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Yeah, I'd enjoy seeing more of these.
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Mar 17, 2023 05:06
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Popete posted:These are great, do more!
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Mar 17, 2023 05:27
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Can we play as China squaring off against the US? It'd be fun to be the underdog
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Mar 17, 2023 06:19
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gradenko_2000 posted:If we're going to stick with the Goon Ford concept I'd like to see something set in the South China Sea. tatankatonk posted:Can we play as China squaring off against the US? It'd be fun to be the underdog Yeah, putting us in as a China, say, would be a nice change and a bit of challenge!
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Mar 17, 2023 10:03
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tatankatonk posted:Can we play as China squaring off against the US? It'd be fun to be the underdog Shamelessly stealing from ColdWar thread, but it'd be hilarious to have goons in the proverbial pilot seat for this: Antigravitas posted:Absolutely unrelated, but someone linked that in the r/aviation in the thread about that drone: edit-wrong c/p
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Mar 17, 2023 11:16
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Foxfire_ posted:@Yooper: Can you crack open the scenario files and list off some what-ifs for other events/how it could have gone? Sure, I can look at it. I think there's a fairly straight forward path, it's just how quickly it occurs based on our actions. RE: Next Scenarios, China Let me look and see what's out there. Or I could do it the old fashioned way and make one.   Here's a request for all of you. There is a request / vote thread over at Matrix. One of the voting choices is full TacView AAR export. What does this do? It allows me to dive in, get a detailed view of who shot what, from where, at what angle, and then do it from different perspectives. Flight sims like DCS use it and it's really great to see things on our own time instead of inside of CMO from only one perspective. We could play an hour, then I go through and intersperse CMO pics and details with TacView snippets.  (This is from DCS) How : If you have a Matrix Forum Account go to this thread and vote for the TacView AAR.  If you don't have a Matrix Forums account you can either make one, or just encourage your friends that do to Vote!
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Mar 17, 2023 12:44
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We should just flag down the dev haunting these forums and tell him we really, really want it
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Mar 17, 2023 14:14
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 Right! So there's a CMO : Live scenario that is a China-Sudan Vs. France-Chad. It's SU-30MKK's, MIG-29's, J-10C, J-16 Flying Sharks, MIG-23's, SU24's, JH-7B's and some ancient rear end A-5C Fantan's. Plus we get tankers and AEW and an bunch of SSM missiles specifically for killing a carrier. Not only is Chad on the west, but there is a French Carrier Group with the... Charles De Gaulle. And we have to sink it. With a whole lot of hot garbage. There's a mega scenario from the Chains of War campaign pack called Salvo, but that is big. And I'm not sure I have that monster in me yet. (That one is China Vs. Us in the Pacific) Question, do we just continue it in this thread and turn it into the CMO LP, or do we start a new one?
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Mar 20, 2023 00:51
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I'd vote to keep it up in this thread and work your way through as many scenarios as you want.
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Mar 20, 2023 00:57
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Yooper posted:Question, do we just continue it in this thread and turn it into the CMO LP, or do we start a new one? Considering that the first scenario was pretty compact and didn't take super long, I would say keep them in this thread unless one of them is an ultrawhopper monster that justifies its own separate thread.
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Mar 20, 2023 00:58
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I'd keep this thread rolling, but obviously up to you. I'm looking forward to dunking Chuck.
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Mar 20, 2023 00:59
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Yeah same thread, just update the tile.
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Mar 20, 2023 01:07
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Keep it here, new thread in the future when we get promoted to a higher theater level
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Mar 20, 2023 01:09
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Nthing same thread, will be interesting to see some airframes I'm not familiar with.
