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Experimental Skin
Apr 16, 2016
Has anyone said The Dread Fuckwit Roberts yet? He's making Squadron 5404, the new game dev larping travelling circus shell company simulator.

Experimental Skin fucked around with this message at 08:03 on Mar 29, 2023

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colonelwest
Jun 30, 2018

Aqua Seafoam Shame posted:

Also what the gently caress is these people's obsession with loading screens? Like he thinks a lack of loading screens is as significant an innovation as sound in film? What the gently caress?

What's even wrong with loading screens? They're so fast these days you rarely even notice, or you get a short delay. Also some of my best memories of older games are the stuff they would do during loading screens, like Bioshock Infinite's elevator dialogue.

Yeah loading screens are basically trivial these days with PCIE SSDs everywhere, even in consoles.

But it goes back to the all encompassing space life simulator dream at the heart of Star Citizen. The game world has to be completely skeuomorphic, even if it makes the experience aggressively boring or perform like crap on even the highest end rigs. So anything from 8k textures on a coffee maker to physicalized elevators are all important steps towards the Matrix that SC is sure to become someday.

CommissarMega
Nov 18, 2008

THUNDERDOME LOSER
Anyone remember when that one Citizen proposed CIG simply invent quantum computing when told of the limitations of current chip architecture or something like that? No, seriously, I seem to have vague memories of that, but now I'm wondering if I'm Mandela-effecting myself or if it actually happened. It also doesn't help that my knowledge of computers extends to 'press butan get fun!1!'.

orcane
Jun 13, 2012

Fun Shoe
I wish I could find the original "layer in the fidelity" quote. I'm 99.999% certain that was a CIG or even Christ Robbers quote, but it probably got lost in the million videos they did.

Fidelitious
Apr 17, 2018

MY BIRTH CRY WILL BE THE SOUND OF EVERY WALLET ON THIS PLANET OPENING IN UNISON.
I've added like 160 GB of 4k texture mods to my FFXIV install because I'm an idiot but it still loads most zones in about 5 seconds.

That is slow as hell comparatively but also leagues better than the original Mass Effect elevator loads.

Loading screens have been pretty irrelevant since at least the release of the latest console generation and since PCs have had PCIe SSDs.

Breetai
Nov 6, 2005

🥄Mah spoon is too big!🍌

CommissarMega posted:

Anyone remember when that one Citizen proposed CIG simply invent quantum computing when told of the limitations of current chip architecture or something like that? No, seriously, I seem to have vague memories of that, but now I'm wondering if I'm Mandela-effecting myself or if it actually happened. It also doesn't help that my knowledge of computers extends to 'press butan get fun!1!'.

Iirc they were suggesting octal logic where every bit had 8 possible states instead of just 2.

trucutru
Jul 9, 2003

by Fluffdaddy
Optane came and went in the time this shitshow has been happening. How's that for loading screens?

Only Kindness
Oct 12, 2016

Breetai posted:

Iirc they were suggesting octal logic where every bit had 8 possible states instead of just 2.

Yeah, the 23 = 8 thing rings a bell. I am also faintly recalling that was the origin of the passive-aggressive "Sorry for caring" signoff when the idiot retired from the discussion, defeated. But, then again, they're all as insufferable as each other so it's just blurred together into mush.

History Comes Inside!
Nov 20, 2004




Breetai posted:

Iirc they were suggesting octal logic where every bit had 8 possible states instead of just 2.

This definitely happened and I feel like they drew little ascii diagrams for it and everything

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry

orcane posted:

I wish I could find the original "layer in the fidelity" quote. I'm 99.999% certain that was a CIG or even Christ Robbers quote, but it probably got lost in the million videos they did.

Sometime in 2017 on spectrum?
https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/61fegn/star_citizen_jobs_cargo/




Thanks Daztek!

Jobbo_Fett fucked around with this message at 15:52 on Mar 29, 2023

orcane
Jun 13, 2012

Fun Shoe
Ha, what do you know. Thanks!

