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MF_James
May 8, 2008
I CANNOT HANDLE BEING CALLED OUT ON MY DUMBASS OPINIONS ABOUT ANTI-VIRUS AND SECURITY. I REALLY LIKE TO THINK THAT I KNOW THINGS HERE

INSTEAD I AM GOING TO WHINE ABOUT IT IN OTHER THREADS SO MY OPINION CAN FEEL VALIDATED IN AN ECHO CHAMBER I LIKE

If you don't want to be stuck with the broken UI changes, you need to use a "custom" UI.

You don't even need to use an actual custom UI, just create a second copy of the default UI folder (obviously it will be named differently), load that as your UI and it will not use the dumb broken garbage they pushed to live.

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Waroduce
Aug 5, 2008

Coolnezzz posted:

I think I've gotten bored of Mischief after a month and I'm kind of interested in seeing how much of a shitshow Oakwynd is going to be. I feel out of my element playing on any EQ server post-PoP, even though the no-drop and loot rules of Mischief are really enjoyable for me. I wish I had stuck with it when it first released instead of trying it out now.

Will probably end up 6-boxing on Oakwynd next week, probably my usual group makeup of SK/SHM/BRD/DRU/MAG/MAG. I've always run a classic "holy trinity" group makeup when boxing but am curious about other group makeups. Maybe main an enchanter with a cleric/bard/other caster boxes and no tank? Not sure how that would go, does anyone else run a non-tank/non-standard based box group?

Pet groups are super strong and usually very fast. I mained a bard while my friend mained a chanter. We were a pretty dangerous duo but we befriended a cleric/enchanter boxer in like Mistmoore who we ended up grinding through low 40's with before we went to the hole. You really only need the cleric/enchanter duo to be a leveling powerhouse though. Where you level is largely dictated by the chanter pet since it does insane damage in classic. You move as the enchanter or mage can get better pets. Pet tanks everything, use snares/root if the cleric pulls heal aggro. If you level where undead are like unrest and mistmoore and guk the cleric is pretty viable damage too i think. Some people like slotting a pally in for heals/rez.

It can be a bit annoying to pull and keep an eye on pet breaks and health bars though. You can fill this out as you like but a bard to lull, pull, sing and give you an extra mezz button is nice. How deep you get with the bard vs set it and forget it melody + autoattack is up to you. I main bard and I enjoy pulling group content so the cleric/enc boxer and my friend could just do caster things and mezz the +1/2's I'd serve up on the exp train. The bard also offers nice quick CC on enchanter pets.

I recall this group comp from this video being pretty interesting even if you aren't rushing. The first maybe 2mins is about the group comp.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fx03DmHD5zI
Cleric, Enchanter, Mage, Mage, Necro, free slot

Usually the free slot is your puller. Bard is super strong for regen, run speed, and very fast pulling. Mage/Enchanter good for more damage. If you want a taunt button SK is pretty good and can pull too.

I might roll a monk or pally. Those seem interesting...maybe box w/ a bard/shaman/wizzy or something to give that a shot. I've heard Monk/Shaman is a really easy starter set up.

I'd be open to some launch weekend grouping though, its always more fun with people and I wouldn't mind just doing a single character either.

diapermeat
Feb 10, 2009

Coolnezzz posted:

I think I've gotten bored of Mischief after a month and I'm kind of interested in seeing how much of a shitshow Oakwynd is going to be. I feel out of my element playing on any EQ server post-PoP, even though the no-drop and loot rules of Mischief are really enjoyable for me. I wish I had stuck with it when it first released instead of trying it out now.

Will probably end up 6-boxing on Oakwynd next week, probably my usual group makeup of SK/SHM/BRD/DRU/MAG/MAG. I've always run a classic "holy trinity" group makeup when boxing but am curious about other group makeups. Maybe main an enchanter with a cleric/bard/other caster boxes and no tank? Not sure how that would go, does anyone else run a non-tank/non-standard based box group?

I've had great success with SK/SHM/Bard/Monk/Monk/Monk. Once you get monk epic's your dps is awesome, and super easy to position an all melee group/don't have to worry about range.

Shartweek
Feb 15, 2003

D O E S N O T E X I S T

Malaria posted:

I also really don't think Oakwynd will be a poo poo show. It's looking the FTE stuff is basically gonna be working. Shouldn't be that bad. The sever has some cool rules too, with character based instead of account based AoC lockouts.

I'm gonna 4 box a team of Paladin(main) and Bard/Druid/Mage. Will probably roll a SK later on the account with the Paladin for sharing heriloom raid stuff.

