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Also Meursault's N corp identity is busted as heck. It's not a normal fighter, instead being the game equivalent of a walking talking tank that is also a minefield. His defense move is a special counter that gives him +2 protection, a damage boost, and is always a high damage single attack counter. Unlike most counters the move also is essentially a better version of guarding, since he gets a defense boost that nullifies most attacks unless they're buffed heavily. Meaning you can just spam it any time an enemy targets him to get a free red move that makes him largely undamageable. It's not uncommon for high damage mobs like the ebony apple to just slam face first into him and do half a dozen attacks that just do 0 damage with the final one doing 1. There's at least one video out there where he gets deployed solo and does nothing but defends and solos the entire level by just standing there menacingly.  Edit: At uptie 3 he also gets a self heal that does damage to enemies because giving him a self heal after all of that is totally balanced. 
Archonex fucked around with this message at 20:13 on Mar 19, 2023 |
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Mar 19, 2023 20:07
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It's because Mr. Salt is the best Sinner and thus deserves nothing but the best
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Mar 19, 2023 20:29
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Seems like Meursault's counter is only really good for abnos though since in human fights defensive skills change the enemy targeting to not hit you. But also he's just really good at winning clashes and doing solid damage with his skill2 and skill3. He did top damage in today's thread abno for me and I never used the counter once.
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Mar 19, 2023 20:34
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Theantero posted:It's because Mr. Salt is the best Sinner and thus deserves nothing but the best His N Identity might be a violent fanatic, but he's also quite thoughtful. If you have him as the main screen identity he reminds you to get enough sleep and wants you to let him know if you have any trouble at work.
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Mar 19, 2023 20:40
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RPATDO_LAMD posted:Seems like Meursault's counter is only really good for abnos though since in human fights defensive skills change the enemy targeting to not hit you. That's because they haven't changed yet defensive skills so that they will clash.
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Mar 19, 2023 20:40
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LostRook posted:His N Identity might be a violent fanatic, but he's also quite thoughtful. If you have him as the main screen identity he reminds you to get enough sleep and wants you to let him know if you have any trouble at work. His afternoon dialogue is nice too. Despite being a prosthetic wielder (or at least one presumed to be one) that his group consider to be inferior to baseline humans he points out that if you're ever feeling troubled about your work you can talk to him. He comes off more as someone who really doesn't get the whole violent supremacist mindset and is trying hard to fill a role. Which is kind of a theme with a lot of the N corp identities we've seen so far. GiantRockFromSpace posted:That's because they haven't changed yet defensive skills so that they will clash. Is this something they're going to do? Because if so he has the potential to be even more broken than G Corp Gregor. Archonex fucked around with this message at 21:09 on Mar 19, 2023 |
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Mar 19, 2023 21:03
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Archonex posted:His afternoon dialogue is nice too. Despite being a prosthetic wielder (or at least one presumed to be one) that his group consider to be inferior to baseline humans he points out that if you're ever feeling troubled about your work you can talk to him. Yeah, they planned to introduce it this week but delayed the changes due to balance issues. Also, Mersault identities seem to be quite thoughtful about others? W Corp Mersault base talks about Don joining the company and mentions that if Dante ever travel by WARP train he'll personally scrape his remains and restore him which is... something  . That's food for thought given how Base Mersault is pretty quiet and direct on the story.