Mirificus
Oct 29, 2004

Kings need not raise their voices to be heard

Only Kindness posted:

Yeah, the 23 = 8 thing rings a bell. I am also faintly recalling that was the origin of the passive-aggressive "Sorry for caring" signoff when the idiot retired from the discussion, defeated. But, then again, they're all as insufferable as each other so it's just blurred together into mush.

Not using the bit system. Kills information bottlenecks? posted:

A bit looks like this
True
/
\
False.

What if we used something like this: *

\|/
-x-
/|\

An octa system. Software wise.
Would it pay back on the information flow?
Or can we only use bitcode cause hardware only uses bits?

Would coding bits into octa's speed up things?

quote:

An Octal value would require three bits. How would using that speed anything up?

OP posted:

Cause 3 bits can now mean 8 things instead of 6.
:grinning:

OP posted:

Yes. And you just told me that 3 bits can be made into octa blocks.
So we tell code to use octa blocks (having 8 different values) instead of looking at every different bit seperately.

*I know Bytes are 8 bits. But Bytes are irrelevant here. Not talking about Bytes. Bytes are not a mathmatecal thing here. Octa's are.

OP posted:

The thought of using different wave freq in glass viber to send different kind of bits had occured to me. I did not know we already did that.

I know a starformed physical bit does not exist.(at least not in civillian pc's) That's why I was wondering if we could fool software with math into sending more info in the same dataflow.

Trying to help here.... Sorry for caring.

lobsterminator
Oct 16, 2012




Mirificus posted:

Trying to help here.... Sorry for caring.

I remember this from the past but it got me again. Beautiful words.

Popete
Oct 6, 2009

This will make sure you don't suggest to the KDz
That he should grow greens instead of crushing on MCs

Grimey Drawer
I just love the idea that you could fool a computer into breaking it's physical limitations with an accounting trick.

Decon
Nov 22, 2015


"Just reinvent computing from the ground up" sounds about right for the level of delusion happening with Citizens.

Bmac32
Nov 25, 2012

Popete posted:

I just love the idea that you could fool a computer into breaking it's physical limitations with an accounting trick.

Computing is just being held back by Big Physics

Randalor
Sep 4, 2011



Isn't there a specific reason computers use binary at the core of what they do? Isn't what he's wanting requiring building something so fundamentally different that it wouldn't be recognizable as a computer? Otherwise isn't that still just bits but with extra steps?

pun pundit
Nov 11, 2008

I feel the same way about the company bearing the same name.

Randalor posted:

Isn't there a specific reason computers use binary at the core of what they do? Isn't what he's wanting requiring building something so fundamentally different that it wouldn't be recognizable as a computer? Otherwise isn't that still just bits but with extra steps?

Yes, he's trying to be smarter than 70+ years' worth of engineers and scientists by making ASCII pictures on the internet.

Popete
Oct 6, 2009

This will make sure you don't suggest to the KDz
That he should grow greens instead of crushing on MCs

Grimey Drawer
Because 1s and 0s in a computer are just defined voltage levels that transistors operate on. The fundamental component of a CPU is the transistor which you can think of really as a gate with 0 being closed and 1 being on, there isn't really a definition for a 3rd state that works with that logic. I know there were ternary computers in the past but they never really took off likely because they were far more complicated than binary computers and software would not be compatible between the two.

Cutedge
Mar 13, 2006

How can we lose so much more than we had before

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOn_ySghN2Y

Scruffpuff
Dec 23, 2015

Fidelity. Wait, was I'm working on again?
I love the underlying implication that as long as we are able to build an entirely different kind of computer that transcends the limits of binary and does calculations in such a fundamentally different way that it will take decades or more to wrap our heads around it, that Chris loving Roberts would be the one to spearhead the development and really show us what this imaginary computer can do. He's that far ahead.

