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Devo
Jul 9, 2001

:siren:Caught Cubs Posting:siren:
I bought the Deluxe pack last time it was on sale and it's fine I guess. The escalations are very linear for my tastes.

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Your Uncle Dracula
Apr 16, 2023
Don’t buy seven deadly sims. The costume are fine but the gameplay is experimental in a way I find doesn’t see to Hitman’s strengths.

Discendo Vox
Mar 21, 2013

This does not make sense when, again, aggregate indicia also indicate improvements. The belief that things are worse is false. It remains false.
The Deluxe escalations are quite linear but fairly nice. The Seven Deadly Sins escalations that I've played through so far (five of seven) vary from boring/simplistic(Pride) to player torture(Sloth). Not playing to the game's strengths is a massive understatement when the game explicitly tells you it is applying negative reinforcement to the act of playing it.

Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 07:14 on May 9, 2023

Nakar
Sep 2, 2002

Ultima Ratio Regum

Danger - Octopus! posted:

If you Alt-F4 out of a Showdown, will the leader be the same NPC model when you restart the Showdown?
Side note for anyone playing with Freelancer Variations: This is not necessarily true if you have different versions of the same map available, because the way the mod works, it selects the map at the time you leave for it, and if you alt-F4 out you might get a different version of the map if one is available. Time of day variations of the same map appear to not change the Suspects (so e.g. Day/Evening Ambrose should not change), but if you roll World of Tomorrow for a Sapienza showdown and then alt-F4 and end up on Landslide, the Suspects are going to change.

The_Doctor
Mar 29, 2007

"The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

I’ve never had time of day variations on Freelancer maps. :confused:

Rythian
Dec 31, 2007

You take what comes, and the rest is void.





It's a mod.

Your Uncle Dracula
Apr 16, 2023
Besides bug fixes, variance in time of day (and maybe a “blind randomize load out and mission” feature) is the only real thing I want from Freelancer.

The_Doctor
Mar 29, 2007

"The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

I’d like them to fix:
- don’t have a ‘blow up safe’ requirement on a map with no safes
- the weird overlapping vehicles as you leave the safehouse
- the whole map suddenly knowing who you are somehow

Rev. Melchisedech Howler
Sep 5, 2006

You know. Leather.

The_Doctor posted:

I’d like them to fix:
- don’t have a ‘blow up safe’ requirement on a map with no safes

The objectives are picked before you choose the mission. Not that you can always pick a mission with a safe, but the objectives aren't tied to a mission as such. There are sometimes going to be objectives that are opposed to one another too. For better or worse, t's a feature not a bug.

Goatse James Bond
Mar 28, 2010

If you see me posting please remind me that I have Charlie Work in the reports forum to do instead

kanonvandekempen posted:

Yes, everything is determined before you start the mission.

I *swear* I've had target model change, and iirc it was when I played it one day, f4ed out, and started it a couple days later. Maybe there's a date-based rng seed?

Jabor
Jul 16, 2010

#1 Loser at SpaceChem
okay but it shouldn't generate a blow-safe objective if none of the maps remaining have any safes

Ghostlight
Sep 25, 2009

maybe for one second you can pause; try to step into another person's perspective, and understand that a watermelon is cursing me



Fair, but then it also shouldn't generate any other challenge that you can't do - leading to the obvious optimum way to play to be not collecting items to begin with so it can't generate objectives using them.

Hedgehog Pie
May 19, 2012

Total fuckin' silence.
I've had another go at freelancer and it's gone a little bit better this time. This is largely down to getting the almighty sieker as a post-mission reward. I don't think I've got the hang of showdowns yet. I'd be intrigued to think what people say as the easiest/hardest showdown maps.

I like collecting the weapons and it brings back memories of doing the same in H2:SA. I'm also now starting to unlock more stuff for the safe house (again, thanking the sieker for helping complete more objectives) and I think it's really charming.

Ghostlight
Sep 25, 2009

maybe for one second you can pause; try to step into another person's perspective, and understand that a watermelon is cursing me



Personally I prefer showdowns on maps with a high amount of civilian access. Whittleton Creek and Miami are good examples, with both having secure areas but suspects that tend to have large pathing areas that take them through the public. I absolutely always avoid Haven and Ambrose because they've both hosed me with walls that NPCs can see through.

