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I'm really pessimistic about the impact of flatscreen to VR ports in general, even the games that went out of their way to do it purposefully haven't made much of an impact, let alone ones that are done "automatically." Ultimately people just want to play flatscreen games in flatscreen, for the most part.
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May 9, 2023 02:24
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Some flatscreen games translate to VR bit I’d argue any good VR game is terrible if forced into flatscreen. How are you gonna play gorilla tag with keyboard and mouse on a monitor
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May 9, 2023 02:29
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Lemming posted:I'm really pessimistic about the impact of flatscreen to VR ports in general, even the games that went out of their way to do it purposefully haven't made much of an impact, let alone ones that are done "automatically." Ultimately people just want to play flatscreen games in flatscreen, for the most part. Oh absolutely in most cases but there are times it works out, and I'd argue that a heap of FPS style games would be good ports if the time was taken for them. Look at things like the serious sam games. Yeah yeah stick loco, but still, they play incredibly well and feel pretty good for what amounts to be a copy pasta port + motion controls. I think more games could do that, if the incentive was there. I get why teams don't, its not quick work. But if something like that plugin gives people/devs a chance to kinda just flip a switch and "see" it, maybe itll motivate more of them to just "make a vr port" or motivate someone to just go ahead and make a mod or something. ofc the real world needs legit ports and not hacks but whatever in some cases ya know? Thats without even thinking about platformers and stuff. I personally love the idea of "3d vr" versions of lots of "3d" and or third person games. idk thats optimistic me.
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May 9, 2023 02:39
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I didn't mean to imply it was as easy as flipping a switch to make a playable VR game, I did say "almost making it easier overall" with the implication that it would be more feasible to create a game in both platforms rather than needing to do both from scratch. It was also a question because I am not sure of the impact UE actual has, just that I have seen it mentioned from time to time! If my question caused any grief I am sorry, was not my intent.
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May 9, 2023 02:39
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Also at a basic requirement the optimisation thresholds are very different between VR and desktop. For the same spec you've got much less room to play with for fancy effects, object count, etc. There's also cutscene direction to consider as well, because you can't arbitrarily throw the player around in VR the way you can in a flatscreen game.
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May 9, 2023 02:39
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Beve Stuscemi posted:Some flatscreen games translate to VR bit I’d argue any good VR game is terrible if forced into flatscreen. By not being a gorilla. Given that most VR games are bound to the same kind of static 3D worldspace as flat games (unless they're pulling some severe nonsense) the issue is less that the space is not compatible and more that the way you interact with it isn't. Instead of trying to spread filler into an impossibly large gap, you can instead embrace it and see the different access points as distinct avatars rather than an alternate control system. This is a lot of extra work, and game design Nightmare mode, but it's not impossible.
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May 9, 2023 02:39
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Super Foul Egg posted:By not being a gorilla. This is pure scope creep and the hallmark of bad project management. You're asking for a whole second game to be built atop the original game.
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May 9, 2023 02:41
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Beve Stuscemi posted:Some flatscreen games translate to VR bit I’d argue any good VR game is terrible if forced into flatscreen. Over my dead body is how Edit: Super Foul Egg posted:By not being a gorilla. Yeah, I don't think it's necessarily impossible or even a bad idea to be able to interface with players in VR through another medium, but that's essentially a completely new game on its own, not a port or alternate control scheme for the existing game. To that point I think Rec Room is a great example of this done poorly - because the players in the non-VR formats have to have feature parity with VR, what ends up happening is the VR stuff will get crowded out (because it's the smaller platform) until it's just a flatscreen game with some optional VR features. Barf Lemming fucked around with this message at 02:46 on May 9, 2023 |
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May 9, 2023 02:41
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Neddy Seagoon posted:This is pure scope creep and the hallmark of bad project management. You're asking for a whole second game to be built atop the original game. It's a reference to asynchronous play using the game mentioned as the example, not a roadmap. Lemming posted:Yeah, I don't think it's necessarily impossible or even a bad idea to be able to interface with players in VR through another medium, but that's essentially a completely new game on its own, not a port or alternate control scheme for the existing game. To that point I think Rec Room is a great example of this done poorly - because the players in the non-VR formats have to have feature parity with VR, what ends up happening is the VR stuff will get crowded out (because it's the smaller platform) until it's just a flatscreen game with some optional VR features. Barf Rec Room is just one of the many games that went all-in on VR and then realised once the vertical line started to curve they were going to need monitors after all, and that kind of implementation always feels awful to the flatscreener and robs the 4D hat wearer of a responsive user to play with. Nobody wins but the 'current players' chart. The real examples are mostly still proof of concept 'experiences' like the PSVR minigame where the VR wearer is the giant dinosaur and the players are all smaller characters on-screen, and another game that tried a similar thing on PC (but the name escapes me). You have to do it from the start, and design around the very different feature sets available to both sides. Personally I think that all flatscreen players in VR should be required by law to be represented by identical Moai statues that can't do anything but slide around.