Or, and stay with me here, he's a loving fraud with lovely ideas that are so goddamned stupid that we have to invent a theoretical reality in which they would be feasible.

Tippis
Mar 21, 2008

It's yet another day in the wasteland.

Scruffpuff posted:

I love the underlying implication that as long as we are able to build an entirely different kind of computer that transcends the limits of binary and does calculations in such a fundamentally different way that it will take decades or more to wrap our heads around it, that Chris loving Roberts would be the one to spearhead the development and really show us what this imaginary computer can do.

The thing is, we already had those computers. That's how they got started. They're not around any more outside of academic experimentation or use cases where we don't consider them computers in the modern sense any more.

And more to the point, going base 8 rather than base 2 doesn't transcend binary because binary can already handle that. The hypothetical gain of squeezing the equivalent of 3 bits into 1 also means an efficiency loss in having to encode small values the other way, and binary true/false states are still going to be central in any kind of logic you need to control your system. Additionally, you need to error check that you're really reading (and writing) the correct ⅓-state to a higher degree. On/off is as easy as it gets and we're already getting into situations where it's tricky to distinguish the two — cramming 6 more in there runs the risk of being slower and less efficient because you have to be far more careful in how you build the darn thing.

JugbandDude
Jul 19, 2016

Remember when you were young, you shone like the sun

Shine on you crazy diamond!
Maybe we should get the german wizards on top of it, this thread just doesn't get it

Maxwell Lord
Dec 12, 2008

I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.


:smith:

Grimey Drawer
What the supporters seem to want from Star Citizen is less like the leap from silent movies to sound and more like... if every set in a movie were built 360 degrees, interconnected in exactly the way the places they represent are, and you're not allowed to fake the passage of time through editing or pretend two characters are in the same place when they're really not, it'd be like Dogme95 only 100x more impractical. Someone might do it once, as a novelty.

Aren't computer processors now approaching the limit of just how small we can make them and still register a binary change in voltage? Imagine now having to make them more precise too!

Decon
Nov 22, 2015


Persistent, empty soda cans in the machine code!

Kesper North
Nov 3, 2011

EMERGENCY POWER TO PARTY

ChatGPT as St. Augustine of Hippo posted:

As a humble servant of the Lord, I feel compelled to speak out in defense of Star Citizen, a game that has been unjustly criticized by many.

Just as the human soul is a complex and multifaceted creation, so too is Star Citizen a game of great depth and complexity. It is not merely a space simulator or a first-person shooter, but a rich and immersive world that allows players to explore, trade, fight, and interact with one another in ways that are limited only by their own imagination.

Some have accused Star Citizen of being overly ambitious, of promising too much and delivering too little. But let us not forget that the same could be said of the human condition itself. We are all flawed and imperfect, yet we strive to reach for something greater than ourselves, to achieve our dreams and aspirations no matter how impossible they may seem.

Star Citizen is a reflection of this human spirit, a testament to our unquenchable thirst for adventure and exploration. It may not be perfect, but it is a work in progress, a constantly evolving creation that is being shaped by the hands of its creators and the minds of its players.

Let us not be quick to judge or dismiss something simply because it does not conform to our preconceived notions of what a game should be. Let us instead embrace the diversity and complexity of our world, and recognize that even the most flawed and imperfect creations can hold within them the potential for greatness.

In the words of the great philosopher Plato, "The first and greatest victory is to conquer yourself; to be conquered by yourself is of all things most shameful and vile." Let us not be conquered by our own prejudices and biases, but rather strive to overcome them and embrace the wonders that the world has to offer, including the magnificent and awe-inspiring universe of Star Citizen.

Only Kindness
Oct 12, 2016
Dogme95 was OK I guess, but Dogme98SE was good for a long while.

