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What hot hatch do you own? This poll is closed. |
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| Golf GTI / R / R32 |
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196 | 0.02% |
| Impreza WRX / STi |
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133 | 0.01% |
| Mazdaspeed 3 |
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92 | 0.01% |
| Veloster Turbo |
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20 | 0.00% |
| Focus ST |
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149 | 0.01% |
| Other Hot Hatch |
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230 | 0.02% |
| Elantra GT |
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1000001 | 99.92% |
| Total: | 1000821 votes | ||
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Apr 1, 2023 22:14
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| # ? May 22, 2024 07:31 |
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Personally I wouldn't buy a manual GTI - the auto is excellent but the manual is mediocre
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Apr 1, 2023 22:39
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I do quite enjoy the manual mk7.
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Apr 1, 2023 23:02
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The manual GTI is fine, nothing amazing, but not terrible or anything.
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Apr 1, 2023 23:13
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I’m not necessarily opposed to a GTI if it came down to it, but in the past I’ve owned a 2002 Jetta and 2008 Passat that spent a lot of time at the shop. I haven’t sworn off VAG altogether because of that but I would prefer something different.
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Apr 1, 2023 23:18
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Mk7 R
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Apr 1, 2023 23:34
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I have a manual MK8 GTI and it’s pretty much perfect for having fun both on the way to the twisties and in the twisties itself. By no means is it going to feel direct and engaging like a Honda or something, but it’s a very good, easy to use and forgiving gearbox and clutch. Plus, adaptive cruise with a manual is pretty cool - I don’t know if any other cars in the price range that offers both. I would genuinely go with a GTI if I had to do it again, it’s so infinitely useful and comfortable, but at the same time, pinning it so the front wheel pivots and scurries into a turn will never not be entertaining. My extremely hot take is I don’t even mind the touch controls - I’m pretty much used to it now.
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Apr 2, 2023 00:52
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Love my manual 7.5 GTI, zero regrets it's by far the best car I've owned.
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Apr 2, 2023 01:23
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I love my 7.5 GTI as well, but I never drive so it's still brand new. It's a 2019 with 8k miles lol. I also bought a motorcycle, so all errands that don't involve carrying things and anything that can be done on a bike is, so it gets driven even less now. It's almost paid off too, less than a year.
Rusty fucked around with this message at 02:49 on Apr 2, 2023 |
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Apr 2, 2023 02:47
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devmd01 posted:So this is the thread to convince me which hatchback to buy? Sweet. I’m in the market for a new (used) car and this time I want a manual, dammit. Never had one and I want the engagement. I know *how* to drive manual but have had very limited exposure and want to get good at it. Look at the FiST as well. You might enjoy it more enough to make the minor size tradeoff. Pain points for both are that it’s Built Ford Rough and the Recaro seats go to poo poo and split along the edges and the plastic trim along the bottom of the normal seat will probably break but at least that one is a $20 part. Your blend door actuator thing will break and make a clicking sound and you won’t be able to defog your windshield, but it’s like a $250 fix and you can DIY it. Your windshield wipers will go wonky. Your paint might be peeling. There might be rust forming in places that you will want to address quickly/relatively inexpensively. Carbon buildup. Fuel pump. You’ll probably want to budget for smaller rims, as the nice stock ones will probably feel a bit harsh anywhere with bullshit roads. The side skirts detatch with age but it’s a relatively easy fix. The Windows Infotainment system is no longer supported and the car will periodically bitch at you to perform vehicle health checks to nowhere. Version three has CarPlay/android auto but it’s kinda old, the pre-2016(17?) ones don’t do that but they do Bluetooth/USB well enough. It’s somehow less annoying than Honda’s infotainment from the same time. You might break/lose a steering wheel button like I did a few weeks ago, but AliExpress has you covered for like $10. Also I hit a pothole the other day and my lumbar support broke, and the internet tells me it’s a $500 fix that I’m not looking forward to. The shifter is only decent enough and kinda fragile/plastic-heavy in its construction. You can definitely shift it ‘too hard.’ Interior nuts and screws rust too easily. There’s a reason Ford got out of the small car game, and the Fit/Finish just isn’t there compared to equivalent Hondas and Mazdas and Toyotas (I’d say the Mazda’s durability is probably more on par tho, despite being much more “premium”). A Fit/Civic will beat the Fiesta/Focus in reliability and durability, but nothing on the car is too difficult to fix. Fortunately my local dealership also has a helpful Ford Parts counter where I can just go to the counter, ask about parts, and order them for DIY install. All told, the car is like a lover who can’t get their poo poo together and might even be debatably abusive at times, but God do they gently caress and suck you better than anybody else in the world can. I will never sell my Fiesta ST. Never never never never never. In fact, I plan to buy a second one and probably a FoST for good measure. They’re just that good to drive. These cars have a character that is unlike anything else—an American hot hatch designed by Belgians primarily for the UK and Euro market. My FiST makes me happy and manages to carve a smile on my face with an astounding frequency, literally any drive can be fun if you want it to be. Despite being FWD, Ford did witchcraft to it to make it tail-happy. The car practically begs you to dance it through turns and intersections. I literally look for excuses to drive it sometimes. If you can live with the problems and relatively cheap maintenance and don’t mind putting up with a dirt cheap interior that’s honestly fine for what it is (FWIW Ford will tell you that they had to hit the $23/25k price point and made smart investments where it matters by cheaping out on creature comforts. I’ve spent many hours in it and it’s fine, it’s a car. The new Mazdas and Hondas are definitely much more premium and luxe tho) I don’t think there are more fun hatchbacks on the road for less than $35k. DeMuro says both the FiST and FoST are “future classics”, if that matters to you. I’m inclined to agree, but I still daily mine more or less. If you can spend more than $35k get a Type R or maybe a GR Corolla. Or I guess the A-Spec Integra if you want to spend a little bit less but still too much, especially for an ugly Si hatch with sueded seats. If you can’t spend Type R money maybe look at the GTI (Mk8 and Mk7/7.5), although I chose the FiST over the Mk7 GTI because it was a way more fun (albeit less comfortable) and unique-feeling car for much less money (like $6k less). Also maybe look at the Mini Cooper S with the BMW engine that everybody raves about. Mk10 Civic hatch is there as is Mk11 Civic Sport, both are nice and have better/nicer to live with manual transmissions, but I don’t think they’re more fun for <$30k. Mk 11 Civic is gorgeous tho and very nice and grown up and comfortable, I’d just have Si/Type R envy, and you probably would too if you’re thinking FoST. Great workhorse cars that could be built into something more tho.
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Apr 2, 2023 03:14
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Any Civic Type R you can get for 35k is likely to be a basket case, proceed with caution. It's a lovely car though, and I miss it.
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Apr 2, 2023 03:16
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If gti sports weren’t more than they were when I bought one new in 2017 I’d almost definitely have one again. Such a good car.
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Apr 2, 2023 05:28
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Ok Comboomer posted:FiST poo poo There’s a lot about mine I don’t like but it’s the most fun car I’ve ever owned and I feel like it’ll be a classic in a way the Focus won’t. I picked up someone for a date and she was like “what the gently caress are these seats” and that’s good enough for me.
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Apr 2, 2023 06:03
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Ok Comboomer posted:FiST poo poo Wow, the US market FiST sounds like a loving train wreck in terms of build quality compared to the Euro-built version. Oof. I occasionally hear of blend door actuator faults in Euro versions but it seems rare compared to what US owners experience. The rest of what you’ve mentioned seems to be specific to the Mexican-built vehicles. FiST over FoST any day unless you absolutely need the bigger car, IMO.
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Apr 2, 2023 07:22
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Here4DaGangBang posted:FiST over FoST any day unless you absolutely need the bigger car, IMO. FiST is 100% the better car to drive. It’s worth paying extra to get one, compared to its big brother. I don’t like how “big” the focus felt, even on the inside. I’ve had a very nice time with my FiST so far - I’ve been daily driving it and commuting in it with zero issues. Bought it used with 85k miles in November and everything seems just fine. Ford CPO with warranty to 122k. It’s not the best-of-the-best interior but it’s an economy car with a hoot of a motor, and I’m used to that coming from the older Honda world. It’s no worse than my Fits were, and in fact the seats are more comfortable and the infotainment is massively better. I have a 2018 so it’s Sync 3 which I hear makes a big difference compared to the older models. Suspension is hard but not uncomfortable, and it handles extremely well for a stock car. I agree with OK Comboomer about going to a 15 or 16” wheel for daily duty - I swapped to 16’s immediately after purchasing the car and I’ll save the 17’s for autocross or something. Good clutch, decent shifter, easily modifiable. Mine has a Cobb Stage 1, BOV spacer (ridiculous to be honest) plus a Mishimoto exhaust and it’s just about perfectly rowdy. Still gets 34mpg consistently. Overall one of the most fun DD’s I’ve had in a long time. It would be just fine as an only car as well. Decent enough room to haul groceries or work stuff and you can fit four adults in it in relative comfort. My kids are 6’ and 5’9” currently and they can sit in the back without complaining for normal trips. 