Goatse James Bond
Mar 28, 2010

If you see me posting please remind me that I have Charlie Work in the reports forum to do instead

Hedgehog Pie posted:

I've had another go at freelancer and it's gone a little bit better this time. This is largely down to getting the almighty sieker as a post-mission reward. I don't think I've got the hang of showdowns yet. I'd be intrigued to think what people say as the easiest/hardest showdown maps.

you want wide open, low density, preferably with some forced pathing through vulnerable areas

Miami is the undisputed king of showdown maps. Dartmoor, Mendoza, Sapienza, and oddly enough Dubai are pretty good, although in the case of Dubai that's probably more a factor of "generally easy maps are still easy when it's a showdown", which also boosts eg Berlin.

Marrakesh is actually a really good showdown map but if you're doing it after the first syndicate of the campaign (or in hardcore mode) there's a risk of (showdown or not) starting in Alerted Marrakesh in the horrible alley behind the school, which means you either bring in an awful lot of firepower or potentially Just Die.

really bad maps are also really bad for showdowns, although honestly i'd rather have a bangkok showdown than a bangkok regular level that rolls one or more of the really awful targets

Ghostlight posted:

Personally I prefer showdowns on maps with a high amount of civilian access. Whittleton Creek and Miami are good examples, with both having secure areas but suspects that tend to have large pathing areas that take them through the public. I absolutely always avoid Haven and Ambrose because they've both hosed me with walls that NPCs can see through.

whittledon is Good But Not Great because once you've identified the target you might just have to rubber duck them

point conceded on wonky sightlines being waaaaaay worse on showdowns than regular missions

Goatse James Bond
Mar 28, 2010

If you see me posting please remind me that I have Charlie Work in the reports forum to do instead
haven's really good for suspects that drink or eat poisonable objects, tho; trivial waiter disguise that gets you to like 80% of the poisonable objects on the map, enormous swathes of suit-friendly space

Wizard of the Deep
Sep 25, 2005

Another productive workday
My favorite for Showdowns is still Berlin. Nobody goes on the roof of the Biker's Garage (unless you lure them with a phone), there's a ton of isolated corners to deal with assassins, there's no sightlines onto the roof, and you can drop the bodies off the back into a completely undiscoverable state. And it's pretty easy to get a biker costume, depending on where you start.

The_Doctor
Mar 29, 2007

"The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

I like Haven and New York for showdowns. I can’t imagine a big sprawling map like Miami or Santa Fortuna. Whittleton conversely is too small for me.

SubponticatePoster
Aug 9, 2004

Every day takes figurin' out all over again how to fuckin' live.
Slippery Tilde

Hedgehog Pie posted:

I'd be intrigued to think what people say as the easiest/hardest showdown maps.
The easiest showdown map is the one you're best at. I personally really like WC and Mendoza. Some people like NY, which I avoid like the plague simply because I don't know it well at all. In general I'd say skip Columbia and Chonquing just because the restricted areas make up a large chunk of the map and make targets harder to get to. It blows if everyone is down in the server area/drug tunnels since even not alerted there are a lot of enforcers. I had a regular 4-target in Columbia with the choice of either SASO or SANF and it sucked because two of the targets were down in the tunnels packing drugs. It'd be doubly lovely with lookouts and assassins on top of regular enforcers (for me anyway, I'm sure there are folks here who breeze through). Showdown targets do move, but sometimes that's limited to a very small area.

Did a showdown last night on Haven, and completely broke the leader's AI. In the mansion I tried throwing a coin at the underside of the balcony area he was standing on so I could take him out in the bushes below, but it somehow got stuck on the 2" of trim on the side. He completely froze, would not move from that spot or even change how he was standing. I guess he could see the coin and wanted to pick it up but the AI couldn't path there so it basically shut down. There was an enforcer maid who stayed within about 10 feet of him at all times. Was able to Sieker her and knock another out with a coconut in between others' routes and then killed him and GTFO, but for a good 5 minutes I was like "surely he's going to move...right?"

KillHour
Oct 28, 2007


Hedgehog Pie posted:

I've had another go at freelancer and it's gone a little bit better this time. This is largely down to getting the almighty sieker as a post-mission reward.

Seiker, Kalmer and lockpick are special because there are two different versions - a regular version that is cheaper and is lost when you lose a campaign like other equipment, and a much more expensive collector's version that goes on your weapon wall and is only lost if you die with it or leave it on a mission. It is absolutely worth going for the collector's versions.