I hope it's not a shitshow but I really don't have much faith in their ability to not screw things up.

FWIW I really enjoyed playing a paladin for my tank when I did back on Mangler. I felt it was just as good at pulling and maintaining aggro as my SK was during classic, it's just not as good at pulling as an SK because of FD.

MF_James posted:

If you don't want to be stuck with the broken UI changes, you need to use a "custom" UI.

Cool, I do run a custom UI on my main box and mostly noticed the garbage on my other machines, I'll have to do this. Thanks!

Waroduce posted:

Pet groups are super strong and usually very fast. I mained a bard while my friend mained a chanter. We were a pretty dangerous duo but we befriended a cleric/enchanter boxer in like Mistmoore who we ended up grinding through low 40's with before we went to the hole. You really only need the cleric/enchanter duo to be a leveling powerhouse though. Where you level is largely dictated by the chanter pet since it does insane damage in classic. You move as the enchanter or mage can get better pets. Pet tanks everything, use snares/root if the cleric pulls heal aggro. If you level where undead are like unrest and mistmoore and guk the cleric is pretty viable damage too i think. Some people like slotting a pally in for heals/rez.

It can be a bit annoying to pull and keep an eye on pet breaks and health bars though. You can fill this out as you like but a bard to lull, pull, sing and give you an extra mezz button is nice. How deep you get with the bard vs set it and forget it melody + autoattack is up to you. I main bard and I enjoy pulling group content so the cleric/enc boxer and my friend could just do caster things and mezz the +1/2's I'd serve up on the exp train. The bard also offers nice quick CC on enchanter pets.

I recall this group comp from this video being pretty interesting even if you aren't rushing. The first maybe 2mins is about the group comp.
snip
Cleric, Enchanter, Mage, Mage, Necro, free slot

Usually the free slot is your puller. Bard is super strong for regen, run speed, and very fast pulling. Mage/Enchanter good for more damage. If you want a taunt button SK is pretty good and can pull too.

I might roll a monk or pally. Those seem interesting...maybe box w/ a bard/shaman/wizzy or something to give that a shot. I've heard Monk/Shaman is a really easy starter set up.

I'd be open to some launch weekend grouping though, its always more fun with people and I wouldn't mind just doing a single character either.

Yeah I've always liked the "passive" dps of pet heavy groups and not having to worry about positioning melee. I had a group on Mangler with an enchanter box charming and setup macros to quickly AE stun, quick mez, malo, heal the enchanter, and re-charm when charm breaks that worked pretty well, my main issue with charm pets is needing to be always on the ready in case charm breaks. I like to be able to afk or have the EQ window in the background while watching a video or looking something up and not having to worry about a charm break. I watched Zaide's video and he does have totally valid points about the enchanter (and possibly 2 enchanters) but he is grouping with actual people and not boxing so they can handle charm breaks much more easily.

Completely agreed that playing with others is way more fun than not doing so, I'd be up for some grouping!

diapermeat posted:

I've had great success with SK/SHM/Bard/Monk/Monk/Monk. Once you get monk epic's your dps is awesome, and super easy to position an all melee group/don't have to worry about range.

My current group on Mischief is SK/SHM/BRD with a monk, rogue, and ranger for DPS and I kind of regret not doing 3 monks due to having to position for the rogue and the ranger not being at its best without actively casting spells. I think a 3 monk group would be my second choice after DRU/MAG/MAG as I like having a porter.

MF_James
May 8, 2008
I CANNOT HANDLE BEING CALLED OUT ON MY DUMBASS OPINIONS ABOUT ANTI-VIRUS AND SECURITY. I REALLY LIKE TO THINK THAT I KNOW THINGS HERE

INSTEAD I AM GOING TO WHINE ABOUT IT IN OTHER THREADS SO MY OPINION CAN FEEL VALIDATED IN AN ECHO CHAMBER I LIKE

If you're boxing a bunch of characters, I'd just do mages then if you don't want to deal with charming.

Waroduce
Aug 5, 2008
I made a little personal server back in the day for eq grouping on yelinak launch. Seems like we have some interest in the thread so I cleaned it out and tided it up a bit

maybe we can use it for shenanigans over launch weekend

xxx Discord exists xxx

Waroduce fucked around with this message at 00:12 on May 20, 2023

Shartweek
Feb 15, 2003

D O E S N O T E X I S T

Waroduce posted:

I made a little personal server back in the day for eq grouping on yelinak launch. Seems like we have some interest in the thread so I cleaned it out and tided it up a bit

maybe we can use it for shenanigans over launch weekend

https://discord.gg/xD38J4yfWY

We also have an EQ TLP Goons Discord which was used a lot during the Mangler and Selos eras.

https://discord.gg/ADPhVtZtq6

I'm up for doing a static group, I'll probably roll multiple characters, one set to play with you and others and another set during times where no one is available to play, since the server is encouraging alts on the same accounts. Either Discord would be fine and maybe we can get some others to join if anyone is interested!