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Mar 19, 2023 21:07
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GiantRockFromSpace posted:Yeah, they planned to introduce it this week but delayed the changes due to balance issues. So is his defense going to have a coin flip added? And if so how much? Also, Meursalt's friendliness makes sense when you know the backstory behind the character he's based on. Meursalt canonically doesn't understand the foibles of society to an absurdist's degree. So if you were to stick him into a supremacist cult with all of it's obsession with hierarchy and an artificially engineered superiority and inferiority he'd be even more absurdly out of place; likely confusing the hell out of everyone as to why he's there or how in the world he got so far into the extremist group without getting whacked even as he points out that they're his inferior due to his position in the cult (He's literally the second in command, or something close to it) and they have to suck it up. Heck, from what I remember even in the novel the only person he seems to value as a friend is an absolute piece of poo poo who abuses his girlfriend and he definitely screws up the life of his friend's girlfriend (he gaslights her into going back to her ex boyfriend so that he can beat her some more) to protect that friend's happiness even if he doesn't understand himself why he's doing it for them. Also, N corp Salt's dialogue hints that N corp Sinclair may be a thing in the future, assuming it isn't referring to Rodion. As for Rodion, she has some hosed up uptie dialogue that infers the nails they use (Which transfer experiences to the user, apparently?) are loving up her head more and more as she goes along. She sounds downright aroused at one point before composing herself and apologizing. Which explains why we haven't seen an inquisitor that was marginally sane. They're also addicted to the nails in a way similar to drug addicts on top of being the in setting equivalent of violent christian/white supremacists. Actually, i'm wondering if all of the N corp upties are going to have some wham lines in them like that. Archonex fucked around with this message at 21:35 on Mar 19, 2023 |
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Mar 19, 2023 21:10
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Archonex posted:So is his defense going to have a coin flip added? And if so how much? Oh, no coin flips added, they are just making defensive skills not skip clashes in Human Battles and making them able to intercept attacks on Abnormality battles IIRC. So you can actually block attacks with them, use counters on weak attacks, etc. Also good points there, I'll admit having not read the book I'm not really one to talk and most I found about the original character was that he seemed apathetic towards everything but you do make a good angle. Maybe I should read some of them. The only book of the 13 I did read was El Quijote and I am glad the devs did not forget that, besides "funny crazy man" and "dreamer that dreams the impossible", Quijote was also a serial meddler who would constantly beat people up if it fit his perceptions, from beating up an abusive master, to some penitents who he thought were evil sorcerers kidnapping princesses, to a guy who liked a ship he considered problematic.
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Mar 19, 2023 21:25
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i think my favorite Meursault picture is the ending of chapter 1, where everyone is varying levels of angry and depressed except for Meursault, who's just sitting perfectly still in his seat hyperfocused on staring straight ahead, having very clearly switched into "this is the appropriate way to sit on a bus" mode with absolutely no concern for anything else that's going on. the cutscene artist's dead-eyed stare for him never fails to make me laugh when it pops up in the background, sincerely hope they keep it going
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Mar 19, 2023 21:27
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GiantRockFromSpace posted:Oh, no coin flips added, they are just making defensive skills not skip clashes in Human Battles and making them able to intercept attacks on Abnormality battles IIRC. So you can actually block attacks with them, use counters on weak attacks, etc. Yeah, the attention to detail so far has been pretty good. I'm wondering if it's going to turn out that Meursalt is afflicted by anomie, as some analysts of the novel have suggested. It would definitely fit with his blunt, blithe reassurances that are hilariously disturbing despite intended to be helpful, along with why he's such a nice guy in his N corp identity. Since a closer reading of his book shows that despite everything Meursalt definitely does have emotions and isn't just a robot. He just lacks the usual amount of selfhood most people have, possibly from having been ground down by the awful realization that his aspirations and ambitions are meaningless in the long run. Given what we know might be true about Dante it does make sense that he'd be a bro with the warp train stuff given the hints to Dante possibly being a really bad person akin to his friend from the novel, or just a copy of the real Dante (who may be an awful bastard instead) as certain dialogue suggests. Archonex fucked around with this message at 21:32 on Mar 19, 2023 |
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Mar 19, 2023 21:29
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Nick Buntline posted:i think my favorite Meursault picture is the ending of chapter 1, where everyone is varying levels of angry and depressed except for Meursault, who's just sitting perfectly still in his seat hyperfocused on staring straight ahead, having very clearly switched into "this is the appropriate way to sit on a bus" mode with absolutely no concern for anything else that's going on. Personally, I'm partial to Chapter 3 Meursault dousing his chicken skewer in ketchup (probably not actually ketchup but I choose to believe it's ketchup).