Hedgehog Pie
May 19, 2012

Total fuckin' silence.
I ask about the showdowns because Miami definitely went quite well for me, but Mendoza got a bit sticky everyone ended up congregating in the bar area, and these lookouts seem to be much better at their jobs than most Hitman guards.

Has anyone had any problems with the upstairs bathroom in New York, the one the banker goes to do coke in? I got seen through the walls in there but luckily I managed to flee pretty sharpish.

Wizard of the Deep
Sep 25, 2005

Another productive workday
As your Freelancer level increases, you'll open up more areas and variations of areas in the Safehouse. Those areas will often have respawning one-time use tools you can take with you as well. For example, once you unlock the main area of the house, you can grab a banana and a fire poker before each mission. Once the outdoors unlocks, you can get a rusty nail (one-use lockpick), a coin (occasionally), and a poison mushroom.

I'm around level 90 now, and I can take a single-use explosive, two slip hazards, a car battery, a couple of miscellaneous throwables, two poisons (either base, vial, or hypodermic), a fiber-wire (stethoscope), and probably a dozen other things I'm forgetting without touching my toolboxes or wall weapons.

Because I'm not constantly buying weapons, I've got ~2.5m Merces too, so I could start buying poo poo up again and clean out couriers every mission.

Freelancer starts pretty slow, but once you get rolling and reestablish your tools, it gets a lot easier and more fun.

Beyond the novelty of new targets, I actually like Freelancer more because now I can take a bunch of fun stuff in, instead of just four items, one of which is a pistol and one is hidden somewhere on the map.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?

Ran into another ridiculous bug and IOI should be ashamed of themselves.

  • So because I did a ton of early showdowns in Miami, I still haven't hit the "kill 50 on this map" challenge for that one location, the only one in the game I haven't gotten yet. But I'm close, 46/50. That's it, I just need to kill four more people in Miami and I've got it done.
  • So off I go to Paris, and I kill a target there.... but my Miami counter doesn't go up. Weird, but surely just a one off.
  • I complete the syndicate and select the next one, now since I still need 4 in Miami, I make sure to pick a syndicate that includes the city I need: Paris.
  • Got to Paris again, kill two targets... neither registers for my Miami numbers! What the gently caress!?!
  • Finish the syndicate, pick the next, make sure that I find one with Paris in it so I can get those Miami numbers up.... oh COME ON I just killed like four people in Paris and my Miami number still hasn't gone up! IOI what the hell is wrong with you, how many people do I have to kill in Paris before you finally trigger the Miami map as completed?
  • Huh, went to finish the Syndicate and my Miami counter finally went up on one of the last levels, which is in Miam..... :stare:
  • :cripes:



  • :negative:
  • :shepicide:

Ripper Swarm
Sep 9, 2009

It's not that I hate it. It's that I loathe it.
Ah, there's Sheikh Salman Al-Ghazali, who of course I know is present here on Hitman's Miami map.

Weird that Hector Delgado isn't with him, but perhaps Hector simply got lost in this palatial Miami mansion, filled with art and artifacts of notable Miami resident Napoleon Bonaparte?

The_Doctor
Mar 29, 2007

"The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

The Palais de M’Iami is one of the most sumptuous in all of Paris Miami.

Picayune
Feb 26, 2007

cannot be unseen
Taco Defender

Wizard of the Deep posted:

My favorite for Showdowns is still Berlin. Nobody goes on the roof of the Biker's Garage (unless you lure them with a phone), there's a ton of isolated corners to deal with assassins, there's no sightlines onto the roof, and you can drop the bodies off the back into a completely undiscoverable state. And it's pretty easy to get a biker costume, depending on where you start.

I had a lookout spawn on the roof of the Biker's Garage during a showdown once (which makes sense, since they can see pretty well from up there) but he was alone so I just choked him out and left him.

Rev. Melchisedech Howler
Sep 5, 2006

You know. Leather.

Jerusalem posted:

Ran into another ridiculous bug and IOI should be ashamed of themselves.


I reread the first two steps several times as I thought I was having a severe reading comprehension issue before realising what was going on

Dabir
Nov 10, 2012

Ghostlight posted:

Fair, but then it also shouldn't generate any other challenge that you can't do - leading to the obvious optimum way to play to be not collecting items to begin with so it can't generate objectives using them.

No, just the safes one. Not having kit is a you problem, the game generating no safes is completely out of your control. The best you could do is leave maps with safes till last in case a blow safe prestige pops up, but that doesn't help in situations where the game will happily generate an entire syndicate with no safes between them and still ask you to get cracking.

