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Samus Returns is so mediocre that I had absolutely no hope for Dread at all, and then it ended up being maybe my favorite Metroid game in the whole SR turned out to be a nice little test run so they could make the REAL game and learn what worked and what didn’t. Other M though is just…. Another level of bad. It’s bad in ways that are hard to really articulate. It’s bad because one man was given total control to enact his vision and it turns out he had a really godawful vision. It’s bad because you can see so many things that could’ve been good if changed just a little bit — better voice acting, a tighter script, use of the nunchuck. It really feels like Team Ninja was trying their best to make a cool 3D action adventure Metroid but had absolutely no clue how to mesh their vision with Sakamoto’s completely nonsensical demands. Like, we can all talk for hours about the dumbass script or Samus’ bland voice acting or “THE DELETER”, but that game stood zero chance of being good when they were forced into “Wiimote ONLY”. Like it feels like they got 3/4ths through development with Wiimote+nunchuck when Sakamoto decided the best course of action was a D-pad and two buttons. A genuinely insane design decision that I will never wrap my head around. Thankfully, all these years later, Metroid is getting the comeback it deserves and Sakamoto lost all credibility forever. I can’t hate him because I mean, he directed Super Metroid and Metroid Fusion. But the best thing that has happened at Nintendo in the last ten years has been the old guys letting the young ones take the reins.
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Mar 14, 2023 04:04
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Simply Simon posted:Bottomless pits are a similar principle to lava pools except you don't have to wade through hot sauce to ascend a stairwell of shame after screwing up a Grapple, so the pits win in my books Does Prime do the old Metroid trick of "oh some lava's just not real and you only know when you jump in"?
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Mar 14, 2023 04:14
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Blackbelt Bobman posted:Samus Returns has problems but like, Other M is REALLY bad. Oh man I'm really looking forward to playing it! Good thing I'm *checks notes* .....6 games away!
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Mar 14, 2023 04:20
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Nikumatic posted:i have not played other m but even so i think i like it better than samus returns you underestimate its power
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Mar 14, 2023 04:58
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Nikumatic posted:i have not played other m but even so i think i like it better than samus returns lol, rofl, lmao come back when you get to the part where Adam has to authorize her to turn the Varia Suit on
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Mar 14, 2023 05:48
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sakamoto is still producer on 2d metroid and introduced dread in an interview as these new devs helping realize the vision the old GBA team couldn't
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Mar 14, 2023 06:26
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Other M is a series of flaws and problems so packed and wound tightly around eachother, with something passable buried deep deep deep down inside there My understanding is that there is a romhack that fixes a vast majority of the bigger gameplay issues. I think it even gives Samus an actual Gravity Suit. e: Yeah, y'know, if you just took a chisel and a very heavy hammer to it, Other M could be kind of like Super Mario 3d World. Like, Mario 64 and Ocarina of Time and Sonic Adventure and Metroid Prime are all very "Here is our IP, reimaged to be taking place in a fully 3d environment" vs 3d World or Other M are more "Here is the series as it existed in the 16-bit era, but with a third dimension added to it" And that's a really cool idea! Samus is pretty snappy and the combat is pretty neat and the idea of having Super Metroid kind of remade in that engine is a neat idea But it's Other M so you have to go into first person to shoot missiles and your gravity suit is just purple sparkles and THEBABY AND JERK OFF YOUR WIIMOTE TO RELOAD YOUR AMMO e2: Other M introduced the dodge-based combat that would make its way into Samus Returns and later Dread, and with it, a lot of very cool animation of Samus really loving aliens up but that's very very very betrayed by the uh story and characterization Sockser fucked around with this message at 06:42 on Mar 14, 2023 |
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Mar 14, 2023 06:31
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Ignoring the narrative Other M is fundamentally incoherent mechanically. It's a fairly linear game with numerous new combat mechanics, dramatic bosses and setpieces, and stylish animations married to a simplified control scheme that means all of this has to be largely automated. You can lean into being a simplified throwback for old fans or have team ninja push the fusion/dread philosophy into 3D, but you can't do both.
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Mar 14, 2023 06:46
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Sockser posted:But it's Other M so you have to go into first person to shoot missiles I alluded to it earlier, but this is even worse than this description lets on. To go into Missile Mode you need to point the wiimote at the screen for the first-person missile mode to start. The same wiimote that you're using to move and jump and shoot. So if you want to use missiles you need to go stationary, make sure you're pointing your wiimote so it picks up the sensor bar, then fire and hope no monsters were nearby to gently caress your poo poo up while you made the bad decision to use missiles in a Metroid game. e: Also you can't 100% the game on the first playthrough because there's a post-game section that gets you the last item pickup you need for it. The boss is a cool throwback, but god drat you will be wondering where the last pickup is if you're trying to get 100% before rolling credits.
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Mar 14, 2023 07:48
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Motto posted:Ignoring the narrative Other M is fundamentally incoherent mechanically. It's a fairly linear game with numerous new combat mechanics, dramatic bosses and setpieces, and stylish animations married to a simplified control scheme that means all of this has to be largely automated. You can lean into being a simplified throwback for old fans or have team ninja push the fusion/dread philosophy into 3D, but you can't do both. thank you for putting this that way, it's a much clearer explanation of my issue of trying to use the wiimote alone for the kind of game design that is involved otherwise than I had before.