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Mar 19, 2023 21:31
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Hm, headless shark day as miserable as I thought it would be
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Mar 19, 2023 22:10
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GiantRockFromSpace posted:
Might as well take this opportunity to take stock: Yi Sang - Thread/Game inspired me to read - Mostly on point, but ours is a bit more in depression mode than "screw around and find out" mode. Faust - There's a whole bunch of versions of Faust which are radically different, and I think I read the one that wasn't Goethe's Faust. May actually be worse than not having read it at all, tbh. - can't comment. Don Quixote - Read part of it, summary of the rest. - Seems pretty accurate, Chapters 2 and 3 showing the mask crack a little makes me wonder how much Alonso Quijano (the underlying nobleman) there really is to our Don Quixote. Hong Lu - Read, but a very long time ago - Fits the general theme, but by that very nature, unless you're looking super deep, you're not going to notice what his deal is. For instance, did you know he's not named after the main character of his novel, he's named after the novel itself? Notice the jade in his eye? Gregor - Read, but a very long time ago - The first one of these where something's clearly off as mandated by the demands of the plot, and also so that Gregor isn't extremely miserable to be around. Somehow has a better relationship with Hermann than the novel's Gregor does with his family. Heathcliff - Haven't read - can't comment. Meursault - Haven't read - can't comment. Outis - Read, but a very long time ago - Hmm, well. This is an interesting one. I suppose it depends how much you're reading into this being "Nobody" rather than Odysseus. After all, gotta look good for the Cyclops/King/suitors when all eyes are on upon you and there's a very real risk of you otherwise not getting out alive/getting your revenge, hmm? ...actually, scratch that, Odysseus being a total dumbass who immediately, shamelessly drops the act and insults everybody to their faces the instant he thinks he's safe makes this 100% on point. Ryoshu - Haven't read - can't comment. Ishmael - Haven't read - can't comment. Rodion - Okay, I have a funny story about this one. Back in high school, I was supposed to read Crime and Punishment for English class. Instead I read scraps of it, Cliff Notes, and BS-ed the rest. Meanwhile I was consumed by guilt about doing this and thought it was super obvious to everyone that I was a fraud and going to be found out. This, of course, is literally one of the main character's struggles in the novel and conveys what Dostoevsky was trying to get at with Raskolnikov better than actually reading the book would have been - They pretty much steal one of the parts of the novel for Rodion's backstory, so I guess it works. Raskolnikov is a bit more self-righteous than Rodion, which ultimately leads to his collapse, but also a salvation that Rodion isn't particularly interested in. Sinclair - Haven't read - can't comment. Dante - Read, but a very long time ago - Pretty on point? The Divine Comedy is weird in that it literally has its author as a self insert character, but he's kind of dazed and confused from his own sins (represented in the novel by animals he meets along the Dark Wood which are the Fixers in the Prologue) and the woman he had and obsessive crush over being dead, so he sort of just falls rear end-backwards into the rest of the story while occasionally getting dunks in on people/having philosophical conversations. It's a pretty good reference character for your stereotypically missing-the-plot but developing into doing the best they can gacha game protagonist. Virgillius - see Dante - Mostly on point, right down to telling Dante that he doesn't care about the Sinners' bullshit. The ways in which he differs are mostly because it ruins the plot of the game if he's as chatty as the actual Virgil was in the Divine Comedy, but also there needs to be somebody within the company who can fulfill the role of Deus Ex Machina that in the Divine Comedy was solved by having angels drop down from Heaven at God's orders. Charon - see Dante - Eh. The Divine Comedy syncretizes a lot from Roman and Greek sources, so I guess you can sort of squeeze Charon in as making sense if you take all of those as reference and replace Charon's greed with Gluttony/feeding the bus. Kind of a tight fit, more important in her role in the story and keeping things on the road. Mephistopheles - see Faust - I still can't comment too much, but I think it's funny how in most of the variants the devil Mephistopheles does at one point serve as a bus to get Faust where he wants to go as part of the necessary preconditions of ensuring Faust's temptation.
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Mar 19, 2023 22:30
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i cant wait for outis to reveal they're actually dias and get hosed up by a poseidon equivalent
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Mar 19, 2023 22:35
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RoyalScion posted:Hm, headless shark day as miserable as I thought it would be People generally seem to have problems with Ichthys, but I never found it too bad? I never had a strategy other than 'prioritize clashing the attack with the massive Attack Power debuff' and 'have enough EGO synergy that you have yours up when it fires the big gently caress Off blood cannon' and that seems to work just fine.
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Mar 19, 2023 22:47
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Theantero posted:Personally, I'm partial to Chapter 3 Meursault dousing his chicken skewer in ketchup (probably not actually ketchup but I choose to believe it's ketchup). My favorite is him holding a pan flute in the Chapter 2 Sinclair soulful maracas scene.