Red Oktober
May 24, 2006

wiggly eyes!



Dabir posted:

No, just the safes one. Not having kit is a you problem, the game generating no safes is completely out of your control. The best you could do is leave maps with safes till last in case a blow safe prestige pops up, but that doesn't help in situations where the game will happily generate an entire syndicate with no safes between them and still ask you to get cracking.

A simple solution for this one would be to force at least one safe to be generated for each block of missions. That way you can choose to leave it in case of an objective as above.

Ghostlight
Sep 25, 2009

maybe for one second you can pause; try to step into another person's perspective, and understand that a watermelon is cursing me



showdown: miami

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZisktcW9Pg

Mierenneuker
Apr 28, 2010


We're all going to experience changes in our life but only the best of us will qualify for front row seats.

Steps: the true nemesis of every modern hitman.







I'm talking about the British pop group ofc

Mierenneuker fucked around with this message at 11:48 on May 10, 2023

Hedgehog Pie
May 19, 2012

Total fuckin' silence.
Can someone please remind me how prestige objectives work? Are they an all or nothing deal? I've not been bothering with them for this exact reason.

Mierenneuker posted:

Steps: the true nemesis of every modern hitman.







I'm talking about the British pop group ofc

THAT is Ian Watkins 47, also known as "H" to distinguish himself from an infamous pedophile.

Discendo Vox
Mar 21, 2013

This does not make sense when, again, aggregate indicia also indicate improvements. The belief that things are worse is false. It remains false.
Party in the city where the heat is on
All night on the beach till the break of dawn

Mierenneuker
Apr 28, 2010


We're all going to experience changes in our life but only the best of us will qualify for front row seats.

Hedgehog Pie posted:

Can someone please remind me how prestige objectives work? Are they an all or nothing deal? I've not been bothering with them for this exact reason.

THAT is Ian Watkins 47, also known as "H" to distinguish himself from an infamous pedophile.

Normally they are an objective with a big payout. You can do them to earn more money, you can fail them and get no extra cash, you can even decide to not choose one at all(although the game will remind you that you didn't pick one before you leave your safehouse).

On hardcore mode, you will fail the entire campaign if you don't complete or fail the prestige objective before you leave a map.

Mierenneuker fucked around with this message at 14:00 on May 10, 2023

Jabor
Jul 16, 2010

#1 Loser at SpaceChem

Hedgehog Pie posted:

Can someone please remind me how prestige objectives work? Are they an all or nothing deal? I've not been bothering with them for this exact reason.

If you're in a normal campaign then just pick one, it doesn't matter if you fail it and it's free money if you complete it. The only risk is that you'll get in over your head and gently caress it all up trying to complete the prestige objective instead of just doming someone and bailing.

If you're in a hardcore campaign then you must pick a prestige objective and it's a campaign fail if you don't complete it.

Basebf555
Feb 29, 2008

The greatest sensual pleasure there is is to know the desires of another!

Fun Shoe

That's the thing with Miami, the targets just mosey on through these secluded hallways and little back rooms and there's always a ton of opportunities to take them out quietly. And it's definitely best to just go straight for that Security disguise just to make sure you can easily follow them through those areas.

Blowjob Overtime
Apr 6, 2008

Steeeeriiiiiiiiike twooooooo!

Jabor posted:

The only risk is that you'll get in over your head and gently caress it all up trying to complete the prestige objective instead of just doming someone and bailing.

Psh, I can get in over my head and gently caress it all up trying to complete regular objectives, not just prestige ones.

Danger - Octopus!
Apr 20, 2008


Nap Ghost

Basebf555 posted:

That's the thing with Miami, the targets just mosey on through these secluded hallways and little back rooms and there's always a ton of opportunities to take them out quietly. And it's definitely best to just go straight for that Security disguise just to make sure you can easily follow them through those areas.

Every single time I do a Miami showdown, I forget that some of the secluded body disposal areas are also where suspects path through. Sometimes it's the leader who arrives at an inopportune moment so it works out ok tho

Maximum Tomfoolery
Apr 12, 2010

Yo, gently caress Colorado.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1081823202512207975/1106010587768573952/2023-05-10_19-08-08.mp4

I can even handle this map Alerted but not when it keeps giving me the loving water tower start.

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Devo
Jul 9, 2001

:siren:Caught Cubs Posting:siren:
Looks like an easy 1,000M to me

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