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Mar 14, 2023 07:58
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Other M has issues that go beyond even the ones mentioned - the game simply hates the concept of the player having fun. I don't think people have even mentioned the asinine pixel hunts yet, but basic traversal is also deliberately clunky and annoying. My go-to example for this philosophy is various long corridors connecting sections. I suspect they hide loading screens, but it's still always a slow walk down an empty tube. However, the game has a speed booster, so after you get that, it should be quicker? Wrong, because there's ridges in the floor that make Samus trip just before reaching booster speed. There's even an extra animation for her stumbling iirc. SlothfulCobra posted:Does Prime do the old Metroid trick of "oh some lava's just not real and you only know when you jump in"?
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Mar 14, 2023 08:50
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MechaX posted:lol, rofl, lmao I think that's one of the parts they made worse in translation... like, it's supposed to play out more like Samus deliberately goes in there with it turned off in order to piss off Adam about the authorisation bullshit, until he screams at her to stop being a jackass and just turn it on.
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Mar 14, 2023 09:44
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The best description of Other M compared to the other Metroid games. https://youtu.be/F0JUSgkdnXo
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Mar 14, 2023 11:59
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I had a great time with Samus Returns. It's weaker than the previous two 2D Metroids (Fusion, Zero Mission), and it's certainly weaker than the Super competitor Dread, but bad? Come on.
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Mar 14, 2023 14:08
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Other M's combat is funny because yeah, you could go around collecting all of these items that increases your beam charge speed Or you can just run face first into every attack and mash a directional button and 10/10 times the Sense Dodge will activate nullifying any damage and giving you a full charge, but it also has like 1000 invincibility frames There is exactly one boss that you actually have to learn its patterns and poses a challenge, and that challenge aspect only really applies in Hard Mode. PaletteSwappedNinja posted:I think that's one of the parts they made worse in translation... like, it's supposed to play out more like Samus deliberately goes in there with it turned off in order to piss off Adam about the authorisation bullshit, until he screams at her to stop being a jackass and just turn it on. ngl, that feels just as bad, except Samus is being really petulant instead of really dumb
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Mar 14, 2023 14:17
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Adam: "Samus, do not use your super missiles and power bombs to blow up the station and kill us all. There are actually living people here for once." Samus : "wow ok I might as well just jump into lava with my suit off then if that's what you want"
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Mar 14, 2023 14:31
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MokBa posted:Other M though is just…. Another level of bad. Last summer I decided it was time. Forget the Wii. I spent a few hours figuring out how to create a good control scheme (well, as good as it can be) for the game on my Steam Deck's gamepad and I think I was pretty successful there. I picked it up in earnest about a month ago and decided I can tolerate the game for about 30 minutes every week. So it's going to be a slow burn here. Xenomrph posted:Oh man I'm really looking forward to playing it! Good thing I'm *checks notes* .....6 games away!
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Mar 14, 2023 14:37
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mastajake posted:I had a great time with Samus Returns. It's weaker than the previous two 2D Metroids (Fusion, Zero Mission), and it's certainly weaker than the Super competitor Dread, but bad? Come on. ExcessBLarg! posted:I can tolerate the game for about 30 minutes every week.
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Mar 14, 2023 14:42
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Simply Simon posted:I don't think people have even mentioned the asinine pixel hunts yet, Whenever I describe Other M to people, the pixel hunts are in my head, but I don't know how to even cross over from "here's how it fails the basics of metroid" to "okay and here's this completely different thing that's tacked on and is also bad and looking for a brown patch of brown blood on a brown dirt floor tripped me up for 15 minutes" It fits in as well with an explanation of the game as it does with the game itself.
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Mar 14, 2023 15:12
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MechaX posted:ngl, that feels just as bad, except Samus is being really petulant instead of really dumb I wish Other M took place like really early with a young Samus who was petulant and bratty, that might work. But instead it takes place right after Super and doesn’t make any sense. Not to mention the fact that it basically stole the plot from Fusion! What the hell was even the point of Other M lol
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Mar 14, 2023 15:36
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Blackbelt Bobman posted:I wish Other M took place like really early with a young Samus who was petulant and bratty, that might work. But instead it takes place right after Super and doesn’t make any sense. Not to mention the fact that it basically stole the plot from Fusion! What the hell was even the point of Other M lol The whole authorization stuff and Samus' PTSD bit with Ridley would have actually worked had Other M been a prequel where she was still in the Galactic Federation.