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May 9, 2023 02:59
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is there any reason why Resident Evil 4 VR would suddenly start to have slowdown every time it's started up? every other game works fine as normal.
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May 9, 2023 04:56
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EbolaIvory posted:Yeah, So I'm actually publishing a game, working with a dev team, and am quite familiar with how things work. I also went to college for programming, have been building PCs and networks for 30 or so years, and have been in the VR scene long enough to literally know everyone. So yeah, I might know a couple things. I don't care about this debate because it's super dumb and boring, but I have worked as a 3d artist in the games industry for 15 years, so I am also omnipotent towards all human concepts as well. Flatscreen games don't really make for super compelling, impactful VR games anyway and I'm looking forward to the industry getting away from them as a crutch.
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May 9, 2023 06:23
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mutata posted:
Yeah i'm not really disagreeing with this part. Some genres tend to work better on a generic scale than others, and doing it right means doing it right and like actually making it an experience. Def not my argument.  I just think its awesome and good for the industry something like this already exists and will only get better over time. I also think itll motivate some teams to look into VR closer for their titles and we may see some cool things transition from a flat game into a vr mod, then maybe they make "a vr game". Yeah pipe dreams I know.
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May 9, 2023 07:17
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King Vidiot posted:I haven't played H3VR in a while, and when I did it was Index, but why did the creator decide to make movement with the Quest 2 controllers a toggle that you have to activate with a button? And why did he bury the explanation for it on a random menu on the intro scene? For what it's worth, there is now a streamlined control mode that works pretty well with the Quest 2 controllers, being much less clunky. It's outlined here.
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May 9, 2023 10:13
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Super Foul Egg posted:It's a reference to asynchronous play using the game mentioned as the example, not a roadmap. Carly and the Reaperman is a good example of the concept, one person controls a person via flatscreen and controller and does platforms, the other is in VR and is a giant floating skull and hands and uses motion controls to move stuff and help the other person. Very fun game to play with a partner.
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May 9, 2023 15:54
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Nanohahn posted:For what it's worth, there is now a streamlined control mode that works pretty well with the Quest 2 controllers, being much less clunky. It's outlined here.  Yeah, I didn't even think to do that. I didn't like the streamlined controls when they were first introduced, when I had an Index, because I liked how grognardy it was to have access to every weird, fiddly little feature of certain guns. But I really mostly just use the eject clip/magazine/cylinder feature, cocking the hammer and switching the fire mode.
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May 9, 2023 16:22
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Beve Stuscemi posted:Some flatscreen games translate to VR bit I’d argue any good VR game is terrible if forced into flatscreen. The only game I can think of that was originally planned for VR but also has a really solid flatscreen implementation is Derail Valley (which has their new major update coming out soon). But a vehicle simulator like that is sort of in its own class.
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May 9, 2023 17:14
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Beve Stuscemi posted:Some flatscreen games translate to VR bit I’d argue any good VR game is terrible if forced into flatscreen. all cockpit games are VR games forced into flatscreen  e;fb with derail valley
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May 9, 2023 17:31
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Budget Cuts 1+2 for Q2 + PSVR2 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-5kWryaraA edit: speaking of pc games porting to VR.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0yRcnVmGxc Looks nice! Turin Turambar fucked around with this message at 17:51 on May 9, 2023 |
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May 9, 2023 17:33
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I would like every top down 3rd person whatever you call it style of game to be VRed. Give me Divinity in Demeo style now. Civilization. StarCraft. gently caress it, FTL. All of em.