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Mar 20, 2023 01:17
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BRIEFINGquote:
Narratively speaking, this one is much more straight forward. The pop up plot elements and choices are basically gone for this one. Our focus is strictly military in this conflict. NAVAL ASSETS  First up is a Type 095 nuclear attack submarine. It has two main weapons, first is a KD-20 cruise missile, second is a YJ-82 anti-ship missile. We'll probably use the cruise missiles early on and lurk and use the YJ-82's later. This is a decently capable sub, but we're swimming in a bathtub. without far to run. French ASW assets are going to be a problem.  Next is a Type 093B nuclear attack marine. It has all anti-ship missiles. Again we'll use this against the De Gaulle group.  This is a fairly capable SSM battery. The YJ-12 is a really great ASM missile, with a supersonic primary phase, sea skimming secondary phase, and active homing phase with terminal maneuvering. On the down side they are fragile and lack any SHORAD or SAM cover. They have a rudimentary radar that will get detected in seconds and this thing will eat poo poo. Naval Air Assets  Port Sudan is our main ASM strike hub. At Port Sudan Military Airport we have 16 J-16 Flying Shark (SU-30MKK Copies), each with a pair of YJ-83K. This missile is a slower, less capable, slightly dumber version of the YJ-12/YJ-82. These things have a huge strike radius, which we can use to our advantage to overfly Eritrea and side strike the De Gaulle. If we lay these things over the sea the CIWS will thwack them.  At Port Sudan International we have a pair of Y-8X Cub's. These are a fairly basic Maritime Patrol aircraft. Great range, long loiter, basic sensors. They will have no problem finding the carrier. The problem is they are a tin shell filled with gasoline. The Carrier Air Wing will eat this thing up. If we deploy it we have to be fairly certain that we'll lose it.  A hypothetical striker! Cool! The JH-7B is also rolling the YJ-12. Ours also have a Defensive Electronic Counter Measure pod, but I don't hold much stock in it. The French will have some potent electronic warfare themselves.  Defending all of this is an SA-2F (1957 era) SAM and a much more capable HQ-9.  The HQ-9 will eat up a Rafale. And the first thing we'll do is shorten the range that it will engage targets. Per our WRA, it will only fire inside of the No Escape Zone. Ideally the SA-2F will make them dodge and then the HQ-9 will strike them.  We'll set the SA-2 in intermittent radar mode with a random dispersion. It'll be on, off, and turn back on randomly again. This may keep it alive slightly longer. Next post we'll go over the middle area, which contains our CAP and long range air to ground strikers.
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Mar 20, 2023 02:08
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This looks like a really interesting scenario! Always fun to see some non USA/Russia setups. Using the tankers seems a bit risky given that they have air assets in multiple directions.
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Mar 20, 2023 10:55
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We're gonna want to get a fix on the de Gaulle asap, and absolutely inundate it with missiles, so I think sacrificing some MPAs to that purpose is a good idea if we don't have another way to do it. And while our subs are operating in a bathtub, so is the French carrier group.
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Mar 20, 2023 12:11
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Please put me in the pilot's seat of a Flogger
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Mar 20, 2023 12:35
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the Charles de Goon must be destroyed!
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Mar 20, 2023 12:39
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Oh, and I'll take our type 093B sub.
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Mar 20, 2023 13:06
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Looks like a neat scenario, I'll take the type 095.
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Mar 20, 2023 13:49
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Please assign me to our most vulnerable available asset.
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Mar 20, 2023 15:35
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Stick me in a J-16 cockpit! China vs France is certainly novel, too bad there isn't as much background as the previous scenario. How difficult is it to put together an escalating conflict like Angola?
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Mar 20, 2023 15:49
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I'll take a J-16 too please.
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Mar 20, 2023 15:58
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I'll take a J-16 if possible, otherwise whatever plane is available.
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Mar 20, 2023 16:13
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Moon Slayer posted:Stick me in a J-16 cockpit! It's not that bad really, you assign victory points to, say China, as certain things happen. So the more you piss off China, the more VP's they get, and that triggers different things. So say above 50 victory points and they launch CAP, then once they detect your flight they get 25 more victory points, and this triggers them hostile. Then once they take damage you add more VP's and they launch a missile strike or some such. But you can make it conditional and branching so there is not a linear outcome. The scripting language (lua) is quite powerful, it's just a matter of putting it together.
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Mar 20, 2023 16:23
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I'll take a J-16 if they're still available. If not, any available jet. I agree with doing what we can to eliminate the CdG from the conversation as quickly as possible.