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Mar 14, 2023 15:40
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It’s also pretty amazing that not only does Other M rely somewhat on prior knowledge of a prequel manga the game contradicts more than once, Samus never actually mentions in game that she had two bird dads raise her from childhood to adulthood How the gently caress do you just not mention the bird dads, it’s like Sakamoto forgot the background of the prior games he himself directed when making Other M
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Mar 14, 2023 15:49
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TaurusOxford posted:The whole authorization stuff and Samus' PTSD bit with Ridley would have actually worked had Other M been a prequel where she was still in the Galactic Federation. b-but THE BABY ...actually TBH even that could have worked, just have young Samus pining for a family of her own and lamenting that her path means she will never get to experience that kind of bond herself, bing bang boom you get poignant dramatic irony
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Mar 14, 2023 15:58
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ExcessBLarg! posted:
Well I was planning to play it on my Wii (the only option available to me I think) sooooo… Edit— with the 3DS eshop shutting down at the end of the month, is Federation Force worth buying for $40? Physical copies are more than that, and I can only imagine the price will go up once the shop shuts down. I was watching retrospective videos about it and people were saying that while it was disappointing at the time, apparently it’s pretty solid if you take it on its own merits? Xenomrph fucked around with this message at 17:24 on Mar 14, 2023 |
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Mar 14, 2023 17:16
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There are a lot of things you could have done to make Other M work, it's mostly just notable that they chose basically the worst possible story to tell the worst possible way Like, everyone talks about Samus and how dirty they do her in that so much everyone forgets about the Mother Brain clone lady who's also psychic or something MokBa posted:Like, we can all talk for hours about the dumbass script or Samus’ bland voice acting or “THE DELETER” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rrZ-sA4FQc&t=100s RBA Starblade fucked around with this message at 17:32 on Mar 14, 2023 |
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Mar 14, 2023 17:27
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Xenomrph posted:Well I was planning to play it on my Wii (the only option available to me I think) sooooo… It's fun, but you will want at least one buddy to play it with you. Its a prime game, so you walk around kinda slow and clunky. Adjust expectations and yes, it's a great time. Me and a friend had a lot of fun with it
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Mar 14, 2023 17:36
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I should add...if in any way possible, play with a circle pad pro
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Mar 14, 2023 18:02
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WHY BONER NOW posted:I should add...if in any way possible, play with a circle pad pro Is that the thumb stick on a New 3DS XL?
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Mar 14, 2023 18:15
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No, original 3ds and 3ds XL had an accessory, it was basically an entire new analog stick (just like the left one), but added to the right side
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Mar 14, 2023 18:18
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The thumb stick acts as a weird right stick, it’s probably good enough.
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Mar 14, 2023 18:22
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WHY BONER NOW posted:No, original 3ds and 3ds XL had an accessory, it was basically an entire new analog stick (just like the left one), but added to the right side Did they make that for the New 3DS XL, too? Edit— looks like they didn’t, but the New 3DS XL has the little c-stick nub that I totally forgot exists. Xenomrph fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Mar 14, 2023 |
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Mar 14, 2023 19:01
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Yeah I think the c stick is supposed to remove the need for a circle pad pro...I've never used a 3ds c stick but I hear they're kinda awkward/stubby
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Mar 14, 2023 19:11
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The c nub is weird on 3ds. I guess I've never had anything go wrong with it but it also doesn't feel good to use. IIRC there was a mod to use a PSP stick over the nub or they might have just fit on normally.
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Mar 14, 2023 19:24
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Games that had Circle pad pro function could access the c-stick nub thing the same way. I did it in Kingdom Hearts 3D, it was fine.
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Mar 14, 2023 23:24
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I did not care for the 3DS thumb pad. Part of my problem with SR was my thumb just hurt after playing it a bit. I'd give it another go if it were ported to the Switch. Also lol I totally forgot about the pixel hunt in my many complaints. I straight up had to look up that solution. It is genuinely unfathomable that that game was released in that condition. Has anyone tried to hack it into something playable, with full analog movement and whatnot? It might be too much of a mess to be worth the effort. It's just sad because there's a decent game hiding in there but it is hiding REAL deep.
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Mar 15, 2023 02:18
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Metroid Prime Hunters trip report: Just got the second Octolith and am now given the choice to go to one of two locations, I’m guessing it doesn’t matter what order you do them in (headed to Vesper). I think I’m getting a handle on the controls a bit better, but I’m very glad that the “chapters” seem to be short so I can take breaks and let my hands recover lol
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Mar 15, 2023 03:03
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MokBa posted:Has anyone tried to hack it into something playable, with full analog movement and whatnot? It might be too much of a mess to be worth the effort. It's just sad because there's a decent game hiding in there but it is hiding REAL deep. https://gbatemp.net/threads/metroid-other-m-redux-based-on-maxximum-edition.602301/
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Mar 15, 2023 03:16
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https://twitter.com/dril/status/1635926768405348352?s=20
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Mar 15, 2023 12:46
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I'll be honest, Other M's the worst game in the series by such a wide country mile that it's crazy.... And yet all I feel now is apathy and would prefer just not bringing it up anymore. It just doesn't feel like it's worth my time and energy. Oh, and Fusion's still in my top 3 of the series with Prime and Dread by the way, every time I play it it's just an immaculate time, and this replay I just finished was no exception.
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Mar 16, 2023 01:38
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I bought Federation Force, does it support partying up with randos via a game lobby listing/browser/whatever, or is it pretty much friends-only, invite-only? In other words, if any of you guys have it would you be down for coop mayhem sometime?
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Mar 16, 2023 03:06
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