the possible international legal consequences".

In her turn, Russian Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Maria Zakharova responded tothe initiative. In her words, President Vladimir Zelensky's instruction to Prime Minister Denys Shmygal to look into the possibility of renaming Russia into Moskovia is "evidence of an attempt to create an 'anti-Russia'.

We would like to add that Russia has actually existed for only 301 years - since 22 October 1721, when Moscow Tsar Peter the Great proclaimed the Moscow Empire as the Russian Empire.

Medvedev took a break from the bottle long enough to slur out this dumbshit response to it:
https://www.jpost.com/international/article-733997

Dmitry, Let's Not Fight Dmitry posted:

Russia will rename Ukraine 'Bandera Reich,' Medvedev warns

Medvedev, who called Zelensky the 'head Nazi in Kiev [sic],' warned that Russia's response to a Ukrainian petition would be tit-for-tat.

Former Russian president Dmitry Medvedev again compared Ukraine to Nazi Germany on Saturday when he suggested Ukraine be renamed 'Schweinisch Bandera-Reich' (Pig Bandera-Reich) in response to a Ukrainian petition calling on the Ukrainian government to rename the entirety of the Russian Federation 'Moscow.'

On Friday, Zelensky responded to the petition after it had passed the 25,000 signatures required to draw a response from the Ukrainian government. The petition, which accuses Russia of stealing the identity of all Rus' people in eastern Europe, called on Ukrainians to "reclaim our identity and our history."

Medvedev, who in his tweet referred to the Jewish-Ukrainian president as the "head Nazi in Kiev [sic]," warned that Russia's response to such a move by Ukraine would be tit-for-tat.

"[Zelensky] ordered to consider officially renaming Russia to Moscoviya. What would our response be? Renaming Ukraine as well, but not to Ukroland, and definitely not to Malorossiya," Medvedev wrote.

"Just Schweinisch Bandera-Reich. Exakt!" Medvedev suggested in a reference to Stepan Bandera, a wartime Ukrainian far-right leader whose Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists militant wing collaborated with Nazi Germany during World War II.

Despite the "international legal consequences" of renaming the Russian Federation, as Zelensky noted, the president ordered a "comprehensive processing" of the petition by his prime minister, Denys Shmyhal, to examine the legality of such a move.

Also, Russia's broke as gently caress. Below is an archive link to non-paywalled Financial Times article

https://archive.ph/fxvch

FT posted:

If you torture the statistics long enough, eventually they�ll confess. On that timeless maxim, Vladimir Putin managed to conjure a minor 2.1 per cent contraction in Russia�s economy last year against the double digits that we were expecting. The bizarre thing is that we believed him!
The IMF and World Bank dutifully recycled Moscow�s official 2022 growth numbers, prompting soul-searching about Russia�s resilience. If Russia could withstand the most sweeping western sanctions since the days of South African apartheid, perhaps we needed to rethink. I am no statistician. I do know, however, that there are deep grounds to mistrust Russia�s official data about anything.

As Jeffrey Sonnenfeld, doyen of the Yale School of Management, points out, Rosstat, Russia�s official statistics agency, has been through a leadership flux in the past year and was already a badly compromised agency. At any rate, Putin got the numbers he wanted. Rosstat predicts that Russia will grow by 0.3 per cent in 2023. I predict that this will be nonsense.

The most thoughtful economists do not sit around like chicks in the nest waiting for data to be dropped into their mouths. They look at other measures. In China, that used to be metrics such as rail freight and electricity usage. Reading Russia today should be much more simple.
Three million of Russia�s most educated people have left the country, taking with them their intellectual capital and energy. Back home, the Russian state is cannibalising refrigerators and other white goods for the chips it can no longer import. According to Sonnenfeld�s monitoring team at Yale, 1,000 of the 1,200 top foreign corporate investors in Russia have now fully pulled out of the country(opens a new window). Their revenues accounted for 35 per cent of Russia�s gross domestic product before the invasion of Ukraine. Among these are the oil and gas companies, such as BP (which took a writedown of $25.5bn(opens a new window)) that kept Russia�s fossil fuel pipelines flowing and its equipment maintained.