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Mar 19, 2023 22:47
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Theantero posted:People generally seem to have problems with Ichthys, but I never found it too bad? I never had a strategy other than 'prioritize clashing the attack with the massive Attack Power debuff' and 'have enough EGO synergy that you have yours up when it fires the big gently caress Off blood cannon' and that seems to work just fine. A big issue is people not knowing that you should let some attacks get off on resistant sinners instead of clashing everything. But also dude has insane offense so he gets extra numbers on non 30 sinners and his heads are high.
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Mar 19, 2023 22:49
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A fair enough point. I do always have Tingtang Man and Kurokumo Ryoshu with me for those big Lust hits to slap the fish in its glowing weak spot, so that might have colored my experience.
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Mar 19, 2023 22:51
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Maybe miserable is overputting it, it's more like there's a reasonable chance of losing if I roll poorly on some stuff since I haven't spent the time to put together other coherent teams besides what I used for ch3.
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Mar 19, 2023 23:00
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Yeah, I guess it's more a question of the other abnos being rather forgiving and less about ichtys being that difficult.
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Mar 19, 2023 23:08
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20 v. 30 Ichthys is like night and day, if you just want to drop down and save yourself the heartache.
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Mar 19, 2023 23:20
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Jossar posted:
On the Dante thing, the angels as deus ex machina to save the protagonist from danger bit made me remember that the Project Moon...iverse? Whatever the setting is called, actually does have angels in it. As for what the angels in this case are referencing, it's a reference to a top tier potentially apocalyptic abnormality with themes of salvation and cults of a certain type of religious bent. Which of course is thematically tied to the Light which Carmen and Ayin from past games are a part of, along with their own horrifying take on it (which is featured already in a subtle way in game), and is basically one of the series full blown eldritch abominations instead of just being a magical girl gone dark, an urban legend that was gameified to work in LC1, or some manifestation of mental anguish extracted from a broken psyche.  W̷̭͉̖̪͈͓̩̖̅͜h̵̨̜̝̬̙̥̲̩͈͚̞̲̃͒̐î̸̭͙̪̲͔̺̲͔͙̼̩̲͓̲͒̄̑̔̃͌ͅt̴͓̬̆͑ė̷̡͚̹͚̪̲̳̠N̷̬̣͚̽͜į̷̗̲̱̰̳̾̓̀̋́͝g̸̡̹̺͈̫͈̮͓͚͒̒̀ͅh̶̨̧͔̖̜̼̳͍̥̣͂͂̚͝ẗ̵̮̦͚̱̭̜͠s̶̗̩̪̓̾̊̋͋̆̇́̓͂̑̿̚  Anyone who's played Lobotomy Corp knows how much of a nightmare that thing is to contain even with a fully decked out group of EGO wielding agents trying to contain the mess, an expendable R team of cloned super soldiers wiping everything out in their path, and all the cannon fodder of an entire base if it gets fully unleashed. It's usually a hard reset of the day for many players despite having a small army of troops ready to go. Imagine the sort of havoc it'd create in the city proper if it showed up again? And this time you've only got five or so highly dysfunctional literary murderhobos to try and stop it? Edit: Making me wonder even more if it's going to show up during the game at some point during the main story is the fact that it's text in LC has a reference to a big wham moment early on in this game. Of particular note, the abnormality has a reference to the gates of hell from chapter 1. Specifically, that it's apostles will stand as a bulwark against the gates of hell (and all that come out of it by implication, which would be the sinners in this case). Also, the mark that Demian and Sonya have sounds an awful lot like the mark that White Nights puts on his apostles before he turns them into monsters. Said apostles also talk about the end of an age and the beginning of a glorious new one just as Sonya and Demian do. This would also tie into Demian's novel equivalent being essentially a fallen angel in some interpretations. Ditto for the mark being a negative thing in many respects, since factoring in both the story of Crime and Punishment along with Demian it's not really a sign of favor from a loving god but more close to being something like the mark of cain. It also is probably a mark not from god but instead either from the anti-christ or straight up the devil given that it's "rival" abnormality is a reference to Jesus Christ and has themes of forgiveness, White Nights has a collar around it's neck with the numbers 666 on it to warn people off from interacting with it, and it takes one of it's apostles realizing what a monster it is after it enacts it's plan and confessing their crime to it's rival abnormality and asking for forgiveness to stop it's rampage. Rodion ought to be really glad that she didn't end up getting marked if that is correct. Sinclair or Outis if she actually is a traitor (she'd be the most likely pick for it) and has the mark too may or may not be hosed though, given what it takes to banish White Nights. Archonex fucked around with this message at 01:27 on Mar 20, 2023 |
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Mar 19, 2023 23:22
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about the literary inspirations of Limbus Company's characters
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Theantero posted:Personally, I'm partial to Chapter 3 Meursault dousing his chicken skewer in ketchup (probably not actually ketchup but I choose to believe it's ketchup). I also really like Ishmael's 'what the gently caress are you doing' look as she watches him do this. Speaking of which, does Rodion have a scar over her right eye or did she somehow get some kebab juice up there in the festivities? There's an orange mark in the ch3 credits image that sort of looks like a stylized wound/scar but I don't remember seeing it anywhere else. !fishhead was annoying as my team had trouble getting EGOs online to clash some of the rougher hits, but what worked well enough was tossing out sacrificial blockers on the really nasty stuff, eating the claps, and focusing on staggered parts to rush down the main health pool. Didn't lose anyone, so Good Enough!