Waroduce
Aug 5, 2008

Coolnezzz posted:

We also have an EQ TLP Goons Discord which was used a lot during the Mangler and Selos eras.

https://discord.gg/ADPhVtZtq6

I'm up for doing a static group, I'll probably roll multiple characters, one set to play with you and others and another set during times where no one is available to play, since the server is encouraging alts on the same accounts. Either Discord would be fine and maybe we can get some others to join if anyone is interested!

oh i didn't know this existed ill jump in here than if this is where the goons are!

xZAOx
Sep 6, 2004
PORKCHOP SANDWICHES
I wanted to dust off my phinny bard (105, broken mirror bored me to death and that's when I quit). I figure my only option is to learn how to box.

Seems like MQ is the way to go. I got it logging in two new characters, got some of the basic plugins working.

But for the stuff to play your characters without having to set them up yourself, seems like the answer these days is kissassist macro, which is from a RedGuides sub? I know you can get mq for free, but is there a free kissassist or something comparable?

If you do sub to RG, what happens when your sub is out? Does your poo poo still work, just you won't get updates (meaning stuff will probably break at some point)?

MF_James
May 8, 2008
I CANNOT HANDLE BEING CALLED OUT ON MY DUMBASS OPINIONS ABOUT ANTI-VIRUS AND SECURITY. I REALLY LIKE TO THINK THAT I KNOW THINGS HERE

INSTEAD I AM GOING TO WHINE ABOUT IT IN OTHER THREADS SO MY OPINION CAN FEEL VALIDATED IN AN ECHO CHAMBER I LIKE

xZAOx posted:

I wanted to dust off my phinny bard (105, broken mirror bored me to death and that's when I quit). I figure my only option is to learn how to box.

Seems like MQ is the way to go. I got it logging in two new characters, got some of the basic plugins working.

But for the stuff to play your characters without having to set them up yourself, seems like the answer these days is kissassist macro, which is from a RedGuides sub? I know you can get mq for free, but is there a free kissassist or something comparable?

If you do sub to RG, what happens when your sub is out? Does your poo poo still work, just you won't get updates (meaning stuff will probably break at some point)?

AFAIK the macros will not check into a server or anything, some plugins might, but that's not what you're dealing with.

You could look into MuleAssist, it's the predecessor to KA, not sure if it's available for free, but it did stop getting developed at some point.

MrTheDevious
May 7, 2006

Ahh nostalgia, you cruel bitch

xZAOx posted:

I wanted to dust off my phinny bard (105, broken mirror bored me to death and that's when I quit). I figure my only option is to learn how to box.

Seems like MQ is the way to go. I got it logging in two new characters, got some of the basic plugins working.

But for the stuff to play your characters without having to set them up yourself, seems like the answer these days is kissassist macro, which is from a RedGuides sub? I know you can get mq for free, but is there a free kissassist or something comparable?

If you do sub to RG, what happens when your sub is out? Does your poo poo still work, just you won't get updates (meaning stuff will probably break at some point)?

MASSIVE effortpost ahead!

MQ has undergone some crazy changes in the last year or so. There's two paid sites that each have their own version, MmoBugs and RedGuides. MmoBugs is still trucking along with an ancient build of MQ, allows active hacks (that get you banned), and has no real momentum in the community. RedGuides rewrote all of MQ2 from the ground-up into a thing they called MQNext. Plugins built for one won't work with the other, so you have to choose one or the other.

The RedGuides people are FANTASTIC and there's a massive community around the ecosystem with 50+ awesome plugins MmoBugs doesn't get. They have also open sourced the entirety of MQNext. This means if you remove MmoBugs option entirely (you should), you have two remaining choices:

1) RedGuides Very Vanilla - this is their "paid" option and comes pre-built with every possible plugin. You click a launcher button and that's all, everything else is handled for you. Note here that I used "paid" rather than paid. You can get this free by simply posting on their forums. You can also :10bux: if you'd rather. Either way, having "paid" access allows you to download all the community plugins (of which there are TONS of amazing ones) which are also handled automatically through the Launcher. This version is also required for the "Premium" CWTN (paid $20 per class) plugins. They are KissAssist/MuleAssist on crack and good enough you can fire up 40 boxes and complete entire raids alone. You cannot use these EVEN IF YOU BUY THEM if you're not using this VV option. Important note - EVERYTHING IS FREE ON TEST SERVER! You can try VV/CWTN plugins on Test all you want before investing a dime.