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Mar 20, 2023 19:44
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I'd also like a J-16 slot
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Mar 20, 2023 21:09
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Seat me in one of those MPAs most assured to get swatted 35 seconds into hostilities.
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Mar 20, 2023 22:37
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 Our AO is big. So big that I think we're going to have issues if we try to fight things on both sides. We could swing Tankers east, cover CAP on the coast, or swing Tankers centerish and cover the west. I need to play with ranges more to get an idea of where we can operate. Khartoum International houses our AEW and Tankers. It roughly splits our AO between the coast and the western bases. Ideal? No. But it gives us some flexibility I guess.  The KJ-500 is a fairly decent AEW bird. But notably the radar has a 350nm range with an ELINT package listening out to 500nm. But we still have the distance problem and we only have two of these. We will almost be guaranteed to suffer a gap in radar coverage.  The tanker is... a tanker. It does carry a shitload of fuel, which is good because we'll need every single drop. As with the AEW, we'll probably suffer some gaps.  Wadi Seidna Air Base has 18 J-16's, half tasked as AAW, and the other half pre-loaded with cruise-ish missiles that have a 100nm mile range.  And we have some options. First up is some dumb bombs, that are daytime only. That's out. Next we have AAW loadouts, which I think we're good on. Lastly is glide bombs, cruise-ish missiles, an anti-ship missile, followed by some Anti-Radiation Missiles. Think HARM's but faster and shittier. We have some aircraft pre-loaded with ARM's so we won't use those. Since fuel is so huge, I'm thinking we stick with the LACM's for now. If we can survive to strike #2, then we'll swap out to those LS-6-500's. Maybe.  Further south at El Obeid we have J-10C Firebirds. No, not the kind Joe Biden used to pick up chicks with at the Dairy Queen, but the Chinese kind. Half are using AAW loadout, the other half with ARM's. The game calls it a Gen IV, but from experience it's like a Gen 3.5. Our ARM loadout can reach out to about the Chadian border. So anything beyond that will need tankers. Our only other option for these is some dumb bombs which is a no-go.  In the east is a variety of closer airbases. El-Fashir is ~260nm to Abeche. Nyala is about the same. Our forward airbase is like 30nm from the Chadian army positions.   El Fashir has SU-24MK Fencer D's in a fairly straightforward bomb dropping configuration. These need overshoot to drop, which could be an issue.  Sudan also has striking MIG-29's which is weird. The typical short legs of this jet gives us a 400nm strike range with only a pair of 500kg bombs. The SU-24 in comparison carries 4500 kg of bombs. They can do CAP, but with short legs we're going to suffer from really quick station times.  At Nyala we have 8 Floggers led by Gradenko2000. They are rocking 1500 kg of bombs. Our only other real option is some Maverickski's, the AS-7 Kerry. But we only get 2. Big downside to this aircraft is it is day only.  Our Forward Airbase has some A-5C FanTan strikers with 90mm rockets. These things fairly well suck. If the area is permissive enough I guess they'll do OK?  We also have 3 of these sweet bad boys rocking some rockets and some laser guided Hellfire-ish missiles. They have a 4.3nm range, which is OK, as long as the SHORAD has a 4.2 nm range.  Goal #1 - Get the AEW, CAP, and Tankers up. Goal #2 - See what is emitting for strikers. Goal #3 - Sanitize the ground area. Goal #4 - Strike Abeche Goal #5 - Strike Northern Airbases Goal #6 - Carrier Target of Opportunity 1 second in and we get this alert from command  
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Mar 20, 2023 23:30
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I count it as a win if we sink the de Gaulle, no matter what else happens.
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Mar 20, 2023 23:54
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Yeah, gently caress up the De Gaulle, that should be our personal goal. EDIT: What's that J10-C in the picture packing? Obviously the red ones are missiles, but the big white clunkers look too big to get airborne speed. Bombs?