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Mar 19, 2023 23:47
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The fish is like the one Abnormality so far where timing Stagger and Break is very important, since it does so many attacks with each leg and they're all relatively slow. Get fast sinners and you can usually stack attacks on a part to Stagger it turn 2, nullifying all of them and ensuring you get the damage on the main HP bar. That's even more important on the Blood Cannon turn, since with how slow Sin accumulation is on Abnormalities you are very unlikely to have two EGO ready to go when it's time, but it's generally pretty doable to stagger the main body before the Cannons go off.
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Mar 19, 2023 23:50
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You don't have to break parts to do damage to the main hp bar! You damage both at once whenever you hit an unbroken part. The UI is just bad about this and only shows one of the bars at a time. As far as I can tell there's pretty much no reason to attack a broken part when you have the opportunity to make unopposed attacks against an unbroken one instead. RPATDO_LAMD fucked around with this message at 00:24 on Mar 20, 2023 |
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Mar 20, 2023 00:22
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My biggest question is there seems to be some mechanic hidden cause I still have 1 coin and 3 passives locked, so maybe there's an easier way to kill it we haven't found yet.
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Mar 20, 2023 00:26
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The other thing is that for at least the limbs they just grow back right away, so the ideal move may be to Stagger the legs without killing them? I will admit I’ve got to actually read its passives, though.
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Mar 20, 2023 00:33
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Jossar posted:Gregor - Read, but a very long time ago - The first one of these where something's clearly off as mandated by the demands of the plot, and also so that Gregor isn't extremely miserable to be around. Somehow has a better relationship with Hermann than the novel's Gregor does with his family. I will say, I do enjoy how Gregor's entire backstory is effectively him repeatedly waking up to realize he's been transformed into a monstrous pest. First waking up to realize he's an experimental child soldier with a horrible arm, then waking up to realize all his fellow soldiers are nothing but cannon fodder in an unnecessary war and deserting, then waking up to realize that the City at large treats all its veterans as nothing more than barely-metaphorical pests. Shows they care and didn't just pick Gregor because Cool Bug Man. (I know I'm talking about the end of the first chapter, but the game's been out three weeks. It's still early enough for me to feel weird enough to spoil things every now and then.)
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Mar 20, 2023 01:04
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AweStriker posted:The other thing is that for at least the limbs they just grow back right away, so the ideal move may be to Stagger the legs without killing them? I will admit I’ve got to actually read its passives, though. Assuming you don't have the raw DPS to just blitz it down, yeah. The optimal route for most of the abnormality bosses (bar stuff like the factory, which has it's own mechanics obviously) is to go for the stagger on as many parts during a single turn, use this to mitigate outgoing damage by making it easier for sinners next turn to block the opportunity to attack while your other sinners do damage. Repeat this process. If it tries to do the fluid press/whatever it's called attack just counter it with an optimal character or abuse broken block mechanics like Meursalt N corp's block if you have it. This requires keeping track of the damage vulnerability of each part obviously. Failing that, just block and tank the hit via that. Notably, a bunch of ego 3's will slaughter the boss in many cases without having to do that. I use Tingtang Hong, Meursalt N corp, Rodya N corp, Blade Lineage Yi Sang, and G Corp Gregor without any problems. I can just hit the win chance button and they'll solo it down with minimal interference. I think I had to pop Meursalt's factory robot ego once to counter him getting targeted. Archonex fucked around with this message at 01:08 on Mar 20, 2023 |
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Mar 20, 2023 01:06
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Archonex posted:Assuming you don't have the raw DPS to just blitz it down, yeah. The optimal route for most of the abnormality bosses (bar stuff like the factory, which has it's own mechanics obviously) is to go for the stagger on as many parts during a single turn, use this to mitigate outgoing damage by making it easier for sinners next turn to block the opportunity to attack while your other sinners do damage. Repeat this process. Oh using N Corp Meursalt's block is smart I have just had him stand in the way of the hits directed at whichever squishy character and let him eat the attacks that are actually aimed at him. I will note he has never staggered from me doing this even one time in all my runs but block still seems like it is probably a more optimized version of the same strat.