2) DIY Build - This is where you build MQNext from its open source on your own. You follow the instructions at https://docs.macroquest.org/ and at the end, you'll have self-produced the same thing as Redguides Very Vanilla. You cannot, however, download any of the community plugins without the "paid" forum account. This is, however, as free as a thing can be. You can, in fact, :10box: or forumquest your way into RedGuides for a single month, download all the plugins you want, then run for free forever. The CWTN plugins are *NOT* available here even if you purchase them.

BOT USAGE in order from easiest to most complex:
- If you're using CWTN plugins, you literally click go and you're done. They have a neat little in-game GUI where you can set each character's role (puller/tank/healer/dps/etc) and a bunch of checkboxes for enabling/disabling things. They are completely idiot proof and will play your character better than you can do so solo manually. In fact, if you'd like to improve your skills on your main, watch CWTN playing it. Absolutely jam-packed with every feature you can imagine, every spell perfectly placed, every AA your class gets has an option for usage. The creator himself uses them to solo raid and is incredibly active in the RG Discord server, so *any* problem you have with them has an answer 30 seconds away. These are what I use for every class that has one. They're truly mindblowing. You can try them FREE on the Test server.

- If you have VV, you have several choices which you can find in the RG forums Level 2 (paid):
1) RGMercs is the easiest, as it's designed to have almost no options for user simplicity. You turn it on and it pilots that character in the way the RGMercs dev decided. I hate it personally, but a LOT of people use it fine

2) Entropy/XGen - More featureful than RGMercs but VERY jank. I've never been able to get these to work very well at all

3) MuleAssist/MAUI - This is KissAssist, but modern. MAUI provides a nice in-game UI similar to the CWTN plugins. Slightly less-good at pretty much everything than CWTN plugins are, but not by much. This is what I use on all my characters that don't have CWTN plugins. One of them is a Bard, which MAUI/MuleAssist (after config) is running as puller AND mezzer amongst the normal melody + dps. It did take a lot of tinkering compared to CWTN, but he's pretty much flawless now and I'm constantly amazed at how well he performs

- If you DIY'd or don't like the above options:
1) KissAssist - this sucker is ANCIENT and feels it. It works quite well once configured, but has no GUI at all, so every tweak involves opening a text file and manually changing things, then restarting the plugin. There is *nothing* that KA can do that MuleAssist/MAUI can't. I have no idea why anyone with access to anything else still uses KA, but it is an option for sure.

Note here that MuleAssist is legitimately a rewrite of KissAssist, and MAUI comes with the ability to auto-convert KA configs to MA ones. That means you can always upgrade to MAUI regardless of KA/MA. If you don't have any configs at all, you can find them https://www.redguides.com/community/resources/categories/kissassist-ini-library.18/ and https://www.redguides.com/community/resources/categories/muleassist-ini-library.24/

Filter for class/level, grab one from the library, start there, then tweak as you see fit. These both require a bit of work/understanding how KA/MA function in general, so even with the downloadable .ini files, you'll have to put some effort into these. My current Bard MAUI started as one of those libraries too.