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Mar 21, 2023 00:27
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PurpleXVI posted:EDIT: What's that J10-C in the picture packing? Obviously the red ones are missiles, but the big white clunkers look too big to get airborne speed. Bombs? Those are drop tanks, for carrying an obscene amount of fuel so you can go far. So this is kind of tangential, but China lacks the ability to project force like the US can. It doesn't have the distant basing and nuclear capable vessels that allow 11 USCSG to flex the American love muscle anywhere in the world. But by building relationships in Africa they can secure themselves basing to maybe someday project force into Africa to protect Chinese interests. What China can do really well right now is project force locally, rather like the Russians could in the North Pacific and Barents Sea. I'm working on more of a storyline Chinese CG scenario but it's tough because China just doesn't have the poo poo to project out and I don't want another South China Sea smackdown. So yah, you need bigger drop tanks to stretch your local legs.
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Mar 21, 2023 01:24
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Huh, for some reason I wouldn't have figured drop tanks would have any reason to have the little fins on the back. Also the solution is clearly to go full Clancy and give the Chinese... submarine carriers, that no one knows about. Suddenly surfacing and disgorging aircraft everywhere.
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Mar 21, 2023 01:40
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Yooper posted:So this is kind of tangential, but China lacks the ability to project force like the US can. It doesn't have the distant basing and nuclear capable vessels that allow 11 USCSG to flex the American love muscle anywhere in the world. Yeah, the PLAN have built a ton of modern ships in the past decade, but while they're now a seriously legit bluewater navy in the way only a few other countries are they just don't have the sheer ability to get around the world like the US. This seems like a pretty good setup given those restrictions. Could also always do a scenario with like the Straits of Malacca?
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Mar 21, 2023 02:22
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Put me in one of the AEW birds, please
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Mar 21, 2023 06:14
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Yooper posted:At Nyala we have 8 Floggers led by Gradenko2000. They are rocking 1500 kg of bombs. Our only other real option is some Maverickski's, the AS-7 Kerry. But we only get 2. Big downside to this aircraft is it is day only. this is going to be really funny one way or another 
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Mar 21, 2023 06:22
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Since I don't think many people have signed up for the Real Man strike package I'll take a JH-7B seat.
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Mar 21, 2023 13:21
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Was thinking about potential scenarios and thought of a North Atlantic faceoff between the French and UK involving the Charles de Gaulle and the Queen Elizabeth in the frenzied aftermath of the Irish Unification of 2024. The Brits have had to pull their old Harrier IIs out of mothballs since the USMC F-35B's currently operating off the Liz have been recalled as the US doesn't want to have anything to do with the fight and the UK hasn't received any of their own yet, meaning the French Rafaeles aren't completely outclassed from the jump. Also, the scenario starts with a British Vanguard and French Triomphant a minute apart and on a collision course with each other while running silent.
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Mar 21, 2023 14:18
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Also, pretty sure that the Mirages are based at Abeche, Chad. I don't think there is an Achebe, Chad - it's probably just an autocorrect error to Chinua Achebe's name. Abeche is ~80/150 nm/km from the Chad-Sudan border, and ~300/550 nm/km from El Fashir. We're going to be facing the French AAE, since Chad only has 6 fixed wing combat aircraft in their entire air force, and those are SU-25s. So those Mirages are hopefully the 2000D variant from the 1990s that haven't gotten the midlife upgrades yet, which carry up to 4 of the old Magic 2 short range air to air missiles. I don't think they can carry 6 of the newer 80 km maximum range MICAs unless they've gotten the update package yet, if they can that's going to be a nasty surprise. And if they can, they're not exactly "obsolete" compared to what we have at El Fashir, especially since our MiGs are in bomb dropping loadout. Nothing we have out west match the Rafales for range, as they can carry Meteors. How long would it take to refit a large chunk of our MiG-29s to have drop tanks and max Alamo loadouts? The only thing we've got at the forward airbase are the A-5Cs, and they'd get mulched even if it's just Mirages carrying Magic 2s. Hell, they're probably at risk to decent MANPADs. habeasdorkus fucked around with this message at 15:25 on Mar 21, 2023 |
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Mar 21, 2023 15:21
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