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Mar 20, 2023 01:11
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Sam Sanskrit posted:Oh using N Corp Meursalt's block is smart I have just had him stand in the way of the hits directed at whichever squishy character and let him eat the attacks that are actually aimed at him. I will note he has never staggered from me doing this even one time in all my runs but block still seems like it is probably a more optimized version of the same strat. N Corp Meursalt is, as mentioned earlier, loving absurd. It appears he's going to get buffed further if the clash thing is true and it doesn't have a coin toss to bypass his mechanics. So abuse his block as much as you want. It's basically an I win button for any enemy dumb enough to target him. His block is not actually a block by the way. It's actually a high defense, high damage counter that functions as a damage nullifying or (Assuming absurd amounts of damage in a single strike, which is the only counter to his move.) lessening block move too. You can tell this by looking at it in the character menu and seeing it has an attack symbol with numbers next to it, meaning that his block is technically an attack that buffs the heck out of his defense and renders him nearly invulnerable to anything except high damage single attack strikes. Add onto that that using the block will add something like 2-3 protection buff to reduce the damage taken even further (If it's an attack with multiple hits it can reduce the damage of each one to 0 or an incredibly low amount.) and give him a damage buff on top of that for his attack at the start of combat without fail due to the way it's built. Which given how it works appears to mean that any time someone initiates a fight with him he gets those buffs, reducing damage even further and pumping his DPS for his counter. I'm not sure how the buff fades (You can't check buffs that start and fade during the combat phase of a round, as far as I can tell.) but assuming it works how like a lot of buffs work and reduces the count by 1 per every round you could theoretically break the game over your knee by just launching him at the enemy in a reduced pop group and have him stand there menacingly while countering and building up higher and higher defense and damage counts per counter if so. Someone who wants to risk wasting the cost of running a mission could check to see if that's so by deploying him solo and seeing his he gets even higher damage per counter in a round. Archonex fucked around with this message at 01:25 on Mar 20, 2023 |
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Mar 20, 2023 01:15
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i got 3* mersault but my friend said hes worse than 1* mersault, should i just stick to him? ive been using default mersault's skill 1 and chains of others some since they seem pretty good for bosses/minibosses
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Mar 20, 2023 02:13
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Which 3* Meursault, WARP or N Corp?
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Mar 20, 2023 02:15
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Junpei posted:Which 3* Meursault, WARP or N Corp?
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Mar 20, 2023 02:16
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Wait, you can change the identities on the TV? How do you do that?
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Mar 20, 2023 02:16
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KobunFan posted:Wait, you can change the identities on the TV? How do you do that? Click the id symbol for a character on the side of the menu and hold the button like you would on the character menu to look at their details.
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Mar 20, 2023 02:20
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Endorph posted:i got 3* mersault but my friend said hes worse than 1* mersault, should i just stick to him? ive been using default mersault's skill 1 and chains of others some since they seem pretty good for bosses/minibosses
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Mar 20, 2023 02:27
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Tried level 30 Ichthys again and still fell flat. This time it didn't even feel like I did anything wrong strategy-wise, I just didn't have the raw numbers to outpower it on even basic clashes. Just gonna beat up the level 20 and focus on building up a team that can stand up to it for next week.
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Mar 20, 2023 02:35
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Now that Thread is easier to get, are there any E.G.Os worth leveling now that it's not such a large investment of a limited resource? I have Meur's gacha ego at uptie 3 so far and thats it.
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Mar 20, 2023 02:36
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