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Apr 2, 2023 11:52
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The FiST is relatively hard to find and relatively expensive compared to the FoST but it’s a more fun car. If I were buying a new hot hatch today I’d probably skip the hatch part and buy a civic Si. (We have a wagon as well if I ever really need to haul stuff)
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Apr 2, 2023 12:53
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Here4DaGangBang posted:Wow, the US market FiST sounds like a loving train wreck in terms of build quality compared to the Euro-built version. Oof. Mine hasn’t had any of the issue Comboomer mentioned except blend door actuator and rock chips. The paint is very thin on mine. I haven’t even read about half those issues on forums or Reddit, so maybe they just got a lemon out of the bunch in terms of build quality. Blend door actuator is a real problem though. It will need to be replaced eventually
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Apr 2, 2023 14:52
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Dr. Lunchables posted:Mine hasn’t had any of the issue Comboomer mentioned except blend door actuator and rock chips. The paint is very thin on mine. The paint failing/flaking is a known Ford issue going back years. The guys at the shop I took it to after my sister clipped the wheel arch couldn’t stop talking about how many warranty jobs they’d done on Escapes/etc with the same problem I think a lot of my non-blend door issues might be the previous owner’s fault, but also they reflect just a generally cheap build and materials quality, even for an economy car of the time Like if you ever get a chance to look at the steering column on a FiST, it’s probably rusty in a non-dangerous way and they’re all like that. According to forums they all came from the factory that way Again, I’m not an automotive engineer and I don’t doubt it when Ford people say that the margins on those cars were super tight and they spent where it matters. Despite/because of being daily driver hatchbacks they are ultimately pretty niche vs the rest of Ford’s lineup To a certain extent it adds to their charm. They feel a bit rougher and simpler and therefore older than they really are, like a 2010s car doing its best impression of a late 90s/early 2000s car
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Apr 2, 2023 16:30
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Oh yeah, it’s definitely a sub-economy car, and you can tell when you’re inside it. (But you honestly will not care when you’re driving it.) I will say that even with all the cheapo plastics, the build quality issues seem to become less drastic as you get closer to the end of the model run. Having a mandatory backup camera and Sync 3 alone make it a much more liveable car than previous years. The FiST is one of those cars that enthusiasts seem to harken back to when complaining about new vehicles: physical gauges, physical buttons and knobs, easy to service, maintain and upgrade, doesn’t need a specialty drain plug wrench, and is by all metrics very reliable. You can drive it stock and have a blast or go balls out and turn it into some kind of fire breathing Lima bean.
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Apr 2, 2023 16:59
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Dr. Lunchables posted:Oh yeah, it’s definitely a sub-economy car, and you can tell when you’re inside it. (But you honestly will not care when you’re driving it.) prices actually seem more reasonable now than when I bought my 2015 in 2021 and yeah, I wish I could’ve held out for a 2017 or later but like you said, I seriously don’t care. I’m driving the car, not the infotainment unit I think I might put Bilstein B6s on it when it hits 125k, but the stock motor and tune make plenty of power for the size IMO, unless you’re driving a bunch of people around all the time I suppose. But even in top gear I still usually feel like Super Mario when I bury the gas
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Apr 2, 2023 17:29
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fknlo posted:If gti sports weren’t more than they were when I bought one new in 2017 I’d almost definitely have one again. Such a good car. coming up on 6 years and 47k mi on our 17 sport (was mine for 4.5 years now wife drives it) and it's been amazingly solid. only thing ive had to replace was the battery after about 3 years. had a customized accessport tune on engine and DSG for 4 years i love my 22 brz but it's definitely not as good of a daily driver, or as useful as our gti is. and nowhere near as quick.
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Apr 2, 2023 17:40
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I adore my Mk 7 GTI although it’s the first hot hatch I ever owned so I don’t have anything to compare it to. I’ve owned it since new and no issues at all other than wheel corrosion which I’ve just had fixed. Oh wait yes I do as my daughters bf has a Fiesta ST. It’s a 2019 model so 2 years newer than my VW but when I was a passenger in it I was really struck by how rattly it was. The cabin quality was abysmal compared to the Golf.
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Apr 2, 2023 17:44
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lol while Old Man GTI sleeps, Fiesta ST shags his daughter
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Apr 2, 2023 17:53
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monkeytennis posted:I adore my Mk 7 GTI although it’s the first hot hatch I ever owned so I don’t have anything to compare it to. I’ve owned it since new and no issues at all other than wheel corrosion which I’ve just had fixed. You’re also comparing two different (though very similar) market segments. I doubt the Focus would be different in terms of build quality (Ford lol) but it’s the more direct comparison. It’s a shame we never got the Polo. VW was, is, and always will be the king of the hot hatch market though. Nobody has topped their interior features and comfort. It’s why everyone still talks about the Golf R as being more “refined” than the Civic Type R, and I think VW has leaned into that distinction. When the time comes, I will be hard pressed to make a choice between a GR Corolla and a Golf R.