UTILS not directly related to automation of characters - VV has a crapload of amazing plugins that enhance all the other aspects of boxing. You cannot get these with the DIY free option.
- My favorite so far are MQNav/EasyTravel/Magellan. Want your whole group that's spread across the land to each invis up, then run to a specific zone? Open Magellan plugin, type the zone you want into search box, mash button, your whole crew navigates there.
- Sick of button mashing Overseer? Plugin auto-runs overseer the minute you log in, then tracks as things finish and queues new ones
- Hate Advanced Loot and wish you could do things like `Give each group member 3 of this quest item, then pass on the rest` or `Give every Tradeskill drop to specific toon carrying 6x extraplanar satchels`? Now you can
- Want to sell all your vendor loot at once? /lootly sell, done
- Want your inventory to be searchable and sortable independent of individual bags? Feast your eyes on Cold's Big Bag
- Your whole group died. You don't want to CR, but lobby rez is annoying with that many characters. LazyLobbyRez to the rescue, click a button and your whole group runs to lobby, summons their corpses, and your healer rezzes them all, then runs them to wherever you'd like
- Powerleveling is tedious as hell. /mac run Hatchery, presto, your bigboye DS powerlevels your lowbies
- So many buttons now when trying to drive multiple characters from a single window! We need more and better clicky things. ButtonMaster is here for you, infinite buttons to click
- How much does buying and memming a million spells from PoK suck? Sucks even more when you hit the point where spells start being sold in other zones, not PoK. Scriber is here for you. Click GO and that character will invis/run/buy/memorize every spell in the game it doesn't already know.
- Things are working pretty great, but it sure would be nice to see the rest of the group's status from the main box - BoxHUD! Quick glance and it'll show you everything from whether each character is invis down to which macro they're using, whether they're burning or not, etc
- Finally the BIGGEST BOI - /autofollow is trash. Absolute garbage. MQ2Nav, however, uses a third party Navmesh generation algorithm that fixes this. You can /afollow literally ANYWHERE in the game and NONE Of your boxes ever gets stuck, falls off a bridge, faceplants a door, etc.
- Additionally, EasyFind brings that MQ2Nav to everywhere. Want to run to a specific NPC? /travelto Bilbo done.

I think that's most everything I use daily, open for questions now :)

xZAOx
Sep 6, 2004
PORKCHOP SANDWICHES
Hah, I had a feeling you may have knowledge to share on this one. Gonna save that!

I found an old RedGuides account that has 50 redcents on it, so seems like that's a good way to try this out for a month. I had started ciphering out the difference between all the combat bots, but your breakdown really helps. Just hate how it was "yet more stuff that wants a subscription price", heh.

I will say, you saying KissAssist sucks was a first. From what i had gathered, that's what I'd set up with. I think the reason why is because the RedGuide newbie videos all show off KA, then you see the KA library and assume it'll be pretty automated. Not as nice as CWTN, but also doesn't cost another $20 per class per year. If you play for a solid year, that's negligible, but generally I play MMOs for 1-3 months then move on to something else.

How do the auto-nav style plugins (esp across zones) work when it's poo poo like "go click this specific item" and "go through these doors" or "hail this nps in the nexus then stand in this spot for 5 minutes", etc? I assume at this point it navigates and handles all that poo poo fine?

quote:

Hate Advanced Loot and wish you could do things like `Give each group member 3 of this quest item, then pass on the rest` or `Give every Tradeskill drop to specific toon carrying 6x extraplanar satchels`? Now you can

Which plugin was that one? The rest you mentioned their names.

RCarr
Dec 24, 2007

Will you not get banned for using this stuff?

onesixtwo
Apr 27, 2014

Don't you realize that being nice just makes you get hurt?
ToS would say yes, but the reality is if you keep to yourself and don't make a problem for other people enough to report you.. most likely nothing you do will ever be noticed by anyone of importance to take action. Same as just using showeq or various hotkey programs / input repeater software that are all illegal but grey-area justifiable to people more easily than full automation is, when they are both the same third-party tool assistance thing. People are doing it all the time on TLPs.

xZAOx
Sep 6, 2004
PORKCHOP SANDWICHES
My understanding is that, first off, is a big difference between automation / botting type stuff versus straight up hacks like warping.

Second, as was said, keep to yourself. There's lots of places to grind exp/plat that are in the middle of nowhere (esp on live) or straight up in your own instances.

Third, and this one seems very important, don't do poo poo unattended. At least not completely, especially so if you're nearer to a spot others may want to play in. Even if you're mq'ing a full group, it sounds like as long as you're present and not training people, that's it's very unlikely poo poo will happen.

Then on the extremely rare case where they do take action, it's like... a week suspension, so long as you stick to number one and don't hack.

I'm pretty excited to give this a whirl. It's a lot learn and set up, though. I was going to manually two box characters up until my bard can join, then three box. I was already dreading trying to learn even these two new classes (plus relearn my bard). But now I'm thinking go full on six box and just learn my tank.

ShowEQ is super common. Used all over tlp's, and they have no real way to detect, without doing shady poo poo themselves. And now that I know more about how boxing works, I'm sure a lot of tlp box crews used the gently caress outta mq too. I had no idea it basically makes its own little network and with across pc's, lol. True box doesn't really hurt controlling them, it seems. Just more work to launch them.