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May 9, 2023 17:51
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Walkabout mini golf is the one goons have been raving about, right? I got a $10 credit on the quest store and it's on sale. Any more native games I should look at? Not sure of the split between native or steam beat saber but it definitely doesn't look like a straight wireless connection through airplay will cut it.
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May 9, 2023 22:00
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Parallelwoody posted:Walkabout mini golf is the one goons have been raving about, right? I got a $10 credit on the quest store and it's on sale. Any more native games I should look at? Not sure of the split between native or steam beat saber but it definitely doesn't look like a straight wireless connection through airplay will cut it. Yes walkabout is great. Especially the sad float away when someone misses an easy putt Beat Saber wired link is best for latency.
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May 9, 2023 22:09
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Parallelwoody posted:Walkabout mini golf is the one goons have been raving about, right? I got a $10 credit on the quest store and it's on sale. Any more native games I should look at? Not sure of the split between native or steam beat saber but it definitely doesn't look like a straight wireless connection through airplay will cut it. I mean, until you get to the higher end of beat saber, like, custom pp maps or whatever. Wireless is honestly fine.
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May 9, 2023 22:21
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I can't play robo recall without it turning into a stuttering mess that takes several seconds to render a screen, so I don't think it is.
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May 10, 2023 00:16
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Bad Munki posted:I would like every top down 3rd person whatever you call it style of game to be VRed. Give me Divinity in Demeo style now. Civilization. StarCraft. gently caress it, FTL. All of em. I find it deeply disappointing that I still can't play Civilization in VR by rotating a big globe around.
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May 10, 2023 01:51
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Roadie posted:I find it deeply disappointing that I still can't play Civilization in VR by rotating a big globe around. Oh poo poo, yes please.
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May 10, 2023 01:52
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Now I just want original X-Com in VR Place bases, intercept UFOs, and slide around little plastic men like I'm playing 40K or something.
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May 10, 2023 06:34
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King Vidiot posted:
I was reluctant to try it for the very same reason, but I did and never looked back. I think these were added later, but you can do stuff like quickbolting and slide locking as well. I find there's not much reason to go back to the old controls, apart from not being able to do some of the exotic stuff.
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May 10, 2023 06:55
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Tabor in a nutshell. https://www.youtube.com/clip/Ugkxt7nrvcQTFjlrBBYbrWA_ontp6qqIheJ1
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May 10, 2023 08:06
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It seems the pvp mode will be another (paid?) game https://twitter.com/DemeoGame/status/1655950895778263042
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May 10, 2023 09:38
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mutata posted:I don't care about this debate because it's super dumb and boring, but I have worked as a 3d artist in the games industry for 15 years, so I am also omnipotent towards all human concepts as well. Yeah, I enjoyed the HL2 VR mod but it doesn't hold a candle to Alyx. Parallelwoody posted:Walkabout mini golf is the one goons have been raving about, right? I got a $10 credit on the quest store and it's on sale. Any more native games I should look at? Not sure of the split between native or steam beat saber but it definitely doesn't look like a straight wireless connection through airplay will cut it. Eleven Table Tennis is insanely good at what it does.
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May 10, 2023 19:17
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port the dark engine over to oculus imo. would love to play thief and play the levels that still hold up as pretty scary even though its 1999 graphics
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May 10, 2023 20:00
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I completely understand the opinion on flatscreen to VR conversions, and this wouldn't be the first videogame opinion I've had that's incredibly far from the norm (like, I like grinding in RPGs, just love sitting there beating up poo poo for hours watching numbers go up, it's very zen to me) But flatscreen to VR conversions have been some of my absolute favorite VR games to play. It's really what keeps me in VR. Mostly because, I think, flatscreen games are just overall a more massive experience and come closer to my dream of VR games being other worlds you hop into. Even though it's not a mod but an official release (though it's not any better than a mod, and it relies on VR specific mods to be good) Skyrim VR is the single VR game I've put the most hours into, by a lot. Completing all the quests in VR was such a massive undertaking that got so deep it really completely felt like being in another world far enough into it. Having familiarity with the world before but now being in it, just climbing up a mountain I've been to before but this time just sitting there looking around, peak VR experience. I enjoyed the Talos Principle in VR more than the flatscreen version, though it's an older conversion with some problems. Similarly for the original Half Life, there's familiarity but now I'm actually in it. Doom 3 is not a great flatscreen game, but it gets so much more in VR. What was just dark and boring is now legitimately scary. For the most part it feels like an actual VR game (besides cutscene stuff which is annoying), like if flatscreen Doom 3 never came out and this was released just as a VR game I'd think we would all be saying it was one of the better VR games. Everything needs a VR mod. VR mods give more life to VR as a whole that's hard to get from the smaller quick VR games out there. The larger, more premium VR games are few and far in between at times. Games like Alyx or Lone Echo are better in that everything's tuned to AI, but how many of those games do we actually have? I keep meaning to give No Man's Sky in VR a shot because it seems very much like something I'd be into. But I think to get the best experience out of that I need a HOTAS or something?