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Apr 2, 2023 18:04
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What would be a reasonable next step after an APR stage 1 engine/transmission on a GTI? The fellow doing it mentioned they have a larger turbo option that apparently is emissions compliant here. Doing nothing is also an option. I’m perfectly happy as is and may at most just opt to do summer tires instead of all seasons and do that year round as it snows at most for a week a year here.
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Apr 2, 2023 18:40
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Always tires, it's the easiest, cheapest, and often most effective upgrade you can make to a vehicle.
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Apr 2, 2023 18:42
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Ok Comboomer posted:lol while Old Man GTI sleeps, Fiesta ST shags his daughter New thread title
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Apr 2, 2023 22:11
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Warbird posted:What would be a reasonable next step after an APR stage 1 engine/transmission on a GTI? The fellow doing it mentioned they have a larger turbo option that apparently is emissions compliant here. Suspension? Have you upgraded rear sway? I did white line front control arms and rear sway and loved it. no downside other than the pita of installing the control arms.
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Apr 3, 2023 02:52
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Ok Comboomer posted:
 af friend. had mine since i bought it in 18. i cant see myself ever letting it go.
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Apr 3, 2023 14:27
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Ok Comboomer posted:Great info Thanks for all the information everyone, very helpful. The fiesta st does sound like a riot, but I do want some creature comforts like heated seats, hence looking at Focus ST3s. I thankfully don’t have to worry about car seats anymore, just boosters. I don’t see a situation where I’d be taking all three kids at once in the back either - that’s what the minivan is for. The most frequent passenger will be a 95lb dog. Lots to think about while I’m browsing listings for sure.
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Apr 3, 2023 14:38
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they do have heated seats? (recaro package) heated steering wheel however is FoST. or until i figure out how to swap one in there as its the hugest complaint for me about that car. ok maybe the shifter too but at that point im just nitpicking.
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Apr 3, 2023 15:09
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Heated steering wheel was only later FoSTs. My 2013 ST3 did not have one.
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Apr 3, 2023 15:23
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still annoyed i cant take all of the fancy UK fistyboi parts into the US version without some respectable gruntwork. putting ze german led lights on that thing was a pain in the rear end
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Apr 3, 2023 15:26
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Civic Type R seats have faulty welding and are falling apart. https://jalopnik.com/2023-honda-civic-type-r-sales-halted-over-faulty-seat-1850289070 Jalopnik frames this as some kind of cheeky quirk and not a huge safety risk, but oh well lol gotta love Honda no matter what.
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Apr 3, 2023 21:20
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TehRedWheelbarrow posted:still annoyed i cant take all of the fancy UK fistyboi parts into the US version without some respectable gruntwork. putting ze german led lights on that thing was a pain in the rear end You rang? 
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Apr 4, 2023 12:01
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.. i suppose i completely brought that on myself.
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Apr 5, 2023 12:02
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Imperador do Brasil posted:You rang? that vanity plate needs to change to Z BELGNS
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Apr 5, 2023 12:24
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Ok Comboomer posted:that vanity plate needs to change to Z BELGNS But that’s not the joke! protection from who, Tommy?
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Apr 5, 2023 14:10
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devmd01 posted:So this is the thread to convince me which hatchback to buy? Sweet. I’m in the market for a new (used) car and this time I want a manual, dammit. Never had one and I want the engagement. I know *how* to drive manual but have had very limited exposure and want to get good at it. I owned a 2016 Focus ST, wife has a 2017 Mazda 3. Both the lower trims with cloth interiors. Neither had any serious issues (I sold the ST at 60k, the 3 has 105k now). They're completely different driving experiences though considering the ST had sport suspension, 250hp turbo 4 and the Mazda is just a nice hatchback with better than average handling for the class. Last I looked FoSTs used were selling for more than I paid new ($21k in 2016) so uhhh yeah I wouldn't pay that for a 5+ year old economy car even the sporty model. But I loved the FoST. Super fun in autoX. The Fiesta was too small for me in general and also even vs. the base Focus ST, feels shittier made inside. Sitting with another grown adult in the FiST my elbow was touching theirs on the center arm rest. 250hp in the FoST is getting near the limit of what FWD can handle, especially with no LSD, and the thing was just great to throw around in the twisties. Ultimately I ended up selling it because I wanted something more adult, cursed myself with a B8.5 Audi S4 and now I'm back in an Elantra N
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Apr 5, 2023 23:26
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| # ? May 22, 2024 07:31 |
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My xB is more of a hot hatch now, just upgraded the brakes and got a matching hotchkis sway bar for the front to match the rear. Also put a strut bar on it lol. With the summer Dunlops it handles pretty drat good now, pretty happy with it.
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Apr 6, 2023 02:39
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