Russia�s natural gas exports have all but dried up. Europe used to take the bulk of Russia�s supply and has now reduced it to close to zero. I have no idea who blew up Nord Stream II but it was quite unnecessary. Europe has shown Chinese-style efficiency in rapidly building LNG capacity to import the liquefied gas that Russia is technically incapable of producing. Russia�s vapour gas is thus stuck with no market. It would take years to build Russian pipelines to alternative buyers.
To be sure, China, India and others are taking the Russian oil that Europe no longer imports. But Russia is selling it at a loss. Deutsche Bank estimates that Russia is earning barely a third of its prewar fossil fuel revenues. It is also becoming increasingly expensive � roughly twice the global average � for Russia to extract it. It costs Russia $45 to extract a barrel of oil and another $12 to get it to its customers. This suits the west perfectly since we don�t want the global oil price to go up and don�t want Russia to make money. Since more than half of Russia�s budget comes from fossil fuel revenues, the government is now pillaging its rainy day funds. More extreme revenue extraction measures will surely follow.

What does this mean for the war in Ukraine? There are good and bad implications. I doubt China would be so rash as to start supplying the arms and ammunition that Russia so desperately needs. My colleague Gideon Rachman has written interestingly on this subject. I share his view that this indicates China�s growing concern about the costs of a prolonged Ukrainian war.
A vassal state the size of Russia is all well and good until you have to start paying the bills. The bad news is that Putin will be increasingly tempted to take desperate measures to bring this war to a favourable conclusion. This week�s salvo of Russian nuclear-capable hypersonic missiles targeted at key Ukrainian infrastructure was a worrying indicator of what a cornered Putin might do. We can certainly expect a cash-strapped Russia to hurl ever more human waves of badly trained conscripts to their deaths on the front lines.

HonorableTB fucked around with this message at 20:01 on Mar 11, 2023

# ? Mar 11, 2023 19:53

tango alpha delta: Sep 9, 2011; Ask me about my wealthy lifestyle and passive income! I love bragging about my wealth to my lessers! My opinions are more valid because I have more money than you! Stealing the fruits of the labor of the working class is okay, so long as you don't do it using crypto. More money = better than!

I don�t know about the rest of you but the fact that my grandfather was born in Lviv makes this whole invasion difficult to not take personally.

Slava Ukraini

# ? Mar 11, 2023 20:28

EorayMel: May 30, 2015; WE GET IT. YOU LOVE GUN JESUS. Toujours des fusils Bullpup Fran�ais.

HonorableTB posted:

Lmao Zelensky's trolling to get the Russian Federation renamed to Moskovia/Muscovy got the Russians really loving mad haha

https://en.socportal.info/en/news/zelenskii-otvetil-na-petitciiu-o-pereimenovanii-rossii-v-moskoviiu-v-rf-otreagirovali/

Medvedev took a break from the bottle long enough to slur out this dumbshit response to it:
https://www.jpost.com/international/article-733997

Also, Russia's broke as gently caress. Below is an archive link to non-paywalled Financial Times article

https://archive.ph/fxvch

Name-calling/bad branding is the only thing more nationwide scathing than war(especially lost ones).

# ? Mar 11, 2023 20:38

teen witch: Oct 9, 2012

Muscovy sounds like a salty fish treat with a lot of strong opinions as to its preparation

# ? Mar 11, 2023 20:38

Power Khan: Aug 20, 2011; by Fritz the Horse

Muscovy should be reduced to it's original size and the occupied territories handed over to it's people.

# ? Mar 11, 2023 20:46

Strategic Tea: Sep 1, 2012

Worrying indications that putin might, in the future if sufficiently provoked, launch missile attacks on civilian infrastructure!!!

# ? Mar 11, 2023 20:47

Icochet: Mar 18, 2008; I have a very small TV. Don't make fun of it! Please don't shame it like that~; Grimey Drawer

This is what Putin thinks is cool. All the guys at his office think this is cool

# ? Mar 11, 2023 21:01

Cthulu Carl: Apr 16, 2006

Strategic Tea posted:

Worrying indications that putin might, in the future if sufficiently provoked, launch missile attacks on civilian infrastructure!!!

Did he find a new guy to tell him that the Hot Topic in the mall is being used as a barracks?