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May 10, 2023 23:39
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My favorite VR games have also been flatscreen to VR mods. Native VR games can be experimental and cool, even if they're often half baked. But playing RE2 and Outer Wilds in VR was an unforgettable experience for me. Regarding NMS, I only played it a few hours. It was fun, and I can see myself getting into it once my buddy gets his PC set up so we can co-op. The VR implementation could be better, though. A bunch of the UI doesn't move with you when you physically turn, which isn't a problem if you turn with a stick, I guess. Flying with VR controls is bad. My old Thrustmaster won't work with my current PC for some reason, so I just used an xbox controller. It worked well enough during the tutorial flights.
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May 11, 2023 00:14
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Cyberpunk 2077 is my most favorite flat to VR game I've played, but I also just really liked the game when it first came out and dodged all the buggy issues that plagued most people so I was biased to like it from the start. Even though the experience is sitting in a chair in the center of my playspace, holding a controller in my hands and playing it that way. Super compelling and really excellent!
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May 11, 2023 00:32
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Roadie posted:I find it deeply disappointing that I still can't play Civilization in VR by rotating a big globe around. This is an extremely good idea. Most of the strategy/management games I've played in VR have frankly been an ergonomic disaster because they force you to stare at the ground with a weight on your face. I think that's going to be a design hurdle for this sort of game. The typical rts top down perspective makes less sense in a VR space. Either you put it on the ground and risk making your game uncomfortable to play or you cheat the perspective and in the VR space it looks like your units are walking up and down a wall like insects. I guess shrinking things down to board game scale is an option, too, but I haven't seen many games take that route. But now I wonder: would an ant farm style game translate a bit more naturally to VR? Has anyone done that? Riatsala fucked around with this message at 03:21 on May 11, 2023 |
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May 11, 2023 03:18
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Bondematt posted:Now I just want original X-Com in VR Or even a Black and White game where you can praise or punish your avatar and such
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May 11, 2023 03:25
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Black & White is already 90% of the way there. The cursor is literally a hand and the UX is very diegetic with an emphasis on gesture input.
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May 11, 2023 04:04
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Steamvr is hosed, I have a reverb g2 and whenever a game is launched it closes steam so I have no access to the overlay. Anyone else experiencing this? Thread on steam suggested using the oculus win7/8 beta channel but I haven’t tried it yet
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May 11, 2023 04:25
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Turin Turambar posted:It always surprises me how loyal are some HTC Vive users! Oh hey that's me! %80 of my time in VR has been playing beat saber and the og vive does that just fine. Recently though I've had the urge to get a newer headset, mostly for driving and flying sims, but also to try some of the other games that have come out in the past 3-4 years. The PC VR headset market seems to be in a pretty bad spot though. From what I can tell most PC specific headsets are either janky, ridiculously expensive, have some sort of major flaw, or in the case of the index getting kind of old. Everything else is being marketed as a more casual experience, or is part of whatever kind of cyberhell the metaverse is. A this point I think I'll just wait and hope the Deckard comes out sometime soon.
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May 11, 2023 08:11
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KodiakRS posted:I think I'll just wait and hope the Deckard comes out sometime soon. i was doing this until recently then i just bought a pico 4. it's probably cheaper than deckard is going to be, and plays some insanely good games natively, and for everything else you have alvr/virtual desktop
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May 11, 2023 14:06
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