Solarin
Nov 15, 2007

There was a period of time after the new studio director took over that they did widespread bans for MQ use on any server. There was several waves I remember hit my guild in particular, but I don’t think that’s happened for a year or more at this point.

ukrainius maximus
Mar 3, 2007
I've been doing some reading up on classes prior to the Oakwynd launch tomorrow, trying to figure out what I want to play. I've dabbled in EQ but have never gotten very far, and I recently have been dipping my toe into P99.

That being said, whenever I look up any information about classes in this game, it basically seems like everything sucks. Maybe it's because the game is so old and the people who still post about it are too terminally online, but I swear every class I look into basically ends with people recommending enchanters.

Yiggy
Sep 12, 2004

"Imagination is not enough. You have to have knowledge too, and an experience of the oddity of life."
The thing with EverQuest being very old is that it’s heavily played through and there is sort of an established meta that a lot of people commonly stick to and then drop off of once classic ends. For a certain style of player that is gonna grind to fifty in pugs or a static group, enc is really good because it’s always sought after for the high DPS of its charm pet and it’s mana regeneration buff. But it always wants a few other specific classes with it, so it’s sort of ascendant within its niche. But if you don’t love that niche (xp grinding in dungeons with other people) it’s not that fun.

I always enjoyed soloing in classic and having a reasonably independent character and so I enjoyed the soloing classes which were much more of a popular niche in classic. Necro probably the best for that but I always preferred and had success with mage. I just enjoyed it more, although now it’s sort of disparaged as a thoughtless class that you play mostly on launches and while you get gear for other classes. But I love it, it’s the superior trade skill farming class in my opinion and only gets better in the later expansions. But a lot of people don’t enjoy that aspect of the game and so they wouldn’t value it over say, a high ceiling DPS always sought after class like enc.

suuma
Apr 2, 2009
e: ^^ lol


The problem with EQ is that's well figured out at this point, so playing a sub-optimal class is, sometimes, not the best. Everybody knows which classes are good and tend to avoid those that aren't (most groups would always take a monk over a ranger, for instance), but every class has a place (back to the prior example - rangers can snare and that's pretty important) especially in late game and even more-so as the game goes on. For instance, druids aren't great for a while, then they get Skin of the Reptile and are suddenly really good again.

Enchanters are particularly busted due to how early-game charm mechanics work. Charm pets can out-tank actual plate tanks and do that while doing the majority of a group's DPS. But they're also pretty risky to play, and despite EQ's fairly relaxing gameplay, you can't really ever take a hand off the keyboard.

Ultimately, EQ supports a lot of different play styles and no classes are bad. It's just that some are just better than others, that those that are better are substantially better, and everybody wants to be killing stuff quickly, so higher DPS classes end up being more popular.

If you just want to guarantee a raid spot without any questions, play a shaman, bard, cleric.

ukrainius maximus
Mar 3, 2007
I'm not sure if I will ever get to that raid level in the game so I try to not let that impact me. Shaman are so cool to me, but I hate the constant buffing, which I think is more of a thing in the classic era?

I don't know why I bother looking this kind of info up since it tends to discourage me from playing or trying certain classes. I just need to play what's fun to me! (which is a halfling druid)

suuma
Apr 2, 2009
I haven't played with a druid since they made insects into Animals (meaning, you can charm them now), which opens up at least a few options. You don't get quite as much control as an enchanter (and you can't haste), but being able to charm animals still makes you pretty strong, since, outside of that, people tend to only play them as under-powered clerics.

I think druids tend to get a bad reputation since they're not the best at DPS or healing but being able to do both gives you a lot of flexibility, and they have enough utility in root/snare/ports that a well-played druid is still a really good thing to have around.

xZAOx
Sep 6, 2004
PORKCHOP SANDWICHES
Shaman are definitely buff bots, lol.

Ench are weird. They're almost useless on raids for a long time. They're very volatile - they swing hard from "oh god gotta get one in the group" to "enchies don't do much". That said, I'm a strong believer in "just get whoever's LFG" for EQ groups. So much fun to be had that way. And even if it's a shitshow...well it's fun too. There's limits to that - you gotta have someone who can heal, someone who can take a hit - but you can get a lot more creative than people allow for. It won't be the most efficient, but it's fun.

I think the first thing you need to do is just figure out what do you want to do? Do you want to solo? Group play? Raid? Are you gonna bail at PoP or earlier? Or you gonna try to stick around for longer?

Failing at that, gently caress it, just play what's fun! If it stops being fun for any reason (mechanics suck all the way to 'I wanna group but no one will have me') then gently caress it. Be done or pick a new class.