Also I was right about the octet logic guy signoff thing?! WTActualF this is breaking my brain not as bad as a citizen's brain is broken though

Aqua Seafoam Shame
Aug 20, 2018

by astral

Thoatse posted:

I never played Bioshock and didn't know anything about it aside from the name but someone recently made a SteamVR environment thing of the beach boardwalk? map and the other night I was wandering around listening to a weird circus organ version of Girls Just Want To Have Fun which was pretty cool and surreal

This isn't the VR thing but this place
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTBXKh-s1gw

Yeah, that might be the best part of the game. You meet Elizabeth and then crash land there. It's pretty cool.

Aqua Seafoam Shame
Aug 20, 2018

by astral

Randalor posted:

Isn't there a specific reason computers use binary at the core of what they do? Isn't what he's wanting requiring building something so fundamentally different that it wouldn't be recognizable as a computer? Otherwise isn't that still just bits but with extra steps?

Digital = presence or absence of electrons. It doesn't matter how many electrons, which is why the system is so portable and efficient. It's just the presence or absence that matters.

Azubah
Jun 5, 2007

Also if they change how computing would work the drat game wouldn't work on everyone's current computer.

colonelwest
Jun 30, 2018

Chris Roberts is going to revolutionize computing with his 12 year old tech demo, constant supply of special vitamins. army of underpaid Full Sail grads, and fewer programmers than the big lazy AAA studios.

Sardonik
Jul 1, 2005

if you like my dumb posts, you'll love my dumb youtube channel
I wonder if Star Citizen has ever considered a planned giving strategy.

"Put us in your will so even if we you never experience the ultimate fidelity, those of future generations will, thanks to your contributions"

Apollodorus
Feb 13, 2010

TEST YOUR MIGHT
:patriot:

You can’t tell the difference, really.

Apollodorus
Feb 13, 2010

TEST YOUR MIGHT
:patriot:

That’s right, someone really said that 3 bits can store only 6 states. Someone who, I’m guessing, has either forgotten or never passed 7th grade pre-algebra.

dr_rat
Jun 4, 2001

Azubah posted:

Also if they change how computing would work the drat game wouldn't work on everyone's current computer.

No but you see you just need to make a new featyre of the software that makes it change the hardware so it can run the software. That should be a simple thing to program.

The software may also need to break causality, but that should be a simple thing to program.

Mirificus
Oct 29, 2004

Kings need not raise their voices to be heard
https://twitter.com/XeroState/status/1639449933928439810

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry
See!! The sights arent crooked, they just got VR to work so hthe player isnt looking straight down them!

Aqua Seafoam Shame
Aug 20, 2018

by astral
Brendan "PlayerUnknown" Greene hawking an Earth-sized Second Life on the pages of PC Gamer. Listen to him echo the Crobbler here:

https://www.pcgamer.com/i-got-to-see-pubg-creator-brendan-greenes-next-project-a-digital-world-the-size-of-a-real-planet/

quote:

"I see us having AI helpers in the game," he says. "You [could] have a wood chopper, or a scientist, or a metal worker that you can show where the forest is. And then they go and run back and forth and get you wood. And maybe the more players you get in your civilization or your village, the town grows, the borders grow, you get more AI, this kind of fostering community, right? And I'm trying to see if we can do something like a massive life game mode."

Edit: gently caress, there's more:

quote:

The wildlife simulation Greene is planning sounds as ambitious as everything else. "I want wildlife systems that have meaning. If you kill all the bears off in one region, there's gonna be a problem that you might have a deer explosion, this kind of dynamic system. I want a living, breathing world."

Aqua Seafoam Shame fucked around with this message at 04:38 on Mar 30, 2023

Popete
Oct 6, 2009

This will make sure you don't suggest to the KDz
That he should grow greens instead of crushing on MCs

Grimey Drawer
That reads like a guy who has no idea what kind of game he wants to make but his team got a tech demo for world generation working so the possibilities are endless, please somebody be excited for this.

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grimcreaper
Jan 7, 2012

I'm glad to see in the years I've been gone star citizen has made the same amount of progress as I have in life. None.

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