# ? Mar 11, 2023 21:07

TEMPLE GRANDIN OS: Dec 10, 2003; ...blyat

my lovely balls have become infected with moscovia putinitis

# ? Mar 11, 2023 21:43

shadow puppet of a: Jan 10, 2007; NO TENGO SCORPIO

teen witch posted:

Muscovy sounds like a salty fish treat with a lot of strong opinions as to its preparation

Better yet, don't use the word Muscovy at all and instead call both Russia-Moscow and acidic Jamaican fish preparation by one word: "escovitch"

It would create a constant lingering confusion about weather you were talking about a slavic landmas or a brined red snapper

# ? Mar 11, 2023 21:44

teen witch: Oct 9, 2012

alcatraz gently caress boy posted:

moscovia putinitis

mods

_{hits different}

# ? Mar 11, 2023 21:45

Tarquinn: Jul 3, 2007; I know I’ve made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you
my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal.; Hell Gem

alcatraz gently caress boy posted:

my lovely balls have become infected with moscovia putinitis

# ? Mar 11, 2023 22:19

Cthulu Carl: Apr 16, 2006

Maybe if we all go back to calling Russia Muscovy Putin will end the war because then he no longer has to settle for being 'president', he can be Grand Duke.

# ? Mar 11, 2023 22:40

DiomedesGodshill: Feb 21, 2009

FT posted:

This week�s salvo of Russian nuclear-capable hypersonic missiles targeted at key Ukrainian infrastructure was a worrying indicator of what a cornered Putin might do.

Cornered? How the gently caress is he cornered? He could just bring his forces back home?

# ? Mar 11, 2023 22:50

bob dobbs is dead: Oct 8, 2017; I love peeps; Nap Ghost

Cthulu Carl posted:

Maybe if we all go back to calling Russia Muscovy Putin will end the war because then he no longer has to settle for being 'president', he can be Grand Duke.

why settle for callin it grand duke when you can call it Megaduke

# ? Mar 11, 2023 22:50

bob dobbs is dead: Oct 8, 2017; I love peeps; Nap Ghost

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megas_doux

# ? Mar 11, 2023 22:50

Cthulu Carl: Apr 16, 2006

bob dobbs is dead posted:

why settle for callin it grand duke when you can call it Megaduke

bob dobbs is dead posted:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megas_doux

Man, just when I think I've started figuring out the metric system....

# ? Mar 11, 2023 23:00

HonorableTB: Dec 22, 2006

Mega Dooky (in his pants)

# ? Mar 11, 2023 23:01

Power Khan: Aug 20, 2011; by Fritz the Horse

https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1634644368274358277

# ? Mar 11, 2023 23:20

Hannibal Rex: Feb 13, 2010

HonorableTB posted:

Lmao Zelensky's trolling to get the Russian Federation renamed to Moskovia/Muscovy got the Russians really loving mad haha

If they rename it Muscovy, Elon's going to switch sides for good.

quote:

Also, Russia's broke as gently caress. Below is an archive link to non-paywalled Financial Times article
https://archive.ph/fxvch

Counterpoint, also from FT:
https://www.ft.com/content/cde8696f...b1-6394ed090c78

# ? Mar 11, 2023 23:23

DiomedesGodshill: Feb 21, 2009

bob dobbs is dead posted:

why settle for callin it grand duke when you can call it Megaduke

This made me really laugh. Well done.

# ? Mar 11, 2023 23:27

Lord Stimperor: Jun 13, 2018; I'm a lovable meme.

bob dobbs is dead posted:

Megaduke

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ht-DQKVacG4

# ? Mar 11, 2023 23:31

Sedgr: Sep 16, 2007; Neat!

Tsar Bumba: Mother of All Dooks.

# ? Mar 11, 2023 23:38

mobby_6kl: Aug 9, 2009; by Fluffdaddy

Power Khan posted:

https://twitter.com/noclador/status/1634644368274358277

Well that's cool but it's going to take Biden & co another 5 years to get over all the "red line" to make that actually available, isn't it

# ? Mar 11, 2023 23:56

BrassRoots: Jan 9, 2012; You can play a shoestring if you're sincere - John Coltrane

tango alpha delta posted:

I don’t know about the rest of you but the fact that my grandfather was born in Lviv makes this whole invasion difficult to not take personally.

Slava Ukraini

Ditto. Granddad came from farms just outside Lviv towards polish border.

# ? Mar 12, 2023 00:14