In my phinny guilds, I will say that druids, necros, ench always seemed to be the least common. Usually only a couple of bard mains in the guild, but lots of bard boxes (esp as the server got older). Lots of melee and caster dps. War/pally/sk/clr/shm always very useful.

xZAOx
Sep 6, 2004
PORKCHOP SANDWICHES

suuma posted:

I think druids tend to get a bad reputation since they're not the best at DPS or healing but being able to do both gives you a lot of flexibility, and they have enough utility in root/snare/ports that a well-played druid is still a really good thing to have around.

Building on what I was saying about weird groups - I *still* remember a highpass hold group, in the basement (I don't remember the camp, but the gobbos near a bank I think?), where we had 3 druids (I was a monk, I don't remember what else). This was back in 99, xmas break in college. It was a dumb, fun group. We were being miscreants and played literally all night, so we just took who was around. I was at home on dialup, so over night was the only time I could play so I wouldn't hog up the phone line!

ukrainius maximus
Mar 3, 2007
I truthfully don’t really know what I want to do or what my goals are. This would be my first TLP that I can jump into at the beginning so I’m intrigued by it. My EQ live experience doesn’t amount to much of anything other than getting nowhere on a bare and monk in like 2004 and then a berserker whenever they were released.

I’ve dicked around since mercs have been introduced and I got a ranger up to maybe the 60s or so.

On P99 I made it to 15 on a druid and I really liked it. I know they have that whole jack of all trades, master of none thing going on but that also kind of appeals to me.

Truthfully I think it’s between wizard and druid and those are two classes that people lambaste online when looking at the classic era. Really it just comes down to gnome vs halfling. I suppose I could go with a magician as well.

MF_James
May 8, 2008
I CANNOT HANDLE BEING CALLED OUT ON MY DUMBASS OPINIONS ABOUT ANTI-VIRUS AND SECURITY. I REALLY LIKE TO THINK THAT I KNOW THINGS HERE

INSTEAD I AM GOING TO WHINE ABOUT IT IN OTHER THREADS SO MY OPINION CAN FEEL VALIDATED IN AN ECHO CHAMBER I LIKE

Druids are kind of rough to play until like PoP, though a bit better than they were in classic-luclin live era.

Druids are not played much at all because their healing is sub-par especially early on, lot of people have a druid box for buffs/ports though (or a wizard), and that carries over into raiding, we have like 120 active mains in our guild on mischief (and like 40-80 more that are inactive or semiactive) and of all those people only 4 are druids.

Wizards are OK, mana (and sometimes agro) problems at least through TBS.

All caster DPS is kind of sub-par until much later expansions, mages hold their own to some degree in MOTM era because of pets, but otherwise do a pittance of DPS compared to melee classes.

Apparently SOF is like a revival of caster DPS though, this is the expansion mischief is about to hit.

MF_James fucked around with this message at 22:12 on May 23, 2023

BGrifter
Mar 16, 2007

Winner of Something Awful PS5 thread's Posting Excellence Award June 2022

Congratulations!

ukrainius maximus posted:

I just need to play what's fun to me! (which is a halfling druid)

You have excellent taste. Probably the biggest thing that will draw me back to a TLP is the desire to redo the mad rush of dozens of people in Misty Thicket whacking beetles and bats with sticks :3:

You’ll get left behind by the tryhards doing it, but I really enjoyed doing low level quests for things like the Paw of Opolla and Testament of Vanear on Mischief.

Yiggy
Sep 12, 2004

"Imagination is not enough. You have to have knowledge too, and an experience of the oddity of life."

MF_James posted:

Apparently SOF is like a revival of caster DPS though, this is the expansion mischief is about to hit.

Yeah its a real breath of fresh air after being bad for several expacs. Wizards start to feel it in TSS but its not til SoF for mages and in SoD necros are starting to nip at my heals on the parse now too. Monks and rogues have lapsed a bit, rangers have recovered a little. Warriors actually start to do some damage.

Underfoot opens up for us here a day after oakwynd launches. Its a weird time on the server because population always ebbs a bit before summer and with tlp launches. Diablo 4 is also not helping matters. Lot of competition for peoples' time. Raid attendance has been haggard past few weeks. Will people come back for launch? Which guilds will make it through to House of Thule in July? I really don't want to reguild again, so, it is tense times on aradune.

cmdrk
Jun 10, 2013
ughhhhh, my brain worms are stirring. I'm not really particularly interested in any aspect of Oakwynd other than "new EQ".

For Yelinak I went ahead and set up Multiplicity so I could box, but was playing with some friends. Most likely no one will join me this time.

Can someone remind me what strong 2-boxes are for TLP? Willing to play anything, but I'll probably drop out around PoP.

Corn Glizzy
Jun 28, 2007



I played an SK on Phinny and had a blast as an enchanter on Yelinak, but like a poster above said, you DEFINITELY can't step away from the keyboard, but groups fuckin' fight over you and that was amazing.

Can't decide what to play on Oakwynd, and I'm looking at the RedGuides stuff now to get boxing poo poo set up. Haven't boxed since my Tunare days, but my Paladin/Shaman combo was fun. Thinkin I might SK/Shaman this time around.

onesixtwo
Apr 27, 2014

Don't you realize that being nice just makes you get hurt?
I'm going SK / Shaman this time. Not going to be doing anything too crazy, but I will be making extensive use of auto-hotkey & hotkeynet to manage my shaman. On Coirnav I kept a counter for how many times I auto-hotkey'd my shaman to death with his canni macro. Hoping to keep that under a dozen in the leveling phase this round.

Corn Glizzy
Jun 28, 2007



MrTheDevious posted:

MASSIVE effortpost ahead!

:yeeclaw:

This was amazing, thank you for putting this together

Shartweek
Feb 15, 2003

D O E S N O T E X I S T
Is MQNext / RedGuides stuff actually allowed to run on TrueBox servers? I thought they specifically coded it so that it won't actually run when playing on TLPs? Or was that only the old MQ2/MMOBugs software?

onesixtwo
Apr 27, 2014

Don't you realize that being nice just makes you get hurt?
As I know it, that was an agreement only made by the MQ team and has nothing to do with redguides software or other active hacks. They do work on TLPs, certainly. People use every flavor on every TLP.

e: to clarify i do not actually know how to set it up so i dunno about the below truebox mention.. that does seem contrary to my understanding of what people have been able to do on the TLPs.

onesixtwo fucked around with this message at 01:26 on May 24, 2023

Shartweek
Feb 15, 2003

D O E S N O T E X I S T
Hmmm, their instruction video says it doesn't work on truebox servers lol.

Corn Glizzy
Jun 28, 2007



Welp I'm an idiot rear end in a top hat, might have helped if I'd have read that it was truebox until OOW

MrTheDevious
May 7, 2006

Ahh nostalgia, you cruel bitch
That is true, you cannot use them as they stand on TLPs if you go with RG. The RG devs have an old Daybreak dev (not a huge surprise to anyone, I assume) and part of their attempted detente with DBG is to disable functionality on the TLPs since those are DBG's cash cow.

That said, MQNext truly is open source, including the portions that prevent TLP functionality. Hypothetically, if one were to comment a choice few lines of code out, perhaps finding them by searching the codebase for the error message MQ gives when you try to load it on truebox, there would be nothing else stopping MQ from working on TLPs. If you've played a TLP before, you'll undoubtedly have seen lots of people using MQ anyway. This is how they do so.

Note that hypothetically if someone hypothetically commented that code, it would hypothetically only fix the direct MQ2 functionality. I'd hypothetically guarantee the CWTN plugins will still not function as they have their own Detours built into them that are *NOT* open source

DisgracelandUSA
Aug 11, 2011

Yeah, I gets down with the homies

cmdrk posted:

Can someone remind me what strong 2-boxes are for TLP? Willing to play anything, but I'll probably drop out around PoP.

I can only speak through PoP, but Enc/Clr, sk/Shm, mnk/Shm, warr/Clr, enc/{Dru, Shm, Enc, mag}, mag/mag, brd/Dru (sleeper pick!). Warr/Dru. Enc/Shm is a neat one as well, I did this on Yelinak, but doesn't really come online until level 60 in Kunark tho.

E: sk/Clr is probably fine as well for raid viability, but shaman is probably better overall.

DisgracelandUSA fucked around with this message at 03:28 on May 24, 2023

Malaria
Oct 21, 2017



Necro/Druid was pretty good for me on Yelinak. The Druid adds a lot of usefulness to the necro and really speeds up downtime while soloing.

cmdrk
Jun 10, 2013
cool, maybe i'll give the classic CLR/ENC a spin depending on what launch day madness looks like. thanks all.

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xZAOx
Sep 6, 2004
PORKCHOP SANDWICHES

MrTheDevious posted:

- Hate Advanced Loot and wish you could do things like `Give each group member 3 of this quest item, then pass on the rest` or `Give every Tradeskill drop to specific toon carrying 6x extraplanar satchels`? Now you can

What plugin/macro is this one!?

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